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Kaizer_Dragos
03-15-2014, 09:52 PM
I'm new to DDO and it's a hell of a lot different than table top which I'm more familiar with. Let me sum this up in a nutshell, I'm looking to build a toaster from hell, however I could use a lot of advice in this. There's a lot to consider with the various trees, both skill and race. Best race, stat allocation (CHA duh), and most importantly what spells should I choose since sorcerer selection is so limited. I do have a good guild for grouping so I should be okay on drawing agro.

Dawnsfire
03-15-2014, 11:01 PM
I'm new to DDO and it's a hell of a lot different than table top which I'm more familiar with. Let me sum this up in a nutshell, I'm looking to build a toaster from hell, however I could use a lot of advice in this. There's a lot to consider with the various trees, both skill and race. Best race, stat allocation (CHA duh), and most importantly what spells should I choose since sorcerer selection is so limited. I do have a good guild for grouping so I should be okay on drawing agro.

Cardtrick has a good basic primer here (http://tinyurl.com/k7uqzad).

In the past the recommended sorc build went something like this:

Cha- max
Con- the rest

Feats- Acid Savant- Toughness, Maximize, Empower, School Spec- Conjuration, Greater School Spec- Conjuration, Quicken (maybe) and Heighten Spell.
Other Savants- Toughness, Maximize, Empower, School Spec- Evocation, Greater School Spec- Evocation, Quicken (maybe) and Heighten Spell.

Skills were: UMD, Concentration, Balance (up to 10), Jump (up to 10)

Now I am certain feats and skills are all different because of the slew of changes in the enhancement pass and later updates. In fact it has been a long time since I saw a pure sorc running around.

Shiardi Sorcs seem the FOTM these days so I'll just suggest you look here (https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/423364-U19-shiradi-WF-sorc-build-primer-more-powerfuller-than-ever).

Best of luck to you!

Ancient
03-15-2014, 11:52 PM
This thread may help as well: https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/437213-Starter-Sorc-Playstyle-videos

SirValentine
03-17-2014, 12:47 PM
Feats- Acid Savant- Toughness, Maximize, Empower, School Spec- Conjuration, Greater School Spec- Conjuration, Quicken (maybe) and Heighten Spell.
Other Savants- Toughness, Maximize, Empower, School Spec- Evocation, Greater School Spec- Evocation, Quicken (maybe) and Heighten Spell.

Skills were: UMD, Concentration, Balance (up to 10), Jump (up to 10)

Now I am certain feats and skills are all different because of the slew of changes in the enhancement pass and later updates. In fact it has been a long time since I saw a pure sorc running around.


Toughness, in particular, is no longer a must-have feat, so should probably get dropped. Sorcs are tight on feats anyway.

Other than that, looks like a decent list of feats & skills. Add Spellcraft, and, if Forged, Repair, for more spell power.

You can do pure Sorc just fine, but various splashes, alone or in combination, are also popular: 2 Pally (Divine Grace), 2 Monk (Evasion), 2 FvS (Just Reward), 4 FvS (Just Reward + more Fire crits).

It just depends on what exactly you want to do.

tsteigner
03-18-2014, 07:34 AM
Cardtrick has a good basic primer here (http://tinyurl.com/k7uqzad).

Skills were: UMD, Concentration, Balance (up to 10), Jump (up to 10)

Best of luck to you!
*schnipp for the important stuff* :)
Skills : Concentration, Spellcraft (must max since it increases your elemental dmg !!!!!), UMD (nice to have), some Balance, some Jump (might work with 0 jump tough, with jump spell +30, epic +8 .......)

Narasida
04-04-2014, 05:37 PM
is there a good thread on what makes Shiradi so good? is it just taking spells that hit a lot so you proc often?


also if you don't got Shiradi yet, is there any two elements which are considered the "best"? i am currently air/fire but wonder if i should make it air/ice. though i read in a 2 year old thread that ice and earth are by far weaker than the other two, does that still hold true?

jaegarnel
04-06-2014, 04:45 AM
is there a good thread on what makes Shiradi so good? is it just taking spells that hit a lot so you proc often?


also if you don't got Shiradi yet, is there any two elements which are considered the "best"? i am currently air/fire but wonder if i should make it air/ice. though i read in a 2 year old thread that ice and earth are by far weaker than the other two, does that still hold true?

Shiradi is good because while it does a bit less damage than a traditional nuking sorc, it is a lot more sp-efficient. So when up against EE mobs with tons of hp, you won't run out of sp halfway through.
The other reason it's good in EE is that it provides very good CC, since every hit your spells do has a 7% chance to paralyze a mob. If you spam chain missiles and other missiles spells, most mobs will be helpless pretty fast.

That being said, people really overestimate the power of Shiradi. It shows its full potential compared to a regular sorc only in EE, draconic is a lot better in EH imo.
However, it's also easier to build for, since you don't need any DCs or lots of sp, or any of the things you get from past lives on a caster.


As for which elements to choose, I'd say air and fire are the best 2 atm, since their passive traits (adding vulnerability for air, adding a dot for fire) are way better than those for ice or earth. Air also gives very nice utility in the form of immunity to knockdown and wings.
But every element is viable in today's endgame, so choose what you like.

Narasida
04-07-2014, 09:39 AM
thanks a lot. that really helps me on.

i always figured i would keep air but maybe experiment with ice instead of fire, maybe.

schelsullivan
04-07-2014, 09:46 AM
Cold element not so good for endgame sorcs now, lots of undead mobs in new endgame.

unbongwah
04-07-2014, 10:43 AM
Skills : Concentration, Spellcraft (must max since it increases your elemental dmg !!!!!), UMD (nice to have), some Balance, some Jump (might work with 0 jump tough, with jump spell +30, epic +8 .......)
You may also wish to max out Perform, which ups your Sonic Spellpower, particularly if going Shiradi.

Panzermeyer
04-07-2014, 11:45 AM
is there a good thread on what makes Shiradi so good? is it just taking spells that hit a lot so you proc often?

I am not sure what the running total is, but full Shiradi line has something like 9 possible 7% chance effects that go off for each spell that is cast. So that is 9 rolls of 7% for an effect to go off.

Now you add that to MM and you get 5 MM that each have 9 rolls of 7% chance of going off. That's 45 rolls for one super low SP spell.

So Shiradi casters focus less on single spell DPS and focus on spells that maximize spell procs and count on the damage/effects from spell procs to kill/destroy the mobs.


also if you don't got Shiradi yet, is there any two elements which are considered the "best"? i am currently air/fire but wonder if i should make it air/ice. though i read in a 2 year old thread that ice and earth are by far weaker than the other two, does that still hold true?

I had read that Ice was the best at some point. Fire use to be the weakest due to the old end game mobs being highly resistant to fire. Not much the case anymore.

To be honest, I see all elements running around all the time, so I think they are all pretty viable these days. Play with what you want and have fun. Personally my case runs as Air/Ice. Being Air Savant, having immunity to knockdown is pretty awesome.

unbongwah
04-07-2014, 01:24 PM
I am not sure what the running total is, but full Shiradi line has something like 9 possible 7% chance effects that go off for each spell that is cast.
I count seven (http://ddowiki.com/page/Shiradi_Champion): Fey Favor, Favorable Winds, Fey Power, Prism, Rainbow, Double Rainbow, Nerve Venom; first three are innates, the rest are in the tiered abilities. Stay Frosty and Stay Good are separate stances; last time I checked, toggling them toggles off Prism/Rainbow/Dbl Rainbow.

I had read that Ice was the best at some point. Fire use to be the weakest due to the old end game mobs being highly resistant to fire. Not much the case anymore.
Fire & Force also have synergies with AoV (http://ddowiki.com/page/Angel_of_Vengeance_enhancements)and are a good combo for a Shiradi sorc. My hunch is that an Air/Fire/Force combo is the most optimal overall; but like you said, you can make pretty much any combo of elements work out.

Doutrinador
11-12-2014, 11:50 AM
I count seven (http://ddowiki.com/page/Shiradi_Champion): Fey Favor, Favorable Winds, Fey Power, Prism, Rainbow, Double Rainbow, Nerve Venom; first three are innates, the rest are in the tiered abilities. Stay Frosty and Stay Good are separate stances; last time I checked, toggling them toggles off Prism/Rainbow/Dbl Rainbow.

Fire & Force also have synergies with AoV (http://ddowiki.com/page/Angel_of_Vengeance_enhancements)and are a good combo for a Shiradi sorc. My hunch is that an Air/Fire/Force combo is the most optimal overall; but like you said, you can make pretty much any combo of elements work out.

An Ice/force savant would work? I was thinking in human, and take defensive buffs on EK, maybe use an medium armor for PPR and MMR (- 15 spell faliure from EK and - 10% augment). The problem i think would be some undeads and magic missiles imune mobs.

Doutrinador
11-18-2014, 08:37 AM
An Ice/force savant would work? I was thinking in human, and take defensive buffs on EK, maybe use an medium armor for PPR and MMR (- 15 spell faliure from EK and - 10% augment). The problem i think would be some undeads and magic missiles imune mobs.

Anyone alive out there?

Ancient
11-18-2014, 08:44 AM
Anyone alive out there?

I think all forms of necromancy (including raising a dead thread, are more in the wizard class).

As far as your question, the success is more of an issue of the details more than the high level description.

Doutrinador
11-18-2014, 08:49 AM
I think all forms of necromancy (including raising a dead thread, are more in the wizard class).

As far as your question, the success is more of an issue of the details more than the high level description.

The last post was from
04-07-2014, 07:24 PM

And its a general quest indeed, but the general idea is clear.

Thx anyway.

catouse9
11-18-2014, 08:53 AM
I am not sure what the running total is, but full Shiradi line has something like 9 possible 7% chance effects that go off for each spell that is cast. So that is 9 rolls of 7% for an effect to go off.

Now you add that to MM and you get 5 MM that each have 9 rolls of 7% chance of going off. That's 45 rolls for one super low SP spell.

So Shiradi casters focus less on single spell DPS and focus on spells that maximize spell procs and count on the damage/effects from spell procs to kill/destroy the mobs.



I had read that Ice was the best at some point. Fire use to be the weakest due to the old end game mobs being highly resistant to fire. Not much the case anymore.

To be honest, I see all elements running around all the time, so I think they are all pretty viable these days. Play with what you want and have fun. Personally my case runs as Air/Ice. Being Air Savant, having immunity to knockdown is pretty awesome.

can you imagine if you were playing Pen and Paper D&D and had to roll that much for every magic missle? People would want to kill the Sorceror player.

unbongwah
11-18-2014, 09:01 AM
An Ice/force savant would work? I was thinking in human, and take defensive buffs on EK, maybe use an medium armor for PPR and MMR (- 15 spell faliure from EK and - 10% augment). The problem i think would be some undeads and magic missiles imune mobs.
Ice Savant is tougher to level, IMHO, since the nicer spells are backloaded; and you don't have an AoE DoT that's as good as firewall for mid-heroic levels. But ultimately, you don't want to depend on only one element; you'll have the APs to spare to invest, say, 11-15 APs in Air or Earth as a backup. Air has higher burst DPS and is Evocation-based like Ice (whereas Earth is Conjuration, splitting your DC focus); Earth has more no-DC spells like Melfs & Acid Fog and there are fewer mobs with acid immunity than electric.

That said, the feats, skills, etc. don't change much between Savant builds. If you can afford it, you can change your spell layout, either by using a Blood of Dragons or paying the sorc trainer. So you could level using one set of spells / Savants, then switch focus later.

Doutrinador
11-18-2014, 09:07 AM
Ice Savant is tougher to level, IMHO, since the nicer spells are backloaded; and you don't have an AoE DoT that's as good as firewall for mid-heroic levels. But ultimately, you don't want to depend on only one element; you'll have the APs to spare to invest, say, 11-15 APs in Air or Earth as a backup. Air has higher burst DPS and is Evocation-based like Ice (whereas Earth is Conjuration, splitting your DC focus); Earth has more no-DC spells like Melfs & Acid Fog and there are fewer mobs with acid immunity than electric.

That said, the feats, skills, etc. don't change much betweeny Savant builds. If you can afford it, you can change your spell layout, either by using a Blood of Dragons or paying the sorc trainer. So you could level using one set of spells / Savants, then switch focus later.

Thx, i will do that. My main question is if is a good thing to be a flesh sorcerer with médium armor.

Tilomere
11-18-2014, 09:28 AM
Thx, i will do that. My main question is if is a good thing to be a flesh sorcerer with médium armor.


It is godly with high twist points and a full ED to twist consecrate-sacred ground and rejuvenating cocoon into draconic on a fleshy-HAMP tank sorc. Especially with a MF weapon. New sorcs that can't self-heal with ED twists should be robots.

unbongwah
11-18-2014, 09:38 AM
My main question is if is a good thing to be a flesh sorcerer with médium armor.
With the changes to PRR & MRR, you can definitely get a big defensive boost from equipping armor on any build. The only question mark is how much build resources you invest in terms of ASF reduction etc. Also there are some nice named caster robes out there, such as Frozen Tunic (http://ddowiki.com/page/Item:Frozen_Tunic), so it's unfortunate not to use them while leveling; although Shadowmail (http://ddowiki.com/page/Shadowmail) is not bad. OTOH, if you're using crafted caster armor (i.e., blue dragonscale et al), then it can be whatever you want.

At least until the Divine Grace nerf goes live, I still think sorc 18 / pal 2 is the way to go, since it also gets you armor profs. If you have the APs to spare, you can pick up some defensive buffs too, like Missile Shield (Deflect Arrows).

Doutrinador
11-18-2014, 10:51 AM
With the changes to PRR & MRR, you can definitely get a big defensive boost from equipping armor on any build. The only question mark is how much build resources you invest in terms of ASF reduction etc. Also there are some nice named caster robes out there, such as Frozen Tunic (http://ddowiki.com/page/Item:Frozen_Tunic), so it's unfortunate not to use them while leveling; although Shadowmail (http://ddowiki.com/page/Shadowmail) is not bad. OTOH, if you're using crafted caster armor (i.e., blue dragonscale et al), then it can be whatever you want.

At least until the Divine Grace nerf goes live, I still think sorc 18 / pal 2 is the way to go, since it also gets you armor profs. If you have the APs to spare, you can pick up some defensive buffs too, like Missile Shield (Deflect Arrows).

Thank you,

I have the medium blue dragonscale armor. I always try to do pure casters, but will consider the pally splash.

akiraproject24
12-03-2014, 10:22 PM
With the changes to PRR & MRR, you can definitely get a big defensive boost from equipping armor on any build. The only question mark is how much build resources you invest in terms of ASF reduction etc. Also there are some nice named caster robes out there, such as Frozen Tunic (http://ddowiki.com/page/Item:Frozen_Tunic), so it's unfortunate not to use them while leveling; although Shadowmail (http://ddowiki.com/page/Shadowmail) is not bad. OTOH, if you're using crafted caster armor (i.e., blue dragonscale et al), then it can be whatever you want.

At least until the Divine Grace nerf goes live, I still think sorc 18 / pal 2 is the way to go, since it also gets you armor profs. If you have the APs to spare, you can pick up some defensive buffs too, like Missile Shield (Deflect Arrows).

Is the Divine grace nerf explained in the lama thread?

unbongwah
12-04-2014, 08:43 AM
Is the Divine grace nerf explained in the lama thread?
It was discussed during the U23 beta; rather than its current uncapped bonus, the plan was to switch to a max bonus of "(pal lvl * 3) + 2," IIRC. So a pal 2 splash could have a max of +8 (2*3 + 2) to saves, pal 3 would max at +11, etc. It hasn't gone live yet, but the Known Issues list (https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/150534-Official-Known-Issues) says, "Divine Grace is not currently limiting its saving throw benefit based on Paladin level. This change will be done for a future game update." So I presume the DG nerf is still coming. And frankly, I'm surprised they're not doing the same thing with Div Might; uncapped bonuses from class abilities are a bad idea from a game-balance perspective, IMHO.