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Cardtrick
02-25-2014, 04:13 PM
This is a super niche build, and so customized to my character that I kind of doubt anyone else will ever make one. I thought about not even posting it, but I'm bored and I figured why not . . .

Build Goals:
1. Get a barbarian past life in a pain-free way, for someone who hates barbarians
2. Use quarterstaffs (I like them, plus I have a nice selection from previous lifes and alts)
3. Have some form of self-healing, ideally even while Raged
4. Be fun to play and relatively easy to level up to 20. Less concerned about performance in epics, although I'll probably work on Destinies a bit with this guy after hitting 20, before TRing again. Epic Elite performance is a complete non issue.

I don't like barbarians. I do like self sufficiency and self healing. I do like quarterstaffs.


Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 04.20.02
DDO Character Planner Home Page (http://www.rjcyberware.com/DDO)

Badstick Barb Life
Level 20 Chaotic Good Human Male
(8 Barbarian \ 8 Rogue \ 4 Favored Soul)
Hit Points: 316
Spell Points: 363
BAB: 17\17\22\27\27
Fortitude: 16
Reflex: 14
Will: 8

Starting Ending Feat/Enhancement
Abilities Base Stats Base Stats Modified Stats
(36 Point) (Level 1) (Level 20) (Level 20)
Strength 18 26 28
Dexterity 11 14 14
Constitution 16 19 19
Intelligence 13 16 16
Wisdom 8 11 11
Charisma 10 13 13

Tomes Used
+1 Tome of Strength used at level 3
+1 Tome of Dexterity used at level 3
+1 Tome of Constitution used at level 3
+1 Tome of Intelligence used at level 3
+1 Tome of Wisdom used at level 3
+1 Tome of Charisma used at level 3
+2 Tome of Strength used at level 7
+2 Tome of Dexterity used at level 7
+2 Tome of Constitution used at level 7
+2 Tome of Intelligence used at level 7
+2 Tome of Wisdom used at level 7
+2 Tome of Charisma used at level 7
+3 Tome of Strength used at level 11
+3 Tome of Dexterity used at level 11
+3 Tome of Constitution used at level 11
+3 Tome of Intelligence used at level 11
+3 Tome of Wisdom used at level 11
+3 Tome of Charisma used at level 11

Starting Ending Feat/Enhancement
Base Skills Base Skills Modified Skills
Skills (Level 1) (Level 20) (Level 20)
Balance 4 6 10
Bluff 3 4 5
Concentration 3 4 5
Diplomacy 0 1 2
Disable Device 5 26 27
Haggle 0 1 2
Heal -1 23 24
Hide 4 12 13
Intimidate 0 1 2
Jump 8 20 24
Listen -1 0 1
Move Silently 4 12 13
Open Lock 4 18 19
Perform n/a n/a n/a
Repair 1 3 4
Search 5 26 27
Spellcraft 1 3 4
Spot 3 21 22
Swim 4 9 10
Tumble 1 3 7
Use Magic Device 4 24 25

Level 1 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+4)
Skill: Bluff (+3)
Skill: Disable Device (+4)
Skill: Hide (+4)
Skill: Jump (+4)
Skill: Move Silently (+4)
Skill: Open Lock (+4)
Skill: Search (+4)
Skill: Spot (+4)
Skill: Tumble (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+4)
Feat: (Human Bonus) Cleave
Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Rogue
Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Sorcerer
Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Wizard
Feat: (Selected) Power Attack


Level 2 (Barbarian)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+0.5)


Level 3 (Rogue)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Hide (+2)
Skill: Move Silently (+2)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+2)
Feat: (Selected) Two Handed Fighting


Level 4 (Barbarian)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Jump (+2)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+0.5)


Level 5 (Barbarian)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)


Level 6 (Barbarian)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Great Cleave


Level 7 (Rogue)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+2)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+4)


Level 8 (Favored Soul)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Heal (+5)
Feat: (Deity) Follower of the Sovereign Host
Spell (1): Nightshield
Spell (1): Protection from Evil


Level 9 (Favored Soul)
Skill: Heal (+5)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Two Handed Fighting
Spell (1): Remove Fear


Level 10 (Rogue)
Skill: Disable Device (+3)
Skill: Search (+3)
Skill: Spot (+2)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+3)


Level 11 (Rogue)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Hide (+3)
Skill: Move Silently (+3)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+2)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 12 (Favored Soul)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Heal (+5)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Bludgeoning Weapons
Spell (1): Bless


Level 13 (Favored Soul)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Heal (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Spell (2): Cure Moderate Wounds


Level 14 (Rogue)
Skill: Disable Device (+2)
Skill: Heal (+1)
Skill: Search (+2)
Skill: Spot (+3)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+3)


Level 15 (Barbarian)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Heal (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Greater Two Handed Fighting


Level 16 (Barbarian)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Heal (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 17 (Rogue)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Heal (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+4)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+3)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 18 (Rogue)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Heal (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+6)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Past Life: Sneak of Shadows


Level 19 (Barbarian)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Heal (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 20 (Barbarian)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Heal (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Human - Human Versatility: Damage Boost (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Human - Human Adaptability: Strength (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Human - Action Surge: Strength (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Human - Action Surge: Strength (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Human - Improved Recovery (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Human - Great Weapon Aptitude (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Human - Great Weapon Aptitude (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Human - Great Weapon Aptitude (Rank 3)
Enhancement: Human - Improved Recovery (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Thief-Acrobat (Rog) - Staff Control (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Thief-Acrobat (Rog) - Staff Training (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Thief-Acrobat (Rog) - Thief Acrobatics (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Thief-Acrobat (Rog) - Thief Acrobatics (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Thief-Acrobat (Rog) - Thief Acrobatics (Rank 3)
Enhancement: Thief-Acrobat (Rog) - Sly Flourish (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Thief-Acrobat (Rog) - Sly Flourish (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Thief-Acrobat (Rog) - Sly Flourish (Rank 3)
Enhancement: Thief-Acrobat (Rog) - Staff Training (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Thief-Acrobat (Rog) - Quick Strike (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Thief-Acrobat (Rog) - Quick Strike (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Thief-Acrobat (Rog) - Quick Strike (Rank 3)
Enhancement: Thief-Acrobat (Rog) - Haste Boost (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Thief-Acrobat (Rog) - Haste Boost (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Thief-Acrobat (Rog) - Haste Boost (Rank 3)
Enhancement: Thief-Acrobat (Rog) - Staff Training (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Thief-Acrobat (Rog) - Sweeping Strikes (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Thief-Acrobat (Rog) - Staff Training (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Thief-Acrobat (Rog) - Staff Lunge (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Thief-Acrobat (Rog) - Staff Specialization (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Thief-Acrobat (Rog) - Vault (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Warpriest (Fvs) - Smite Foe (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Warpriest (Fvs) - Resilience of Battle (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Warpriest (Fvs) - Divine Might (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Warpriest (Fvs) - Divine Might (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Warpriest (Fvs) - Divine Might (Rank 3)
Enhancement: Warpriest (Fvs) - Toughness (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Warpriest (Fvs) - Toughness (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Warpriest (Fvs) - Toughness (Rank 3)
Enhancement: Warpriest (Fvs) - Smite Weakness (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Warpriest (Fvs) - Wall of Steel (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Warpriest (Fvs) - Wall of Steel (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Warpriest (Fvs) - Wall of Steel (Rank 3)
Enhancement: Warpriest (Fvs) - Inflame (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Warpriest (Fvs) - Inflame (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Warpriest (Fvs) - Inflame (Rank 3)
Enhancement: Warpriest (Fvs) - Inflame: Saving Throws (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Warpriest (Fvs) - Inflame: Saving Throws (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Warpriest (Fvs) - Strength (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Warpriest (Fvs) - Ameliorating Strike (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Frenzied Berserker (Bar) - Die Hard (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Frenzied Berserker (Bar) - Toughness (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Frenzied Berserker (Bar) - Extra Rage (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Frenzied Berserker (Bar) - Extra Rage (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Frenzied Berserker (Bar) - Power Rage (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Frenzied Berserker (Bar) - Angry Arms (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Frenzied Berserker (Bar) - Extra Action Boost (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Frenzied Berserker (Bar) - Extra Action Boost (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Frenzied Berserker (Bar) - Extra Action Boost (Rank 3)
Enhancement: Frenzied Berserker (Bar) - Mad Munitions (Rank 1)




Class Split

Barbarian alignment restrictions mean no monk and no paladin -- two of the basic "self healing melee" archetypes. Quarterstaff use doesn't completely rule out ranger, but it definitely negates a lot of the ranger benefits; plus, ranger self-healing is spell based and doesn't come online until pretty late in the leveling process.

Since monk is out, that means I need at least 5 rogue levels for staff specialization in the Acrobat tree. Rogues gain a little self healing through UMDing Heal scrolls, and I've played acrobats who used nothing but that before; it's not ideal, but it's workable. However, that's not an option while Raged.

So -- I want 4 levels of Favored Soul or Cleric for the Warpriest line and Ameliorating strike, which is a burst heal that procs on Smite and can be used up to once every 15 seconds. It works even while raged. It won't be enough to keep me up entirely in harder difficulties, and there's not perfect synergy -- it really works better with TWF, since it procs independently for each hand -- but it seems to be the best option to get self healing as a barbarian.

Then it's just a matter of choices. I want to take the first 5 rogue levels relatively early. Assuming I'm going to want trap skills, which I might as well with 5 rogue levels, it will be a lot easier if I have at least one more rogue level later on in the process to top off skills. That puts me at 6+ rogue levels, 6+ barbarian levels, and 4+ favored soul levels. I decided I didn't want to bother trying to be a caster -- I'm going to use Rage from time to time, and there's no synergy there. So I want to stick with the bare minimum 4 FvS levels. Then I'm at 6-8 rogue and 10-8 barbarian. Levels 9 and 10 of barbarian give virtually nothing. Level 8 of rogue gives more skillpoints and another point of dodge. So I'll go 8-8-4.

Race

Human is the obvious choice -- easiest access to healing amp and skills. The extra feat isn't really necessary, but it's nice.

Feats

Feats-wise, I need Power Attack, Cleave, Great Cleave, and IC: Bludgeoning for all the usual reasons. Then the full THF line, because glancing blows are nice and I have the room.

With the human bonus, that leaves one feat, which could be used for pretty much anything. Extend could be convenient to help keep up the low-level FvS buffs (Nightshield, Protection From Evil). If I was going to spend much time in epics, Empower Healing would be a good choice for Rejuvenating Coccoon. Stunning Blow is an option, but I don't think my DC would be good enough to be much use. I might still go that route, though. Since I have a rogue past life, and since I can't keep hide and move silently maxed, I ultimately decided on Sneak of Shadows -- sneaking is occasionally useful and the extra damage clicky is nice on bosses.

Skills

When you're taking this much rogue, you might as well get full trap skills (which, for me, includes Spot). Ameliorating Strike is affected by Positive Spellpower, so I want Heal as high as possible. UMD is a must, always. Others are less important.

Stats

This is a 36-pt build with +3 tomes across the board. Strength is maxed, of course. 13 Int with a +3 tome is enough for the skills I want. 16 CON is plenty, especially since I'm not going to be taking many of the barbarian enhancements that really tend to make them HP sinks. Put the leftover points in DEX and CHA for reflex saves and Divine Might.

Enhancements

These are ridiculously tight. I want at least tier 2 Improved Recovery, which requires 12+ points in the Human tree. Ameliorating Strike is 22+ points in the Warpriest tree. Staff Specialization and Vault mean 34+ points in the Acrobat tree. That's 68 points, leaving only 12 left over to play with.

I put the leftover points into Frenzied Berserker -- there's a lot of nice stuff in the lower tiers there, and 11 points is enough to buy 10 HP, 2 extra rages, 3 extra action boosts (more haste boost + damage boost, yay!), +6 % glancing blow damage, +2 % chance of weapon effects on glancing blow, and + 1 STR while raging.

A solid alternative, which I might end up doing, is to go with 17 points in the human tree for tier 3 Improved Recovery. That only leaves 5 points to distribute among the barbarian tree, but it might still be worth it.

Summary

As you can see . . . it's not much of a barbarian. But I think it might be a pretty solid quarterstaff melee character and a way for someone who doesn't like barbarians to get the past life.

I TRed my main guy last night and I'm going to run with this. But I welcome any suggestions!

whereispowderedsilve
02-25-2014, 04:32 PM
Great idea! This will work great for my qstaff user! Woohoo! :P! :)! :D!

Theolin
02-25-2014, 04:51 PM
I would think about empower healing at some point for cocoon if you wanted to do some epic & might be nice if you unrage and want to heal up with spells. Although I have no clue if you can use cocoon while raged though.

Ehmadeus
02-25-2014, 04:58 PM
I'm doing a twf barb/rogue/fvs and I'm finding the weapon bond effects to be handy. Extra AC, PRR and damage - the Occult Slayer tree is interesting in a 'buff and special attacks' sort of way.

marinerfan
02-25-2014, 05:04 PM
Although I have no clue if you can use cocoon while raged though.

I don't think you can..not 100% sure though

Cardtrick
02-25-2014, 05:06 PM
Great idea! This will work great for my qstaff user! Woohoo! :P! :)! :D!

Glad you like it! Like I said, I mostly customized this for my preferences and my character, but I'm glad someone else finds it interesting.

I'll try to post back once I've played it a bit with a performance report.


I would think about empower healing at some point for cocoon if you wanted to do some epic & might be nice if you unrage and want to heal up with spells. Although I have no clue if you can use cocoon while raged though.

Definitely. I mentioned that in the "Feats" section as a great use for the last feat if I was planning on playing in epics much. But it probably got lost in my wall of text, sorry:


If I was going to spend much time in epics, Empower Healing would be a good choice for Rejuvenating Coccoon.

Sneak of Shadows is easily replaceable. I still might end up swapping it for either Empower Healing or Stunning Blow.

You can't use Rejuvenating Coccoon while raged, but realistically -- with as little investment in barbarian levels and enhancements as I've made -- the playstyle doesn't revolve around being raged all the time. In tougher content, staying un-raged and using an empower healed Coccoon is definitely the way to go.


I'm doing a twf barb/rogue/fvs and I'm finding the weapon bond effects to be handy. Extra AC, PRR and damage - the Occult Slayer tree is interesting in a 'buff and special attacks' sort of way.

Yeah, I agree. When I first tried putting this together, I was thinking about going with Occult Slayer. But unfortunately, due to the required deep AP investments in other trees, I have only 11 or 12 APs free to spend on the barbarian trees. It just seemed to me like Frenzied Berserker offered more -- if nothing else, I love the extra action boosts for that delicious haste boost + damage boost combination. And the +6% to glancing blow damage is really nice on a build with gTHF and increased attack speed.

I do think Occult Slayer is an appealing tree for someone who's not crazy about the standard barbarian playstyle. But I just couldn't make it work on this build.

kuro_zero
02-26-2014, 01:18 AM
Nice - I was thinking of something similar had I decided to stack 3x barb PL. In the end decides wasn't worth the grind for 20 extra 20hp but wanted to see about getting high doublestrike via Killer and Quick Strike for dual proc AS. Means almost no AP for Barb enhancements tho lol.

Cardtrick
02-26-2014, 01:59 PM
Nice - I was thinking of something similar had I decided to stack 3x barb PL. In the end decides wasn't worth the grind for 20 extra 20hp but wanted to see about getting high doublestrike via Killer and Quick Strike for dual proc AS. Means almost no AP for Barb enhancements tho lol.

Yeah, I did look at that. I didn't really mention it in my post, but the doublestrike from Quick Strike is one of the reasons that I started looking into this idea (I like the idea of Ameliorating Strike, but I don't really like TWF).

But unfortunately Killer is a Tier 4 enhancement in the Assassin tree. Presumably you'd want Killer III, which means 23 APs into Assassin. There's also a hard requirement of 22 APs in Warpriest for Ameliorating Strike and 32 in Acrobat for Staff Specialization (34 if you also want Vault, which I definitely do). Even skipping Vault, that puts you at 77 APs -- meaning that full combination isn't available until you've hit level 20.

For me, since I'm mostly doing this for the past life (there are a lot more optimal ways to spend 8 levels than on barbarian, otherwise), performance at 20 is of secondary importance to performance at 18.

I also really consider Tier 2 Improved Recovery a virtual necessity for the build. I haven't done the math, but I'm virtually certain that the extra healing amp from spending 12 APs in the Human tree will do more for the self-healing capabilities than the extra doublestrike chance from Killer. It's also a bigger benefit when using other forms of healing (scrolls, friendly neighborhood divines when not soloing).

So it is definitely a really appealing option, but just not one that I felt I could make fit. It would be a lot nicer if Killer was a tier 2 enhancement like Quick Strike.

kuro_zero
02-26-2014, 06:36 PM
Yeah, I did look at that. I didn't really mention it in my post, but the doublestrike from Quick Strike is one of the reasons that I started looking into this idea (I like the idea of Ameliorating Strike, but I don't really like TWF).

But unfortunately Killer is a Tier 4 enhancement in the Assassin tree. Presumably you'd want Killer III, which means 23 APs into Assassin. There's also a hard requirement of 22 APs in Warpriest for Ameliorating Strike and 32 in Acrobat for Staff Specialization (34 if you also want Vault, which I definitely do). Even skipping Vault, that puts you at 77 APs -- meaning that full combination isn't available until you've hit level 20.

For me, since I'm mostly doing this for the past life (there are a lot more optimal ways to spend 8 levels than on barbarian, otherwise), performance at 20 is of secondary importance to performance at 18.

I also really consider Tier 2 Improved Recovery a virtual necessity for the build. I haven't done the math, but I'm virtually certain that the extra healing amp from spending 12 APs in the Human tree will do more for the self-healing capabilities than the extra doublestrike chance from Killer. It's also a bigger benefit when using other forms of healing (scrolls, friendly neighborhood divines when not soloing).

So it is definitely a really appealing option, but just not one that I felt I could make fit. It would be a lot nicer if Killer was a tier 2 enhancement like Quick Strike.

Yea it was theory build idea and not something I particularly planned out and yea, I figured it would be too AP intensive to be really viable. I would've been happy if it was a Tier3 along the lines of Druid Fatal Harrier.

As for the Healing Amp, every bit helps especially in the heroic levels as heal amp gear is difficult to slot with so few options available.

Saekee
02-26-2014, 08:07 PM
thx for posting this. I have been wracking my brain also on PL barbarian and I do not like the class...was thinking stick but couldn't wrap my head around it. Nice. Am posting here as autobookmark too...

Cardtrick
02-28-2014, 10:14 AM
Performance report 1 (levels 1-5)

I haven't had much time to play the last few days, so I haven't gotten very far. And I spent about half the time I did play farming (unsuccessfully) for a Chieftain's Spear from Three Barrel Cove, so I really didn't level up much.

Not a lot to say about the first few levels. At this point, my guy is a rogue 2 / barbarian 3. I've invested some into the Acrobat tree, but this is the stage where even the basic barbarian rage is really useful, so I'm also taking 3 extra rages. And I don't want to commit too thoroughly to quarterstaffs at the moment -- until I get Staff Specialization, I'm not using exclusively staffs. Carnifex with good strength (and rage) is just too good in these levels.

I'm completely destroying the content on elite so far, but of course that's more about gear than build. It's insane how twinked-out a character can get at these levels with decent Cannith Crafting levels and a good supply of Masterful Craftsmanship shards. +10 gear for all rogue skills; +4 gear for STR, CON, DEX, and INT; +4 resistance; armor of invulnerability; acid of bleed and holy of undead bane quarterstaffs; Carnifex. You'd have to deliberately sabotage your build not to be effective.

Advice for anyone following a similar path:

1. Don't tie yourself to quarterstaffs too early. If you don't have Staff Specialization or at least a Chieftain's Spear / Theurgic Stave (something with an expanded crit profile), you're probably better off waiting. I'm using Carnifex against crittable enemies and crafted quarterstaffs against everything else (holy of undead bane, shrieking of everbright, and shrieking of construct bane). For levels 1 - 3, before Carnifex came online, I used a crafted acid of bleed quarterstaff. Assuming I don't manage to pull a Chieftain's Spear or trade for one (I don't really know how much they go for, but I offered 150,000 plat on the trade channel and got no takers), I'll probably continue to use Carnifex up until level 8; I've got some nice staffs to switch in from that point on.

2. Depending on gear, if you're trying to do traps on Elite you may be better off initially taking Human: Skill Boost rather than Human: Damage Boost as the first core (you need one of them to open up tier 1 Improved Recovery). I did this until I hit level 5 and could use crafted +10 skills gear.

3. Sly Flourish (special attack at tier 1 in the acrobat tree) is really nice in these levels. I took all three tiers of it. Unlike the other thief acrobat special attacks, it works with any weapon. The third tier is an attack with +1.5W and +3 to critical threat range. It also acts like a successful Diplomacy check, decreasing your aggro with all surrounding enemies. The +3 to critical threat range is awesome with something like a Carnifex that already has a broad and deadly crit profile -- it's the next best thing to an instant kill ability. And dumping aggro is nice if you have a hireling or are running in a group. I like to use Sly Flourish on one enemy while surrounded by the group and then immediately follow up with a Cleave. Often, Sly Flourish has worked, allowing me to get sneak attack damage with the Cleave, which is a nice bonus!

Cardtrick
03-09-2014, 12:31 PM
Still slowly leveling this guy up, although my limited play time has been split between him and an alt. I'm honestly not sure I can recommend this build to others. This level range was pretty awkward. I mean, it wasn't terrible, but it wasn't a lot of fun either.

I definitely felt like I was a bit behind the power curve while running BB elites from levels 8 to 11. My class split was just too mixed up to feel powerful. No staff specialization, no ameliorating strike, weak rages (which I barely used anyway because they interfere with trapping). No reasonable self healing. I'm well geared enough to still do fine on elites, but it wasn't as fast or as fun as I'm used to. I was pretty reliant on a hireling for healing.

Level 12, though -- man, talk about an insane jump in power. At level 12, I got Improved Critical: Bludgeoning, Staff Specialization, and the second FvS Core (DR 5/-, letting me swap my lifeshield/invulnerability armor out for giantcrafted leather). With this level up, the crit profile on my Theurgic Stave jumped from 19-20 x2 to 15-20 x3 -- that is ridiculously nice.

This is also the level at which I was able to supplement my Theurgic Stave with a Pos3 green steel (Holy/Good Burst/30% healing amp/Greater Disruption) and Bloody Shadow Staff (Lesser Vampirism, Bodyfeeder, Life Stealing). Theurgic Stave will remain my primary DPS weapon. Pos3 for undead, Bloody Shadow Staff for situational survival use (especially before I can take ameliorating strike) and for the level drain against particularly high-HP enemies.

All of that said, I still am questioning the value of this build. I will probably post a suggested updated version once I've capped and TRed this guy. I think I could definitely improve the leveling order a bit. Level 12 should be the 5th rogue level -- no point in that before you can take staff specialization. And the favored soul should be pushed back a bit. Realistically, the earliest I can take both staff specialization and amelioriating strike is level 14 (technically possible at 13, but have to give up too much). So no sense in taking the 4th FvS level before then. To be honest, though, I'm starting to think that a acrobarb build for the barbarian life would be better achieved with a straight 10/10 barb/rogue split -- you'd lose ameliorating strike, but gain Improved Evasion or Opportunist and be able to invest a lot more in the barb enhancement trees. The Occult Slayer tree has some pretty nice synergy.

Also, I was unhappy with the feat order and swapped feats at level 9 -- I took the Dragonmark of Passage instead of iTHF. I'll push iTHF back to 15 and take gTHF at 18 rather than the Sneak of Shadows I originally planned. I thought I could live without easy Dimension Door, but it turns out I was wrong. If I play this in epics much, I'll probably swap the level 9 feat again, replacing it with Empower Healing. I also find that, as I play this, I'm moving around a lot and Cleaving/Sweeping/etc. frequently. With my current playstyle, I don't know that I'm getting much value out of the THF feats. I'll see how it goes, but right now it's looking like it would almost certainly be better -- especially from an endgame standpoint -- to spend those feats instead on Stunning Blow/Empower Healing/Quicken.

Saekee
03-09-2014, 12:48 PM
Still slowly leveling this guy up, although my limited play time has been split between him and an alt. I'm honestly not sure I can recommend this build to others. This level range was pretty awkward. I mean, it wasn't terrible, but it wasn't a lot of fun either.


thx for these updates

Cardtrick
03-28-2014, 04:34 PM
All done. I actually capped the guy a couple of days ago and he's been running around in epics a bit, but I'll be TRing again soon. I still intend to post a somewhat revised build in this thread -- but it might be a few days.

Summary

I retract my earlier qualms about the build's performance. From level 12 on, this was extremely powerful and easy to level. Gianthold was about as trivial as it's ever been for me on a non-sorcerer life. DPS was excellent, rogue skills are really hand, and even survivability was really quite good with Ameliorating Strike.

On the other hand, it's not a Barbarian. I think I raged . . . maybe five or ten times, total, during this level range? And for the majority of it, I had literally 0 enhancement points in the barbarian trees. The 8 barbarian levels are enough to give a past life, but in terms of this build's effectiveness, they serve no purpose except to provide a bag of HPs and BAB. The ability to cast spells and use scrolls was more important to me than a few points of strength and constitution.

Random notes

Warpriest and Acrobat go together really well. Or, more accurately -- Warpriest is awesome on any melee build that can afford to splash 4 levels of Favored Soul or Cleric. So many nice things. Inflame is great, Ameliorating Strike is great, Divine Might is great, PRR and HP and DR are great.

It doesn't seem like much, but it was really nice to be able to self-cast Protection From Evil and Nightshield -- those are some extremely useful immunities that don't work as well when cast from items, and the 5 minute durations were enough not to be too annoying. Cure Moderate was nice to have, too, especially since I was already wearing Devotion and healing amp items for Ameliorating Strike.

One of this build's strongest points was the ability to put out excellent burst damage in a short period of time, against both groups and bosses. Popping Warpriest Divine Might, Warpriest Inflame, Human Damage Boost, and TA Haste Boost simultaneously, then wading into a group and rapidly tossing out Sweeping Strikes then Great Cleave then Cleave makes you into a walking fireball and takes out a group really quickly. Against a boss, you run the same boosts, but instead start with a Quick Strike followed immediately by Smite (which does extra damage, heals you and your group mates, and also stacks vulnerability on the boss). It's not a monkcher or sorcerer, but definitely very solid burst DPS for a melee.

The lack of a ranged option really hurt after a while. There are times when the game is just really unfun if you have to chip away at ranged enemies with a throwing weapon. For the last couple of levels, I made what may seem like a strange choice -- I dialed back the human enhancements, completely specced out of the barbarian enhancements, and invested enough into Mechanic to gain light repeater proficiency and a couple of crossbow DPS boosts. I didn't take any feats, so ranged damage wasn't great, but it was a lot better than using a throwing weapon or a bow. (I used a Doublecross Bow (http://ddowiki.com/page/Item:Doublecross_Bow) with Wind Howler Bracers and a Quiver of Poison -- there are probably better options, but this was enough to let me finish without much pain.)

This build benefits enormously from healing amp. I wouldn't want to try this on a non human. My survivability took a big jump at level 16 when I was able to put on my old dragontouched healing amp set.

I ended up sticking with the dragonmark of passage for the "free" feat, although I didn't use it as much as I thought I would. If/when I do get around to posting a revised build, I think I'm going to suggest Stunning Blow. I had initially thought that I wouldn't be able to get the DCs to useful levels, but I've changed my mind. With Divine Might running -- which it constantly was -- my strength was actually very respectable. Generally in the mid to high 40s, depending on what I was wearing (in some content, I used Madstone Boots, which pushed it higher; in other areas, I needed more healing than I could get from Ameliorating Strike and wanted to leave myself open to casting heal scrolls without having to take the time to end the rage effects). If I'd used a Spare Hand and a Vertigo staff, I think I could have had a lot of success with Stunning Blow.

I was really tempted to take Traditionalist Caster from the human tree, but couldn't find the APs to spare. It's a little stupid anyway, 10 universal spellpower isn't that big of a deal, but I just like the idea of being a "traditional" caster who is currently smashing you in the face with his quarterstaff.

kuro_zero
03-29-2014, 07:39 AM
All done. I actually capped the guy a couple of days ago and he's been running around in epics a bit, but I'll be TRing again soon. I still intend to post a somewhat revised build in this thread -- but it might be a few days.

Summary

I retract my earlier qualms about the build's performance. From level 12 on, this was extremely powerful and easy to level. Gianthold was about as trivial as it's ever been for me on a non-sorcerer life. DPS was excellent, rogue skills are really hand, and even survivability was really quite good with Ameliorating Strike.

Staff Specialization is stupid good, isn't it lol! Got one last character jumping on the TR train and planning on knocking its Barbarian PL out of the way next. I think I'll do something similar here.


On the other hand, it's not a Barbarian. I think I raged . . . maybe five or ten times, total, during this level range? And for the majority of it, I had literally 0 enhancement points in the barbarian trees. The 8 barbarian levels are enough to give a past life, but in terms of this build's effectiveness, they serve no purpose except to provide a bag of HPs and BAB. The ability to cast spells and use scrolls was more important to me than a few points of strength and constitution.

There is one thing I like to with barbarian rages and it utilizes the Tier1 Athletics:


Athletics: +1/+2/+3 Balance, Jump, Swim.
Rank 3: When you activate Barbarian Rage, you gain +35% Action Boost bonus to movement speed for 20 seconds.

Next, in same tree, pick up all the Extra Rages and then take Tier2 Sprint Boost (1pnt is plenty). Rage then dismiss rage (if you're not a WF you'll need a lesser restore) - you gain sprint boost but its not linked to the actual boost timer or counter. When it runs out you can hit the actual sprint boost, and when that runs out re-rage/dismiss to repeat the cycle..

You can have continuous insane run speed for 5 minutes strait. Its crazy fun lol.

Cardtrick
03-29-2014, 09:01 AM
You can have continuous insane run speed for 5 minutes strait. Its crazy fun lol.

That's awesome! I definitely missed that "hidden" third level ability when looking at the enhancements.

Spending the AP to take the extra rages, athletics, and sprint boost would mean giving up the repeater proficiency and crossbow enhancements from Mechanic, but that seems worth it most of the time.

EllisDee37
03-29-2014, 09:19 AM
If/when I do get around to posting a revised build, I think I'm going to suggest Stunning Blow.This was my immediate thought upon skimming the OP. Stunning Blow is quite effective in heroic elites at a much lower DC than you'd expect.

Drag trip (the free basic one, not Improved which costs a feat) to your hotbar as well. It's crazy effective when targeting the right kind of mobs.

Cardtrick
03-29-2014, 10:41 AM
This was my immediate thought upon skimming the OP. Stunning Blow is quite effective in heroic elites at a much lower DC than you'd expect.

Drag trip (the free basic one, not Improved which costs a feat) to your hotbar as well. It's crazy effective when targeting the right kind of mobs.

Yes, I kept a Vertigo staff around as a swap weapon and used trip pretty regularly (currently, Smite Foe/Ameliorating Strike is bound to 1 while Trip is bound to Shift+1). Acrobat even has enhancements available to boost trip DCs, which I specced into for a while, although I didn't use them for long. The problem with either Trip or Stunning Blow is that I still don't think my DCs are high enough on this build if I took it into difficult epics -- but in the heroic levels, trippable/stunnable enemies died so fast anyway that I'm not sure it's worth taking the time to apply single target CC. On a dex build, or a build with more rogue levels, sweeping strike is awesome because it's an AOE trip -- but the DC is too weak on a strength based splash build like this to be useful (except as a +3W Cleave, which I definitely used it for whenever it was off timer).

I really can't overstate how devastating the combination of high strength (divine might), haste boost, damage boost, inflame, acrobat attack speed, and staff specialization is. Most non-rednamed really just melted away. The only things I would have really liked stunning blow for were non-crittable, non-undead enemies like elementals -- but of course, enemies like that are mostly immune.

This character's very first life was actually an old strength based kensai acrobat, long before the enhancements pass. I used to use stunning blow all the time on that life -- but that was partly because my DPS was significantly less than what's achievable these days, and partly because we still got autocrits on stunned enemies and dreamspitter neg-leveled on every crit.

I still think it's a tough choice between Stunning Blow, Dragonmark of Passage, and Empower Heal -- it really depends on playstyle and what content will be run.

Azarddoze
03-29-2014, 08:53 PM
I know it's been a while but... Good build and looks fun but I would swap around points from human tree to assassin for more damage. It will pay off much more than a bit more healing and some more over healing.

Truth is, with a +74 (I think) devotion item by level 14, where it starts to matter, and good enought umd to scroll heal, ameliorating strike should be enought to keep anyone alive without all those points spent in the human tree. Even on a 2hf.

I do think it's truely one of the most fun build for a barbarian past life for anyone who don't really like barbarians. Good thing you wrote that up for folks to enjoy!

willox2112
10-15-2014, 12:55 PM
I am currently running a similar build, I was totally unaware of your post here in the forums.
I did it basically for the same reason as you, to get a barb past life. After playing with it for a while, it has been completely surprising how good it is doing in epics.

My class split is a bit different, Barb 7/ Rogue 7/FvS 6. I wanted to have as few Barb levels as possible. With the extra rogue I get some SA, and the extra FvS gets me some saves, level 3 spells, energy resist, and Unyielding.

As I leveled I kept changing my enhancements to find the best combination. The focus is obviously Acrobat with at least 22 pts in Warpriest. I dabbled a bit in Occult Slayer, but I got bored with it. I think that it is a good tree, but I tend to change weapons or cast from scrolls pretty often and that kills the Weapon Bond bonuses. Right now I have 0 points dedicated to the barb trees. I don't use barb rage and I don't feel like I need it; with all the penalties you get it's not worth it.

I finally settled on extra SA from Assassin and Envenomed Blades.

My selected race was half elf, basically for some heal amp. and the Paladin Diletantte, which gives some Cha bonus to saves.

Finally, my destiny of choice is Divine Crusader. I get healed whenever I kill a mob, when I hit Ameliorating Strike, and when I hit Consecration. With all these sources of healing it is a rare occasion when I am low on hp's, and when that happens I can hit Unyielding. I have cocoon twisted but I am planning to replace it because I barely use it.

I really like the build, I had an acro-monk a couple of lives back and I have to say that I prefer this one.

Keep on rockin'!

Makkuroi
10-16-2014, 03:33 PM
Im trying a staff pally atm, and really like the acro style, planning to use it on more melee lives (rogue, barb, maybe druid and even arti)

The OP said that the build is weakish before lvl 11.. i think the problem might be the leveling order. Id take rogue at 1, barb at 2 (for run speed), rogue at 3 (for quick strike and evasion) then start taking 4 fvs levels for early DR and small self-heals, then going back to rogue. As long as you have 5 rogue lvls at 12, youre fine, and you dont really need many barb levels before 20. Ill probably go 7/7/6 too.

willox2112
10-17-2014, 04:25 PM
Im trying a staff pally atm, and really like the acro style, planning to use it on more melee lives (rogue, barb, maybe druid and even arti)

The OP said that the build is weakish before lvl 11.. i think the problem might be the leveling order. Id take rogue at 1, barb at 2 (for run speed), rogue at 3 (for quick strike and evasion) then start taking 4 fvs levels for early DR and small self-heals, then going back to rogue. As long as you have 5 rogue lvls at 12, youre fine, and you dont really need many barb levels before 20. Ill probably go 7/7/6 too.


Trying to max out my rogue skills I came up with this leveling order; it is a bit awkward... I take a rogue level at 1, and then at every 3rd level. Max out FvS early, and 13-20 is mostly barb. The only exception is Barb at 18 and a rogue at 19. Why? Trying to max out skills.

Ro Fv Ro Fv Fv Ro Fv Fv Ro Fv Ba Ro Ba Ba Ro Ba Ba Ba Ro Ba

sk3l3t0r
11-03-2014, 01:39 PM
I discovered this build about a month ago and TR'ed into it on my current life...while I haven't used a q-staff yet and just hit level 11 (using caniflex and AGA up to level 10, then switched to Bloody Cleaver) I find this build to be great up until now. It's been a breeze leveling and suspect it will get even easier as I hit level 12.

I started making a triple pos greensteel q-staff, and farming threnal atm for the theurgic stave and eventually the lordsmarch chain for the staff of shadow.

Once I hit level 12 I will switch to my greensteel greataxe from Bloody Cleaver until I finish my q-staff farming and then revamp my enhancements.

I plan to adapt the q-staff aspect of the build for my rogue and druid lives and the q-staves i will have farmed / acquired by then will be recyclable into those lives.

I also plan to adjust the leveling order to get my 4 FvS levels earlier.

So far, it's been great fun playing this build as per the OP and made a few notes on some slight changes I will make for future lives.