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Certon
01-14-2014, 11:26 AM
Monk alignment restrictions should be non-chaotic instead of lawful
Bard and barbarian should be non-lawful instead of chaotic

Barbarian/monks and bard/monks galore! :)

Guanmagi-1
01-14-2014, 11:28 AM
Good old Gung-Fu would be dusted off and TRing in a NY minute.

Teh_Troll
01-14-2014, 11:32 AM
I got a better idea . . . change the game so monk isn't required on everything that's not a flavor build.

TeacherSyn
01-14-2014, 01:07 PM
Monk alignment restrictions should be non-chaotic instead of lawful
Bard and barbarian should be non-lawful instead of chaotic

Barbarian/monks and bard/monks galore! :)

This class alignment in game is inherent to the D&D definition, of course. It will never be changed.

Still, Monks can gain some barbaric or bardic flavor with epic destinies Legendary Dreadnought, Fury of the Wild and Fatesinger.


I got a better idea . . . change the game so monk isn't required on everything that's not a flavor build.

I question why everyone isn't a full Monk, myself. Splashing is like eating just one Lay's Potato Chip. Get thee to a monastery, all--and stay there. ;)

Teh_Troll
01-14-2014, 01:23 PM
I question why everyone isn't a full Monk, myself. Splashing is like eating just one Lay's Potato Chip. Get thee to a monastery, all--and stay there. ;)

Splash a few levels for even more ridiculous power. It's gotten stupid lately.

How long before everyone is Bladeforged and centered before Turbine realizes how terrible they are at balancing things?

HungarianRhapsody
01-14-2014, 01:27 PM
Splash a few levels for even more ridiculous power. It's gotten stupid lately.

How long before everyone is Bladeforged and centered before Turbine realizes how terrible they are at balancing things?

Thankfully, most players are either not interested in making the most powerful character or they're just really bad at it.

Looking at the Who list, I see way fewer Monk splashes than there should if people were trying to get the most out of their character. I'd suggest that this is at least part of what keeps DDO balanced - the fact that the players are balanced even when the game isn't.

Teh_Troll
01-14-2014, 01:33 PM
Thankfully, most players are either not interested in making the most powerful character or they're just really bad at it.

That's really it. Most people are just bad at DDO. They really should take my course . . .



Looking at the Who list, I see way fewer Monk splashes than there should if people were trying to get the most out of their character. I'd suggest that this is at least part of what keeps DDO balanced - the fact that the players are balanced even when the game isn't.

Dude, people still play paladins and bards. Boggles the mind . . .

Most of DDO's activity is in the heroic-game, no matter how much Turbine tries to shift this they fail every time. The Heroic game isn't nearly as broken as the Epic game. If that's where you focus most of your time it really doesn't matter.

None of this excuses how broken things are at the top though.

Memnir
01-14-2014, 01:37 PM
The only class combinations they should open up is to take away the stupid need for Iconics to have one level in... whatever. It's unspeakably frustrating.

Give them progressively awesome bonuses for taking their iconic class at levels 6/12/18 - but the enforced need to have one level in a class is just gaspingly stupid design, imho.

Guanmagi-1
01-14-2014, 01:40 PM
They really should take my course . . .

More people would sign up if the price of the course could be washed from the soul.

Guanmagi-1
01-14-2014, 01:41 PM
It's unspeakably frustrating.

Yes. One more TR and I've got all 12 Iconics done. Sayonara.

Teh_Troll
01-14-2014, 01:55 PM
The only class combinations they should open up is to take away the stupid need for Iconics to have one level in... whatever. It's unspeakably frustrating.

Give them progressively awesome bonuses for taking their iconic class at levels 6/12/18 - but the enforced need to have one level in a class is just gaspingly stupid design, imho.

Sorry, but we never should have been allowed to TR into iconics in the first place. If you want the "win" you gotta "pay" for the heart.

If you need to find me I'll be playing my Bladeforged without pally levels or my Pure 20 Wizard sunelf.

Memnir
01-14-2014, 02:01 PM
Sorry, but we never should have been allowed to TR into iconics in the first place. If you want the "win" you gotta "pay" for the heart.I'm not talking about TRing.

Thrudh
01-14-2014, 02:05 PM
Splash a few levels for even more ridiculous power. It's gotten stupid lately.

How long before everyone is Bladeforged and centered before Turbine realizes how terrible they are at balancing things?

I looked up Bladeforged to see what makes them so awesome... Lots of Fortification... nice... Still not that awesome... A lot of wf bonuses and penalties... okay so no big deal...

Wait, what? Reconstruct? As an SLA? What? Reconstruct!!

When my poor hobbit fighter has to spend feats and ton of APs to get 4 heals, bladeforged get as many reconstructs as they can cast (based on SP - which you can refill)??

What??! Son-of-a-bi....

harry-pancreas
01-14-2014, 02:07 PM
Monk alignment restrictions should be non-chaotic instead of lawful
Bard and barbarian should be non-lawful instead of chaotic

Barbarian/monks and bard/monks galore! :)

please don't

Teh_Troll
01-14-2014, 02:11 PM
I looked up Bladeforged to see what makes them so awesome... Lots of Fortification... nice... Still not that awesome... A lot of wf bonuses and penalties... okay so no big deal...

Wait, what? Reconstruct? As an SLA? What? Reconstruct!!

When my poor hobbit fighter has to spend feats and ton of APs to get 4 heals, bladeforged get as many reconstructs as they can cast (based on SP - which you can refill)??

What??! Son-of-a-bi....

Not just that . . . "Power of the forge" is essentially HV Damage boost and can be used at the same time as fighter haste boost.

My 12/6/2 was human . . . so BF not only gives more DPS (weapon attachment, power attack, no loss of HV damage boost as PoTF is the same thing but better) but a friggin reconstruct clickie as well.

And with a Shroud SP item I think I'm at 395 SP at level 15? with the freebie gear hitting about 400 HP off a reconstruct with much room to get better.

Yeah, it's a no-brainer. The only reason not to be Bladeforged is you can't afford it.

Oh . . . and the SLA works under Madstone rage and somebody tested on lamania and told me it still works while Barbarian raged. So if you still got your LR+20 . . . get an LR+1, and alignment change, and make yourself a BF Barbarian with a reconstruct clickie.

Yeah . . . this game's not broken . . .

Lonnbeimnech
01-14-2014, 02:25 PM
Not just that . . . "Power of the forge" is essentially HV Damage boost and can be used at the same time as fighter haste boost.

My 12/6/2 was human . . . so BF not only gives more DPS (weapon attachment, power attack, no loss of HV damage boost as PoTF is the same thing but better) but a friggin reconstruct clickie as well.

And with a Shroud SP item I think I'm at 395 SP at level 15? with the freebie gear hitting about 400 HP off a reconstruct with much room to get better.

Yeah, it's a no-brainer. The only reason not to be Bladeforged is you can't afford it.

Oh . . . and the SLA works under Madstone rage and somebody tested on lamania and told me it still works while Barbarian raged. So if you still got your LR+20 . . . get an LR+1, and alignment change, and make yourself a BF Barbarian with a reconstruct clickie.

Yeah . . . this game's not broken . . .
Barbs were asking for years to get better self healing ability, and this is how it's served up...

Hjarki
01-14-2014, 02:53 PM
I got a better idea . . . change the game so monk isn't required on everything that's not a flavor build.

And we have a winner.

What really boggles my mind is that most of what makes a Monk imbalanced is senseless deviations from base PnP rules. The stances. Using TWF with unarmed. 10k Stars (with bows, no less). It's very much an 'unforced error' on the part of the DDO designers when they took a perfectly fine class and then augmented it to such extreme levels.

Monks are not supposed to be heavy damage-dealers or tanks. They certainly aren't supposed to be serious ranged combatants.

Unfortunately, it doesn't seem there is any inclination on the part of designers to do anything about the Monk imbalance. Even if there was, the solution wouldn't be Barbarian/Monks.

Violith
01-14-2014, 03:22 PM
Barbs were asking for years to get better self healing ability, and this is how it's served up...

hmm, nto sure who he was talking about. but in the threads I have seen where they were tested. the consensus was that it didnt work in barbarian rage.