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Failedlegend
12-24-2013, 07:26 AM
Hey all I just want to start off by saying this is NOT an EK build...at most its spends 9ap in EK simply to gain martial weapon and temporarily Light armor proficiency (all 3 builds switch to robes once Dex outpaces light armor, especially when they pick up Epic Mage Armor)

That said I currently have 3 versions of this build and the goal for all 3 is the same a Primary spellcaster than can TWF as a secondary thing. I'll make a seperate post for build's 2 and 3 but to start is the single-class elven wizard

Now this build was an attempt to do this idea without any multi-classing and it works although Build #2 and #3 have obvious advantages especially since the PM capstone is fairly meh but it is nice that this is possible


Elven Wiz20 (TWF Rapiers)

Str 8
Dex 18
Con 12
Int 18 (Lvl ups here)
Wis 8
Cha 10

Skills: Concen, Balance, UMD, MS

Level Order: Rogue1, Wiz 2-13, Rogue 14, Wiz 15 -20

1 TWF
1W Extend
3 SF: Enchant
6 Weapon Finesse
5W Empower
9 GSF: Enchant
10W Maximize
12 PL:Wiz
15 ITWF
15W Heighten
18 IC: Piercing
20W Mental Toughness
ED Shadowdancer
21 GTWF
24 ESF: Enchant
26 Epic Mage Armor
27 Epic Reflexes
28 Elusive

Failedlegend
12-24-2013, 07:30 AM
Pretty standard Wizard splash of 2 rogue for evasion and unlocks umd/trap skills but it also gives me rapier and light armor proficiency allowing me to pretty much ignore EK...picking up Venomed Blades and the extra Sneak attack is nice as well...not sure whether to go Shadowdancer or Magister+SD Twists with this one since it already has evasion



Elven Wiz18/Rogue2 (TWF Rapiers)

Str 8
Dex 18
Con 12
Int 18 (Lvl ups here)
Wis 8
Cha 10

SKills: Concen, DD, Search, Spot, UMD

Level Order: Rogue1, Wiz 2-13, Rogue 14, Wiz 15 -20

1 TWF
2W Extend
3 SF: Enchant
6 Weapon Finesse
6W Empower
9 GSF: Enchant
11W Maximize
12 PL:Wiz
15 ITWF
17W Heighten
18 IC: Piercing
ED Shadowdancer or Magister w/ SD Twists
21 GTWF
24 ESF: Enchant
26 Epic Mage Armor
27 Epic Reflexes
28 Elusive

Failedlegend
12-24-2013, 07:38 AM
This version of the build is primarily an attempt to boost negative spellpower (dark disciple = +20 neg spellpower for 2 AP, also +2% crit) as much as possible..heal skill included for completeness but I will not be taking it (see sig) also this one uses Maces instead of rapiers since well since Morninglord.

The Morninglord racial abilities are surprisingly useful (Light Guard FTW) if your planning to be a support character...if your in a static group with a few other spellcasters picking up Divine Vitality will make your friends really happy :)


ML Wiz18/Rogue1/ML1 (TWF Light Maces)

Str 8
Dex 16
Con 12
Int 20 (Lvl ups here)
Wis 8
Cha 8

SKills: Concen, OL, UMD, Heal, Balance

1 TWF
3 SF: Enchant
3W Extend
6 Weapon Finesse
7W Empower
9 GSF: Enchant
12 PL:Wiz
12W Maximize
15 ITWF
17W Heighten
18 IC: Bludgeon
ED Shadowdancer
21 GTWF
24 ESF: Enchant
26 Epic Mage Armor
27 Epic Reflexes
28 Elusive

unbongwah
12-24-2013, 09:36 AM
Any chance you can spare a few stat pts & a feat for Power Atk? And have you already considered wiz 18 / monk 2 for extra feats + Evasion?

Failedlegend
12-25-2013, 10:58 AM
Any chance you can spare a few stat pts & a feat for Power Atk? And have you already considered wiz 18 / monk 2 for extra feats + Evasion?

Well I really do like having OL/trap skill also the venomed blades and the sneak attack but what 2 feats would you suggest?

unbongwah
12-25-2013, 01:05 PM
TWF & Power Atk are the obvious picks for monk feats, given your stated goals. You'd also be centered w/short swords, so maybe switch to drow?

Failedlegend
12-27-2013, 10:20 PM
TWF & Power Atk are the obvious picks for monk feats, given your stated goals. You'd also be centered w/short swords, so maybe switch to drow?

Well I've alreadi taken TWF (and Improved/Greater Versions) although picking up PA would be nice but does its +5 do more damage than 1D8 (venomed blades), haste boost and damage boost?

aasra
12-31-2013, 10:50 AM
If you are not dead set on TWF I can recommend THF Dwarf with CON to damage from the racial tree. I'm finishing up my 18/2 Wizard/Rogue life and I'm very happy with how the build worked out. I spent 4 feats on melee (Power Attack, Cleave, Great Cleave and Improved Critical) and put the rest in caster feats. I split stats between CON, INT (which I maxed, level ups here) and STR (started with 12 IIRC, just enough to get Power Attack on level 3). For the first 15 levels or so I did pretty much all my killing with a great axe and aoe spells, then gradually shifting to a mix of melee (mostly cleave spam plus the first cleave from EK) and necromancy instant kills. The caster side of things works just fine, once you get into the teens the loss of caster levels isn't really noticeable and before that melee is more effective anyway. The downside of ditching STR is that you won't qualify for overwhelming critical when you get to epics, but since I'm doing past lives that's not so much a concern for me. You get a very decent HP pool and good fort save from using CON as your damage stat, with Insightful Reflexes and the immunities from Undead form reflex and will are no problem either. All in all a very survivable character with good damage output and trapping skills. Anyway, food for thought :)

Failedlegend
01-04-2014, 02:04 PM
Hmmmm...THF with Dwarf is actually a really cool idea wizards go Con/Int anyways and IR negates the need for Dex...not having OC is only a minor issue...I have to go to work soon but when I get back I'll look into what it will look like.

Failedlegend
01-05-2014, 10:49 PM
How's this look?


Dwarven Wiz18/Rogue2

Str 13
Dex 8
Con 19
Int 18 (Lvl ups here)
Wis 12
Cha 6

Rogue@ 1 & 9

Skills: Search, DD, Concen,UMD, Spot, OL

Feats:

1 Insightful Reflexes
2W Extend
3 Power Attack
6 Cleave
6W Maximize
9 Great Cleave
12 Dragonmark
12W Heighten
15 PL:Wiz
17W Empower
18 IC: Bludgeon
ED Shadowdancer
21 SF: Enchant
24 GSF: Enchant
26 ???
27 Epic Reflexes
28 Elusive Target

aasra
01-07-2014, 10:57 PM
I would recommend that you take heighten earlier, heightened web works like a charm while leveling and for a few enhancement points you can get it practically free. I'm guessing the dragon mark is for the Earthgrab enhancement for Dwarf? If so you probably won't have much use for it for the first few levels. I would consider moving some stuff around and getting insightful reflexes in earlier. Also I'd switch the order of Maximize and Empower, might just be a personal preference but I find the Maximize damage boost more useful than empower. It looks pretty similar to the order I used, I didn't have the dragonmark feat however (but I was tempted :p):


PROGRESSION:
1 Rogue (1) – Insightful Reflexes
2 Wizard (1)- maximize (wizard)
3 Wizard (2)– Power Attack
4 Wizard (3)
5 Wizard (4)
6 Wizard (5)– extend (wizard), Cleave
7 Wizard (6)
8 Wizard (7)
9 Rogue (2) – Great cleave
10 Wizard (8)
11 Wizard (9)
12 Wizard (10) – Heighten (wizard), necro focus
13 Wizard (11)
14 Wizard (12)
15 Wizard (13) – Greater necro focus
16 Wizard (14)
17 Wizard (15) - Spell pen (wizard)
18 Wizard (16) – IC: slash
19 Wizard (17)
20 Wizard (18)

Well that was the plan at least, I ended up with no greater necro focus and empower instead. I took empower at level 12 and was going to switch it out later, but I messed up a bit :) Considering that my necro worked fine anyway it might actually have been the better option to keep empower.

Failedlegend
01-16-2014, 01:48 PM
Delaying the DM does make sense because E-Grab is the main reason to take it (although Radiant Forceshield and Spell Resistance are really nice) also I'll likely want to spend a few APs elsewhere first so I'd say

So what about this order

1 Insightful Reflexes
2W Extend
3 Power Attack
6 Cleave
6W Maximize
9 Great Cleave
12 Dragonmark
12W Heighten
15 PL:Wiz
17W Empower
18 IC: Bludgeon
ED Shadowdancer
21 SF: Enchant
24 GSF: Enchant
26 ???
27 Epic Reflexes
28 Elusive Target

SlayerInFlorida
01-17-2014, 12:01 PM
I thought the idea of a dwarf mage with THF looked interesting. This is my first draft using the char planner - please provide feedback.
(+1 strength tome before level 3 and +2 int tome at level 10 for more skill points. Enhancements still in work).

How would Eldritch Knight work with this?


Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 04.20.01
DDO Character Planner Home Page (http://www.rjcyberware.com/DDO)

Level 20 Lawful Good Dwarf Male
(2 Rogue \ 18 Wizard)
Hit Points: 234
Spell Points: 1199
BAB: 10\10\15\20
Fortitude: 11
Reflex: 16
Will: 11

Starting Ending
Abilities Base Stats Base Stats
(32 Point) (Level 1) (Level 20)
Strength 12 13
Dexterity 8 8
Constitution 18 18
Intelligence 18 25
Wisdom 10 10
Charisma 6 6

Tomes Used
+1 Tome of Strength used at level 2
+2 Tome of Intelligence used at level 10

Feat/Enhancement
Modified Skills
Skills (Level 20)
Balance 10
Concentration 28
Disable Device 30
Open Lock 11
Search 32
Spellcraft 30
Spot 15

Level 1 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Insightful Reflexes


Level 2 (Wizard)
Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Maximize Spell


Level 3 (Wizard)
Feat: (Selected) Power Attack


Level 4 (Wizard)


Level 5 (Wizard)


Level 6 (Wizard)
Feat: (Selected) Cleave
Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Heighten Spell


Level 7 (Wizard)


Level 8 (Wizard)


Level 9 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Great Cleave


Level 10 (Wizard)


Level 11 (Wizard)


Level 12 (Wizard)
Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Spell Focus: Necromancy
Feat: (Selected) Spell Penetration


Level 13 (Wizard)


Level 14 (Wizard)


Level 15 (Wizard)
Feat: (Selected) Greater Spell Penetration


Level 16 (Wizard)


Level 17 (Wizard)
Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Empower Spell


Level 18 (Wizard)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Slashing Weapons


Level 19 (Wizard)


Level 20 (Wizard)
Enhancement: Dwarf - Dwarven Toughness (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Dwarf - Dwarven Constitution (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Dwarf - Dwarven Toughness (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Dwarf - Dwarven Constitution (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Dwarf - Dwarven Toughness (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Dwarf - Iron Stomach (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Dwarf - Stout (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Dwarf - Axe Training (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Dwarf - Dwarven Tactics (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Dwarf - Axe Training (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Dwarf - Axe Training (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Dwarf - Axe Training (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Dwarf - Throw Your Weight Around (Axes) (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Archmage (Wiz) - Conjuration I: Grease (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Archmage (Wiz) - Conjuration II: Web (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Archmage (Wiz) - Energy of the Scholar (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Archmage (Wiz) - Spell Critical: Elemental and Force I (Rank 1)

Failedlegend
01-17-2014, 09:34 PM
Honest EK is really not worth the AP right now there's a few tier 1s and maybe a tier 2 ability which isnt bad (I spend enough to unlock spellsword since its has great synergy with echoes of power for when ur out of mana it gives a decent, unlimited boost to damage) perma-tenser's is nice but I'd much rather an effect that doubled extends effectiveness and made ur self-cast buffs undispellable.

TL:DR only spend a few pts. in EK, focus on AM or PM or both. Subject to change if the devs fix EK.

SlayerInFlorida
01-18-2014, 08:02 AM
Thanks for the info on EK.

I made a mistake on my char planner - you can't use a tome before you are level 3 - so I have to start my character with 13 strength at creation so i can take power attack at level 3.

aasra
01-19-2014, 09:57 PM
I thought I'd link to a build that I took inspiration from for my CON melee wizard, it might be useful to someone else as well.

https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/427578-Korsat-%E2%80%93-18Wizard-2Monk-Undead-Blitzer

The Pale Trapper thread also has some useful information:
https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/422622-Pale-Trapper-for-new-players-%28Human-18-2-Wizard-Rogue%29

The builds you guys posted look sensible to me.