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LavidDynch
11-17-2013, 10:26 PM
BUILD IS ABOUT TO BE NERFED. NO MORE NONE MONK SPLASH BUILDSNO MORE NONE MONK SPLASH BUILDSNO MORE NONE MONK SPLASH BUILDSNO MORE NONE MONK SPLASH BUILDSNO MORE NONE MONK SPLASH BUILDSNO MORE NONE MONK SPLASH BUILDSNO MORE NONE MONK SPLASH BUILDSNO MORE NONE MONK SPLASH BUILDSNO MORE NONE MONK SPLASH BUILDSNO MORE NONE MONK SPLASH BUILDS


The Dirk Jiggler

This is the offspring of some serious trial and error and hours of grind just to test things out -- I think it is one of the most fun hybrid builds that you can play at the moment, mostly due to the fast innate movement speed and action packed 'in your face' arcade way of play style (stun, instakill and burst dmg).

This build feels like a jetfighter amongst bombers!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TEsw38smbWc&feature=youtu.be

16 Mnk, 2 Rgr, 2Ftr
Fury of the Wild
Twists: Rejuv, LD tactics, Dance of Flowers
36 point build.
Pastlife: 3 mnk, 3 ftr, 1 pal,

HO - +3 Tactical DC (only matched by dwarf) can start with 18 Wisdom, 18 Strenght and MAX out wisdom with level stats and still reach 23 Strenght required for OC.
16 monk - Quivering Palm, Adamantine DR. + half die step compared to 15 mnk
2 Rgr - Bow Strenght, TWF
2 Fighter - +3 Tactical DC, 2 feats, haste boost.

* worth noting so far: HE is better dmg and has a smoother attack animation than HO while using fists, but can't reach the absolute top Quivering Palm DC that is required for harder EE's .

Stats
Str 18, 48 (5tome, 12item, 2ship 5morale, 2Ship, 2Yug, 2ED)
Dex 13, 26 (5tome, 8item, 2ship -2 Earth Stance)
Con 13, 42 (5tome, 12item, 2ship, 5morale,2 yug 3 Earth stance )
Int 6 ----
Wis: 18, 54 (7lvl,, 5tome, 4AP, 13-14tiem, 2Yug, 2ED, 2ship)
Cha 6, 20 (5tome, 7item, 2ship)

PRR: 68
HP: 950-1050
Saves: 62, 50, 55 (no tensers)
Double Strike::14%
Skills:: UMD, Concentration, Heal.

Heroic Feats (12)
7 base+ 3 mnk +2 ftr
1. PA*
2-3 Cleave x2
4 Imp. Crit - Bludgeon
5-6 TWFx3 (one feat gained from Rgr)
7 Stunning Fist*
8 Pointblank
9 Manyshot
10 Zen Archery*
11. PL monk
12. PL pal
*monk feat

Epic Feats
OC
Martial Arts
Vorpal Fists (Epic Fortitude is probably the wiser choice, but I am all for dmg)

Destiny Feats
Tactician
Superior TWF

Quivering Palm DC 73
18 base
22 wis
16 Item
6 LD tactics
3 FTR PL
6 HO/FTR tactic
2 Feat

Not worried about stunning fist DC.

Leveling
01: Monk
02: Fighter
03: Ranger
04: Ranger (free TWF)
05-18: Monk
19: Fighter
20: Monk

Enhancements
Half-Orc - Orcish Fury
Half-Orc - Mighty Sundering (Rank 3)
Kensei (Ftr) - Kensei Focus: Martial Arts
Kensei (Ftr) - Kensei Weapon Specialization: Martial Arts
Kensei (Ftr) - Haste Boost (Rank 3)
Kensei (Ftr) - Tactics (Rank 3)
Ninja Spy (Mnk) - Ninja Training (Rank 2
Ninja Spy (Mnk) - Shadow Veil
Ninja Spy (Mnk) - Sneak Attack Training (Rank 3)
Ninja Spy (Mnk) - Acrobatic (Rank 3)
Ninja Spy (Mnk) - Subtlety
Ninja Spy (Mnk) - Unbalancing Strike
Ninja Spy (Mnk) - Agility (Rank 3)
Ninja Spy (Mnk) - Wisdom (Rank 2)
Ninja Spy (Mnk) - No Mercy (Rank 2)
Shintao (Mnk) - Bastion of Purity
Shintao (Mnk) - Protection from Tainted Creatures
Shintao (Mnk) - Iron Hand
Shintao (Mnk) - Argent Fist
Shintao (Mnk) - Deft Strikes (Rank 3)
Shintao (Mnk) - Exemplar (Rank 3)
Shintao (Mnk) - Iron Skin (Rank 3)
Shintao (Mnk) - Fists of Iron
Shintao (Mnk) - Conditioning (Rank 3)
Shintao (Mnk) - Instinctive Defense
Shintao (Mnk) - Wisdom (Rank 2)
Shintao (Mnk) - Violence Begets Violence
Shintao (Mnk) - Meditation of War
Shintao (Mnk) - Empty Hand Mastery

Gear
Head: Black Helmet +8 strenght, SLOT: +2 Luck, 200SP
Armor: Black Dragon,, SLOT:16 PRR //
Necky: Jorg collar,haste with SLOT: Vitality 20HP and Deathblock
Trinket: Prowess +3 ins. Str
Eyes: 10 wis/10 Res
Belt: 10 con 50hp, encrusted belt (30hp, con6)
Bracers: 30% AMP Gr. conv of parrying with ritual (+5saves)
Gloves: FOT healing SLOT: Imperial Blood, 8 Dex
Ring1.(Swap!). Dun Robar +10 shattering,with, ins +2con, Elemental absorbation ring, TOD ring (encrusted) holyburst.
Ring2. Deadly X Accurracy
Cloak: Cloak of the bear (+6DC) // Adamantine // the jewelled cloak, ghost cloak
Boots: Fort 120% of dodge 8% with yellow slot SLOT: +2 ins.wis

Weapons
Antipod slotted with level drain.
Pinion x2 (good/elemental dmg)
Epic Bow of the Silver flame.

Swapping healing gloves for backstabbers and slot devotion on antipod is something i'm considering, will cost me a slot. Gear can always be mixed and matched to fit your current loot situation, for instance, getting intricate field optics +3 wis will change the current set up for me.

DPS?
I will try to get a video out as soon as possible only afraid to overheat my laptop by doing so at this stage.... below is the dmg I'm seeing at the moment.

Red named:
"White hits" 85-100 + various (SA, elemental dmg etc)
Crits around 400-500+ various numbers

Stunned mobs:
"White hits" 200-300
Crits: 400 - 900

Ranged dmg is a steady 1.5-3k/Furyhit.

Please feel free to post suggestions and improvements, or if you have any other questions.

Bests,

Jichael

redspecter23
11-17-2013, 10:35 PM
It looks like a fun build for sure, but to name it "Dirk Jiggler" and not wield daggers seems like a waste of an interesting name. Perhaps I'm missing some obscure Boogie Nights reference or something.

voodoogroves
11-17-2013, 10:38 PM
His characters (and builds) are all name-variants.

Jichael - your +3 HO tactics ... just the sundering bit (since you're ignoring stunning fist DC) is what you're talking to right?

LavidDynch
11-17-2013, 11:05 PM
His characters (and builds) are all name-variants.

Jichael - your +3 HO tactics ... just the sundering bit (since you're ignoring stunning fist DC) is what you're talking to right?

Hey.

Ye, in theory a dwarf would reach a better overall tactics.

Stunning fist is for some odd reason more functional, even with 10 less DC than what quivering palm, from what i have noticed. I'm not ignorring Stunning fist -- just not worried about it. I believe off hand strikes adds to stunning fist, but I suspect the same goes for QP as I have clearly missed a QP due to activating it out of range and second later the mob is dead since my character has come within the target box (not sure).


@redspecter23: fists are more manly than knifes.

whomhead
11-18-2013, 09:55 AM
Ranged dmg is a steady 1.5-3k/hit.

I'm curious about this, as it seems unlikely to me that you're actually getting 1.5-3k damage per hit... that is unless I'm making some correct assumptions about how you came up with that. I'm assuming that without IC:ranged, IPS, or 10k stars, that you're only whipping out the bow for a Furyshot. If you're claiming 1.5-3k per hit, then that would seem to me to be the total damage dealt by an average 4 arrow burst, including your adrenaline overloaded burst.

I'm asking because I've been considering a build like this, that stays mostly unarmed but busts out a bow situationally or for burst DPS. My major concern is that the ranged DPS is going to be pretty bad, so was surprised to see the number you quoted above.

Thanks in advance for elaborating, and for the nice build!

mrtweakin
11-18-2013, 10:33 AM
Have you compared the additional 10% off-hand strikes by going 3 ranger with that of the 1 additional monk giving a half die step?

Assuming this is FotW? If so then yeah, those are the ranged numbers my 15/3/2 gets. Seems right on.

unbongwah
11-18-2013, 10:55 AM
Any chance you can squeeze in Imp Sunder somewhere? You might not need it, but it's essentially a "free" stacking +3 DCs (-3 Fortitude) to Stunning Fist & Quivering Palm vs tougher EE mobs. The extra crit dmg to higher-Fortification targets doesn't hurt, either.

Also, does +offhand procs from Tempest still apply to handwraps? If so, you may want to consider rgr 3 / monk 15: you lose a pt to monk DCs, +0.5[W], and Adamantine ki strike; but gain +10% offhand from Tempest for a full 100% proc chance (w/Deft Strikes).

LavidDynch
11-18-2013, 11:31 AM
Any chance you can squeeze in Imp Sunder somewhere? You might not need it, but it's essentially a "free" stacking +3 DCs (-3 Fortitude) to Stunning Fist & Quivering Palm vs tougher EE mobs. The extra crit dmg to higher-Fortification targets doesn't hurt, either.

Also, does +offhand procs from Tempest still apply to handwraps? If so, you may want to consider rgr 3 / monk 15: you lose a pt to monk DCs, +0.5[W], and Adamantine ki strike; but gain +10% offhand from Tempest for a full 100% proc chance (w/Deft Strikes).

I believe you need to have Turbine approved weapons equipped for any of the ranger TWF enhancements to work, but there was also a time where i believed in Santa Clause in other words i might be wrong...

However, if it does work it would be a viable split, i heard from someone that monk DC/lvl is rounded up; no loss of DC. I feel this build is AP starved so that could be another compromise for that split.

Improved Sundering is also under consideration, glad someone pointed that out. Swapping out PL:pal for it, If i have to.

LavidDynch
11-18-2013, 11:36 AM
Assuming this is FotW? If so then yeah, those are the ranged numbers my 15/3/2 gets. Seems right on.

The video is a bit stressed. I almost cut out the entire first encounter due to fighting with a scroll in my hand.

Normally the bow dmg is a bit higher -- but videos doesnt lie, i guess...

whomhead
11-18-2013, 12:36 PM
The video is a bit stressed. I almost cut out the entire first encounter due to fighting with a scroll in my hand.

Normally the bow dmg is a bit higher -- but videos doesnt lie, i guess...

So, it looks like 1.5k on a natural 19 or 20 critical, 750 on others, and >100 per hit on normal attacks. That's nowhere near 1.5-3k per hit. I'm glad though, as those numbers match up quite nicely with my monkcher, and I couldn't figure out where I was leaving more than 1000 damage on the table compared to you.

supott
11-18-2013, 01:01 PM
i am thinking about the same split, and i am surprised that the 12 monk 6 ranger is so popular, when this split gives you quivering palm.

i was planning on these feats:

fighter 2:
1 power attack,
2 itwf

monk 3:
1 stunning,
2 zen,
3 10k

normal 7:
1 pbs,
2 precise shot,
3 manyshot,
4 gtwf,
5 ips,
6 ic:bludgeon
7 free

epic 3:
1 combat archery
2 vorpal
3 ic: piercing

LavidDynch
11-18-2013, 01:07 PM
So, it looks like 1.5k on a natural 19 or 20 critical, 750 on others, and >100 per hit on normal attacks. That's nowhere near 1.5-3k per hit. I'm glad though, as those numbers match up quite nicely with my monkcher, and I couldn't figure out where I was leaving more than 1000 damage on the table compared to you.

Hehe -- have been playing a lot in groups lately, alot of those groups has means to double the dmg(i have seen bow crit around 6k on this build, and 4k hit with fist) nerve venom/pinned mobs are more usual then non-helpless mobs. so maybe i was perhaps exaggerating a bit which is human nature, and there is a lot of human natures on the forums :D

But no worries -- The dmg should be about equal to a monkcher without the deadlyshot ofc.. and only for 20seconds. (I believe most monkchers don't pick IMA as feat so perhaps got a very tiny bit of edge there...:P

LavidDynch
11-18-2013, 01:19 PM
i am thinking about the same split, and i am surprised that the 12 monk 6 ranger is so popular, when this split gives you quivering palm.

i was planning on these feats:

fighter 2:
1 power attack,
2 itwf

monk 3:
1 stunning,
2 zen,
3 10k

normal 7:
1 pbs,
2 precise shot,
3 manyshot,
4 gtwf,
5 ips,
6 ic:bludgeon
7 free

epic 3:
1 combat archery
2 vorpal
3 ic: piercing

here is the thing -- i also could fit in full archer utility; IPS etc etc.. it all looks so god **** good on paper, in reality, and i tried it, you will be:
a/ A KI starved glass cannon without ammunition.
b/ A gimped monkcher confused if your going to melee or range. Trust me it will just be very very awkward -- not play friendly at all, and not very effective.

edit: the reason why people gp 12/6/2x builds is that archery is so nice at the moment that quivering palm will never be an option. Lets put it this way: instead of gather up the next batch of 40 mobs to one-two shot, you will risk your life to melee one or two mobs?

unbongwah
11-18-2013, 03:38 PM
i am thinking about the same split, and i am surprised that the 12 monk 6 ranger is so popular, when this split gives you quivering palm.
I think it's partly some folks (inc. me) are still hung up on Ye Olde Monkcher combo; but also that switching from 12/6/2 to 16/2/2 means giving up 3 feats (4 if you include Diehard, though who counts that?), so something's gotta give on your build.

Plus the tough part is figuring out what to splash on your monk. Apart from rgr or ftr, there's also:

Paladin 2 gets you Divine Grace; twist in Bane of Undeath and you can use Divine Might as well.
Cleric or FvS 2 gets you low-tier Warpriest goodies (Smite Foe/Weakness, Divine Might, Wall of Steel); it also unlock Heal skill & Emp Heal feat (great if you've got Rejuv Cocoon).
Druid 2 gets you Ram's Might, Vengeful Hunter, doublestrike action boost, Beguile (still a useful debuff for trash, IMHO); and again access to Emp Heal.


So many options, so hard to choose...

LavidDynch
11-18-2013, 08:27 PM
Just a Blitz video -- Sorry about the quality.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dx0wyEj_V4U&feature=youtu.be

jskinner937
11-19-2013, 01:17 AM
Has something changed? Adrenaline on a unarmed build used to be terribly SLOW and AwkWaRD!!!

LavidDynch
11-19-2013, 08:22 AM
Has something changed? Adrenaline on a unarmed build used to be terribly SLOW and AwkWaRD!!!

Adrenaline is slow on all melee, as you can tell; adrenaline knockdown duration is only 1-3 seconds with wraps and +16 crit range doesn't apply.

Elsaabeth
11-19-2013, 01:00 PM
Looks a fun build - just about to TR my pure monk and this looks awesome.

2 quick questions:

Whats the suggested leveling order?
I am thinking of going dwarf over half-orc (+3 DC and i think HO are really ugly! [although Dwarves aren't much better]) - worried about stat distribution for the feats. Any thoughts?

Thanks for taking the time to post.

-Spryng

LavidDynch
11-19-2013, 06:16 PM
Looks a fun build - just about to TR my pure monk and this looks awesome.

2 quick questions:

Whats the suggested leveling order?
I am thinking of going dwarf over half-orc (+3 DC and i think HO are really ugly! [although Dwarves aren't much better]) - worried about stat distribution for the feats. Any thoughts?

Thanks for taking the time to post.

-Spryng

Dwarf is just as good as horc.
I started with monk for skillpoints (picked stunningfist and PA), went one ftr (for haste boost + feat: cleave), 2 rgr (mostly so I wouldn't pick TWF by misstake), rest monk up til lvl18.

at lvl18 i started to spec AP to get a functional QP. You will have to be in firestance a lot during heroics -- and that is normal.

Stats depends on tomes: you need to reach 17 Dex by lvl19.

Hope that helped.

ChicagoChris
11-19-2013, 08:49 PM
The Dirk Jiggler


16 Mnk, 2 Rgr, 2Ftr
Fury of the Wild
Twists: Rejuv, LD tactics, Dance of Flowers
36 point build.
Pastlife: 3 mnk, 3 ftr, 1 pal,

HO - +3 Tactical DC (only matched by dwarf) can start with 18 Wisdom, 18 Strenght and MAX out wisdom with level stats and still reach 23 Strenght required for OC.
16 monk - Quivering Palm, Adamantine DR. + half die step compared to 15 mnk
2 Rgr - Bow Strenght, TWF
2 Fighter - +3 Tactical DC, 2 feats, haste boost.

* worth noting so far: HE is better dmg and has a smoother attack animation than HO while using fists, but can't reach the absolute top Quivering Palm DC that is required for harder EE's .

Stats
Str 18, 48 (5tome, 12item, 2ship 5morale, 2Ship, 2Yug, 2ED)
Dex 13, 26 (5tome, 8item, 2ship -2 Earth Stance)
Con 13, 42 (5tome, 12item, 2ship, 5morale,2 yug 3 Earth stance )
Int 6 ----
Wis: 18, 54 (7lvl,, 5tome, 4AP, 13-14tiem, 2Yug, 2ED, 2ship)
Cha 6, 20 (5tome, 7item, 2ship)

PRR: 68
HP: 950-1050
Saves: 62, 50, 55 (no tensers)
Double Strike::14%
Skills:: UMD, Concentration, Heal.

Heroic Feats (12)
7 base+ 3 mnk +2 ftr
1. PA*
2-3 Cleave x2
4 Imp. Crit - Bludgeon
5-6 TWFx3 (one feat gained from Rgr)
7 Stunning Fist*
8 Pointblank
9 Manyshot
10 Zen Archery*
11. PL monk
12. PL pal
*monk feat

Epic Feats
OC
Martial Arts
Vorpal Fists (Epic Fortitude is probably the wiser choice, but I am all for dmg)

Destiny Feats
Tactician
Superior TWF

...

Bests,

Jichael

What's your leveling order?

Looks like
1: monk
2-3 fighter
4 monk
5-6 ranger
then all monk

Thanks

LavidDynch
11-19-2013, 10:04 PM
What's your leveling order?

Looks like
1: monk
2-3 fighter
4 monk
5-6 ranger
then all monk

Thanks

I should have included this in the build.

If you want evasion earlier -- go for it, but i'd go ranger pretty early to get rid of them since the second level of ranger blocks future TWF-progression. Also, you are pretty free to pick "fun" feats such as cleave and great cleave early on.

I think i went something like this (leveled same build twice).
01: Monk
02: Fighter
03: Ranger
04: Ranger (free TWF)
05-18: Monk
19: Fighter
20: Monk

jskinner937
11-19-2013, 10:55 PM
Adrenaline is slow on all melee, as you can tell; adrenaline knockdown duration is only 1-3 seconds with wraps and +16 crit range doesn't apply.

However with unarmed it actually reduces DPS since it interrupts the attack sequence and takes a second to restart. Unbridled Fury is the exception since it has no lazy animation like the single shot adrenalines. Blitz is the way to go for unarmed or any true DPS melee.

LavidDynch
11-20-2013, 09:50 AM
However with unarmed it actually reduces DPS since it interrupts the attack sequence and takes a second to restart. Unbridled Fury is the exception since it has no lazy animation like the single shot adrenalines. Blitz is the way to go for unarmed or any true DPS melee.

It interrupts the attack sequense for all melee. Blitz is very OP -- but also very situational at the moment due to the zoning, outside of Blitz LD is weak and even weaker on wraps... this build steps in a quest and is ready to go everytime = a lot more fun.

Fafnir
11-21-2013, 04:59 PM
Very nice build and gear layout.

If you can post what feats you take when, it would be interesting. The mix between bonus feats for monk and bonus feats for fighter means that you need to be careful to optimise.

You run in earth stance? I dislike Mediation of War in that case because of the negative to dodge cap.

LavidDynch
11-24-2013, 10:51 AM
Very nice build and gear layout.

If you can post what feats you take when, it would be interesting. The mix between bonus feats for monk and bonus feats for fighter means that you need to be careful to optimise.

You run in earth stance? I dislike Mediation of War in that case because of the negative to dodge cap.

Thanks.

I have * on my monk feats. It is really hard to screw up the feat selections for this kind of build.

Yes, earth is my goto stance. The extra PRR is worth it. DMG with bow and fists increased.

The only problem this build really has is the total lack of a second heal; I could probably get my UMD up to 38+, heal scrolls isn't really my thing thou.

will take a deeper look on bladeforged...

jskinner937
11-24-2013, 12:13 PM
It interrupts the attack sequense for all melee. Blitz is very OP -- but also very situational at the moment due to the zoning, outside of Blitz LD is weak and even weaker on wraps... this build steps in a quest and is ready to go everytime = a lot more fun.

You know you can hold a blitz charge through zoning? I usualy charge on my way to a quest and if i manage to lose it during a quest (which is not often) it does not take long to charge with C,GC,MS, whatever else you have SB, SF, Trip, etc.

macadope
11-24-2013, 06:46 PM
I made that build back in sept.

I wanted to share the kind of unarmed numbers it can do.

https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/425379-Highest-unarmed-damage?highlight=Highest+unarmed+damage

Those numbers were without no mercy at all, and was only lvl25. And while punching those numbers I had about a 68qp.

I don't have a good crit screen shotted but you can do the math there.

LavidDynch
11-24-2013, 07:04 PM
I made that build back in sept.

I wanted to share the kind of unarmed numbers it can do.

https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/425379-Highest-unarmed-damage?highlight=Highest+unarmed+damage

Those numbers were without no mercy at all, and was only lvl25. And while punching those numbers I had about a 68qp.

I don't have a good crit screen shotted but you can do the math there.

I recorded a crit of 6.470 dmg (1:36 - 1:44 of the blitz video) -- I must say that this is not a build that would win any wraps-dmg championships --

LavidDynch
02-07-2014, 02:45 AM
updated the build for next update.

whomhead
02-07-2014, 07:02 AM
I hadn't realized this was your thread. I just have to laugh, and say this...


You can build an effective hybrid, but a monkcher with QP. ummm no.

LavidDynch
02-07-2014, 07:42 AM
I hadn't realized this was your thread. I just have to laugh, and say this...

This is not a monkcher -- it is an effective hybrid build (similar to cetuss build, juggernaut etc).

edit: i have other new concepts to be tested once they have nerfed monks back to the soulstone age. This build was really really fun to play thou, i will make a final farewell video of it) that should be pretty neat to watch.

unbongwah
02-07-2014, 07:47 AM
I hadn't realized this was your thread. I just have to laugh, and say this...
Most people consider monkchers to be full-time archers with 10K Stars, Slaying Arrows, and IPS. This build only takes Manyshot & Zen Archery to exploit that burst DPS option. So technically, he's not contradicting himself. :) It's possible to come up with a monkcher w/QP - e.g., HE or elf monk 15 / rgr 4 / ftr 1 should have all the necessary feats, then it's just a matter of spending APs - but then the tough part is getting your DCs high enough to make QP relevant.

Takllin
02-07-2014, 08:35 AM
This is not a monkcher -- it is an effective hybrid build (similar to cetuss build, juggernaut etc).

edit: i have other new concepts to be tested once they have nerfed monks back to the soulstone age. This build was really really fun to play thou, i will make a final farewell video of it) that should be pretty neat to watch.

Are you saying its nerfed because shattering no longer affects QP DC?

They have kept other Tactics bonuses to the DC of it, just not shatter specifically.

unbongwah
02-07-2014, 09:01 AM
They have kept other Tactics bonuses to the DC of it, just not shatter specifically.
That's still a -13 DC loss on this build (10 from Shatter +10, 3 from HO Sunder enhs), dropping it to 60 DC, which I presume is considered too low to be viable in current endgame. You'll be able to "charge up" QP's DC by using it repeatedly and adding Imp Sunder (as I suggested 3 mos. ago) would also help; but it will no longer be quite so OP.

Takllin
02-07-2014, 09:08 AM
That's still a -13 DC loss on this build (10 from Shatter +10, 3 from HO Sunder enhs), dropping it to 60 DC, which I presume is considered too low to be viable in current endgame. You'll be able to "charge up" QP's DC by using it repeatedly and adding Imp Sunder (as I suggested 3 mos. ago) would also help; but it will no longer be quite so OP.

Yeah I just wanted to ask incase I was missing something else that was getting the nerf bat.

LavidDynch
02-07-2014, 09:33 AM
That's still a -13 DC loss on this build (10 from Shatter +10, 3 from HO Sunder enhs), dropping it to 60 DC, which I presume is considered too low to be viable in current endgame. You'll be able to "charge up" QP's DC by using it repeatedly and adding Imp Sunder (as I suggested 3 mos. ago) would also help; but it will no longer be quite so OP.

A monk that doesnt hit "the flow DC", i would say around 73-75 will quickly end up as a dead monk and dead monks don't charge anything...

I consider QP to be just as good as SF in terms defence. When u kite in an S backwards (mob spawns tends to be more than 2-3, more like 10, and you do not want to get mobbed as a monk) you will have about 2 enemies on you when you choose to engage, monks dont have the raw dmg to mow down enemies as other builds to avoid dmg. So, if Turbine decimate QP your left side will be in the open nonstop, and in EE they hit hard.

If Turbine ever fix the knockdown in fury, this build wouldnt suffer of the QP nerf (as much as other monks). the proposed nerf will literally kill monks. will be hilarious to watch, i can give them that.

whomhead
02-07-2014, 09:52 AM
This is not a monkcher -- it is an effective hybrid build (similar to cetuss build, juggernaut etc).

So much ridiculousness over what amounts to semantics and two feats, as far as I can tell. If I hadn't used the term monkcher in the title, then I presumably would have gotten nothing but actual helpful responses...? I'm still laughing. These forums really can be quite horrible.

LavidDynch
02-07-2014, 12:08 PM
So much ridiculousness over what amounts to semantics and two feats, as far as I can tell. If I hadn't used the term monkcher in the title, then I presumably would have gotten nothing but actual helpful responses...? I'm still laughing. These forums really can be quite horrible.

There was more than semantics and two feats. Unbongwah had a crystal clear definition of a monkcher 2-3 posts up here...I´m sorry if you didnt perceive the information i posted in your thread as usefull. Its not like i had any experience of your planned build or anything.

Teh_Troll
02-07-2014, 12:24 PM
If Turbine ever fix the knockdown in fury, this build wouldnt suffer . . .

/troll-mode off

How much of a DPS hit do you get using celestias?

LavidDynch
02-07-2014, 12:27 PM
/troll-mode off

How much of a DPS hit do you get using celestias?

No idea as i only have one (so far)

edit: aaaaah.. now i see where ur getting at but then you can´t use SF... my dull mind has taken some heavy tackles on my future project (also a flavor build)

whomhead
02-07-2014, 01:32 PM
There was more than semantics and two feats.

Only if you stop reading at the word monkcher. In the other thread I said things like:


Which feat do you all think is the most useful on a monkcher (16 monk/2 fight/2 rang that spends most time in melee and pulls out a bow for situational/burst DPS)


I choose to go melee most of the time primarily because I just prefer the play style. Stunning fist, quivering palm, great cleave and fists of iron are fun to cycle through in melee, and quite effective as well. I normally bust out the bow for a furyshot boss beatdown and whenever manyshot is off timer. I am admittedly not optimized for best 10k stars usage (only 42 wis in water stance with pinion out), but I typically find the DPS for it to lag behind what I can do with wraps, Unbridled Fury aside, of course.

To describe the way I like to play the character. So if you actually read it, you will see that it matches rather closely to your build here, albeit with a greater focus on ranged DPS and giving up some QP effectiveness for that. Hence the two feats. But you're right, it really is more like 3 feats. Is it technically a monkcher or a hybrid? Frankly, I don't care. Does it matter what we call it if the way it is played is described in the thread?

I hesitated to bring this all up here, but I figure it is all good since someone once told me that:


Unsolicited opinions relevant to the topic is what you get on forums -- if you are lucky.

LavidDynch
02-07-2014, 01:46 PM
Only if you stop reading at the word monkcher. In the other thread I said things like:





To describe the way I like to play the character. So if you actually read it, you will see that it matches rather closely to your build here, albeit with a greater focus on ranged DPS and giving up some QP effectiveness for that. Hence the two feats. But you're right, it really is more like 3 feats. Is it technically a monkcher or a hybrid? Frankly, I don't care. Does it matter what we call it if the way it is played is described in the thread?

I hesitated to bring this all up here, but I figure it is all good since someone once told me that:

Didnt we have this debate a long time ago?

so how do you enjoy your build?

whomhead
02-07-2014, 01:54 PM
Didnt we have this debate a long time ago?

so how do you enjoy your build?

Yes, I suppose we did. But then I realized this was your build - and it is a very nice one - and it all just became so ridiculous that I had to bring it up again.

I like my character just fine. Haven't had a lot of time to play recently, but I'm almost done with my third eTR. The QP nerf is a blow, to be sure, but at least it prevents me from having to worry about finding somewhere to slot a shattering item.