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RandomFireGuy
10-05-2013, 12:10 AM
i would like to know if the smite, exalted smite, or divine sacrifice work with a bow

unbongwah
10-05-2013, 06:05 PM
No, no, and no. Divine Favor & Divine Might (if you have Bow STR) will apply to bows; but that's about it.

RandomFireGuy
10-07-2013, 03:29 AM
great, so paladin is the single class that gains NO unique benefit for ranged? the only class that can NOT be acceptable as a ranger?

Dexraven
10-07-2013, 03:45 AM
great, so paladin is the single class that gains NO unique benefit for ranged? the only class that can NOT be acceptable as a ranger?

Funny thing is, a Paladin can follow the Silver Flame, who's chosen weapon is a Longbow. You would think at least they could smite with a Bow

psykopeta
10-07-2013, 04:09 AM
great, so paladin is the single class that gains NO unique benefit for ranged? the only class that can NOT be acceptable as a ranger?

tell me benefits of barbs,clr, fvs, etc etc to ranged weapons

ah right, none, only the ones that come with str, if ppl can play bardcher, barbcher why can't u play a ...pallcher?

cru121
10-07-2013, 06:28 AM
pallcher?
I guess bowadin would be a better word.

RandomFireGuy
10-07-2013, 06:35 AM
tell me benefits of barbs,clr, fvs, etc etc to ranged weapons

ah right, none, only the ones that come with str, if ppl can play bardcher, barbcher why can't u play a ...pallcher?

bowbarians are astoundlingly hard hitters at the loss of 10k stars... incredible damage in manyshot, and almost acceptable out. clerics get good buffs and self healing and lv 7 spells with 6monk to make a great 10k star sustain ranged. fvs are like clerics, but get silver flame feats autogranted, so more damage at the loss of lv 7 spells, (assuming 1 rng for bow str to save feats), and both get bonus damage from warchanter enhancement line...

any more ranged questions?

ArcaneArcher52689
10-07-2013, 08:27 AM
any more ranged questions?

Anyone know if the new warpriest smite works with bows? I'll be sad if it doesn't.

unbongwah
10-07-2013, 12:24 PM
tell me benefits of barbs,clr, fvs, etc etc to ranged weapons
You're right there are no special synergies with clerics & FvS, although if going WIS-based monkcher, your build is a little less MAD than other caster / ranged hybrids.

Bowbarians aren't so bad; Rage applies to Bow STR, as does the crit bonuses from Death Frenzy+Focused Wrath, AFAIK. Main drawback is feat shortage, esp. if going barb 18 for DF. Pop off Manyshot, then switch to melee, same as any good rgr.

Bardchers are all right, too; Inspire Courage & Haste apply to ranged dmg, as does Skaldic Rage and Rage spell (w/Bow STR).

Druid archers: Ram's Might, Vengeful Hunter & Fatal Harrier work w/ranged atks; so does Reaving Roar, but since its proc is centered on you and the whole point to ranged atks is to keep your distance, it's not so useful.

Anyone know if the new warpriest smite works with bows? I'll be sad if it doesn't.
Unfortunately, the description explicitly says, "Smite your enemy with a melee attack," so that's a big no. :(

ArcaneArcher52689
10-07-2013, 01:02 PM
Unfortunately, the description explicitly says, "Smite your enemy with a melee attack," so that's a big no. :(

Well, damn... Guess i should have read that more closely. I might actually bug report that, seeing as how a silver flame warpriest would be all about them bows...

RandomFireGuy
10-07-2013, 08:35 PM
You're right there are no special synergies with clerics & FvS, although if going WIS-based monkcher, your build is a little less MAD than other caster / ranged hybrids.

Bowbarians aren't so bad; Rage applies to Bow STR, as does the crit bonuses from Death Frenzy+Focused Wrath, AFAIK. Main drawback is feat shortage, esp. if going barb 18 for DF. Pop off Manyshot, then switch to melee, same as any good rgr.

Bardchers are all right, too; Inspire Courage & Haste apply to ranged dmg, as does Skaldic Rage and Rage spell (w/Bow STR).

Druid archers: Ram's Might, Vengeful Hunter & Fatal Harrier work w/ranged atks; so does Reaving Roar, but since its proc is centered on you and the whole point to ranged atks is to keep your distance, it's not so useful.

Unfortunately, the description explicitly says, "Smite your enemy with a melee attack," so that's a big no. :(

thank you for the support


also, why does turbine hate archery?

unbongwah
10-09-2013, 02:18 PM
also, why does turbine hate archery?
Well, I wouldn't say they hate archery; but they definitely pigeon-holed it as "low sustained DPS / high burst DPS" combat style. Which wouldn't be so bad, if the melees and the casters weren't so great at both.

But they did add a bunch of new goodies to U19: the AA tree is greatly expanded, with more special atks & secondary imbues; DWS is not as nice, but I think, e.g., Sniper Shot is useful to a sneak-atk-based ranged build.

OTOH, clearly they hate the thought of paladins using bows, considering how few of their abilities affect ranged atks, despite Silver Flame's favored weapon being longbow.

Inoukchuk
10-09-2013, 04:05 PM
1) archery is over powered in nearly every other game system, including PnP D&D since you get full attacks all the time, never have to close distance, never have to stand toe-toe to attack, are able to reach opponents on ledges, across chasms, flying, etc. DDO scaled back damage so that not every toon is built as an archer and melee gets ignored, and to prevent excessive kiting like so many other games had (looking at you EQ).
2) there are very many very viable archery builds in DDO (see moncher, battle engineer builds, pure rangers, etc)
3) why should EVERY class have synergy with archery? Each class has something great to offer, just because you want what that class has to offer does not mean it should also give you abilities that synergize with every other fighting style. Paladin has become just about the most splashed class (next to monk maybe) due to the excellent saves bonus and DM, it doesn't need more reasons to splash it (though SD tree could use some love for tanking, which sucks now)

RandomFireGuy
10-09-2013, 07:58 PM
1) archery is over powered in nearly every other game system, including PnP D&D since you get full attacks all the time, never have to close distance, never have to stand toe-toe to attack, are able to reach opponents on ledges, across chasms, flying, etc. DDO scaled back damage so that not every toon is built as an archer and melee gets ignored, and to prevent excessive kiting like so many other games had (looking at you EQ).
2) there are very many very viable archery builds in DDO (see moncher, battle engineer builds, pure rangers, etc)
3) why should EVERY class have synergy with archery? Each class has something great to offer, just because you want what that class has to offer does not mean it should also give you abilities that synergize with every other fighting style. Paladin has become just about the most splashed class (next to monk maybe) due to the excellent saves bonus and DM, it doesn't need more reasons to splash it (though SD tree could use some love for tanking, which sucks now)

1) true, i will accept that
2)i am very aware of this, as i have been able to come up with a build for every other class
3) i don't expect every class to "bow" down to my desires... i was just hoping that i could do every life as an archer in this character, for flavor purposes.

as for archery... you have to be VERY specific with how you build... make a mistake, and you're just a needle flinger, but if you build an archer well enough, you can have unparalleled burst dps, or sacrifice a bit of burstiness for outstanding sustain with monkchers or arti's... it's just that typically, there's nothing besides ranger PrE's (now treees) that directly works with archery... usually you have to pick things out of a tree that give some bonus to benefit otherwise