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Teh_Troll
08-14-2013, 03:30 PM
My 150ish AC, 1200ish HP, 23% dodge, 130ish PRR, 110 Intim evasion tank is gimped to the stoneage with the ENH pass.

Currently human Fighter 18/Monk 2. Switches between TWFing and S&B when its needed.

He's tanked everything on every difficulty, but I can't find a way to not make him terrible with these changes.

Give me and excuse not to change to an Earth-Stance Kensai like everyone else.

unbongwah
08-14-2013, 08:31 PM
Could someone go over all the ways in which the new Enhancements "break" tanks? Just wanna be sure I understand what all the issues are. So far I've gleaned:


Alacrity (10% doublestrike) is Kensei capstone; SD capstone (Last Stand) looks unremarkable - it definitely doesn't boost DPS.
Higher-tier stance bonuses are S&B-only.
Maxing out stance costs more APs than SD III currently does: 36 APs vs 24 APs for all pre-reqs, excluding pts spent to hit each tier.
Since tiers are unlocked by PrE pts not total pts spent, have to spend a lot more in SD PrE rather than, say, Kensei for more DPS or racial enhs.
Besides stances, many SD abilities are S&B-specific, when ofc most tanks want to be in DPS (THF/TWF) mode 99% of the time.


Am I missing anything?

Teh_Troll
08-14-2013, 08:37 PM
Am I missing anything?

15 less PRR

Carpone
08-18-2013, 12:05 PM
Alacrity (10% doublestrike) is Kensei capstone
Kensei capstone is 15% Doublestrike and Doubleshot, +2 DCs, +2 STR, +2 Action Boosts.

Teh_Troll
08-18-2013, 12:52 PM
Kensei capstone is 15% Doublestrike and Doubleshot, +2 DCs, +2 STR, +2 Action Boosts.

Really? They upped it to 15% double strike?

Carpone
08-18-2013, 01:52 PM
Really? They upped it to 15% double strike?
Yes.

unbongwah
08-19-2013, 09:16 AM
Kensei capstone is 15% Doublestrike and Doubleshot, +2 DCs, +2 STR, +2 Action Boosts.
In that case, I wonder if "S&B Kensei" makes more sense than a conventional SD; i.e., DPS-focused but with survivability bonuses from SD stance.

PainStealer
08-19-2013, 07:19 PM
Personally I TRed my stalwart into https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/422617-The-Abomination

Can still use your S&B gear when you want to tank .... But at other times running TWF with x6 crits.

And yes the capstone is 15% doublestrike. Personally I feel that you give up too much in versatility to justify that. By multiclassing the way I did you gain .. multishot, earth stance 3 ( bigger crits ) , shadow fade, rams might , etc ...

I went dwarf but really the build will work with any race.

Testing the build on Lammania I was able to achive very high AC numbers in S&B mode as well as huge DPS in TWF mode.

Teh_Troll
08-22-2013, 09:28 AM
Personally I TRed my stalwart into https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/422617-The-Abomination


I'm thinking something similar, either back to the Fighter 12/Ranger 6/Monk 2 ("Monster") split or 8/6/6. Power Surge versus 15% more incorporeal over what you can get from gear.

Tanks just aren't needed any more so I took Greater Weapon focus and switched to a DPS kensai on his current 18 fighter 2 monk build and I have to say I was extremely disappointed. The DPS was not good at all, my Tempest was getting better Sobrien beat-down times now that they both have 30% haste boost and more Tempest doesn't even have Overwhelming Critical.

I'm sorry but that just shouldn't be. Toons with good self-healing should not be able to put out more damage than those that don't. Horribly broken but it is what it is.

Fighters shouldn't have to splash as deeply as it looks like they do in order for them not to be garbage and it's looking like the best bet for a viable fighter is 8-12 levels of another class.

Wipey
08-22-2013, 02:18 PM
Really? They upped it to 15% double strike?
Kensei is still **** if you want pure. Expensive boosts/tactics, useless active abilitites, vorpal sharing cooldown with hjaste boost, Meditation is okay but impractical.
Total boredom for pure class. Only crappy pally tanking tree might be more boring.

unbongwah
08-22-2013, 03:44 PM
I'm thinking something similar, either back to the Fighter 12/Ranger 6/Monk 2 ("Monster") split or 8/6/6. Power Surge versus 15% more incorporeal over what you can get from gear.
What about ftr 12 / monk 6 / rgr 2? Lose some feats & +10% offhand vs rgr 6 / monk 2; but gain Shadow Veil and 10K Stars while keeping Power Surge.

emptysands
08-28-2013, 04:54 PM
What about ftr 12 / monk 6 / rgr 2? Lose some feats & +10% offhand vs rgr 6 / monk 2; but gain Shadow Veil and 10K Stars while keeping Power Surge.

Ninja 2 and DEX for damage on slashing/piercing may be a issue.

Musashiclaw
09-17-2013, 07:33 PM
I guess we are still looking?

Nightmanis
09-17-2013, 08:17 PM
https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/424991-Somebody-please-stop-me

Modify mine a bit :D go full thf, probably add a bit of con instead of str, take toughness a couple more times, whatever floats your boat.

maddmatt70
09-25-2013, 12:55 AM
14 fighter 4 paladin 2 monk race dwarf. Sword and board and possibly two handed. In S&B using tower and full plate: tactics can hit 70, prr 130, Hit points 1350+, Will and Reflex 50+, Fort about 70, Intimidate about 100, ok healing amp, excellent hate, blur and incorporeality, no dodge or ac really, cocoon with empower healing and decent positive spell power. All this while in Legendary Dreadnaught.
Feats
All two handed fighting feats. (could substitute prefer thf for perfect twf).
overwhelming critical and prerequisites.
Just weapon focus feat no other weapon specialization feats.
Kind of lacking for dps enhancements, but has all the dps dreadnaught destiny stuff.

lyrecono
09-25-2013, 01:42 AM
I'm sorry but that just shouldn't be. Toons with good self-healing should not be able to put out more damage than those that don't. Horribly broken but it is what it is.

Fighters shouldn't have to splash as deeply as it looks like they do in order for them not to be garbage and it's looking like the best bet for a viable fighter is 8-12 levels of another class.

sad sad truth :(

On Lamania my tank had
in plate+axe&board
2300+hp/near 200prr (with diminishing returns though), 190-200 AC, saves 65+, fort75+, desent hate, 19% dodge etc
Dps was low, but all i had was the lv 14 gh D-axe, doing 100 damage per hit. i did spring for the overwhelming crit feat
Parasitic breasplate+axe and board
In evasion mode things dropped a little, though not as much as i expeted though.

i'm rebuilding an alt to match this, so far it has huge saves and hitpoints. works fine in normal pug groups, in groups with minmaxed toons i can intimidate mobs of them for a little whille giving the healer/their own self healing a chance (this on EE), the AC and other protective stuff seem to hold up fine in EH, on EE's its 70% effective. (the 70% is still better then most people's protection)

Communication helped a lot too, letting people know what you can and can't do to help m out.

Best fun in tanking i have done so far is:
Emo assasin boss in wheloon, with it's thight corners (EE) it required a lot of patience, in the past attempts, it was a rez fest, shoot shoot...take agro, die, get rezed etc. Communication and patience worked better
What goes up (only one not dieing on EE)
Running elite STK underlevel with several 4 minute lag spikes every 10 minutes, carying 5 soulstones through the quests. (hobgoblins just couldn't kill me XD)

lyrecono
09-25-2013, 05:55 AM
What goes up (only one not dieing on EE)


As some one was so nice to E-mail me, no i didn't die due lagging behind in running speed (short dwarven defender legs and all)
I was in the front of the party holding down mobs whille the party foccused on 1 mob at the time. (again communication)

Another question i got:
the entire tank build was done to prove such a build was some what usefull, when handled right.
The run to lv 16(atm) wasn't always fun, often laughed at, "why a tank? there is nothing out there atm that needs tanking",
I beg to differ, not everyboddy operates at the top 1% of the skill level, some players need to be coached through levels, this build allowed for that, to be the punching bag whille they learn.

Another question i got:
It's no fun being a tank, in Heroic/Epic elites the AC won't hold up, if things go south you die last, you're just a waste of party spot why should i take you into elites?

Got plenty of protection(high ac/blur/ghostly/displacent/dodge/prr/saves/ 175 fortrification), selfhealing, rez scrolls XD, i'm dodging/blocking etc 70+% of all incomming damage and have enough to soak up the rest, me holding down 8 mobs by myself opens up 5 party slots to pick m of 1 by one, making things easyer on healers.


With my curent gear i can't reach 90% miss chance
With better named gear it could go up higher (looking at you item creators), this alt has barely any gear besides a standerd easy gear (greensteel hp and pdk gloves) but i'm still working on it.

I haven't even posted a build yet i'm getting feedback, thanks for the E-mails but next time post them up here :P

unbongwah
09-25-2013, 09:11 AM
14 fighter 4 paladin 2 monk race dwarf. Sword and board and possibly two handed.
I've got a pre-U19 build like this that I'm trying to figure out how to "rehabilitate," so to speak. Currently ftr 12 / pal 4 / monk 2: I had planned to go pal 6 (I wanted Divine Righteousness which was pal 6 ability); but post-U19 I'm wondering if two more ftr lvls for 1 more feat would be better.

I forget my exact feat layout, but something like:
Monk (2): Power Atk + Toughness
Ftr (7): THF x3, Shield Mastery & ISM, Dodge, Mobility
Heroic: Cleave, Imp Shield Bash, GC, IC:Slash, Stunning Blow, CE, Imp Trip
Epic: Overwhelming Crit, eToughness, Blinding Speed OR eDR

The idea was a mix of DPS, S&B, survivability, and tactics feats.

maddmatt70
09-25-2013, 10:42 AM
I've got a pre-U19 build like this that I'm trying to figure out how to "rehabilitate," so to speak. Currently ftr 12 / pal 4 / monk 2: I had planned to go pal 6 (I wanted Divine Righteousness which was pal 6 ability); but post-U19 I'm wondering if two more ftr lvls for 1 more feat would be better.

I forget my exact feat layout, but something like:
Monk (2): Power Atk + Toughness
Ftr (7): THF x3, Shield Mastery & ISM, Dodge, Mobility
Heroic: Cleave, Imp Shield Bash, GC, IC:Slash, Stunning Blow, CE, Imp Trip
Epic: Overwhelming Crit, eToughness, Blinding Speed OR eDR

The idea was a mix of DPS, S&B, survivability, and tactics feats.

Yeah something similiar although your intimidate is going to be low and no improved sunder. I do not think ce and imp trip are worth it. I like the second cooldown on I trip, but two feats on that not worth it. I also have never been a fan imp shield bash. Dodge and Mobility are not worth it for a sword and board unless light armored because you can easily slot on 10% dodge item or not so definitley shelve those unless you have light armor, but light armor strength and cha based likely means your reflex save is not worth it so what have you.

In order to get your intimidate up there I would swap CE and I trip for bullheaded, skil focus intimidate. I would also fit in force of personality instead of imp shield bash. I think I had weapon focus for kensai although not sure how important that was. I definitely had empower healing for cocoon. With that extra feat for 14 fighter I was able to fit in improved sunder. In the epic feats I would have Tactician and PFTHF or PFTWF and also epic persuasion (for the +3 to intimidate).

AC takes too much investment so that is not worth it for S&B for sure. Dodge feats are kind of not worth it anymore either for S&B with the way gear and enhancement costs for dodge works and the limits on dodge for S&B. Intimidate is pretty important I think for bosses so spend the costs there.

Hit Points, physical resistance, decent saves, decent healing amp, some self healing, high intimidate, those make a fine tank and a tank that can still has some dps and great tactics to boot. For an S&B fighter convinced this is the way to go.

Inoukchuk
09-25-2013, 04:49 PM
I've got a pre-U19 build like this that I'm trying to figure out how to "rehabilitate," so to speak. Currently ftr 12 / pal 4 / monk 2: I had planned to go pal 6 (I wanted Divine Righteousness which was pal 6 ability); but post-U19 I'm wondering if two more ftr lvls for 1 more feat would be better.

I forget my exact feat layout, but something like:
Monk (2): Power Atk + Toughness
Ftr (7): THF x3, Shield Mastery & ISM, Dodge, Mobility
Heroic: Cleave, Imp Shield Bash, GC, IC:Slash, Stunning Blow, CE, Imp Trip
Epic: Overwhelming Crit, eToughness, Blinding Speed OR eDR

The idea was a mix of DPS, S&B, survivability, and tactics feats.

To me the more important part of 6 pal is unyielding sov.

Also consider 3/4 monk. You will be centered so adding in healing curse and healing finisher should add some decent healing that doesn't require you to break off attacking, and of course the E-P-E finisher gives that nice AoE stun immunity when needed.

unbongwah
09-26-2013, 07:56 AM
Also consider 3/4 monk. You will be centered so adding in healing curse and healing finisher should add some decent healing that doesn't require you to break off attacking, and of course the E-P-E finisher gives that nice AoE stun immunity when needed.
If I went that route, I'd just LR into monk 6 / ftr 12 / pal 2, twist in Bane of Undeath, and be Yet Another Earth Stance Ninja / Kensei. The goal is to find a viable S&B alternative (which means centering ain't an option), not to follow the herd. The problem is in this case, the herd has the right idea...

Chai
09-26-2013, 09:25 AM
What does TUrbine do when people complain that the best archery builds in the game use 6-12 monk levels?

THey make it so the most powerful fighter builds use monk levels too. :p

unbongwah
09-26-2013, 09:47 AM
What does TUrbine do when people complain that the best archery builds in the game use 6-12 monk levels?

THey make it so the most powerful fighter builds use monk levels too. :p


</tinfoil hat>

As much as I still enjoy DDO (4 years & counting!), it's clear Turbine struggles to keep things fairly balanced. A lot of old splashes got nerfed in U19, only to have [I]new splashes become ridiculously OP: e.g., ftr for max Haste Boost, cleric or FvS for Divine Might, FvS on casters for Scourge + Just Reward. They introduce new toys to make non-STR-based melee / ranged builds more viable, only to change other things which keep them gimp, like making DM a STR bonus and getting rid of Showtime (pretty much the only class-based DEX boost pre-U19, IIRC). And monks have gotten buffed then nerfed then buffed again so many times, I've lost count. :rolleyes:

ReaperAlexEU
09-26-2013, 09:48 AM
As some one was so nice to E-mail me, no i didn't die due lagging behind in running speed (short dwarven defender legs and all)
I was in the front of the party holding down mobs whille the party foccused on 1 mob at the time. (again communication)

Another question i got:
the entire tank build was done to prove such a build was some what usefull, when handled right.
The run to lv 16(atm) wasn't always fun, often laughed at, "why a tank? there is nothing out there atm that needs tanking",
I beg to differ, not everyboddy operates at the top 1% of the skill level, some players need to be coached through levels, this build allowed for that, to be the punching bag whille they learn.

Another question i got:
It's no fun being a tank, in Heroic/Epic elites the AC won't hold up, if things go south you die last, you're just a waste of party spot why should i take you into elites?

Got plenty of protection(high ac/blur/ghostly/displacent/dodge/prr/saves/ 175 fortrification), selfhealing, rez scrolls XD, i'm dodging/blocking etc 70+% of all incomming damage and have enough to soak up the rest, me holding down 8 mobs by myself opens up 5 party slots to pick m of 1 by one, making things easyer on healers.


With my curent gear i can't reach 90% miss chance
With better named gear it could go up higher (looking at you item creators), this alt has barely any gear besides a standerd easy gear (greensteel hp and pdk gloves) but i'm still working on it.

I haven't even posted a build yet i'm getting feedback, thanks for the E-mails but next time post them up here :P

would love to see your breakdown with the current gear set. i thought my S&B paly had modest gear and he's only just pushing past the 100 mark on AC and PRR, so it would be great to see what other low hanging fruit is out there i can focus on. not that i intend to tank EE anytime soon, but there is no harm in aiming to improve

Bridge_Dweller
09-26-2013, 09:54 AM
</tinfoil hat>

As much as I still enjoy DDO (4 years & counting!), it's clear Turbine struggles to keep things fairly balanced. A lot of old splashes got nerfed in U19, only to have [I]new splashes become ridiculously OP: e.g., ftr for max Haste Boost, cleric or FvS for Divine Might, FvS on casters for Scourge + Just Reward. They introduce new toys to make non-STR-based melee / ranged builds more viable, only to change other things which keep them gimp, like making DM a STR bonus and getting rid of Showtime (pretty much the only class-based DEX boost pre-U19, IIRC). And monks have gotten buffed then nerfed then buffed again so many times, I've lost count. :rolleyes:

It makes you wonder if they make the classes imbalanced on purpose or are they really just clueless as to what needed to keep things balanced.

The enhancement pass was a chance to have more balanced classes from what we had before, what we got made things worse.

Panzermeyer
09-26-2013, 10:39 AM
It makes you wonder if they make the classes imbalanced on purpose or are they really just clueless as to what needed to keep things balanced.

The enhancement pass was a chance to have more balanced classes from what we had before, what we got made things worse.

I use to work in the gaming industry. So I understand a lot of what turbine does. Definitely not everything, but a lot.

The simple truth is a law of unintended consequences.

With a system and game this large, there is no possible or conceivable way that everything can get tested adequately.

First of all when I worked in the gaming industry I was, (and everyone else here) astonished at how many peopel who didn't even play the games made decisions about how the games should be. The Marketing department in particular often had a huge influence in the game, and in the company I worked with, I couldn't name a one of them that actually played ours or any other game for that matter. If they didn't make decisions about game content, they often made deadlines and pushed stuff that forces a cutting out of content or gameplay as well.

Secondly even with an effect QA team, there was no game that was shipped that didn't ship with bugs. Just the realty.

Now we have an open ended, ever evolving game here with increased content.

I guarantee you in fixing eventually what once was a bug, but the players turned into game mechanics, they completely change build types.

Or I bet they have even put in stuff that they believe is good for the characters like for a tank build or something, only for the players to have a different mind set then any of the developers every thought, and just make things worse.

I guarantee you most OP build ideas are build ideas that the dev never even immagined possible. So when the updates happen and people come up with these ideas that over power things, it was completely unintended.

Just stuff like that.

I mean think of this.

Do you honestly think with this new update that all the new quests AND the new enhancements where actually fully and completely tested through with all possible permutations and consequences?

Cause with so many players we will find out ways to do things that the devs never even thought of. =)

Inoukchuk
09-26-2013, 11:09 AM
If I went that route, I'd just LR into monk 6 / ftr 12 / pal 2, twist in Bane of Undeath, and be Yet Another Earth Stance Ninja / Kensei. The goal is to find a viable S&B alternative (which means centering ain't an option), not to follow the herd. The problem is in this case, the herd has the right idea...

Ah, didn't realize you weren't already planning to be centered. I saw 14 fighter levels and wondered on the purpose of the extra 2 and thought "that would be better spent elsewhere, like monk for some extra benefits". 12/4/4 really isn't a bad split really as it gets you turns for DM from paly (and a blue bar) and some benefits from monk (but only if centered).

unbongwah
09-27-2013, 01:14 PM
Here's what I have so far as dwarf ftr 12 / pal 6 / monk 2:

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 04.19.01
DDO Character Planner Home Page (http://www.rjcyberware.com/DDO)

Level 28 Lawful Good Dwarf Female
(12 Fighter \ 6 Paladin \ 2 Monk \ 8 Epic)
Hit Points: 548
Spell Points: 170
BAB: 19\19\24\29\29
Fortitude: 25
Reflex: 13
Will: 14

Starting Feat/Enhancement
Abilities Base Stats Modified Stats
(32 Point) (Level 1) (Level 28)
Strength 16 25
Dexterity 11 13
Constitution 18 22
Intelligence 11 13
Wisdom 8 8
Charisma 12 14

Tomes Used
+2 Tome of Strength used at level 7
+2 Tome of Dexterity used at level 7
+2 Tome of Constitution used at level 7
+2 Tome of Intelligence used at level 7
+2 Tome of Charisma used at level 7
+3 Tome of Constitution used at level 23

Level 1 (Monk)
Feat: (Selected) Cleave
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Power Attack


Level 2 (Paladin)


Level 3 (Paladin)
Feat: (Selected) Shield Mastery


Level 4 (Paladin)
Ability Raise: STR


Level 5 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Great Cleave


Level 6 (Fighter)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Shield Bash
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Two Handed Fighting


Level 7 (Fighter)


Level 8 (Monk)
Ability Raise: STR
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Toughness


Level 9 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Improved Critical: Slashing Weapons
Feat: (Selected) Improved Shield Mastery


Level 10 (Fighter)


Level 11 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Improved Two Handed Fighting


Level 12 (Fighter)
Ability Raise: STR
Feat: (Selected) Force of Personality


Level 13 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Greater Two Handed Fighting


Level 14 (Fighter)


Level 15 (Fighter)
Feat: (Selected) Combat Expertise
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Improved Trip


Level 16 (Fighter)
Ability Raise: STR


Level 17 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Stunning Blow


Level 18 (Paladin)
Feat: (Selected) Dodge


Level 19 (Paladin)


Level 20 (Paladin)
Ability Raise: STR
Enhancement: Dwarf - Dwarven Toughness (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Dwarf - Dwarven Constitution (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Dwarf - Axe Training (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Dwarf - Dwarven Tactics (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Dwarf - Dwarven Tactics (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Dwarf - Dwarven Tactics (Rank 3)
Enhancement: Dwarf - Axe Training (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Dwarf - Dwarven Runes (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Dwarf - Dwarven Runes (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Dwarf - Dwarven Runes (Rank 3)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Toughness (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Overbalance (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Stalwart Defense (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Stand Fast (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Durable Defense (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Durable Defense (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Durable Defense (Rank 3)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Threatening Countenance (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Threatening Countenance (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Threatening Countenance (Rank 3)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Shield Striking (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Shield Striking (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Shield Striking (Rank 3)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Resilient Defense (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Resilient Defense (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Resilient Defense (Rank 3)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Inciting Defense (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Inciting Defense (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Inciting Defense (Rank 3)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Strong Defense (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Strong Defense (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Strong Defense (Rank 3)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Strength (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Swift Defense (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Tenacious Defense (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Tenacious Defense (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Tenacious Defense (Rank 3)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Strength (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Block and Cut (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Block and Cut (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Block and Cut (Rank 3)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Hardy Defense (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Hardy Defense (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Hardy Defense (Rank 3)
Enhancement: Kensei (Ftr) - Kensei Focus: Axes (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Kensei (Ftr) - Haste Boost (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Kensei (Ftr) - Haste Boost (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Kensei (Ftr) - Haste Boost (Rank 3)
Enhancement: Knight of the Chalice (Pal) - Fiendslayer I (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Knight of the Chalice (Pal) - Extra Turning (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Knight of the Chalice (Pal) - Extra Turning (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Knight of the Chalice (Pal) - Extra Turning (Rank 3)
Enhancement: Knight of the Chalice (Pal) - Extra Smite (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Knight of the Chalice (Pal) - Divine Might (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Knight of the Chalice (Pal) - Divine Might (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Knight of the Chalice (Pal) - Divine Might (Rank 3)
Enhancement: Knight of the Chalice (Pal) - Vigor of Life (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Sacred Defender (Pal) - Holy Bastion (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Sacred Defender (Pal) - Divine Righteousness (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Sacred Defender (Pal) - Item Defense (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Sacred Defender (Pal) - Sacred Armor Mastery (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Sacred Defender (Pal) - Sacred Armor Mastery (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Sacred Defender (Pal) - Sacred Armor Mastery (Rank 3)
Enhancement: Shintao (Mnk) - Bastion of Purity (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Shintao (Mnk) - Exemplar (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Shintao (Mnk) - Exemplar (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Shintao (Mnk) - Exemplar (Rank 3)
Enhancement: Ninja Spy (Mnk) - Ninja Training (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Ninja Spy (Mnk) - Acrobatic (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Ninja Spy (Mnk) - Acrobatic (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Ninja Spy (Mnk) - Acrobatic (Rank 3)


Level 21 (Paladin)
Feat: (Selected) Epic: Overwhelming Critical


Level 22 (Paladin)


Level 23 (Paladin)


Level 24 (Paladin)
Feat: (Selected) Epic: Epic Toughness


Level 25 (Paladin)


Level 26 (Paladin)


Level 27 (Paladin)
Feat: (Selected) Epic: Epic Damage Reduction


Level 28 (Paladin)


Perhaps unsurprisingly, the biggest limiting factor is APs. Since it's a little tough to read this format, here's the summary:

36 APs in Stalwart Defender - Threatening Countenance, all stance bonuses, most S&B abilities like Block & Cut, Swift Defense, and Shield Striking, core enhs thru Stand Fast.
4 APs in Kensei - core Axe + max Haste Boost
13 APs in KotC - max Extra Turning & Divine Might, +10% heal amp
6 APs in Sacred Defender - Divine Righteousness, max Armor Mastery
4 APs in Shintao - +5% heal amp, +3 Heal & Intim, +10% threat amp [AFAIK, these bonuses apply regardless of centering.]
4 APs in Ninja - +3% Dodge
13 APs in dwarf - HPs, CON, axe x2, max tactics & saves bonuses


I'd like to incorpate tactics into this build, but I can't really afford the DC boosts I want (i.e., Power Surge + Kensei tactics); not without gimping something else, anyway. That being the case, I might drop them entirely, which would free up a few feats. Perhaps I'll save tactics for the Earth monk / Kensei instead.

Infiltraitor
09-27-2013, 09:36 PM
I am about 90% finished with overhauling my Reignbeau Evasion Tank.

https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/424449-Reignbeau-12-Fighter-6-Paladin-2-Monk

900 DPS with Sword and Shield. I could use some critique and suggestions.

maddmatt70
09-28-2013, 08:45 PM
Here's what I have so far as dwarf ftr 12 / pal 6 / monk 2:

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 04.19.01
DDO Character Planner Home Page (http://www.rjcyberware.com/DDO)

Level 28 Lawful Good Dwarf Female
(12 Fighter \ 6 Paladin \ 2 Monk \ 8 Epic)
Hit Points: 548
Spell Points: 170
BAB: 19\19\24\29\29
Fortitude: 25
Reflex: 13
Will: 14

Starting Feat/Enhancement
Abilities Base Stats Modified Stats
(32 Point) (Level 1) (Level 28)
Strength 16 25
Dexterity 11 13
Constitution 18 22
Intelligence 11 13
Wisdom 8 8
Charisma 12 14

Tomes Used
+2 Tome of Strength used at level 7
+2 Tome of Dexterity used at level 7
+2 Tome of Constitution used at level 7
+2 Tome of Intelligence used at level 7
+2 Tome of Charisma used at level 7
+3 Tome of Constitution used at level 23

Level 1 (Monk)
Feat: (Selected) Cleave
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Power Attack


Level 2 (Paladin)


Level 3 (Paladin)
Feat: (Selected) Shield Mastery


Level 4 (Paladin)
Ability Raise: STR


Level 5 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Great Cleave


Level 6 (Fighter)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Shield Bash
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Two Handed Fighting


Level 7 (Fighter)


Level 8 (Monk)
Ability Raise: STR
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Toughness


Level 9 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Improved Critical: Slashing Weapons
Feat: (Selected) Improved Shield Mastery


Level 10 (Fighter)


Level 11 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Improved Two Handed Fighting


Level 12 (Fighter)
Ability Raise: STR
Feat: (Selected) Force of Personality


Level 13 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Greater Two Handed Fighting


Level 14 (Fighter)


Level 15 (Fighter)
Feat: (Selected) Combat Expertise
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Improved Trip


Level 16 (Fighter)
Ability Raise: STR


Level 17 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Stunning Blow


Level 18 (Paladin)
Feat: (Selected) Dodge


Level 19 (Paladin)


Level 20 (Paladin)
Ability Raise: STR
Enhancement: Dwarf - Dwarven Toughness (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Dwarf - Dwarven Constitution (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Dwarf - Axe Training (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Dwarf - Dwarven Tactics (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Dwarf - Dwarven Tactics (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Dwarf - Dwarven Tactics (Rank 3)
Enhancement: Dwarf - Axe Training (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Dwarf - Dwarven Runes (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Dwarf - Dwarven Runes (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Dwarf - Dwarven Runes (Rank 3)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Toughness (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Overbalance (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Stalwart Defense (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Stand Fast (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Durable Defense (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Durable Defense (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Durable Defense (Rank 3)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Threatening Countenance (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Threatening Countenance (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Threatening Countenance (Rank 3)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Shield Striking (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Shield Striking (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Shield Striking (Rank 3)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Resilient Defense (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Resilient Defense (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Resilient Defense (Rank 3)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Inciting Defense (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Inciting Defense (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Inciting Defense (Rank 3)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Strong Defense (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Strong Defense (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Strong Defense (Rank 3)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Strength (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Swift Defense (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Tenacious Defense (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Tenacious Defense (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Tenacious Defense (Rank 3)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Strength (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Block and Cut (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Block and Cut (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Block and Cut (Rank 3)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Hardy Defense (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Hardy Defense (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Stalwart Defender (Ftr) - Hardy Defense (Rank 3)
Enhancement: Kensei (Ftr) - Kensei Focus: Axes (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Kensei (Ftr) - Haste Boost (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Kensei (Ftr) - Haste Boost (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Kensei (Ftr) - Haste Boost (Rank 3)
Enhancement: Knight of the Chalice (Pal) - Fiendslayer I (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Knight of the Chalice (Pal) - Extra Turning (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Knight of the Chalice (Pal) - Extra Turning (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Knight of the Chalice (Pal) - Extra Turning (Rank 3)
Enhancement: Knight of the Chalice (Pal) - Extra Smite (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Knight of the Chalice (Pal) - Divine Might (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Knight of the Chalice (Pal) - Divine Might (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Knight of the Chalice (Pal) - Divine Might (Rank 3)
Enhancement: Knight of the Chalice (Pal) - Vigor of Life (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Sacred Defender (Pal) - Holy Bastion (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Sacred Defender (Pal) - Divine Righteousness (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Sacred Defender (Pal) - Item Defense (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Sacred Defender (Pal) - Sacred Armor Mastery (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Sacred Defender (Pal) - Sacred Armor Mastery (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Sacred Defender (Pal) - Sacred Armor Mastery (Rank 3)
Enhancement: Shintao (Mnk) - Bastion of Purity (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Shintao (Mnk) - Exemplar (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Shintao (Mnk) - Exemplar (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Shintao (Mnk) - Exemplar (Rank 3)
Enhancement: Ninja Spy (Mnk) - Ninja Training (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Ninja Spy (Mnk) - Acrobatic (Rank 1)
Enhancement: Ninja Spy (Mnk) - Acrobatic (Rank 2)
Enhancement: Ninja Spy (Mnk) - Acrobatic (Rank 3)


Level 21 (Paladin)
Feat: (Selected) Epic: Overwhelming Critical


Level 22 (Paladin)


Level 23 (Paladin)


Level 24 (Paladin)
Feat: (Selected) Epic: Epic Toughness


Level 25 (Paladin)


Level 26 (Paladin)


Level 27 (Paladin)
Feat: (Selected) Epic: Epic Damage Reduction


Level 28 (Paladin)


Perhaps unsurprisingly, the biggest limiting factor is APs. Since it's a little tough to read this format, here's the summary:

36 APs in Stalwart Defender - Threatening Countenance, all stance bonuses, most S&B abilities like Block & Cut, Swift Defense, and Shield Striking, core enhs thru Stand Fast.
4 APs in Kensei - core Axe + max Haste Boost
13 APs in KotC - max Extra Turning & Divine Might, +10% heal amp
6 APs in Sacred Defender - Divine Righteousness, max Armor Mastery
4 APs in Shintao - +5% heal amp, +3 Heal & Intim, +10% threat amp [AFAIK, these bonuses apply regardless of centering.]
4 APs in Ninja - +3% Dodge
13 APs in dwarf - HPs, CON, axe x2, max tactics & saves bonuses


I'd like to incorpate tactics into this build, but I can't really afford the DC boosts I want (i.e., Power Surge + Kensei tactics); not without gimping something else, anyway. That being the case, I might drop them entirely, which would free up a few feats. Perhaps I'll save tactics for the Earth monk / Kensei instead.

There should be 0 investment in AC. +3% dodge? Why, just wear a +10% dodge item. Why do you need max turning? why any turning at all. Forget about Divine righteousness and go for 14 fighter.

gabbatastic
09-29-2013, 01:10 AM
I am sitting happily at AC205, PRR138 I run with displacement clickies, ghostly, lesser displacement, and initimidate 85. With cocoon and silver flame pots I am able to stand all day in storm horns EE. build is straight paly in sentinel. working on ftr/pal multiclass to see if I can get the AC and prr up. I twist lithe, cocoon and walking with the waves.

unbongwah
09-29-2013, 08:14 AM
There should be 0 investment in AC. +3% dodge? Why, just wear a +10% dodge item. Why do you need max turning? why any turning at all. Forget about Divine righteousness and go for 14 fighter.
I can hit 21% Dodge: 10% Dodge item + 2% Mobility item + 3% Dodge feat + 3% Acrobatic (Ninja) + 3% Imp Dodge (Kensei). Extra Turning is just filler to open up Divine Might; nothing better on T1 KotC, unfortunately. Same w/Sacred Armor Mastery, although at least it raises my MDB. Pal 6 is for Unyielding Sovereignty; a full heal every 10 mins. for emergencies seems more useful than 1 extra feat. [It also gives Divine Favor a little more juice, for +2/+2 instead of +1/+1; minor perk, but I'll take what I can get.]

If I did choose to keep tactics, I'd rearrange APs quite a bit: at least 33 APs in SD, 11 APs in KotC for max Divine Might, 21 APs in Kensei for +3 Tactics, Haste Boost, & Power Surge, 8 APs in dwarf for +3 tactics, leaving 7 free to spread around. In that case I might swap FoP or Dodge for Imp Sunder.

But this is a work-in-progress; I'm making it up as I go.