PDA

View Full Version : Thoguhts on new enhancements - Half-orc 18/2 Barbarian/Fighter



Thrudh
07-28-2013, 12:41 PM
My half-orc barbarian/fighter made out VERY well in the new enhancement pass...

Get full haste boost instead of just rank 1... Ton of extra boosts too, more than before... +3 to tactical feats instead of just +1.

Kept Power Attack enhancements, and hardy rage, and Power rage for +3 STR, +3 CON when raging.

Half-orc enhancements are even better than before... Instead of +4 damage from orc melee damage, I get +6, and 20% extra damage to helpless enemies!!! Hullo!!

Why in the world is everyone screaming nerf on the main boards?

I kept +2 to crit multipliers on 19-20, plus another +1 when in death frenzy... No change there.

I got a few new clickables like Exhausting Blow and Tantrum...

Looks like stunning blow half-orc barb/fighters made out great in the new enhancement pass...

So far I'm 4 for 4 in this enhancement pass... I'll check out my Favored Soul next.

Battlehawke
07-28-2013, 12:55 PM
I like! A lot!

Thrudh
07-30-2013, 12:28 AM
My half-orc 18/2 barb/fighter has the following enhancements on live

Damage Boost IV (30% damage)
Extra Action Boost
Orc Extra Action Boost II
Sprint Boost I
Fighter Haste Boost I (15% haste)
Extend Rage II (50%)
Extra Rage I
Hardy Rage III (+3 CON)
Power Rage III (+3 STR)
Barb Intimidation
Power Attack III
Orc Power Attack I
Stunning Blow I
Trip I
Orc Melee Damage (+4 with two-handers)
Orc STR II
Orc Toughness II
Barb Toughness II
Barb CON II
Fighter STR I
Frenzied Berzerker III (+2 crit multiplier on 19-20),
Supreme Cleave (2[W])
Frenzy
Death Frenzy (another +1 crit multiplier)


On Lamannia I get

Damage Boost III (25% damage)
Extra Action Boost I (from Kensai)
Extra Action Boost II (from Frenzied Berzerker)
Sprint Boost I
Fighter Haste Boost III (30% haste)
Extend Rage II (50%)
Extra Rage III
Hardy Rage III (+3 CON)
Power Rage III (+3 STR)
Power Attack II (Barb)
Orc Power Attack II
+3 Tactics DCs
Orc Melee Damage (+6 with two-handers)
Orc STR II
Barb CON II
Orc STR +2 when raging
Frenzied Berzerker III (+2 crit multiplier on 19-20),
Supreme Cleave (2[W])
Frenzy
Death Frenzy (another +1 crit multiplier)

So compare those... Both give the +3 crit multiplier on 19-20... Same number of extra Action Boosts, same Hardy Rage and Power rage... Same Extend Rage, Two extra rages instead of one. Same Barb +2 CON, Same half-orc +2 STR. Same Power Attack bonuses. Same Frenzy, Death Frenzy, Supreme Cleave.

Damage Boost is slightly lower, but I go from 15% Haste Boostt to a full 30% Haste Boost.
Half-orc Power Rage gives an extra +2 STR when raging
Half-orc gives +6 to damage when using two-handed weapons instead of +4

Half-orc gives BRUTALITY!!!! (20% damage to stunned opponents) - this stack with Sense weakness?

+3 tactics DCs instead of +1 to stunning blow and trip.

I lose is 25% damage boost instead of 30% damage boost, I lose barb intimidation, and some toughness enhancements (but my hitpoints only dropped by 5). And I gain all kinds of things... +3 to tactics instead of +1, more STR, more extra damage, 20% more DPS when opponent is stunned, full haste boost.

The enhancements as written are a huge BUFF to my barbarian's DPS.

http://i40.tinypic.com/262sig0.jpg

Thrudh
07-30-2013, 12:33 AM
http://i40.tinypic.com/262sig0.jpg

I should probably drop one of the extra action boosts and pick up Tantrum at the top of the Frenzied Berzerker tree.

50% chance to knock down all enemies I hit is pretty sweet.

Charononus
07-30-2013, 12:34 AM
My big issue with horcs is the racial core ability 1 and 3 which is a morale bonus when you're hurt. It doesn't stack and the ones that go farther than rage or primal scream require being so injured that you'll probably be dead soon in challenging content if you don't start getting heals from a potion or divine.

I haven't checked on these in a while but it shows a horrible understanding of the mechanics of the game by the designer.

Thrudh
07-30-2013, 12:39 AM
My big issue with horcs is the racial core ability 1 and 3 which is a morale bonus when you're hurt. It doesn't stack and the ones that go farther than rage or primal scream require being so injured that you'll probably be dead soon in challenging content if you don't start getting heals from a potion or divine.

I haven't checked on these in a while but it shows a horrible understanding of the mechanics of the game by the designer.

I'll take 2 wasted AP points for 20% extra damage to stunned opponents... If that stacks with Sense Weakness, it's freaking huge... Almost all the other half-orc racial abilities you have to take to get to Brutality are rock-solid

+2 STR
+4 to hit, +6 damage
Improved Power Attack
Power Rage (another +2 STR)
and then Brutality (How in the world can you power-gamers not be excited about 20% more DPS?? Does it not stack with Sense Weakness?).

Charononus
07-30-2013, 12:46 AM
I'll take 2 wasted AP points for 20% extra damage to stunned opponents... If that stacks with Sense Weakness, it's freaking huge... Almost all the other half-orc racial abilities you have to take to get to Brutality are rock-solid

+2 STR
+4 to hit, +6 damage
Improved Power Attack
Power Rage (another +2 STR)
and then Brutality (How in the world can you power-gamers not be excited about 20% more DPS?? Does it not stack with Sense Weakness?).

I'm cynical I assume nothing stacks unless it has two stated different bonus types. Once it goes live if someone proves it stacks I'll believe it, but not till then or a dev chimes in to say it does.

lyrecono
07-30-2013, 05:38 PM
does no one seem to notice the 50% base dps loss from live?
does no one seem to notice the very high requirements for the top tier stuff forcing you to spend points on mediocre stuff?
3/5% on the glancing blows? really? feats/epic 2hf feat/ED stuff give way better returns.
15 hp added to die hard? hahahahahaha with the damage output on elite mobs this looses its use after lv 5, maybe 8?
blood trail: max 10 temp hp for 2-4-6 seconds? not worth the investment
enhancement requiring slicing blow/imp sunder/improved trip on a feat starved class.
Impr trip requires combat expertise, a feat that is useless on a barb especially a frenzied berserker since armor class is down the drain for them anyway and they would loose a huge amount of dps by using it, it locks out power attack. if you realy want to trip i would rather recommend Lay waste, having power attack as a pre. having more synergy with the rest of the barb class.

The other tree's have nice stuff too, which only drives the point home that we should have class tree's next to the prc classes.
A tree where we could spend points on useful stuff that is now spread around the tree's. Creating 3 tree's for the prestige classes and have the class tree points spend count toward the prestige class would fix allot.
Limiting builds to one prc per class for balancing.

Another way of fixing it is making the core enhancements free (if you have put enough points in, similar to the ED's)

racial enhancements for the half orc are a joke, on live you wouldn't need to spend 2 points on those worthless enhancements, though the extra damage vs helpless is nice indeed, assuming it stacks with its epic brother.

Thrudh
07-30-2013, 06:09 PM
racial enhancements for the half orc are a joke, on live you wouldn't need to spend 2 points on those worthless enhancements, though the extra damage vs helpless is nice indeed, assuming it stacks with its epic brother.

They are just as good as they are on live. Are you saying you spend 0 APs on half-orc enhancements now? They are basically all the same... Extra melee damage, extra STR, extra Power Attack.

I have those now on live.. I get them again on Lamannia, and I get the huge bonus of 20% extra damage on stunned mobs.

Certainly seems like a buff to me.

lyrecono
07-30-2013, 10:24 PM
They are just as good as they are on live. Are you saying you spend 0 APs on half-orc enhancements now? They are basically all the same... Extra melee damage, extra STR, extra Power Attack.

I have those now on live.. I get them again on Lamannia, and I get the huge bonus of 20% extra damage on stunned mobs.

Certainly seems like a buff to me.


seems and reality are strangers here.....
i was referring to the orcish fury, which is as useles on lamania as on life, at least dwarfs get 10 hp between the con upgrades, horcs are stuck with something that does not work, because nobody tells their healer: please keep my hitpoints just under 25%. this is why nobody takes these on live except for a few jokers trying to prove a point. (remember that drow sorc with a 1 con?)

Qhualor
07-30-2013, 10:44 PM
sounds like a lot of clickies. I don't mind some, but not when im spending the time trying to cycle through them, keep frenzies up, fight and scream "HJEAL MEEH!!!". heroic mobs would probably go down quick enough anyways, but in epics along with more clickies it would just be down right annoying.

that's just my take on what ive been reading since character copy wont let me get to Lama. who knows, maybe I will be pleasantly surprised when it hits live. if not, I will be heard :D

Thrudh
07-30-2013, 11:00 PM
seems and reality are strangers here.....
i was referring to the orcish fury, which is as useles on lamania as on life, at least dwarfs get 10 hp between the con upgrades, horcs are stuck with something that does not work, because nobody tells their healer: please keep my hitpoints just under 25%. this is why nobody takes these on live except for a few jokers trying to prove a point. (remember that drow sorc with a 1 con?)

Yes I agree those 2 APs are totally wasted... but that's only 2... The rest of the APs are worthwhile... More STR, more STR, Improved Power Attack, and +4 to hit/+6 damage are very good enhancements.

You telling me you don't want those? I'm seeing people on these boards say the half-orc enhancements suck, but they are better than they are on live. They have been buffed, even if you DON'T count the 20% more damage on stunned opponents...

Count that (if it stacks with Sense Weakness), and half-orcs have the best racial enhancements in the game.

lyrecono
07-30-2013, 11:09 PM
for these tests i used no party buffs, no clickie's, no rage/frenzie etc, its just the first number that pops up in the string of numbers (usualy followed by elemental and such damage)

i don't mind the good stuff in the racial/barb tree's, i hate the not so good stuff that's forced down our throats that will limit our choices

Teh_Troll
07-30-2013, 11:37 PM
They are just as good as they are on live. Are you saying you spend 0 APs on half-orc enhancements now? They are basically all the same... Extra melee damage, extra STR, extra Power Attack.

I have those now on live.. I get them again on Lamannia, and I get the huge bonus of 20% extra damage on stunned mobs.

Certainly seems like a buff to me.

Can you do a small test . . . time how long it takes to beat down EE Sobrien (helpless of course, especially with that possibly stacking bonus) on both Lama and live and state the difference in times.

I'm curious, I don't have one myself to test but this will answer people's questions.

Thrudh
07-30-2013, 11:45 PM
Can you do a small test . . . time how long it takes to beat down EE Sobrien (helpless of course, especially with that possibly stacking bonus) on both Lama and live and state the difference in times.

I'm curious, I don't have one myself to test but this will answer people's questions.

I did some tests in the other thread.

https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/421305-I-Am-Usually-the-Guy/page2

Teh_Troll
07-31-2013, 08:00 AM
I did some tests in the other thread.

https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/421305-I-Am-Usually-the-Guy/page2

Do that test, it's also a hell of a lot of fun.

Cetus
08-04-2013, 10:17 AM
Here's the problem:

Half Orc AP costs to get brutality

Human gives you an extra feat and costs 1 AP to unlock damage boost. Thats a 20% boost you get which cancels out the halforc damage you when burst DPSing. Thats it, you saved like 20+ ap's to spend elsewhere.

The only thing from halforc that I really would like to have are the extra action boosts.

Brutality is nice, but after playing with it I ended up not touching it because with combat brute + sense weakness + ninja spy, anything that can be made helpless already gets ripped apart. The extra 20% is overkill. Doesn't do anything for red named fights either.

I'm thinking about putting together a con-based dwarven barbarian (with con to hit) with the tier 5 instakill and earthgrab with a massive amount of HP's right now. Silver flame pots don't touch con, so that might be a possibility.