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View Full Version : Fleshie Arty Viable and other questions...



WanderingGrump
06-26-2013, 08:15 AM
Hi folks,

Since it was on sale I decided to get the Arty class and while I am not in a hurry to building one quickly I am going to start researching the build I will use on my road to completionist since it's required. I am not sure if I will like the class but one thing I do know is for personal reasons I don't play Warfarged. Call me silly or odd but I just can't bring myself to do it. So with that being the case is it viable to actually run a fleshy Arty? Is Construct Essence worth taking and actually lead to viability for realistic self healing?

I have seen there is a Bastard Sword melee version of the Arty and since my completionist toon has a heck of a Bastard sword selection that will likely be a consideration for the build I use. I don't know if I will do much as far as repeaters go on the toon but I may try it and see if I like it.

Other than the damage considerations what is better between repeater types. Is it noticeable the difference between light and heavy crossbows? Which is supperior? Is a Great Crossbow worth using at all (I suspect it's something that looks good but in truth is more of a flavor thing or a trap like Kama's on a Monk, but since I haven't used them it's hard for me to say)?

Thanks for the thoughts on this...

Darkrok
06-26-2013, 08:31 AM
My opinion: Construct Essence is a trap. Especially on a human or half elf where you can get quite a bit of healing amp. Now that said, it's like any other toon then that relies on scrolling to heal - you're going to have to move around to get those heals off - you're not just going to stand in there and hit the quickened recon any time you get low on life - but it's far more effective than gimping both heals and you're more likely to have friendly healers help you out. I know on my hybrid druids (only 9 levels of druid) I'm more than happy to toss heals on random pug fighters, barbs, arti's, etc...but my greater vigor is rarely maximized (don't have the sp's to be tossing that around constantly) and if I see dark green numbers I'm not going to bother - it's just not effective enough and makes it clear you're planning on always healing yourself. Don't get me wrong, construct essence does what it's advertised to do. It just reduces all methods of healing yourself.

I'm not too knowledgeable about the damage output of bastard sword arti's. I can say that casting and supplementing with rune arm + repeater works great at lower levels (repeaters do the bulk of the work here) and pretty well up through 20 (blade barrier destroys heroic content) but I don't know how well it works in Epics.

Best crossbows are either of the repeaters. Nothing else is really worth using.

Veles
06-26-2013, 08:49 AM
Humans/helves make the best arties. Best hjeal amp, scroll healing, cocoon, extra feat/sneak damage.
That's plenty to heal yourself ( or others ) for a ranged toon. Recon is easy zerging button in easy content.
Construct essence on fleshy ( or Improved Fortification on toaster ) is terrible trap if you EVER going to need any heals from someone else. Hello CITW ?

Anecdotal evidence, but the best arties I have met and posted some hard solo completions are fleshies.

smeggy1384
06-27-2013, 12:27 AM
My thoughts on Construct Essence were pretty torn... it can be handy if you solo a lot or go for the BYOH groups, but when you need a heal from others it's taking a big chunk out of that. I ran through 3 human arti lives and used it on one full one, swapped it out on one life, and skipped it on one. I missed it a few times, but the situations some self repairs would have saved me so would a real healer (or sometimes even a hireling) or just some smarter playing.

It's not needed on a flesh arti, you have Stoneskin, very strong UMD potential, protection and resist elements spells, and a robo dog that can be a very tough tank (when it doesn't bug out).

As far as great crossbows vs repeaters the great does more per hit while the repeater does more hits (and with various effects more damage over time)... at low levels you'll probably be one shotting mobs anyway, so the repeater wastes 2 bolts (unless you happened to have mobs lined up). Early on grab whatever has the most effects to hit things with, something like a Lacerating repeater at level 2 is crazy. As monsters get to where they survive more than one hit the repeater pulls way ahead of the great crossbow.

One thing to keep in mind is the Flame Turret tends to grab a lot of aggro, using it like an extra tank (or door blocker) can greatly extend your survival when you have no self healing without a wand or scroll.

AlmGhandi
06-27-2013, 12:54 AM
Fleshy is not really a problem.... construct essence is lame if you are planning on pugging...
cure serious pots and cure critical wands (started collecting before I rolled the arti) were not a problem. Didn't even have to bring a hire until about level 19....
I did a Halfling... kept dex and int more or less the same... and managed to get to cap.

ericrd
06-27-2013, 01:43 AM
fleshie artie very viable no construct essence needed...you have 4 types oh healing pot bombs,scrolls,wands and pots

have had a helf artie since they came out.havnt had any probs with stayiin alive..iive soloed some ees and all ehards/heroic elites,also capped all eds with him....not mellee though so not sure about viablity of fleshy melle artie

WanderingGrump
06-28-2013, 04:39 AM
Thanks for the replies folks. I more suspected that Construct Essence wasn't really a great idea. I have talked to a few who have taken it and it just isn't worth it in the environment I most often play which is usually with my Guildies, in small fixed TR duo/trio's and the occasional PUG.

I am still debating if I want to go for a caster/ranged arty or more of a melee version. I am not sure if a melee based arty is a good idea yet but I am still hunting around. The Juggernaut seems intriguing for a class split perspective but I am not sure I would want to try scroll healing with a heavy melee toon, though I do it with my h-elf monk.

If any of you have some melee build recommendations I'd welcome those.

Stoner81
06-28-2013, 05:29 AM
The Juggernaut seems intriguing for a class split perspective but I am not sure I would want to try scroll healing with a heavy melee toon, though I do it with my h-elf monk.

That particular build is rather advanced and requires a lot of gear to make it work plus (IIRC) +4 tomes on all stats, I did a arty life on a human and it worked really well it had a good amount of heal amp lots of skill points (maxed INT) and shredded it's way through level 1-8 ish (might have been more I can't remember). I crafted a heavy repeater of holy and bleed and it was a massacre. This included the damage bonuses from arty infusions and was a lot of fun.

Feats wise pick precise shot and improved precise shot as these will help with your DPS no end since you can target casters at the back of room and still everything else between them and you.

Stoner81.

GlassJaw
06-30-2013, 10:59 AM
I leveled a Human Art to 20 specifically to be my crafter/farmer and it was both fun and a cakewalk. I did a pretty standard ranged build (with IPS) but I also took Aug Summoning, Construct Essence, and all the Dragonmarks of Making. Worked like a charm.

Sure I could have scroll/wand-healed but having multiple Recon and Repair SLAs was really nice.

Todkaninchen
07-02-2013, 03:15 PM
I'm not too knowledgeable about the damage output of bastard sword arti's. I can say that casting and supplementing with rune arm + repeater works great at lower levels (repeaters do the bulk of the work here) and pretty well up through 20 (blade barrier destroys heroic content) but I don't know how well it works in Epics.

Best crossbows are either of the repeaters. Nothing else is really worth using.

One thing to remember is--as long as you can make your to-hit rolls--you can add your INT mod to damage and buff your damage/DR breaking just like you can with a repeater. What's going to be slower is your "rate of fire" and the fact you need the various feats (based on STR) to get your weapons to proc the added damage on glancing blows.

Or, rather, you're probably going to be a STR/INT build instead of a DEX/INT build with a repeater except you might need more investment into STR than a repeater arti needs on DEX. Additionally, unlike a repeater arti that can add 2[W] to the weapon damage with Deadly Weapons (spell) and the Epic Feat Combat Archery, you're going to be even more reliant on your Epic Destinies for bumping your melee damage (and defenses).

So, Legendary Dreadnought?

As far as bows...

For the most part, for random loot bows, the difference in the repeaters is pretty small. For Green steel bows, no reason not to go for heavies. For named bows, really depends on the bow.

For greatcrossbows...

They can be fun at lower levels or in (lower CR) wilderness areas where they can do a lot of damage in a single shot and almost nothing has fortification (so you get your crits). However, unless you're doing Endless Fusillade with one*, even with rapid shot/rapid reload together, you're probably scrimping on your DPS...

So, unless it's got some really, really interesting "on critical" proc and you're running Improved Critical Ranged plus Improved Precise Shot and you can't find the same on a repeater, probably not an advantage.






* - Yes, Endless Fusillade--for a short period of time--will turn a Great Cross into a repeater.

unbongwah
07-02-2013, 04:12 PM
This seems as good a place as any to post this build; for fun I took advantage of the free tomes from the 7th birthday celebration to roll up this toon:

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 03.16.01
DDO Character Planner Home Page (http://www.rjcyberware.com/DDO)

Level 25 True Neutral Dwarf Female
(20 Artificer \ 5 Epic)
Hit Points: 347
Spell Points: 1197
BAB: 15\15\20\25\25
Fortitude: 10
Reflex: 10
Will: 12

Starting Feat/Enhancement
Abilities Base Stats Modified Stats
(32 Point) (Level 1) (Level 25)
Strength 11 13
Dexterity 16 19
Constitution 16 18
Intelligence 17 27
Wisdom 8 10
Charisma 6 8

Tomes Used
+2 Tome of Strength used at level 7
+2 Tome of Dexterity used at level 7
+2 Tome of Constitution used at level 7
+2 Tome of Intelligence used at level 7
+2 Tome of Wisdom used at level 7
+2 Tome of Charisma used at level 7
+3 Tome of Dexterity used at level 15

Level 1 (Artificer)
Feat: (Selected) Point Blank Shot


Level 2 (Artificer)


Level 3 (Artificer)
Feat: (Selected) Toughness


Level 4 (Artificer)
Ability Raise: INT
Feat: (Artificer Bonus) Precise Shot


Level 5 (Artificer)


Level 6 (Artificer)
Feat: (Selected) Precision


Level 7 (Artificer)


Level 8 (Artificer)
Ability Raise: INT
Feat: (Artificer Bonus) Maximize Spell


Level 9 (Artificer)
Feat: (Selected) Power Attack


Level 10 (Artificer)


Level 11 (Artificer)


Level 12 (Artificer)
Ability Raise: INT
Feat: (Artificer Bonus) Improved Critical: Ranged Weapons
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Slashing Weapons


Level 13 (Artificer)


Level 14 (Artificer)


Level 15 (Artificer)
Feat: (Selected) Cleave


Level 16 (Artificer)
Ability Raise: INT
Feat: (Artificer Bonus) Improved Precise Shot


Level 17 (Artificer)


Level 18 (Artificer)
Feat: (Selected) Great Cleave


Level 19 (Artificer)


Level 20 (Artificer)
Ability Raise: INT
Feat: (Artificer Bonus) Rapid Shot
Enhancement: Artificer Damage Boost I
Enhancement: Artificer Damage Boost II
Enhancement: Artificer Crossbow Attack I
Enhancement: Artificer Crossbow Damage I
Enhancement: Artificer Crossbow Damage II
Enhancement: Artificer Improved Rune Arm Use I
Enhancement: Artificer Improved Rune Arm Use II
Enhancement: Artificer Improved Rune Arm Use III
Enhancement: Artificer Improved Rune Arm Use IV
Enhancement: Artificer Battle Engineer I
Enhancement: Artificer Rune Arm Overcharge I
Enhancement: Artificer Rune Arm Overcharge II
Enhancement: Arcane Empowerment
Enhancement: Dwarven Axe Damage I
Enhancement: Dwarven Spell Defense I
Enhancement: Dwarven Spell Defense II
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
Enhancement: Kinetic Spellcasting I
Enhancement: Kinetic Spellcasting II
Enhancement: Kinetic Spellcasting III
Enhancement: Kinetic Spellcasting IV
Enhancement: Kinetic Spellcasting V
Enhancement: Kinetic Spellcasting VI
Enhancement: Deadly Kinetics I
Enhancement: Deadly Kinetics II
Enhancement: Deadly Kinetics III
Enhancement: Deadly Kinetics IV
Enhancement: Deadly Kinetics V
Enhancement: Deadly Kinetics VI
Enhancement: Force Manipulation I
Enhancement: Force Manipulation II
Enhancement: Force Manipulation III
Enhancement: Force Manipulation IV
Enhancement: Force Manipulation V
Enhancement: Force Manipulation VI
Enhancement: Force Manipulation VII
Enhancement: Artificer Intelligence I
Enhancement: Artificer Intelligence II
Enhancement: Artificer Intelligence III
Enhancement: Artificer Wand and Scroll Mastery I
Enhancement: Artificer Wand and Scroll Mastery II
Enhancement: Artificer Wand and Scroll Mastery III
Enhancement: Artificer Wand and Scroll Mastery IV


Level 21 (Artificer)
Feat: (Selected) Spell Focus: Evocation


Level 22 (Artificer)


Level 23 (Artificer)


Level 24 (Artificer)


Level 25 (Artificer)


The idea was a dwarven arty (loosely inspired by this splash page (http://www.ddo.com/sites/default/files/slides/dragon-slide.jpg)) who could also melee w/d.axe+RA. Picks up PA/CL/GC with the intention of picking up Lay Waste & Momentum Swing. Not intended as an EE build; just something different to level with for fun.