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NeedHelp
05-09-2013, 12:59 PM
I'm going for first life pure rogue and was playing with the build creator and this is what I came up with. I was going for assassin path and still wanted her to be good with traps. I haven't unlocked +4 APs yet and was wondering if I made a good use of AP and features. I'm looking for any advice and open to suggestions for changes.

This build is more focused for teaming but I don't always team so your opinion would be good to make her more efficient solo with hireling companion. I'm also open to suggestions for a splash of other classes for this build. I do want to keep Half Elf race as primary choice.

I made an error with enhancements at the start so at level 14 I reset them to acquired requirements for assassin path. I kept tumbler at 1 from the start because I read in the wiki that you only really need 1 point for rogue - later on I raised this skill to 4. I also kept jump at level 10 because I read 10 is the max level for jump ability. I added most skill points to primary class skills and what was left I distributed to increase bluff and haggler.

For features I selected toughness, dodge, mobility, crippling strike, defensive roll, evasion, improve critical piercing weapons (but I though maybe slashing weapons a better choice?), skill mastery, and power attack.

I don't know, its my first try, so any advice you guys can provide is appreciated.


Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 03.16.01
DDO Character Planner Home Page (http://www.rjcyberware.com/DDO)

Thief Lyn
Level 20 True Neutral Half-Elf Female
(20 Rogue)
Hit Points: 316
Spell Points: 0
BAB: 15\15\20\25\25
Fortitude: 9
Reflex: 15
Will: 5

Starting Feat/Enhancement
Abilities Base Stats Modified Stats
(28 Point) (Level 1) (Level 20)
Strength 16 20
Dexterity 14 17
Constitution 14 16
Intelligence 14 18
Wisdom 8 8
Charisma 8 8

Starting Feat/Enhancement
Base Skills Modified Skills
Skills (Level 1) (Level 20)
Balance 6 27
Bluff -1 27
Concentration 2 4
Diplomacy -1 0
Disable Device 6 29
Haggle 3 20
Heal -1 0
Hide 6 35
Intimidate -1 0
Jump 7 16
Listen -1 0
Move Silently 6 35
Open Lock 6 27
Perform n/a n/a
Repair 2 5
Search 6 28
Spot 3 23
Swim 3 6
Tumble n/a 8
Use Magic Device 3 23

Level 1 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+4)
Skill: Disable Device (+4)
Skill: Haggle (+4)
Skill: Hide (+4)
Skill: Jump (+4)
Skill: Move Silently (+4)
Skill: Open Lock (+4)
Skill: Search (+4)
Skill: Spot (+4)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+4)
Feat: (Half-Elf Dilettante) Half-Elf Dilettante: Barbarian
Feat: (Selected) Toughness


Level 2 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Bluff (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Tumble (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 3 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Bluff (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Dodge


Level 4 (Rogue)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Bluff (+2)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 5 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Jump (+2)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 6 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Bluff (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Power Attack


Level 7 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Bluff (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 8 (Rogue)
Ability Raise: INT
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Bluff (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 9 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+2)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Toughness


Level 10 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Bluff (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Rogue Bonus) Improved Evasion


Level 11 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Bluff (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 12 (Rogue)
Ability Raise: INT
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Bluff (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Jump (+2)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Piercing Weapons


Level 13 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Bluff (+3)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Rogue Bonus) Crippling Strike


Level 14 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Bluff (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+2)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Rogue Damage Boost I
Enhancement: Rogue Damage Boost II
Enhancement: Rogue Skill Boost I
Enhancement: Half-Elf Improved Damage Reduction I
Enhancement: Half-Elf Improved Damage Reduction II
Enhancement: Human Adaptability Constitution I
Enhancement: Human Greater Adaptability Strength I
Enhancement: Rogue Subtle Backstabbing I
Enhancement: Rogue Subtle Backstabbing II
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
Enhancement: Racial Toughness III
Enhancement: Rogue Assassin I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Accuracy I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Accuracy II
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training II
Enhancement: Improved Hide I
Enhancement: Improved Hide II
Enhancement: Improved Move Silently I
Enhancement: Improved Move Silently II
Enhancement: Half-Elf Barbarian Constitution I
Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity I
Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity II
Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity III
Enhancement: Half-Elf Barbarian Toughness I
Enhancement: Half-Elf Barbarian Toughness II


Level 15 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Bluff (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Tumble (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Toughness
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Accuracy III


Level 16 (Rogue)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Bluff (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Tumble (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Rogue Bonus) Skill Mastery
Enhancement: Rogue Assassin II
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training III


Level 17 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Bluff (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Tumble (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Accuracy IV


Level 18 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Bluff (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+2)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Mobility
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training IV


Level 19 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Bluff (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+2)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Rogue Bonus) Defensive Roll
Enhancement: Rogue Assassin III


Level 20 (Rogue)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Bluff (+2)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Rogue Skill Boost II
Enhancement: Rogue Deadly Shadow
Enhancement: Rogue Wrack Construct I
Enhancement: Improved Disable Device I

Barhai
05-09-2013, 02:25 PM
I'm going for first life pure rogue and was playing with the build creator and this is what I came up with. I was going for assassin path and still wanted her to be good with traps. I haven't unlocked +4 APs yet and was wondering if I made a good use of AP and features. I'm looking for any advice and open to suggestions for changes.

This build is more focused for teaming but I don't always team so your opinion would be good to make her more efficient solo with hireling companion. I'm also open to suggestions for a splash of other classes for this build. I do want to keep Half Elf race as primary choice.

I made an error with enhancements at the start so at level 14 I reset them to acquired requirements for assassin path. I kept tumbler at 1 from the start because I read in the wiki that you only really need 1 point for rogue - later on I raised this skill to 4. I also kept jump at level 10 because I read 10 is the max level for jump ability. I added most skill points to primary class skills and what was left I distributed to increase bluff and haggler.

For features I selected toughness, dodge, mobility, crippling strike, defensive roll, evasion, improve critical piercing weapons (but I though maybe slashing weapons a better choice?), skill mastery, and power attack.

I don't know, its my first try, so any advice you guys can provide is appreciated.


Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 03.16.01
DDO Character Planner Home Page (http://www.rjcyberware.com/DDO)

Thief Lyn
Level 20 True Neutral Half-Elf Female
(20 Rogue)
Hit Points: 316
Spell Points: 0
BAB: 15\15\20\25\25
Fortitude: 9
Reflex: 15
Will: 5

Starting Feat/Enhancement
Abilities Base Stats Modified Stats
(28 Point) (Level 1) (Level 20)
Strength 16 20
Dexterity 14 17
Constitution 14 16
Intelligence 14 18
Wisdom 8 8
Charisma 8 8

Starting Feat/Enhancement
Base Skills Modified Skills
Skills (Level 1) (Level 20)
Balance 6 27
Bluff -1 27
Concentration 2 4
Diplomacy -1 0
Disable Device 6 29
Haggle 3 20
Heal -1 0
Hide 6 35
Intimidate -1 0
Jump 7 16
Listen -1 0
Move Silently 6 35
Open Lock 6 27
Perform n/a n/a
Repair 2 5
Search 6 28
Spot 3 23
Swim 3 6
Tumble n/a 8
Use Magic Device 3 23

Level 1 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+4)
Skill: Disable Device (+4)
Skill: Haggle (+4)
Skill: Hide (+4)
Skill: Jump (+4)
Skill: Move Silently (+4)
Skill: Open Lock (+4)
Skill: Search (+4)
Skill: Spot (+4)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+4)
Feat: (Half-Elf Dilettante) Half-Elf Dilettante: Barbarian
Feat: (Selected) Toughness


Level 2 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Bluff (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Tumble (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 3 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Bluff (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Dodge


Level 4 (Rogue)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Bluff (+2)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 5 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Jump (+2)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 6 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Bluff (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Power Attack


Level 7 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Bluff (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 8 (Rogue)
Ability Raise: INT
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Bluff (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 9 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+2)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Toughness


Level 10 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Bluff (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Rogue Bonus) Improved Evasion


Level 11 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Bluff (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 12 (Rogue)
Ability Raise: INT
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Bluff (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Jump (+2)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Piercing Weapons


Level 13 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Bluff (+3)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Rogue Bonus) Crippling Strike


Level 14 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Bluff (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+2)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Rogue Damage Boost I
Enhancement: Rogue Damage Boost II
Enhancement: Rogue Skill Boost I
Enhancement: Half-Elf Improved Damage Reduction I
Enhancement: Half-Elf Improved Damage Reduction II
Enhancement: Human Adaptability Constitution I
Enhancement: Human Greater Adaptability Strength I
Enhancement: Rogue Subtle Backstabbing I
Enhancement: Rogue Subtle Backstabbing II
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
Enhancement: Racial Toughness III
Enhancement: Rogue Assassin I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Accuracy I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Accuracy II
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training II
Enhancement: Improved Hide I
Enhancement: Improved Hide II
Enhancement: Improved Move Silently I
Enhancement: Improved Move Silently II
Enhancement: Half-Elf Barbarian Constitution I
Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity I
Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity II
Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity III
Enhancement: Half-Elf Barbarian Toughness I
Enhancement: Half-Elf Barbarian Toughness II


Level 15 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Bluff (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Tumble (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Toughness
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Accuracy III


Level 16 (Rogue)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Bluff (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Tumble (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Rogue Bonus) Skill Mastery
Enhancement: Rogue Assassin II
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training III


Level 17 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Bluff (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Tumble (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Accuracy IV


Level 18 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Bluff (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+2)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Mobility
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training IV


Level 19 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Bluff (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+2)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Rogue Bonus) Defensive Roll
Enhancement: Rogue Assassin III


Level 20 (Rogue)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Bluff (+2)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Rogue Skill Boost II
Enhancement: Rogue Deadly Shadow
Enhancement: Rogue Wrack Construct I
Enhancement: Improved Disable Device I




So what's the plan with this character?
What weapons are you going to use, what armor and notable gear?
Because right now I'm just not seeing the build use: as a rogue TWF is the optimal way of doing dps, that means 3 feats needed and 17 dex (or use a tome and start a little lower).
Also mobility? What dex/dodge are you planning on having? it takes a dex of 48 to fill up a dragonscale hide armor, most new armors have quite high max dex.

I'd say a high heal amp (monk dilettante) is better than more HP (barb one) but that's a personal style and both works.

NeedHelp
05-11-2013, 04:53 PM
Gosh, you got me there. I'm new to DDO I've no idea about weapons or gear. I was going for rogue because I hate not being able to open secret doors and disabling traps. Plus I'm learning the quests for the first time and figured going rogue is the best choice. I started with a druid but like I said I want to disable traps and open secret doors.

From what you telling me I'm missing TWF and two other features and I should try monk dilettante. I'll keep working on this build.

ForumAccess
05-12-2013, 08:13 AM
I also kept jump at level 10 because I read 10 is the max level for jump ability.
Jump caps at 40, not 10. There is a spell that will add 30 to your jump skill, but whether or not you can depend on others to cast it on you is largely determined by your playstyle.

As was already mentioned, the three Two Weapon Fighting feats are essentially necessary for any assassin rogue to not be entirely gimped. This will require 17 base Dexterity, meaning points spent at character creation, points from level ups, and tomes used. Enhancements and items will not help you to qualify for this.

The choice of what Dilettante feat to use is more debatable. And, fortunately, changeable via feat swaps with Fred the Friendly Mindflayer. If you want to try out Monk Dili, you will need 13 starting Wisdom. But really, going with Barbarian is not a terrible choice as it opens up two additional Toughness enhancements for Rogues, as well as a Constitution increase. The benefit of Healing Amp from Monk Dili is something that only really starts to shine when you stack it with other healing amp enhancements and gear, which is hard to do for non-monks at lower levels.

Splitting your level up attribute increases is never really a good idea, unless it is necessary to hit the minimum threshold for something. You need to decide what you want to focus on. Either Strength for a 'combat' style of Rogue, with a slightly higher base damage (which is quite overshadowed by your sneak attack damage), or else Intelligence for a high Assassinate DC. Or even Dexterity, as there are some weapons that will let you use your DEX mod for attack and damage, and that will become much more usable in the upcoming Enhancement Trees. But splitting your focus between them while leveling up is something that won't really get you very far in any of the areas.

As I mentioned before, the Two Weapon Fighting line requires a base Dexterity of 17. The Improved Sneak Attack epic feat would require a base Dexterity of 21. Keep these thresholds in mind when planning out your stats, as well as what Tomes you will be likely to use to get those bonuses. If this is your first character you will likely be able to afford a +1 DEX tome before you want to take Improved Two Weapon Fighting, and a +2 DEX tome before you hit epic levels. Or you can just P2W and buy a +3 tome with Turbine Points / Astral Shards.

~Abyssal_Mage
05-13-2013, 01:18 AM
This is only my opinion so take it as such.

Not sure what Dilly you should take but their are advantages to a few. As a new player I would probably go Fighter Dilly and switch out at higher levels (12'ish) but most of the Dilly's have their advantages. Barbarian, Druid, Wizard, and Sorcerer would probably be ones I would stay away from though.

Stats - 12 Str, 16 Dex, 14 Con, 15 Int

Level Up's - + Int, + Dex, + Int, +Int, +Dex, ??? (Int most likely @ 24)
The goal is to get to 21 Dex at lvl 21. 16 + 2 level ups, +3 Tome should get you there. By level 21 you should have enough PP to afford a +3 tome on the AH. The good thing is you never have to purchase a +1 or +2 Dex tome so that should save you some money and redundancy.

Feats -
Toughness
TWF line x 3
Improved Critical: Pierce or Slash (I'm favoring Pierce as of this post)
Precision (15+)

I'll let the real Rogue experts round out the build :cool:

bsquishwizzy
05-13-2013, 05:34 PM
I'm going for first life pure rogue and was playing with the build creator and this is what I came up with. I was going for assassin path and still wanted her to be good with traps. I haven't unlocked +4 APs yet and was wondering if I made a good use of AP and features. I'm looking for any advice and open to suggestions for changes.

This build is more focused for teaming but I don't always team so your opinion would be good to make her more efficient solo with hireling companion. I'm also open to suggestions for a splash of other classes for this build. I do want to keep Half Elf race as primary choice.

I made an error with enhancements at the start so at level 14 I reset them to acquired requirements for assassin path. I kept tumbler at 1 from the start because I read in the wiki that you only really need 1 point for rogue - later on I raised this skill to 4. I also kept jump at level 10 because I read 10 is the max level for jump ability. I added most skill points to primary class skills and what was left I distributed to increase bluff and haggler.

For features I selected toughness, dodge, mobility, crippling strike, defensive roll, evasion, improve critical piercing weapons (but I though maybe slashing weapons a better choice?), skill mastery, and power attack.

I don't know, its my first try, so any advice you guys can provide is appreciated.


My opinion for a new player doing rogue (usually with a 28-point build) is to go DEX-based (this means having a high-DEX scrore), and use finesse for a weapons feat. it is easier to come to grips with maintaining CON, INT (for an assassin) and DEX than CON, INT, STR, and DEX. Yeah, your base DPS will be lower, but you'll make up for that in SA damage, and you'll augment your killing power with specialized weapons.

DEX plays a huge role with rogues. It ie nest to embrace it early as opposed to try and work around it.

As fort trapping, most of that is gear-nased. You want any and all gear that maximize Search, Spot, Disable Device, and Open Lock. You'll also want items that maximize your DEX, INT, and WIS scores.

Since you are going the Assassin route, you'll also want stiff that maximizes your Sneak scores, as to do a successful assassination, you need to sneak up on the mob in question.

Because of a decent INT score, you can throw some points into UMD. Also look to get an item that increases your CHA score, along with Luck boosters and Pursuasion items (this you can craft).

Still, your base melee is going to require maybe short swords, daggers, and rapiers. You'll rely heavily on anything that gives you sneak attack damage boosters, along with some of the more common special effects like blinding, paralyzing, vorpal, disruption, and banishing. You'll be carrying around a lot of weapons, but the amoung of damage you'll be doing overall because of these will be pretty amazing. Again, because you'd be a finesse build, your average amount of damage isn't going to be all that great, but when you start using all of the special effects and assassination, the number of kills you'll effortlessly rack up will be a surpries even to you.

So, that's my basic advice.

NeedHelp
05-18-2013, 10:53 AM
Thanks for the advice. I redo the build let me know what you guys think?

13 strength was needed for fighter dilettante.

end results

Str 14
Dex 23
Con 13
Int 20
Wis 8
Cha 8


Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 03.16.01
DDO Character Planner Home Page (http://www.rjcyberware.com/DDO)

Annassassin
Level 20 True Neutral Half-Elf Male
(20 Rogue)
Hit Points: 224
Spell Points: 0
BAB: 15\15\20\25\25
Fortitude: 7
Reflex: 18
Will: 5

Starting Feat/Enhancement
Abilities Base Stats Modified Stats
(28 Point) (Level 1) (Level 20)
Strength 13 14
Dexterity 16 23
Constitution 13 13
Intelligence 15 20
Wisdom 8 8
Charisma 8 8

Starting Feat/Enhancement
Base Skills Modified Skills
Skills (Level 1) (Level 20)
Balance 7 29
Bluff -1 16
Concentration 1 1
Diplomacy -1 -1
Disable Device 6 28
Haggle 3 22
Heal -1 -1
Hide 7 38
Intimidate -1 -1
Jump 1 13
Listen -1 -1
Move Silently 7 38
Open Lock 7 29
Perform n/a n/a
Repair 2 5
Search 6 28
Spot 3 22
Swim 1 2
Tumble 7 17
Use Magic Device 3 22

Level 1 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+4)
Skill: Disable Device (+4)
Skill: Haggle (+4)
Skill: Hide (+4)
Skill: Move Silently (+4)
Skill: Open Lock (+4)
Skill: Search (+4)
Skill: Spot (+4)
Skill: Tumble (+4)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+4)
Feat: (Half-Elf Dilettante) Half-Elf Dilettante: Fighter
Feat: (Selected) Toughness


Level 2 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Tumble (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Rogue Damage Boost I
Enhancement: Rogue Skill Boost I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training I
Enhancement: Rogue Improved Trap Sense I


Level 3 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Tumble (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Two Weapon Fighting
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Accuracy I
Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity I


Level 4 (Rogue)
Ability Raise: DEX
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Tumble (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Elven Dexterity I
Enhancement: Improved Hide I
Enhancement: Improved Move Silently I


Level 5 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Tumble (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Rogue Damage Boost II
Enhancement: Rogue Subtle Backstabbing I


Level 6 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Tumble (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Finesse
Enhancement: Rogue Skill Boost II
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training II


Level 7 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Tumble (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Accuracy II
Enhancement: Improved Hide II
Enhancement: Improved Move Silently II


Level 8 (Rogue)
Ability Raise: DEX
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Bluff (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Rogue Assassin I


Level 9 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+2)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Dodge
Enhancement: Elven Dexterity II


Level 10 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Bluff (+2)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Rogue Bonus) Crippling Strike
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II


Level 11 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Bluff (+2)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity II
Enhancement: Half-Elf Fighter Strength I


Level 12 (Rogue)
Ability Raise: INT
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+3)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Toughness
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Accuracy III
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training III


Level 13 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Bluff (+2)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Rogue Bonus) Improved Evasion
Enhancement: Rogue Assassin II


Level 14 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Bluff (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 15 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Bluff (+2)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Two Weapon Fighting
Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity III


Level 16 (Rogue)
Ability Raise: INT
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Jump (+2)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Rogue Bonus) Opportunist
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training IV


Level 17 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Jump (+2)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Accuracy IV


Level 18 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Jump (+2)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Greater Two Weapon Fighting


Level 19 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Jump (+2)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Rogue Bonus) Defensive Roll
Enhancement: Rogue Subtle Backstabbing II
Enhancement: Improved Hide III
Enhancement: Improved Move Silently III
Enhancement: Rogue Improved Trap Sense II


Level 20 (Rogue)
Ability Raise: INT
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Bluff (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Tumble (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Rogue Damage Boost III
Enhancement: Rogue Skill Boost III
Enhancement: Rogue Deadly Shadow
Enhancement: Rogue Subtle Backstabbing III
Enhancement: Rogue Assassin III

ForumAccess
05-21-2013, 05:29 AM
13 strength was needed for fighter dilettante.

With fighter Dili, you are essentially trading a feat for the STR enhancements, relative to Human. That is a losing trade. Khopesh is your best weapon choice, which Fighter Dili does not give you. Rapier is tied for your second best option, which you already get.

Splitting your level up increases is a really bad idea. You need to pick a focus and sick with it, either Dexterity or Intelligence. Dividing your focus between them does nothing but lowering your potential. Either you are going to use a weapon that allows you to take advantage of the high dexterity, or else you are trying to max out your Assassinate DC. Splitting between them gets you nowhere.

bsquishwizzy
05-22-2013, 03:51 PM
With fighter Dili, you are essentially trading a feat for the STR enhancements, relative to Human. That is a losing trade. Khopesh is your best weapon choice, which Fighter Dili does not give you. Rapier is tied for your second best option, which you already get.

Splitting your level up increases is a really bad idea. You need to pick a focus and sick with it, either Dexterity or Intelligence. Dividing your focus between them does nothing but lowering your potential. Either you are going to use a weapon that allows you to take advantage of the high dexterity, or else you are trying to max out your Assassinate DC. Splitting between them gets you nowhere.

+1.

A better bet might be Cleric Dilly where you have access to healing scrolls and wands, or maybe sorc dilly (not sure on what would be better as I don't deal much with Helfs).

You're going full-out DEX, which means that STR is nice for damage, but SA damage and special weapons, and factors applied to damage with rogue levels (like the Assassin II vorpal strike capability) weill compensate for raw damage at higher levels. Healing and buffs to augment UMD, I think, would be more vital to a DEX-based rogue build than STR.