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Ape_Man
04-14-2013, 07:14 PM
Remove it.

Archangel666
04-14-2013, 09:20 PM
Agreed. Especially for Monks. If we can't wear Armour then at least let us bloody use our agility to dodge incoming attacks properly.

ripperj
04-15-2013, 01:26 AM
I also agree. What is the max any given char can get their dodge up to anyway? 50 maybe? This would naturally require them to sacrifice a lot of other areas in order to even get there. If your willing to drop dps, PRR, HP and whatever else to get dodge up; I say more power to ya.

CheeseMilk
04-15-2013, 10:26 AM
There is an ability in the coming enhancement overhaul that adds to the dodge cap (in the Tempest tree, iirc).

I assume there will be one for monk trees as well.

Emizand
04-15-2013, 10:28 AM
I assume there will be one for monk trees as well.

Hey, hey were the monk trees and we keep monk treeing around!

Elation
04-15-2013, 10:29 AM
completly agree!!!

/signed or whatever it takes

would also like a review of natural armour and protection....

Ape_Man
04-15-2013, 10:30 AM
There is an ability in the coming enhancement overhaul that adds to the dodge cap (in the Tempest tree, iirc).

I assume there will be one for monk trees as well.

Not enough.

The MDB cap is fine, but if you're not in armor there should be no cap.

dredre9987
04-15-2013, 10:34 AM
Why so we can go back to being hit only 5% of the time? That was broken and you know it.

Archangel666
04-15-2013, 10:36 AM
Why so we can go back to being hit only 5% of the time? That was broken and you know it.

Absolutely, because it's totally possible to have 100% Dodge on all the time.

Sarcasm aside what I feel they should do for Monks is to remove the Dodge Cap and have all Dodge Bonuses for Monks give double the effect, similar to how Sorcs and FvS get double SP from items, enhancements etc.

dredre9987
04-15-2013, 10:38 AM
Absolutely, because it's totally possible to have 100% Dodge on all the time.

Sarcasm aside what I feel they should do for Monks is to remove the Dodge Cap and have all Dodge Bonuses for Monks give double the effect, similar to how Sorcs and FvS get double SP from items, enhancements etc.

And we get hit ALL the time in a quest now huh?

Ape_Man
04-15-2013, 10:41 AM
Why so we can go back to being hit only 5% of the time? That was broken and you know it.

Nobody is asking for that, and it's impossible.

What we see above is a very lame attempt at a strawman, either playing on the ignorance of the other players or the poster is simply so ignorant of the to-hit formula that he actually thinks it's possible.

After a few more years of troll-training you might be ready to step into the ring, until then stop posting because you have no idea what you are talking about.

Archangel666
04-15-2013, 10:45 AM
And we get hit ALL the time in a quest now huh?

In tougher content when mobs hit for 300 damage a swing?

Monks in any stance but Earth have ZERO damage mitigation (Other than the capstone of 10 DR/EPIC, which means bugger all 300-10=290 WOW! What a difference!).

My Monk actually has 25% Dodge most of the time and I still get hit quite a lot and when they do hit it HURTS!

If Turbine isn't going to give non-Earth Stance Monks any Damage Mitigation and it's going to hurt that much when we do get hit then we need more Dodge to prevent as many hits in the first place.

It's not like we'd be getting this for free, my Monk has 25% due to GM Water, Dodge and Mobility Feats and Gear.

smatt
04-15-2013, 10:51 AM
They're removing the dodge cap for monks.....

But only when they're using kamas....

Archangel666
04-15-2013, 10:55 AM
They're removing the dodge cap for monks.....

But only when they're using kamas....

lol. Corrupt a Wish DDO Style?

Ape_Man
04-15-2013, 10:59 AM
They're removing the dodge cap for monks.....

But only when they're using kamas....

/win

dredre9987
04-15-2013, 11:00 AM
So no dodge cap, throw on concealment and such and seriously? With the new enhancements people are posting up you could get 100% dodge short term.....

As it stands now my monk dodge capped at 25% with displacement clickies and incorp rarely gets hit.....

Ape_Man
04-15-2013, 11:02 AM
. . .With the new enhancements people are posting up you could get 100% dodge short term.....




I'm calling BS on this. Show me the numbers.

dredre9987
04-15-2013, 11:24 AM
Go look at them yourself, not believing something doesn't make it false.

maddmatt70
04-15-2013, 11:25 AM
Say I see this on lammania, but I did not test it myself, but what does the + to dodge cap mean in the enhancements. Is there still a hard at 25 and this just gets a character closer to it or can it now go above 25? I am guessing there is still a hard cap at 25 just could not test it myself.

gphysalis
04-15-2013, 11:26 AM
With the new enhancements people are posting up you could get 100% dodge short term.....


I'm calling BS on this. Show me the numbers.

Short term dodge is easy to get to 100% on live.
Be a shadowdancer, use the 100% dodge ability.

If you don't have any damage mitigation when you're not in earth stance, maybe you need to look at getting PRR on your gear, try slotting a 14 PRR crystal in your dragonscale robe.

dredre9987
04-15-2013, 11:28 AM
Say I see this on lammania, but I did not test it myself, but what does the + to dodge cap mean in the enhancements. Is there still a hard at 25 and this just gets a character closer to it or can it now go above 25? I am guessing there is still a hard cap at 25 just could not test it myself.

From a guildmate testing it is allowing you to bypass the cap.

Archangel666
04-15-2013, 11:28 AM
Short term dodge is easy to get to 100% on live.
Be a shadowdancer, use the 100% dodge ability.

If you don't have any damage mitigation when you're not in earth stance, maybe you need to look at getting PRR on your gear, try slotting a 14 PRR crystal in your dragonscale dress.

Tell me something please.

How much damage does 14 PRR mitigate when being hit for 300 damage?

*Edit* Or, tell you what, let's reduce that to 100 Damage.

I can't see anyone honestly trying to claim that EE mobs don't hit for that much.

How much damage does 14 PRR mitigate when being hit for 100 damage?

dredre9987
04-15-2013, 11:30 AM
Tell me something please.

How much damage does 14 PRR mitigate when being hit for 300 damage?

Tell me something please.

How much damage does 100% dodge mitigate when being hit for 300?

maddmatt70
04-15-2013, 11:32 AM
From a guildmate testing it is allowing you to bypass the cap.

Ahh very cool I thought that this would happen. This should make for some interesting tank builds. This means that maybe somebody can tank difficult boss's eventually if they have medicore prr.

Gkar
04-15-2013, 11:33 AM
Hey, hey were the monk trees and we keep monk treeing around!

/groan

I don't know if I should pos rep or neg rep you for that.

Ah, what the heck +1 :D

Archangel666
04-15-2013, 11:33 AM
Tell me something please.

How much damage does 100% dodge mitigate when being hit for 300?

How long can you sustain that 100% Dodge?

If it's x uses per day you'll quickly run out after the first few encounters.

If it's on a Cooldown with infinite uses then you're moving at a snails pace waiting on it to come off cooldown.

CheeseMilk
04-15-2013, 11:38 AM
Tell me something please.

How much damage does 14 PRR mitigate when being hit for 300 damage?

*Edit* Or, tell you what, let's reduce that to 100 Damage.

I can't see anyone honestly trying to claim that EE mobs don't hit for that much.

How much damage does 14 PRR mitigate when being hit for 100 damage?

9.1%.

It's better than nothing.

dredre9987
04-15-2013, 11:38 AM
How long can you sustain that 100% Dodge?

If it's x uses per day you'll quickly run out after the first few encounters.

If it's on a Cooldown with infinite uses then you're moving at a snails pace waiting on it to come off cooldown.

You telling me someone isn't going to just throw down cash and grab shrines from the store? You know it will happen.

I will find out today what the exact details on it are for you.

Archangel666
04-15-2013, 11:43 AM
9.1%.

It's better than nothing.

True. 9.1% better than nothing. lol

So, mob hits for 100 Damage, 9.1% is mitigated, Player takes 93.9 Damage.

Mob hits for 300 Damage, 9.1% is mitigated, Player takes 272.7 Damage.

And Turbine feels this is balanced?

gphysalis
04-15-2013, 11:55 AM
Tell me something please.

How much damage does 14 PRR mitigate when being hit for 300 damage?


How long can you sustain that 100% Dodge?


14 PRR mitigates ~9% damage
Shadowdancer gets 100% dodge for 15 seconds every 2 min ~ 12.5% damage mitigation.

Back to PRR,
14 PRR (blue slot)
15 PRR (Planar focus of prowess set bonus)
6 PRR (Twist from Fury of the wild)
=35 PRR, which mitigates 19% of damage (58 out of 300 damage)

If you're not being attacked by a marilith, this is significant damage mitigation.

Archangel666
04-15-2013, 12:06 PM
14 PRR mitigates ~9% damage
Shadowdancer gets 100% dodge for 15 seconds every 2 min ~ 12.5% damage mitigation.

Back to PRR,
14 PRR (blue slot)
15 PRR (Planar focus of prowess set bonus)
6 PRR (Twist from Fury of the wild)
=35 PRR, which mitigates 19% of damage (58 out of 300 damage)

If you're not being attacked by a marilith, this is significant damage mitigation.

Thanks for that. I will admit to not having the CITW Wraps yet (Though amusingly my Monk does have the Favour needed to upgrade them), so I'll have to look into that. I also missed the Blue Slot, so I'll look into that one too. (Now to see if I have any Blue Slots on anything that I can free up, kinda doubt it, but you never know).

The thing is, and this is mot meant as an attack on you, and hopefully it's not taken as such, but I'm not so sure I'd agree that 19% is significant damage mitigation.

On Epic Hard or Epic Normal it would reduce damage substantially, but who needs PRR for those?

On Epic Elite the mobs hit so bloody hard that 19% of *Insert obscenely high damage number here* is...

I just can't agree that it's significant. It's better than nothing, certainly, but that's about all I can agree with.

*Edit* Gave you a +1 for the info, even if I disagree with your conclusion.

gphysalis
04-15-2013, 12:16 PM
The thing is, and this is mot meant as an attack on you, and hopefully it's not taken as such, but I'm not so sure I'd agree that 19% is significant damage mitigation.

I would agree that it is not enough mitigation, and other sources should be avaliable.

However, I would argue that it is significant.
(I define significant as being able to survive one more hit)
Imagine a mob hitting you 3 times
3 * 300 = 900. On my character with ~770 hp, this would leave me dead.
3 * 240 = 720. This would leave me alive, and able to run away.

If you hp is between 720 and 900, then 35 PRR would mean the difference between surviving two hits and surviving three hits.

Monks have the problem of damage mitigation
Casters have the problem of DCs (this is less applicable to monks because of ways to boost stun dc)
Other melees have the problem of mob HP inflation (again, matters less to monks because of stunning + sense weakness)

Basically, the CR scaling of EE mobs leads to a poorly balanced game.

Archangel666
04-15-2013, 12:37 PM
I would agree that it is not enough mitigation, and other sources should be avaliable.

However, I would argue that it is significant.
(I define significant as being able to survive one more hit)
Imagine a mob hitting you 3 times
3 * 300 = 900. On my character with ~770 hp, this would leave me dead.
3 * 240 = 720. This would leave me alive, and able to run away.

If you hp is between 720 and 900, then 35 PRR would mean the difference between surviving two hits and surviving three hits.

Monks have the problem of damage mitigation
Casters have the problem of DCs (this is less applicable to monks because of ways to boost stun dc)
Other melees have the problem of mob HP inflation (again, matters less to monks because of stunning + sense weakness)

Basically, the CR scaling of EE mobs leads to a poorly balanced game.

Fair enough, I can't fault your reasoning.

For me though significant damage mitigation should mean going from 2 hits from a mob kills you to 10 hits from a mob kills you.

Rather than 2 hits from a mob kills you to 3 hits from a mob kills you.

If that makes any sense at all.

Oh and I obviously agree about the CR of mobs being stupidly high.

I ran EE Druid's Deep the other night (Guildie wanted some EE Wraps, she didn't spawn, naturally) and I noticed that the Wood Woads are CR 54.

Are you serious Turbine?

CR 54?

What exactly was the point in adding "Defence Chance At Level" to the Character Sheet when we're fighting mobs over twice our level?

Thrudh
04-15-2013, 12:40 PM
25% incorporeal + 25% Dodge + 50% displacement clickable offers pretty good protection. Plus, just normal AC probably gives the EE mobs 5%-10% misses.

I thought EE was already too easy? Why do we need to raise the dodge cap?

gphysalis
04-15-2013, 12:41 PM
Are you serious Turbine?

CR 54?

What exactly was the point in adding "Defence Chance At Level" to the Character Sheet when we're fighting mobs over twice our level?

They're trolling you

Ape_Man
04-15-2013, 12:46 PM
25% incorporeal + 25% Dodge + 50% displacement clickable offers pretty good protection.

I thought EE was already too easy? Why do we need to raise the dodge cap?

There simply should be no limits, period. The limits should not exist.

When we first saw CiTW beta there was no cap on dodge besides the MDB. The cap got put in place in beta when somebody (Lelo I think?) came up with a build that could sustain like a 43% full time dodge. it was a ranger/rogue/something splash that in reality would have been TERRIBLY WORTHLESS but heck it'd be hard to hit.

If people want this freedom to gimp themselves they should be allowed. personally I wouldn't bother as I find the PRR mitigation to be more reliable but why should anyone else have this illogical limit?

At the same time there should be no insane 100% perma-dodge toons. If an ability allows that (which quite frankly I don't believe) it shouldn't be possible. But if somebody wants to gimp themselves with 3 twists and a dodge-based ED more power to them.

Ape_Man
04-15-2013, 12:47 PM
They're trolling you

yeah, the "defense per level" thing was possibly the dumbest thing added to the game.

Archangel666
04-15-2013, 12:57 PM
25% incorporeal + 25% Dodge + 50% displacement clickable offers pretty good protection. Plus, just normal AC probably gives the EE mobs 5%-10% misses.

I thought EE was already too easy? Why do we need to raise the dodge cap?

25% incorporeal

Tell me how you get this on a Light Monk please. I have 10% from the eRing of the Stalker.

25% Dodge

Check. Not enough.

50% displacement clickable

Got one already, they don't last all that long. 1:30 seconds per charge and 2 charges each, so carry 20 of them?
And I might point out that anyone can use these, so erm...yeah. Pally with 50% mitigation from PRR can use a Displacement Clickie too.

Perma-Blur

Check, though again, anyone can use this including the above example of the Pally.


Oh and please don't try to strawman me with somthing pointless like "You want the damage mitigation of a Plate Wearer with the DPS of a Monk" Because that's just dumb and nobody is claiming that.

What I want is something equivalent. For Monks that's Dodge. Even with high Dodge chance a Monk is still going to get hit occasionally and with no or almost no Damage Mitigation inherent to the Class this means that mobs hit HARD.

An increase of the Dodge Cap for Monks wouldn't help when getting hit but would help get hit less.

Ape_Man
04-15-2013, 01:05 PM
What we want is something equivalent . . .

Don't be so fast with this "we" stuff. What I'd want is to scrap all this garbage and just go back to Armor Class.

I mean seriously, this is a half-baked stupid system. DEX bonus to AC in D&D terms clearly represents you ability to "dodge" out of the way. Yet in DDO's inane defense system it's still Armor class.

Archangel666
04-15-2013, 01:09 PM
Don't be so fast with this "we" stuff.

Agreed and edited.

thegreatneil
04-15-2013, 02:51 PM
This is for ape_man.

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b331/iamthegreatneil/ScreenShot00046_zps37b72776.jpg (http://s22.photobucket.com/user/iamthegreatneil/media/ScreenShot00046_zps37b72776.jpg.html)

Ape_Man
04-15-2013, 02:55 PM
This is for ape_man.

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b331/iamthegreatneil/ScreenShot00046_zps37b72776.jpg (http://s22.photobucket.com/user/iamthegreatneil/media/ScreenShot00046_zps37b72776.jpg.html)



Without the obvious bug?

maddmatt70
04-15-2013, 03:25 PM
25% incorporeal

Tell me how you get this on a Light Monk please. I have 10% from the eRing of the Stalker.

25% Dodge

Check. Not enough.

50% displacement clickable

Got one already, they don't last all that long. 1:30 seconds per charge and 2 charges each, so carry 20 of them?
And I might point out that anyone can use these, so erm...yeah. Pally with 50% mitigation from PRR can use a Displacement Clickie too.

Perma-Blur

Check, though again, anyone can use this including the above example of the Pally.


Oh and please don't try to strawman me with somthing pointless like "You want the damage mitigation of a Plate Wearer with the DPS of a Monk" Because that's just dumb and nobody is claiming that.

What I want is something equivalent. For Monks that's Dodge. Even with high Dodge chance a Monk is still going to get hit occasionally and with no or almost no Damage Mitigation inherent to the Class this means that mobs hit HARD.

An increase of the Dodge Cap for Monks wouldn't help when getting hit but would help get hit less.

Elven light monk in shadowdancer 5 destiny which is actually not a bad build has +25 incorp, 25 dodge, and displacement clickies (dragonmark feats).

Llewndyn
04-15-2013, 04:07 PM
And blurry on, technically aren't you just the product of crop dusting?

I have nothing else to add.

Archangel666
04-15-2013, 04:57 PM
And blurry on, technically aren't you just the product of crop dusting?

I have nothing else to add.

What, you mean splattered across the scenery as a fine mist?

(Couldn't resist, it was too good a feed line).

FuzzyDuck81
04-16-2013, 02:35 AM
25% incorporeal + 25% Dodge + 50% displacement clickable offers pretty good protection. Plus, just normal AC probably gives the EE mobs 5%-10% misses.

I thought EE was already too easy? Why do we need to raise the dodge cap?

I have a monk that uses this, its rather nice :) most of the time you're very hard to hit & then combine that shadowdancer ability twisted in & being in primal avatar for primal travel, its roughly 30secs at a time that you can be virtually untouchable

Dmnqwk
04-16-2013, 03:46 AM
The problem with dodge is you cannot simply take dodge and look at the issue as a standalone, you need to put it into context of all forms of mitigation:
1) Permanent
2) Temporary
3) Extraordinary

Permanent damage mitigation includes:
Armor
PRR
Dodge
Blurry/Ghostly/Incorporeality
DR

Temporary is:
Stoneskin
Displacement
Activated Abilities such as Shadowdancer's 100% dodge

Extraordinary include:
Stunning and other tactical feats
Mass Hold and other spells

If we remove temporary from the standard equation and focus on Extraordinary,since Epic Elite is very limiting on this category, with very high dcs being required for non-100% success rates. On top of that, Tactical feats in DDO all focus on str (who on earth classifies a TRIP as being str-based after all!)

Rather than concern yourself with a dodge cap, perhaps DDO could invest on making more tactical feats that are based upon attributes other than Strength.
Trip - Allowing a dex based trip with it reflex save based (adding str OR dex to the save) would make more sense than the current incarnation.
Stunning Blow/Fist - Blow should be str based while fist should be wisdom for the fort save.
Dirty Tricks - Int based fighting move which would result in a random condition from dazed/blinded/disarmed (deals 75% less damage) that is reflex save based (with dex or int as the modifier)

Keeping the base damage mitigation low is not so much of an issue as preventing non-str chars from having options in combat. I'd also like to see Rangers receive a feat that lets them trip/stunning blow with their bow around level 7-9. (obviously melee range only)

Focus on mitigating damage through skill rather than stacking dodge on your character!

honkuimushi
04-16-2013, 03:10 PM
I'm not sure if it should be completely removed, but it should at least be raised for unarmored characters. A lot of the Monk and other character abilities or gear that a Monk or multiclassed Monk would have access to grant dodge bonuses almost exclusively. There might be some minor AC boosts, but there are very few options for DR or PRR. Past 20, with decent gear it's really easy to hit 25, and then you're out of luck. What makes it even worse, is that with all the abilities that increase MDB, a light armor build can hit the 25% cap as well. And with the increasing tiers of armor, they might very well find it easier to get a higher AC as well-- to go along with the inherent PRR they get.

Honestly, I'd prefer to see the whole new system scrapped and go back to a d20 based system with the current armor tiers and having monsters use the decreasing attack bonuses used in PnP. After all, that was reversed so players wouldn't keep interrupting their attack chain so that they would always be attacking at their highest to hit value. Computer controlled characters can be programmed not to do that. So if monsters with an attack bonus of 20 and above made 20% of their attacks at +0, 20% at -5, 20% at -10, 20% at -15, and 20% at -20, you've expanded the viable range of ACs quite a bit. If you also make them use Epic attack bonuses where you only get +1 to hit every 2 levels, you slow down the race even more. You could even use the "armor as DR" option in Unearthed Arcana. Either of those would have been better than the kludge we have to use now.

Panserbjorne
05-22-2013, 03:09 AM
The problem with dodge is you cannot simply take dodge and look at the issue as a standalone, you need to put it into context of all forms of mitigation:
1) Permanent
2) Temporary
3) Extraordinary

Permanent damage mitigation includes:
Armor
PRR
Dodge
Blurry/Ghostly/Incorporeality
DR

Temporary is:
Stoneskin
Displacement
Activated Abilities such as Shadowdancer's 100% dodge

Extraordinary include:
Stunning and other tactical feats
Mass Hold and other spells

If we remove temporary from the standard equation and focus on Extraordinary,since Epic Elite is very limiting on this category, with very high dcs being required for non-100% success rates. On top of that, Tactical feats in DDO all focus on str (who on earth classifies a TRIP as being str-based after all!)

Rather than concern yourself with a dodge cap, perhaps DDO could invest on making more tactical feats that are based upon attributes other than Strength.
Trip - Allowing a dex based trip with it reflex save based (adding str OR dex to the save) would make more sense than the current incarnation.
Stunning Blow/Fist - Blow should be str based while fist should be wisdom for the fort save.
Dirty Tricks - Int based fighting move which would result in a random condition from dazed/blinded/disarmed (deals 75% less damage) that is reflex save based (with dex or int as the modifier)

Keeping the base damage mitigation low is not so much of an issue as preventing non-str chars from having options in combat. I'd also like to see Rangers receive a feat that lets them trip/stunning blow with their bow around level 7-9. (obviously melee range only)

Focus on mitigating damage through skill rather than stacking dodge on your character!

Very insightful.

In order to balance this with existing mitigation, you need to look at all mitigation. Entirely true. (+1 REP)

One thing, that was not discussed however, was prerequisites. Extraordinary mitigation should REMAIN that way. As it cannot be increased drastically or doled out to every class or it essentially becomes another type of mitigation altogether.

Currently, trip is a free tactical ability so just allowing a DEX-based trip in addition to the STR-based trip would increase mitigation AND unbalance encounters. A way to prevent STR characters from losing Trip (brute force applied to legs), or DEX characters from gaining Trip in massive amounts would be to use PREREQUISITES. If you were to make Improved Trip/Combat Expertise act as a prerequisite it reduces the number of people using it and ensures that it remains extraordinary.

The system is balanced because it requires an advanced defensive stance (Combat Expertise) and Improved Trip to perform. Additionally, you should lose all Archer's Focus stacks when you perform a Bow trip. Your focus is not on the targets in your field-of-vision!

The classes that I designed Improved Trip feats for were Rangers, Fighters, Rogue, Artificers and Monks:

*OMNIPRESENT FOCUS (RANGER) BENEFITS: As Rangers are able to focus on switching between ranged/melee combat, perhaps they should NOT lose Archer's Focus when tripping with a bow, due to the fact that they switch between ranged/melee routinely as well as keeping two targets in sight as a granted ability from class levels.

*TACTICAL COMBO (FIGHTER) BENEFITS: Fighter utilizes both Improved Trip/Knockdown effects (including 6 secs knockdown from Great Crossbow) to render a target prone and Improved Sunder concurrently, in effect, rendering a Severe Stunning Blow to a creature and rendering it helpless for up to 8 secs or until the target stands up. If you are using a Great X-bow or a Repeating X-bow and have Improved Sunder as well, the Sunder may be performed as a ranged attack. The fighter must apply both tactical feats himself with the Improved Trip occurring FIRST, then the Improved Sunder applied NEXT to be eligible for the mob to receive the Severe Stunning Blow.

*TEMPLE STRIKE (ROGUE) BENEFITS: Rogue strikes a vulnerable point on any mob that can be Bluffed, giving a -15 penalty to the Balance save to stand up (ensuring that when an enemy fails it's save against your DC, that it's going to STAY down. Successfully bluffing the target then enables sneak attack damage and you could switch to a melee weapon or commence volleying with a repeater/heavy crossbow and preventing retribution from the mob.

*HARASSING TRIP (ARTIFICER) BENEFITS: When a creature is tripped by you, attacks from your Iron Defender will extend the Trip duration by 3 secs per attack, up to 10 stacks. When a mob is tripped by your Iron Defender, your crossbow/bow will extend the duration by 2 sec for each missile that hits, up to 30 stacks. (MAX DURATION: 1min30secs)

*INSTINCTIVE RE-STRINGING (MONK) BENEFITS: Synergy exists within Henshin Mystic abilities for specific weapon/ranged attacks/AOEs so I elect that we include the Bow spec options within that tree, offering a choice between Quarterstaves/Bows (choosing both options further into the tree). The specific weapon/ranged abilities are: Ki Bolt, Force/Fire Spellpower/Lighting the Candle. The AOE abilities are: Glancing blows and Fire-based. When using a Quarterstaff, the Trip would use his Dexterity, when using a Longbow, the trip would use his Wisdom. This improved trip ability indicates that a monk could unstring his bow, perform a trip with the quarterstaff and re-string the bow in a moment's notice. The effect of Improved Trip for monks could probably lower the cooldown on trip by 5 seconds since martial arts/quarterstaves usually involve multiple trips and would ensure that you could give those powerful ki abilities a cast time to balance them while still allow considerable damage that would not immediately inundate the monk with attackers. (With a 10sec cooldown, you could trip 4 attackers, have a few seconds to gather each/position yourself for a Incinerating Wave/begin casting Cauldron of Flame and stack the damage for 20 secs OR you could trip only 3 and s(assuming all of them failed their STR/DEX check and their balance saves!).

My intention though is to make the requirements for DEX-based Tripping, specific to the feat/enhancement and making it easier to balance with only minor tweaks to encounters instead of a complete re-balancing.

EvilII
05-22-2013, 05:20 AM
14 PRR mitigates ~9% damage
Shadowdancer gets 100% dodge for 15 seconds every 2 min ~ 12.5% damage mitigation.

.

To be fair, you are getting 100% damage redcution for 15 seconds and then you'll be dead before the cooldown expires. So that's still 100% damage reduction (incorporeal).

QuantumFX
05-28-2013, 11:45 PM
Or set the hard cap to equal your current DEX score. (Notice that I said score not modifier.) It’s kind of absurd that a function that is based off of physical coordination (dodge) isn’t influenced by the D&D stat that represents physical coordination (DEX).