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Xanendor
03-25-2013, 02:45 AM
Greetings everyone.

I started DDO Jan. 3 of this year. To date I have already done the TP farm on all servers. I have five level three's; one level five; one level six; three level sevens; one level eight; and one level nine. As you might assume I am really burned out on Korthos, Harbor and Marketplace quests hehe.

Every character I have leveled I have out-leveled the quests. What I mean for example is my current level eight guy hasn't even finished all the level five quests yet. I do run them on elite and more often than not I also do the breakables and optionals so I can see how I am accelerating my experience. I really want to run quests at level range as much as possible. I see no fun in being able to one or two-shot mobs. I want the challenge of fighting mobs at level (and I guess you could say, "as originally intended"). So I tried an experiment. I created a new Paladin and purposely did every quest on normal mode, skipped most optionals but did breakables still because I need the loot and consumables. This didn't work out as I had hoped. I still hit level three before I finished all the level two quests, and when I made level five I still had level three quests undone - and so on and so forth.

So in my experience after leveling twelve characters, doing every quest, even once on normal and skipping optionals there is just no way to do every quest and stay in level-range of them. The in-game Adventure Compendium (list of quests) I just go down the list one by one to make sure I am not missing any.

Anyhow. I wanted to ask you long-time and experienced players your thoughts on this, and your method of questing and leveling.

Do you do quests at level (even on elite) one run each quest and when you level up just skip all the ones you haven't done? What I mean is, you are level four and you do level four quests. When you make level five you start doing level five quests - skipping all the quests that are now below you that you haven't done yet? And then you go back at a later date and do them for favor, for example a level eight character zerging through all the level one to seven elite quests that you skipped over?

Maybe it's the hidden OCD in me but as hard as I try it just bugs me to know I am skipping quests. I feel guilty about it and I even feel obligated to do them all, even if it's just for the favor; but then I'm griping at myself for having out-leveled the quests again.

Should I just say pfft and so what? Skip them, do them later if I want the favor? I mean why should it matter to me that I am level twelve for example zerging a level four quest for favor right? I'm after the favor afterall and not the experience at this point right? I don't know. It just bugs me a lot for some reason. I have no idea why I feel obligated to do every quest, even the ones I hate but I wind up doing them just to see them checked off in the list in red.

And that's another thing. I am already self-aware of the fact that I somehow got it into my head that every quest needs to be done on elite and when I die over and over trying to complete it because those "pfft thhbt" blade traps chopped me up I get peeved at myself for not being able to complete it without dying. I don't know where I got it in my head that I just *have* to do it on elite. I'm stuck in this rut and it's frustrating me. I know I don't have to do it on elite. I know I don't have to answer to anyone but myself. But it just feels wrong not to do them on elite because it makes me feel I can't do what everyone else does and I don't know why that bothers me so much.

I think a lot of it has to do with all these "streak" posts I read in the forums. Well, if they do it then I have to do it too! Bahh! rofl

What advice do you experienced players have for me? Do quests on normal, maybe hard and forget about this whole elite-streak business and just zerg the elites later on when you want the favor? Just do them on normal and hard without all the frustration and extra time and effort that elite runs cause? I solo mostly, maybe 95% of the time and usually with a hireling. I should have stated that sooner I suppose.

I need help! (yeah, in the head I meant.) lmao Maybe you got some expert advice?

Another question I have is about something that confuses me. This is a topic I have seen talked about a lot in the forums but opinions are so all over the place I don't know what to believe or count as credible. This is the first topic I attempted to pay attention too in the first few days of me playing DDO but it was over my head so I just played the game and didn't concern myself with it. The topic that confuses me is the five, seven or nine quest runs - like EEE/H/N or NNNNNNN/H/E <---- this stuff.

I have seen posts who say do them in lots of nine, some say seven like EEEEE/H/N or ddowiki had a chart showing variations of the five-runs like NNN/H/E.

I just don't get all this. What is so magical about the 5,7,9 run rule? Why not just E/H/N or N/H/E (if free to play) and then go on to next quest? The whole point is to get the streak bonus plus the first time difficulty bonus right? So that would be E/H/N (if you can open on elite). So why 5, 7 or 9?

Why not just one of each difficulty and then move on?

Thanks everyone and sorry for the long post. I appreciate all your help/advice and expertise.

EDIT TO ADD: I assume this 5, 7, 9 run business has to do with people doing TR runs right? Because around third life and beyond they are really going to hurt for quests that give experience? And this goes right back to my very first problem - I out level quests as it is only running them once on normal, egads I could only imagine running each one 5 7 or 9 times on top of it. I'd be level 15 doing level 6 quests still! (exaggeration to make a point but maybe truth to it?)

Uska
03-25-2013, 03:01 AM
The people who advocate doing quests multiple times are power lvling and trying to level the quickest way I dont really enjoy that myself but I do it if thats what the group is doing since I enjoy grouping more than solo play. Nothing wrong with doing a quest once and moving to the next I enjoy that more myself.

Anyways good gaming and maybe see you around.

rebelxzar
03-25-2013, 03:08 AM
One of your options after reaching 20 is to True Reincarnate. This starts you out again at L1, with some benefits. (See ddowiki for a full explanation). The experience needed for a "TR" character is dramatically higher, especially for multiple TRs. They are the ones who need the streak bonus to level. For a first life character, Experience is easy until around 10, where it gets tougher depending on which adventure packs you have access. You will find yourself repeating quests on different difficulties in order to progress.

The good news is, you will no longer be killing everything in one swing, so that will not be an issue! (Unless you are a multiple TR with top gear running on normal! )

Meretrix
03-25-2013, 03:15 AM
My advice is to do quests at level and skip those you outlevel. The next time you level up a new character or TR you can do the quests you missed and have a different experience leveling up.

ZzpxpzZ
03-25-2013, 03:16 AM
The reason there seems to be so many quests is because TRs take a lot more XP to level than first lifers and they have to have content enough for the highest amount, not the lowest.

With running every quest only once on elite without an xp pot, I do not believe there are any levels before 18 where a third life TR will XP cap before finishing the quests at that level.

(I can not say 100% since there are a few packs I skip every life, TBC and Threnal specifically, however those level ranges usually only have me 1/3rd to 1/2 through the next level before I take each level.)

EllisDee37
03-25-2013, 03:22 AM
The people running ENNNNNNH are running very, very few different quests. Maybe a few dozen total during an alt's entire lifetime from 1 to 20.

Regarding how do you avoid outleveling content, a guildie of mine runs all content at-level before taking a level. This means that for a non-trivial amount of quests he gets zero xp due to being at his level's xp cap. I could never do that.

smeggy1384
03-25-2013, 03:27 AM
I've run most non raid quests in the game a bunch of times over the 6 completed lives of my main character and am working on my 7th now. Doing quests two levels below my level on Elite for the streak is the way to go, if i can handle the quest. Doing it first on elite gets a huge boost to exp out of quests, and as a TR you need a stacking 5% more exp per level on a second life character, and 10% more per level on a 3rd+ life one. Ends up being nearly double, if not more, compared to what a first life took. The exp required is why you see the various number of runs for quests.. People know exactly how many runs of the quest they need to do to hit that much needed exp per level amount, and also if they need to break every barrel, disable traps, go for conquest...

Each time i get that character i look back over the quest list to see what i skipped, probably 10 quests total.

For a first life character that much effort to level is unneeded, as is the effort to maintain an elite streak. You likely don't know the quests to the point that you are sick of them (well maybe up to market you do from the first post) and can avoid every trap, monster ambush, and snag every available optional if you choose to. Doing elite in a quest you don't know that well, and don't have a guide for, can be counterproductive.

First is the time investment. Maybe it's not an issue to you, but a lot of people get frustrated to spend 10-30 minutes cleaning a quest of every breakable and monster to kill then being nailed by a trap at the end and having to release and restart. It's pretty much all or nothing for experience.
Ok let's say there was a rez shrine handy on that trap at the end... you still died. Your gear took a durability hit, which will cost you money. You are rez sick, and you still have to pass that trap. So back you go... and die again. It just gets worse. Those death penalties stack, so chances of crossing that trap get lower and lower. Deaths add up, this cuts into your limited profits from low level loot, if it does not eat all of it up for repairs.

In the end you either get lucky and pull off a flawless run in elite or have a horrible luck streak and it costs you time and plat for a big repair bill. First life? Learn quests on normal, enjoy the story and humor mixed in, and don't feel pressure to do a difficulty above what you are prepared for. I have to remind myself on my alts that they are not nearly as ready for elites as my TR is.

Flavilandile
03-25-2013, 04:03 AM
Welcome to DDO.


Greetings everyone.

I started DDO Jan. 3 of this year. To date I have already done the TP farm on all servers. I have five level three's; one level five; one level six; three level sevens; one level eight; and one level nine. As you might assume I am really burned out on Korthos, Harbor and Marketplace quests hehe.

Every character I have leveled I have out-leveled the quests. What I mean for example is my current level eight guy hasn't even finished all the level five quests yet. I do run them on elite and more often than not I also do the breakables and optionals so I can see how I am accelerating my experience. I really want to run quests at level range as much as possible. I see no fun in being able to one or two-shot mobs. I want the challenge of fighting mobs at level (and I guess you could say, "as originally intended"). So I tried an experiment. I created a new Paladin and purposely did every quest on normal mode, skipped most optionals but did breakables still because I need the loot and consumables. This didn't work out as I had hoped. I still hit level three before I finished all the level two quests, and when I made level five I still had level three quests undone - and so on and so forth.

At low level there's more than enough quests to outlevel quests, it's more or less has always been that way, even in the early days of DDO. ( ok, there was less low level quests, but by not much )
In the end what people do at those level ( unless they are favor farming too ) is to do the quests they like and/or find interesting. This is valid up to LVL 5/7 more or less and it comes to the fact that Originally DDO was released with a cap at LVL 10 and no TR mechanism, so when you had a character capped the only thing you had left ( beside trying to kill Velah and Farming for +2 Tomes in the Last Part of Co6 and Giant's Cave ) was to create another character and start again... There was enough quests that you didn't have to redo with your new character all the quests you had done with the previous one.




So in my experience after leveling twelve characters, doing every quest, even once on normal and skipping optionals there is just no way to do every quest and stay in level-range of them. The in-game Adventure Compendium (list of quests) I just go down the list one by one to make sure I am not missing any.

Anyhow. I wanted to ask you long-time and experienced players your thoughts on this, and your method of questing and leveling.


Well it's going to depend on your play style.
Some are Elite Streak fanatic, others don't care about it.
Some are zergers that will just rush past all the quest content to reach the completion while others will make sure they maximize all the optionals and explore all the corners of the quest instance.
Some are going fast from one fight to another while others will take their time, talk about weather and such before hitting the next mod wave.
DDO offer enough options that you can choose to fit to the way you prefer to play it, so it's really up to you.
Some of the options you will choose will make it harder for you to group, but in the end it's really up to you.



Do you do quests at level (even on elite) one run each quest and when you level up just skip all the ones you haven't done? What I mean is, you are level four and you do level four quests. When you make level five you start doing level five quests - skipping all the quests that are now below you that you haven't done yet? And then you go back at a later date and do them for favor, for example a level eight character zerging through all the level one to seven elite quests that you skipped over?


Well, when I level a character I just do the quests I prefer, and as I know them well I tend to do them fast. ( not at zerg speed though )

Now in my static group, we do all the quests of a given level, at level [ preferably ], at a slow pace, as the group started 7 years ago, we don't have the problem you encounter at low level ( we hit lvl 19 a few weeks ago, but as we play only a few hours a week, it's not surprising. )



Maybe it's the hidden OCD in me but as hard as I try it just bugs me to know I am skipping quests. I feel guilty about it and I even feel obligated to do them all, even if it's just for the favor; but then I'm griping at myself for having out-leveled the quests again.

Not really, eventually you'll go back to the quests you missed, either with a new character or with an over level character to zerg them for favor [ you can do LVL 2 quests with a LVL 20 character, you won't get XP, but you'll get full favor ].



Should I just say pfft and so what? Skip them, do them later if I want the favor? I mean why should it matter to me that I am level twelve for example zerging a level four quest for favor right? I'm after the favor afterall and not the experience at this point right? I don't know. It just bugs me a lot for some reason. I have no idea why I feel obligated to do every quest, even the ones I hate but I wind up doing them just to see them checked off in the list in red.


You nailed it about running the quests... Now you can do a quest even if you over level it, you'll get less XP from it, and it shouldn't break your streak if you have one.



And that's another thing. I am already self-aware of the fact that I somehow got it into my head that every quest needs to be done on elite and when I die over and over trying to complete it because those "pfft thhbt" blade traps chopped me up I get peeved at myself for not being able to complete it without dying. I don't know where I got it in my head that I just *have* to do it on elite. I'm stuck in this rut and it's frustrating me. I know I don't have to do it on elite. I know I don't have to answer to anyone but myself. But it just feels wrong not to do them on elite because it makes me feel I can't do what everyone else does and I don't know why that bothers me so much.

Quests don't have to be done on elite, and especially as a new player.
We do the quests on elite because we have been doing them for a lot time ( I don't remember how many times I've done Waterworks... but problably something like 100 time ), we know what to expect and where... we can stop right before the trap, we know where the box is, where the mob is, where we can play hide and seek with a mob that hit hard, where are the safe spots, and all the other things that comes from doing the quest many time.




I think a lot of it has to do with all these "streak" posts I read in the forums. Well, if they do it then I have to do it too! Bahh! rofl

What advice do you experienced players have for me? Do quests on normal, maybe hard and forget about this whole elite-streak business and just zerg the elites later on when you want the favor? Just do them on normal and hard without all the frustration and extra time and effort that elite runs cause? I solo mostly, maybe 95% of the time and usually with a hireling. I should have stated that sooner I suppose.

As I said : do the quests the way you prefer them and the way you have fun doing them.
If that means doing them on Elite and dying 40 times in Waterworks there's no problems as long as you are having fun.
The XP bonuses for Hard and Elite really matter for TR characters, but for a first life character there's more than enough XP in quests on normal to level to cap. ( ok, LVL 18 is a difficult level and if you do quests at level you'll have to redo some and chase some explorers to reach 19 )



I need help! (yeah, in the head I meant.) lmao Maybe you got some expert advice?


Not an expert, but I've given my opinion.



Another question I have is about something that confuses me. This is a topic I have seen talked about a lot in the forums but opinions are so all over the place I don't know what to believe or count as credible. This is the first topic I attempted to pay attention too in the first few days of me playing DDO but it was over my head so I just played the game and didn't concern myself with it. The topic that confuses me is the five, seven or nine quest runs - like EEE/H/N or NNNNNNN/H/E <---- this stuff.

This is to optimize the XP gain to level fast ( as it's done in the high XP/minute quests ) to cap. Unless you want to zerg to 20 to TR, there's no point going down that way.... The first one (EEE/H/N) is the new ( since Streak came ) way to do quests to maximize XPs the second one (N*6/H/E) is the old way of doing things [ before Streak ].

Unless you TR, it doesn't matter much.



I have seen posts who say do them in lots of nine, some say seven like EEEEE/H/N or ddowiki had a chart showing variations of the five-runs like NNN/H/E.

I just don't get all this. What is so magical about the 5,7,9 run rule? Why not just E/H/N or N/H/E (if free to play) and then go on to next quest? The whole point is to get the streak bonus plus the first time difficulty bonus right? So that would be E/H/N (if you can open on elite). So why 5, 7 or 9?


Why 5... because you get a malus at the 6th repeat of a given quest at a given difficulty.
Why 7... because the malus increase at the 8th repeat.

So you repeat the quest 5 time at a given difficulty, the go to another difficulty, and then go to the last difficulty...
Thus making 7 run of the quest. ( or 9 if you run the quest 7 time first )

Now with the Streak it's not really worth hitting the repeat malus, so people stick to 3*E/H/N to maximize the First
Time Bonus.

ka0t1c1sm
03-25-2013, 04:43 AM
Don't forget you can "bank" enough XP to be 1 point shy of enough XP for 2 levels. That can help you run all the quests while still at level.

Like mentioned before though, at the lower levels there is more quest XP to go around than you need. Don't sweat it, run the quests you enjoy, skip the ones you don't, and come back to them later for favor when you can tear through them like a god.

AbyssalMage
03-25-2013, 04:48 AM
Not an expert but here is what I do (as Premium, VIP & F2P may be different)

House P 150
House K 150
Coin Lords 150
Silver Flame 150

On each character I get the above favor. I actually skip the Carnival Pack mainly because I hate the adventures (House P favor) but I run Tangle on N/H/E to make up the favor. I also do the N/H/E on Catacombs and Necro 1(Silver Flame). House K I do many of the f2P adventures also on N/H/E and with the packs I own, usually have 150 or 152 when I am done.

I skip many adventures, mainly because like you pointed out, they get boring doing them multiple times so I do the ones I enjoy and skip the rest at lower levels. Or if I do them, it's only once. As an example, I skip Proof is in the Poison (95% of the time), Tear (Most people farm this one), and The Pit. I have actually added Crucible to the list of Adventures I will never do again :/ (Or if I do, it will be as frequently as Proof).

There are a few levels where their are power climbs, lvl 11, 16, and 18 are the noticeable ones for me. NPC AI (more recent. NPC's begin spamming spells, SLA's, and special attacks), HP inflation, and incoming damage seem to spike at these level ranges compared to one level lower.

I didn't read it, but it could because I am sleepy but you can also bank levels (You may have already stated that you do this, again I am tired and hopefully what i have typed makes sense).

red_cardinal
03-25-2013, 05:15 AM
Focus on one or two characters max.
Level them up and TR them twice so they'll be legends.
Tweak your gear and your build - google forums.

New prestige enhancements will be out soon, so many builds will change and many classes will gain in power.
New expansion pack will come in Summer - so you'll be able to create level 15 characters instantly. However, expansion will cost real money.

With legend characters you can run any quest on elite first to get bravery bonus. If the quest is level 3 and you're level 5 - you get BB for that quest. And that's the best method to run and get max first time XP. Then you can repeat a few times on hard if you want and finally on normal.

You can adhere to diversity and run every quest only once on elite, but you need a powerful character and knowledge of the game and to be able to mostly solo - take care of yourself.

There are a lot of gimmicks which can't be and won't be written in text about how to play certain quests. The best way is to follow others and play your one or two characters. However, DDOWiki may help you with a few of them.

Having multiple toons is confusing and they will lack in power.

I'd recommend to run the following classes:
- Warforged wizard/sorcerer - self-repair, you can zerg if you know how and you only need to blast stuff,
- Human cleric/favored soul - after level 11, blade barrier can solve most of your problems... However, until then, you're gimp pretty much.
- Barbarian or Paladin or Fighter with cleave and greater cleave - spamming cleaves will kill most mobs, but you'll always need a hireling to take care of you.

Althoism is a disease which will make you ineffective. As much as it's fun to try new builds and create your own things, best is in the end to focus on one or two characters!

If you ever get a legend character, you should have enough game experience and gear and know your way around in DDO world.

Happy hunting.

Lonnbeimnech
03-25-2013, 05:16 AM
on a first life toon it takes 1,900,000xp to hit level 20
on a third life toon it takes 4,378,500xp. <---these are the people talking about elite streaks and maximizing xp/min


consider your level 9 toon, 350,000 xp to hit level 9 and out leveling those level 5 quests after doing them on norm hard and elite. If you were on your third life you would still be level 7 and doing those quests in level range.

Also consider there are more low level quests than high level quests.
there are 21 level 3 quests
there are 18 level 4 quests
there are 23 level 5 quests.

there are 9 level 14 quests.
there are 7 level 15 quests.
there are 9 level 16 quests

FuzzyDuck81
03-25-2013, 05:40 AM
Just play through & have fun - the low levels have a lot of the much older content, which was built & optimised for characters/parties with significantly lower relative power levels - a level 5/6 character now with decent equipment by todays standards is probably more powerful than many old *capped* level 10/12s with some of the top-end gear from their era... as you're getting higher up, you'll be running into more of the newer quest lines with more appropriate difficulty & start to get a good challenge - some particular quests have aspects that can be extremely difficult at level (for whatever reason) without proper preparation & coordination... the end fights of "in the flesh" & "enter the kobold" are 2 that spring to mind as being outright murderously vindictive on elite.

Another part of it is your character's personal capabilities vs. specific monster types - undead can be very troublesome for rogues 3 levels over the quest level but a divine/arcane type can just wander through easily while below level, spellcasters with a couple of well-targeted crowd-control spells can be a nightmare for a fighter but barely phase a monk or rogue and beholders (if you haven't run into any yet, then good luck!) if you're unprepared can be very, very nasty for virtually everyone.

As for the burgeoning alaholism... yeah many of us suffer from that affliction :) It'll probably even itself out over time once you've had some more experience & found a couple of playstyles that fit you. The problem of course is that casters especially take a while to get up to their real power potential, so their playstyle will change, often quite drastically, as you level - for example, at low levels clerics are generally IMO better off being not much more than melees with healing & buffs (plus the occasional sound burst for a quick group stun), but at later levels they can get some very powerful magic capabilities for crowd control, dps & instakills too.

Gremmlynn
03-25-2013, 06:32 AM
Another question I have is about something that confuses me. This is a topic I have seen talked about a lot in the forums but opinions are so all over the place I don't know what to believe or count as credible. This is the first topic I attempted to pay attention too in the first few days of me playing DDO but it was over my head so I just played the game and didn't concern myself with it. The topic that confuses me is the five, seven or nine quest runs - like EEE/H/N or NNNNNNN/H/E <---- this stuff.

I have seen posts who say do them in lots of nine, some say seven like EEEEE/H/N or ddowiki had a chart showing variations of the five-runs like NNN/H/E.

I just don't get all this. What is so magical about the 5,7,9 run rule? Why not just E/H/N or N/H/E (if free to play) and then go on to next quest? The whole point is to get the streak bonus plus the first time difficulty bonus right? So that would be E/H/N (if you can open on elite). So why 5, 7 or 9?

Why not just one of each difficulty and then move on?
Math. Not all quests are created equally. The number of runs is determined by the time it takes to complete it and the xp given. Players who do this are the complete opposite of how you describe yourself. They are attempting to do the least number of quests, or at least runs, possible by only doing the quests with the highest xp/min ratio. The number of runs is generally determined by the repeat penalty driving the xp/min below whatever threshold they have set, wherein they run the other two difficulties once each (no repeat for first time at a given difficulty plus the first time bonus) and move on to the next quest on their agenda.

Gremmlynn
03-25-2013, 06:40 AM
Focus on one or two characters max.
Level them up and TR them twice so they'll be legends.
Tweak your gear and your build - google forums.

New prestige enhancements will be out soon, so many builds will change and many classes will gain in power.
New expansion pack will come in Summer - so you'll be able to create level 15 characters instantly. However, expansion will cost real money.

With legend characters you can run any quest on elite first to get bravery bonus. If the quest is level 3 and you're level 5 - you get BB for that quest. And that's the best method to run and get max first time XP. Then you can repeat a few times on hard if you want and finally on normal.

You can adhere to diversity and run every quest only once on elite, but you need a powerful character and knowledge of the game and to be able to mostly solo - take care of yourself.

There are a lot of gimmicks which can't be and won't be written in text about how to play certain quests. The best way is to follow others and play your one or two characters. However, DDOWiki may help you with a few of them.

Having multiple toons is confusing and they will lack in power.

I'd recommend to run the following classes:
- Warforged wizard/sorcerer - self-repair, you can zerg if you know how and you only need to blast stuff,
- Human cleric/favored soul - after level 11, blade barrier can solve most of your problems... However, until then, you're gimp pretty much.
- Barbarian or Paladin or Fighter with cleave and greater cleave - spamming cleaves will kill most mobs, but you'll always need a hireling to take care of you.

Althoism is a disease which will make you ineffective. As much as it's fun to try new builds and create your own things, best is in the end to focus on one or two characters!

If you ever get a legend character, you should have enough game experience and gear and know your way around in DDO world.

Happy hunting.Strange. I generally play more than 2 in a session, have never TRed and still manage to have fun in the game.

psykopeta
03-25-2013, 06:46 AM
Don't forget you can "bank" enough XP to be 1 point shy of enough XP for 2 levels. That can help you run all the quests while still at level.

Like mentioned before though, at the lower levels there is more quest XP to go around than you need. Don't sweat it, run the quests you enjoy, skip the ones you don't, and come back to them later for favor when you can tear through them like a god.

THIS

also have in mind the xp you need is really low, 1,9M

players that run 1 time every quest in game, have 2 choices:

- don't lvl till they've done all (current lvl - 2) quests
- take the lvl, having in mind that all (current lvl - 2) won't give bravery streak, so if they're pugging may have troubles finding ppl to join in the group

i get 3k favor/life, mostly because i don't like repeating silly quests(less than 1k/min, dunno why ppl repeat em), i don't bank xp ti 3 situations:
-hit lvl 11, i claim it, do von 3 e/h/n and farm shadow crypt e/11 times hard/normal/casual, simply the xp/min is awesome and allows me to not bank xp til lvl 11(here i'm banking til finish with the farm)
-hit lvl 14, claim it, do lordsmarch plaza chain and farm tomb of raiyum(a.k.a. wizard king or wk), something like e/7h/n/c at this point im banking too
-hit lvl 18, claim it, not gonna claim lvl til i hit lvl 20

rest of time i do single elite runs, no farming nor banking, and when i hit lvl 9 i skip the lvl 6 quests i haven't done and all the time do the same, that's why i only get 3k favor/life lol

moomooprincess
03-25-2013, 07:40 AM
Anyhow. I wanted to ask you long-time and experienced players your thoughts on this, and your method of questing and leveling.

Do you do quests at level (even on elite) one run each quest and when you level up just skip all the ones you haven't done? What I mean is, you are level four and you do level four quests. When you make level five you start doing level five quests - skipping all the quests that are now below you that you haven't done yet? And then you go back at a later date and do them for favor, for example a level eight character zerging through all the level one to seven elite quests that you skipped over?

Should I just say pfft and so what? Skip them, do them later if I want the favor? I mean why should it matter to me that I am level twelve for example zerging a level four quest for favor right? I'm after the favor afterall and not the experience at this point right? I don't know. It just bugs me a lot for some reason. I have no idea why I feel obligated to do every quest, even the ones I hate but I wind up doing them just to see them checked off in the list in red.

And that's another thing. I am already self-aware of the fact that I somehow got it into my head that every quest needs to be done on elite and when I die over and over trying to complete it because those "pfft thhbt" blade traps chopped me up I get peeved at myself for not being able to complete it without dying. I don't know where I got it in my head that I just *have* to do it on elite. I'm stuck in this rut and it's frustrating me. I know I don't have to do it on elite. I know I don't have to answer to anyone but myself. But it just feels wrong not to do them on elite because it makes me feel I can't do what everyone else does and I don't know why that bothers me so much.

What advice do you experienced players have for me? Do quests on normal, maybe hard and forget about this whole elite-streak business and just zerg the elites later on when you want the favor? Just do them on normal and hard without all the frustration and extra time and effort that elite runs cause? I solo mostly, maybe 95% of the time and usually with a hireling. I should have stated that sooner I suppose.

Another question I have is about something that confuses me. This is a topic I have seen talked about a lot in the forums but opinions are so all over the place I don't know what to believe or count as credible. This is the first topic I attempted to pay attention too in the first few days of me playing DDO but it was over my head so I just played the game and didn't concern myself with it. The topic that confuses me is the five, seven or nine quest runs - like EEE/H/N or NNNNNNN/H/E <---- this stuff.

I have seen posts who say do them in lots of nine, some say seven like EEEEE/H/N or ddowiki had a chart showing variations of the five-runs like NNN/H/E.

I just don't get all this. What is so magical about the 5,7,9 run rule? Why not just E/H/N or N/H/E (if free to play) and then go on to next quest? The whole point is to get the streak bonus plus the first time difficulty bonus right? So that would be E/H/N (if you can open on elite). So why 5, 7 or 9?

Why not just one of each difficulty and then move on?

Thanks everyone and sorry for the long post. I appreciate all your help/advice and expertise.



1. I NEVER care about elite streaks. EXP is easy to get. In the beginning I raced to be the highest level, now I don't care. I play the way I want.

2. Some quests you will learn to only run once if you can. Some quests you want to run over and over. For me, all my low levels try to run Waterworks over and over and over as that is a good quests series to get (bound to account items for a F2P) and you might get some very cool named loot in there.

Korthos I run on elite ONCE and NEVER again. Some characters still have not bothered. The loot is terrible and not worth anything except for the Archivist's Necklace.

Harbor I avoid Kobold Assault and Stealthy Repossession until I am over level. No point in my opinion. Bad loot. Some players like Stealthy to work on their stealth stuff, I want it over with ASAP. Sometimes I will run Durk's Got a Secret mutlitple times for a MuckBane and Kobold's New Ringleader(lots of chests, quick run). Except for WW, Durk's, and Ringleader I mostly do the other ones once on elite and then done.

Marketplace Missing in Action I run on elite once. Sunken Sewers, I run elite once. Freshen the Air I avoid as long as possible. Proof is in the Poison I avoid as long as possible or even longer. Redfang I might run a couple times. Shan to Kor(p2P) I can run several times, but I eventually get bored of it, try for that Ring of Feathers. I despise Sharn Syndicate as the loot is bad, the favor per TP is bad, the only good thing is you get BTA stuff by running one quest. If you try to solo the Bookbinders quests on elite at level. Get frustrated.

Catacombs(P2P) I run once. Excellent favor per TP, absolutely terrible EXP, absolutely terrible loot. if you solo and have some UMD the wand of minor wounds is very nice. Other than that, I run it once.

Chronoscope is nice loot for low levels, but I really don't like the quest. Not much to it. It is like Kobold Assault on steroids.

At second level you can start to run house quests. Depths Series in House D.

3. I assume others have already explained NNNNHE. I won't.

4. No, I don't care what level I am doing a quest. If I am level 6 doing a level 3 quest, fine. My criteria is strictly: Am I getting favor? Am I getting some EXP? Can I finish quickly? If I can run a quest three or so times in one hour, that is good. More is even better. As I said, I will gladly do Freshen the Air at 20th level so I can do it in 8 minutes. I will say Proof is in the Poison will probably take me 25 minutes, but I really hate that quest.

FuzzyDuck81
03-25-2013, 07:52 AM
Korthos I run on elite ONCE and NEVER again. Some characters still have not bothered. The loot is terrible and not worth anything except for the Archivist's Necklace.


Don't forget that "hey, lets introduce you to using the store" grog trade-in to get the siberys cake :) The main reason i still run korthos on every character.

THOTHdha
03-25-2013, 09:09 AM
Do you do quests at level (even on elite) one run each quest and when you level up just skip all the ones you haven't done? What I mean is, you are level four and you do level four quests. When you make level five you start doing level five quests - skipping all the quests that are now below you that you haven't done yet? And then you go back at a later date and do them for favor, for example a level eight character zerging through all the level one to seven elite quests that you skipped over?
This is something that is going to vary widely from person to person. Really, do whatever is making you enjoy things, or will make you a better player in the end. Challenging yourself and finding new ways to stay alive through difficult situations will certainly make you a better player! But dieing over and over to something that you simply do not have the gear to have the HP and Saving Throws to endure is just frustrating, not helpful.

Personally, if I am doing a life that I plan to True Reincarnate from, I tend to farm the high XP/min quests a bit, and then maybe grab any quests from that level range that have important favor tied to them, like Silver Flame or Agents of Argonessan. It is only on lives that I know (hope?) I will not be TRing again that I like to see my Compendium a full list of Red!


I know I don't have to answer to anyone but myself. But it just feels wrong not to do them on elite because it makes me feel I can't do what everyone else does and I don't know why that bothers me so much.

I think a lot of it has to do with all these "streak" posts I read in the forums. Well, if they do it then I have to do it too! Bahh! rofl
Here is the thing about that line of reasoning; DDO's greatest strength is that it allows you extreme flexibility when it comes to character creation! This is almost universally the reason why everyone who I know that still plays DDO does so. With this flexibility you get the ability to create amazingly awesome characters, with incredible potential. .... Once you really know the system, and know what you will be encountering in each quest.

This also means that people are able to create extremely poor performing characters. I am not trying to suggest that you have done so, but having played on all of the servers up to level 12 already I am sure that you have seen some things that made you really change the way that you built some of your later characters, as opposed to how you made your first one. Most D&D players realize about level 10 that they know just enough about how the game mechanics of DDO work, and are superficially based on D&D, to get themselves screwed up! :p

Another really huge dividing point is gear. Just to illustrate the point, here is a HP break down for a 'starter' and 'geared' Artificer at level 12. I will use Human and Warforged variants, since it is much more likely for a newer player to not have access to the WF race.

'Starter' level 12 Human Artificer: 20 (Heroic Durability) + 72 (12 Artificer levels) + 24 (14 starting CON) + +24 (+4 CON item) + 14 (Toughness Feat) + 30 (Toughness Enhancements) + 20 (Improved False Life Item)
= 204 HP at level 12

'Geared' level 12 Warforged Artificer: 20 (Heroic Durability) + 72 (12 Artificer levels) + 48 (18 starting CON to qualify for Epic Toughness) + 12 (+3 CON Tome) + 12 (CON Enhancement) + 36 (+6 CON item) + 12 (+2 CON Shrine) + 10 (Barbarian PL Passive Feat, once) + 20 (Barbarian PL Selected Feat) + 30 (Toughness Enhancements) +20 (Toughness Item) + 30 (Greater False Life Item) +20 (Large Guild Slot)
= 352 HP at level 12

With more than time and a half as many HP, there is certainly a much larger margin of safety for someone who is geared up and taking advantage of things such as old banked gear, past lives, and Guild buffs. I chose HP just because it is something that is often compared on these forums, but in reality the second character would also have a very massive increase in survivability due to their much greater potential for Saving Throws. So people just starting out really should not feel frustrated that they can not do some of the things that many people on the forums take for granted. The experience and gear will come with time.


What advice do you experienced players have for me? Do quests on normal, maybe hard and forget about this whole elite-streak business and just zerg the elites later on when you want the favor?
Things start getting a lot harder in the level 12+ quests. About a year ago there was a very major change to the way that Spells work, and they never really did fix things entirely in older content. The boss of 'Eyes of Stone' in particular is one that makes me roll my eyes, as on Elite she can zap you with a Disintigrate capable of hitting for over 400 damage, and with a DC that is very difficult to resist even for someone very well geared. I would absolutely recommend dropping to a Hard streak, maybe still trying Elite for some of the quests that do not have as many traps and casters. You can find that kind of info on DDOwiki, if you do not mind the minor spoilers.


Another question I have is about something that confuses me. <snip> like EEE/H/N or NNNNNNN/H/E <---- this stuff.

Why not just one of each difficulty and then move on?
The people who grind, or repeatedly run the same quest, do not attempt to get the First Time bonus on all of the quests. Even for a multi-TR, it is absolutely unnecessary to repeat quests like this. However, there are some quests in the game that offer rewards that are insanely out of line with all of the others. People who like to 'grind lives' typically just focus on these quests in order to get the most XP/min possible, and ignore the majority of the content.


I hope that you enjoy DDO! And do not be afraid to ask any other questions that might come to mind.

TheGamingThor
03-25-2013, 09:26 AM
Hi.

I know that I suffer from the same OCD.

However, I have found a way to combat this:

-level to 20, then

-buy VIP for a month

This allows you to do every quest, get a TON of favor, and do it all in very little time. It

only costs like $10 for one month, so I think its worth it. And, trust me, it will be worth

it when you see all that red. :)

Nickademus42
03-25-2013, 10:26 AM
With running every quest only once on elite without an xp pot, I do not believe there are any levels before 18 where a third life TR will XP cap before finishing the quests at that level.

Running a 4th life TR with a 30% xp pot (and now the 10% VIP bonus), I've run almost every quest, skipping raids and a few terrible xp/min or obnoxious quests like Kobold Assault and Gladewatch Outpost Defense, and stayed mostly a level ahead but only once did I risk capping and losing some of my gained experience. I had to ditch three of the Red Fens quests because I was holding lvl 10 and within a couple thousand xp of lvl 11.

Other than lvl 9 holding 10-11, I've not had a point where there were too many quests to do them all for xp. This is of course a triple TR, so the xp needed is much more than a first lifer. But still, it shows the content base is large enough to support running each quest once to experience all the game. Though the VIP 10% bonus may interfere with this if you plan to throw in raids and the handful of quests most TRs skip.

Nickademus42
03-25-2013, 10:30 AM
Korthos I run on elite ONCE and NEVER again. Some characters still have not bothered. The loot is terrible and not worth anything except for the Archivist's Necklace.

For a caster, yes. But for new players who play melees the Goggles of Insight and Anger set offers a nice bonus to attack rolls as well as an Expeditious Retreat clickie.

bonscott87
03-25-2013, 01:52 PM
Honestly, it's not something I worry about, we (wife and I duo) run quests for the fun. And I don't feel obligated to run them all. We skip quests we don't like. We never go to Three BC for example, or run the Carnival. Don't care for Necropolis (other then 1 which isn't bad). Don't like Restless Isles either.

Even with all that we're always over level. So here we sit just hitting level 14 and we're just now getting out to the Sands and then Gianthold after that. But then again we like running everything at least 2 over level and run everything on at least Hard if not Elite. Heck, at level 13 we finally were running VON and on VON 3 we got 25K experience points on Hard, even being over level. We probably could have done it on Elite but the last time we ran it about a year ago we had many deaths. LOL

Anyway, we concentrate on quests for fun or loot. We rarely grind something if we don't like it.

Therigar
03-25-2013, 03:11 PM
Greetings everyone.

You are correct -- it is very easy to out level quests in DDO. On first life characters this is a given and many people skip entire quests, quest chains and raids leveling their first life characters. This can be done even if you do not repeat quests with any regularity or run them on all difficulty levels. It is especially easy to do if you are VIP or are in groups that run hard and/or elite streaks as the bonus XP adds up.

On second life characters it is still possible to out level quests. Generally this is the result of players having a better idea of where the easy XP is so they skip low payoff quests -- especially if there is nothing there in loot to entice them.

With third life characters (and beyond) this is still true but it is even more the case that players are now hunting down the highest payoff quests for the XP. Very often players already have a good supply of gear so they have little motive to run most of the quests. These then get very focused on how to get best XP.

It is at this point that you will see players planning 7 or more repeats of the same quest. These are almost always TR groups where the players are looking for the fastest way to get back to L20.

And, that makes sense for most players because the most exciting quests are at the late levels. This is where the best loot is found and this is where quests are the most challenging.

If you want to see all of the quests then my recommendation is that you run them only twice -- once on normal (or hard if you can open them) and once on elite (for the favor). This will slow you down enough that you should keep close pace to the quest levels. It will also break any streaks you have going so you can avoid bonus XP.

Even better is to do them only once -- on elite only. By doing things that way you should be able to get in most quests at or near the quest level.

bonscott87
03-25-2013, 03:44 PM
Favor...something I forgot to post about. Favor is really the highest motivating factor on which quests to run for me so most early ones get run on Elite.

First goal is the first 2 steps of Coin Lords so you get both backpack upgrades. Typically this is really easy to get by level 5 ish capped with the Sharn quests.
Then I shoot for 1st step of Silver Flame, 2nd step later for the cookie.
House P is my next beeline as step 1 gets you good buffs but step 2 is the Time Pendent which is a *must*.
House J is pretty easy to get both 1st and 2nd steps for the buffs as well.
House K mid levels to get both bank upgrades.

I can usually get most of this by level 10 or 11. Just got the 2nd House K favor at level 13 but we ran Von and Ataraxia much later then usual for some reason.

After that it's all just gravy, but get Argo for the hit point bonus.