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UurlockYgmeov
02-27-2013, 08:19 AM
Ok so I dreamed (literally) this up last night and thought it would be worth posting and seeking input.


Like class past life / completionist - just for races.

Each TR from a race (up to three) would grant a passive past life feat.

Dwarf
+2 saves vs spells and poisons
+1 Search and Balance

Elf
+2 saves vs sleep and enchantment spells
+1 Listen, Search, Spot
+10 spell points Dexol

Halfling
+1 bonus to attack with thrown weapons
+1 saves
+2 sneak attack Dexol
+2 negative energy resistance (halflings are always happy go lucky and that has some of that optimism has carried forward into current and future lives)

Human
2 extra skill points at creation
Human Skill Knowledge: allows 1 cross class skill to be considered a class skill JOTMON

Drow
+1 or +3 stacking SR
+1 stacking Listen, Search, and Spot
+1 stacking Intelligence Mastikator or +2 Light resistance since Drow build up a tolerance to it.

Half-Elf
+1 extra skill point per level
+2 saves vs sleep and enchantment Mastikator

Half-Orc
+10 stacking hitpoints (can never have enough hit points)
+2 damage on glancing blows gphysalis
+1 Force resistance - Half-orcs know to shrug off damage and ignore magic....

Warforged
+1 saves vs poison and disease
+1 repair skill
+10% repair amp Mastikator
+1 DR/Adamantine Dexol


Feat purchasable active feat / enhancement improvement track.

Dwarf
+20 hitpoints Mastikator
loot boost 1x day (as the dragonmark enhancement)

Elf
Detect Secret Doors 1/day Mastikator
+1 Spell Pen Mastikator
weapon proficiency longbow and longsword (lv1)
weapon focus longbow and longsword (lv7)

Halfling
invisibility 1/day (as per spell)
+4 luck bonus for 20 seconds 5/day Mastikator

Human
+5% healing amplification
1 skill point per level Mastikator
additional cross class skill now considered class JOTMON

Drow
Vulkorim transformation: +1d3 poison damage Mastikator
Vulkorim transformation: +5 Fire resistance
Vulkorim transformation: +4 poison saves

Half-Elf
+1 extra skill point per level
Detect Secret Doors 1/day Mastikator

Half-Orc
+1 Strength Mastikator
+1 skill point per level Mastikator
-1 second on tactical feat cooldowns

Warforged
repair light damage 1x day
+5% repair amplification Mastikator
minor repair systems (repair +1 hp chance upon damage) Mastikator



Past Life Race Completionist Feat

I don't know - but another +2 to all stats *chuckle* which keeps it in line with existing and the hinted new completionist feat.

Dexol
02-27-2013, 08:23 AM
I suggested something similar a bit back, responses were luke warm at best, but I'm still a believer!

http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=250997

Mastikator
02-27-2013, 09:13 AM
My 2 cents:

On the passive.
Humans should not receive +1 int on a passive feat. If anything that stat belongs to Drow (who also need the love much more than humans).
Humans getting 2 skill points on creation is plenty, especially considering how powerful humans already are.

Half-elf should get +2 saves vs sleep and enchantment spells imo, one half from humans (1 skill point), one half from elves.

Half orcs are fine with 10 stacking hp. Barbarians are fine with it, why shouldn't half-orcs be.

Warforged I'd give 10% repair amp.

Onto the active feats.
Dwarves, detecting secret doors is actually an elf ability, not a dwarf ability, it should go to the elves.
On the other hand, dwarves are a hardy folk, and maybe should get 20 hp, along with the +1 loot boost 1/day.

The elven one should give something that benefit elves of all kind.
So imo, 1/day detect secret doors + 1 spell pen + weapon prof & focus: longsword & longbow

Halflings are lucky, give them an action boost that gives a +4 good luck bonus for 20 seconds 5 times/day in addition to the invisibility.

Humans, 1 extra skill point/level + 10% heal amp

Drow. Not sure what to give them either. I'm partial to some kind of Vulkorim transformation, or maybe +1 int & +1 dex

Half elf. +1 skill point/level + detect secret doors

Half orc. +1 skill point/level (they are after all half humans ;)) + +1 str

Warforged. +10% repair amp & systems repair (1 repair/10 sec)

UurlockYgmeov
02-27-2013, 09:18 AM
I suggested something similar a bit back, responses were luke warm at best, but I'm still a believer!

http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=250997

from your post:

Past Life: Race
We have them for classes why not races.

Random ideas: all stack * 3 as per usual.

Past Life: Human - +1 skill point / level
Past Life: WF - +1 DR/Adamantine
Past Life: Halfling - +2 Sneak Attack
Past Life: Dwarf - +1 HP / Level
Past Life: Elf - +5 SP / Level
Past Life: Drow - +2 Spell Resistance

Maybe counts towards a 2nd completionist style feat

incorporated into original post. thank you!

JOTMON
02-27-2013, 09:33 AM
Past Life: Human - Skill Knowledge - Allows 1 cross class skill to be levelled as a class skill.
Past Life: WF - +5% PRR ( gives a 5% stacking bonus to all existing PRR) & +2 poison/disease resistance
Past Life: Halfling - +5% dodge (not affected by 25% dodge cap or Armor restrictions)
Past Life: Dwarf - dwarven axe proficiency & +1 to attack/damage from axes & Mobility
Past Life: Elf - Bow proficiency & +1 to all ranged damage & +5% Bonus SP
Past Life: Drow - +5% Spot/Search/Sneak/Hide & permanent detect secret doors & +1 sneak attack/damage


The way I see it a % bonus would be much more desirable for any vested classes to consider TR'ing the racial bonusses.

UurlockYgmeov
02-27-2013, 09:33 AM
My 2 cents:

On the passive.
Humans should not receive +1 int on a passive feat. If anything that stat belongs to Drow (who also need the love much more than humans).
Humans getting 2 skill points on creation is plenty, especially considering how powerful humans already are.

Half-elf should get +2 saves vs sleep and enchantment spells imo, one half from humans (1 skill point), one half from elves.

Half orcs are fine with 10 stacking hp. Barbarians are fine with it, why shouldn't half-orcs be.

Warforged I'd give 10% repair amp.

Onto the active feats.
Dwarves, detecting secret doors is actually an elf ability, not a dwarf ability, it should go to the elves.
On the other hand, dwarves are a hardy folk, and maybe should get 20 hp, along with the +1 loot boost 1/day.

The elven one should give something that benefit elves of all kind.
So imo, 1/day detect secret doors + 1 spell pen + weapon prof & focus: longsword & longbow

Halflings are lucky, give them an action boost that gives a +4 good luck bonus for 20 seconds 5 times/day in addition to the invisibility.

Humans, 1 extra skill point/level + 10% heal amp

Drow. Not sure what to give them either. I'm partial to some kind of Vulkorim transformation, or maybe +1 int & +1 dex

Half elf. +1 skill point/level + detect secret doors

Half orc. +1 skill point/level (they are after all half humans ;)) + +1 str

Warforged. +10% repair amp & systems repair (1 repair/10 sec)

nice! added to original post.

UurlockYgmeov
02-27-2013, 09:35 AM
Human - Skill Knowledge - Allows 1 cross class skill to be levelled as a class skill.

nice. added to passive.

ZzpxpzZ
02-27-2013, 10:42 AM
Racial past lives would comparatively be a joke to obtain since people would just be passively obtaining them while doing other past lives.

I wouldnt say it isnt an interesting concept - I would probably buy into the idea of having them - but they need to be a lot weaker than most of your suggestions.

Something more in line for what you suggest for dwarves right now.

Perhaps with a half effective completionist feat so 1 to all stats and skills. This would be weak enough too that its nice for flavor but not something that would be taken often, even by the people who have it.

CaptainSpacePony
02-27-2013, 11:03 AM
Racial past lives would comparatively be a joke to obtain since people would just be passively obtaining them while doing other past lives.

I wouldnt say it isnt an interesting concept - I would probably buy into the idea of having them - but they need to be a lot weaker than most of your suggestions.

Something more in line for what you suggest for dwarves right now.

Perhaps with a half effective completionist feat so 1 to all stats and skills. This would be weak enough too that its nice for flavor but not something that would be taken often, even by the people who have it.

I think the idea behind the OP is interesting enough to consider, with special conderation given to Z's feedback.

UurlockYgmeov
02-27-2013, 12:46 PM
Good feedback -

all benefits needs to be in line with what is already in place for existing past life feats.

Don't think Oh - I have class completionist, will automatically have race. Most players favor one or two races and don't play the rest.

Or can make separate - so you can either receive class or race, but not both. don't think many would like that.

diasho2
02-27-2013, 01:19 PM
I have talked to a few people in various groups about this as well since I personally only play warforged for the most part. Most people that I have talked to fit into the same catagory as well, although everyone favors different races for different reasons.

Just like the having the past life feats gives people a reason to branch out and try different classes having race as past life as well would encourage people to branch out of that comfort zone, and would provide more flavor to the game.

UurlockYgmeov
02-27-2013, 01:46 PM
I have talked to a few people in various groups about this as well since I personally only play warforged for the most part. Most people that I have talked to fit into the same catagory as well, although everyone favors different races for different reasons.

Just like the having the past life feats gives people a reason to branch out and try different classes having race as past life as well would encourage people to branch out of that comfort zone, and would provide more flavor to the game.

+1 - totally the idea. well said.

gphysalis
02-27-2013, 02:04 PM
I think that if this existed, it should give very minor benefits.
The active past lives, however, should give benefits that are compareable to a feat, but slightly better usually.

I like your suggestions, but I would suggest that some be weaker

Elf

+2 saves vs sleep and enchantment spells
+1 Listen, Search, Spot
+10 spell points (Instead of +30)

Drow

+3 stacking SR (Instead of the other things) (Stacking +int is too powerful, and this would give player SR a much needed boost)

Half-Orc

+2 damage on glancing blows (HP is already assigned to Barb, no need to repeat)

Warforged

+1 saves vs poison and disease
+1 repair skill
+5% repair amp (Instead of 10% (5% amp is the approx value of a past life, like paladin))
+1 DR/Adamantine Dexol

UurlockYgmeov
02-27-2013, 03:05 PM
I think that if this existed, it should give very minor benefits.
The active past lives, however, should give benefits that are compareable to a feat, but slightly better usually.

I like your suggestions, but I would suggest that some be weaker

Elf

+2 saves vs sleep and enchantment spells
+1 Listen, Search, Spot
+10 spell points (Instead of +30)

Drow

+3 stacking SR (Instead of the other things) (Stacking +int is too powerful, and this would give player SR a much needed boost)

Half-Orc

+2 damage on glancing blows (HP is already assigned to Barb, no need to repeat)

Warforged

+1 saves vs poison and disease
+1 repair skill
+5% repair amp (Instead of 10% (5% amp is the approx value of a past life, like paladin))
+1 DR/Adamantine Dexol



I like - just that I would hope that these would be on par with existing passive past life feats. So yes WF should be 5% to make it on pair with existing paladin passive past life (I remembered incorrectly).

I will be consolidating these into the original post later today.!

Love it!

Mortimar
02-27-2013, 05:55 PM
Philosophically speaking, I think this would only make sense if you benefit from past lives of a particular race only if you TR into that race. So, for example, if you had been a human in 3 past lives and a dwarf in another 3 past lives and then you TR for a seventh time and choose human, you would only get the human benefits. Past life class is different since you actually trained in those classes no matter the race, but for a race you should have to be that race to take advantage of any past life race benefits since it is inherent to that specific race.

UurlockYgmeov
02-28-2013, 08:49 AM
Philosophically speaking, I think this would only make sense if you benefit from past lives of a particular race only if you TR into that race. So, for example, if you had been a human in 3 past lives and a dwarf in another 3 past lives and then you TR for a seventh time and choose human, you would only get the human benefits. Past life class is different since you actually trained in those classes no matter the race, but for a race you should have to be that race to take advantage of any past life race benefits since it is inherent to that specific race.

Makes sense - only one past life gained per past life.

UurlockYgmeov
03-01-2013, 08:08 PM
more comments?

Turbine said going to work on the TR system this year - so let's get ahead of the curve. :D

Kelendren
03-03-2013, 05:31 PM
Drow
+1 or +3 stacking SR
+1 stacking Listen, Search, and Spot
+1 stacking Intelligence Mastikator



+1 stacking Intellect? Seems overpowered in instances where one could theoretically do 4 drow past lives and then have an extra 20 spell power at level 1 and 10 per level after for their wizard, not to mention the +2 to DC's

UurlockYgmeov
03-03-2013, 05:52 PM
+1 stacking Intellect? Seems overpowered in instances where one could theoretically do 4 drow past lives and then have an extra 20 spell power at level 1 and 10 per level after for their wizard, not to mention the +2 to DC's

Max is 3 past lives, so a max of +3.

But is noted - and needs further discussion to evaluate especially since no precedence for stat bump from past life feat.

UurlockYgmeov
03-05-2013, 10:00 AM
bump. :D

TrinityTurtle
03-05-2013, 10:51 AM
I really like the idea, and I think it would be a nice reward to mix up the races for players. Although I do dread the halfling life. I accept that some people have great fun with them and love them, but I am not one of those people. :)

UurlockYgmeov
03-05-2013, 03:40 PM
what surprises me is how few have even bothered to read the original post. sad.

Starp
03-05-2013, 04:04 PM
I think that the majority of these are way overpowered, honestly.

How about this: when you are reborn you remember what it was like to be a dwarf, elf, human, etc. and this allows you to increase your social skills (bluff, diplomacy, and intimidate...maybe even haggle?) when interacting with that race. So, for example, if I were a human in my past life, I get a +1 to intimidate vs. humans because I know how humans tick.

UurlockYgmeov
03-05-2013, 04:59 PM
I like what you are thinking - however need to be on par with existing passive past life feats.

Mastikator
03-05-2013, 11:33 PM
I like what you are thinking - however need to be on par with existing passive past life feats.

Actually, why would they need to be on par with existing auto-granted past life feats? Isn't it enough that they are on par with each other?

UurlockYgmeov
03-06-2013, 12:18 AM
Actually, why would they need to be on par with existing auto-granted past life feats? Isn't it enough that they are on par with each other?

Interesting point - why on par with existing? game balance and desirability - want them to be desirable - but not uber.

Tinman.pl
03-06-2013, 05:02 AM
I would even dare to add some past life elemental resistances dependent on the race (like with Ranger pl).
As with all those resistances can be stacked up to three times.

Drow Elf - +1 stacking lightning resistance;
Dwarf - +2 stacking fire resistance per pl - it's well known that they are sturdy and tough race;
Elf - +2 stacking lightning resistance - i must admit, i have no idea why it's lightning, but it fits just right;
Halfling - +1 stacking sonic resistance;
Half-Elf - +1 stacking sonic resistance;
Half-Orc - +1 stacking acid resistance;
Human - +1 to all elemental resistances - they are still most versatile race in game;
Warforged - +2 stacking cold resistance - it's a machine, it wont catch a cold.

So in sum, if someone would TR to all races 3 times (i can see the reason to do it now), then he could achieve +9 to all elemental resistances.

UurlockYgmeov
03-06-2013, 06:21 AM
can also see a +2 Light resistance somewhere in the mix.....

Tinman.pl
03-06-2013, 11:32 AM
can also see a +2 Light resistance somewhere in the mix.....

^ and that.
Would be nice for some neg energy resistance too.

UurlockYgmeov
03-06-2013, 12:49 PM
^ and that.
Would be nice for some neg energy resistance too.

There we go - I knew I was forgetting something besides light; force would also be nice... just on who and with what justification.

UurlockYgmeov
03-06-2013, 12:54 PM
^ and that.
Would be nice for some neg energy resistance too.

added. thanks for the input! :)

Tinman.pl
03-06-2013, 01:34 PM
added. thanks for the input! :)

I've wrote some more but looks like you missed it :p

UurlockYgmeov
03-06-2013, 02:24 PM
I've wrote some more but looks like you missed it :p

I saw it - just mulling it over. could be just a +1 if in addition to everything already in place; would need to be a +4 if it replaced (not a +2 since ranger gives a +2 to all each past life).

I like how you have built in a total package.... complete them all and get it all.:)

Starp
03-06-2013, 03:43 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jZkdcYlOn5M
:p

>snip<

I like some of it, but I still think that your modified OP is still too strong. Get a halfling past life and get +1 to all saves; spend three past lives and get +3 to all save!?! Wow! That by itself is equivalent to the acquirining the feat Luck of Heroes three time! I don't know of any passive PL feats currently out there that matches it. Get a human PL and any one chosen cross-class skill can now be treated as in class!?! Another wow! If that was a limited duration active feat (like a skill boost), I wouldn't argue so much against it.

I guess what I'm trying to get across is that these should be beneficial but not overpowered, as well as being thematic. Let me try a hypothetical, let's say that I was a dog in a previous life (I said hypothetical!). Since I am a human now, what benny would that previous life, maybe not even barely remembered, maybe just instinctive response, give me...would I be more loyal, more territorial, like raw meat more, be hairier? Have a +2 to listen, spot, and search? A +2 to swim? Even a -2 to concentration (squirrel!)? For an active feat, when I "recall more about [my] past life", would I be able to jump better (+2 to jump), and get the chance once per day to howl to the sky to call my fellow doggies to me (cast Summon Monster I: Celestial Dog)? ;)

In that same theme, let's pick a Dwarf. According to the wiki (http://ddowiki.com/page/Dwarf), Dwarves tend to be broad, compact, and muscled, but if I reincarnated from a Dwarf into an Elf, would you expect that the new baby Elf to be shorter, broader, and have a beard? :eek: I would think not. Dwarves also have racial bonuses (and deficiencies too, of course). How can we thematically tie the past life into the current life, and kind of match the current way past life feats are implemented (http://compendium.ddo.com/wiki/Past_Life_Feats)? For the passive feat, use the +1 to social skill stuff I mentioned previously (not overpowered, certainly not required(!), but a nice benny nonetheless); or even bump it to +2 per past life to a max of +6 for three PL's. For the active feat: acquire the active racial past life feat and gain the first tier of all of that race's enhancements; or as a different argument, unlock them for your use in your current life.


To take the Dwarf who reincarnated into an Elf, I envision that the Elf now has +1 to Bluff, Diplomacy, Intimidate, and maybe Haggle vs. Dwarves because the Elf "really understands" Dwarves. Should the Elf care to burn a feat on the Dwarven racial past life, the Elf now has all of the following:

Dwarven Racial Axe Attack which matches Dwarven Axe Attack I but does not unlock Dwarven Axe Attack II.
Etc. for Dwarven Racial Axe Damage which matches Dwarven Axe Damage I but doesn't unlock Dwarven Axe Damage II
And etc. for the rest of the Enhancements that start with the word "Dwarven": thus, Giant Dodger, Goblinoid Hatred, Tactics, Shield Mastery,Armor Mastery, Armored Agility, Spell Defence, Poison Resistance, Faith, and also Constitution.
And three times per day can use the ability "Bearded Beerdrinker":rolleyes: which grants all of the Dwarven racial passive feats as your feats for 30 seconds. These feats would be Dwarven Stability, Giant Evasion, Orc and Goblin Bonus, etc.
That may be too overpowered, so the active feat might better just unlock all of the Dwarven enhancement lines. Come to think about it, that is probably the better way to do it, because then if a Dwarf reincarnates into a Dwarf, he'll get a small beneficial passive bonus, but the active feat will just mimic an ability that he already has (kind of like the way Turbine implemented Half-elf Dilletante...Dilletante: Fighter provides skill with all martial weapons - nice for a Rogue, not so beneficial for a Fighter).

UurlockYgmeov
03-06-2013, 04:59 PM
+1 from the OP.

You got the idea. Attractive enough but not uber. On par with existing and themed like existing.

When I posted this originally - just added (mostly) suggestions - and still consider this in the brainstorming phase. In brainstorming - you don't eliminate - only add.

Still haven't a clue about enhancements/active feat(s).

Well thought out post - very helpful! :)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jZkdcYlOn5M
:p


I like some of it, but I still think that your modified OP is still too strong. Get a halfling past life and get +1 to all saves; spend three past lives and get +3 to all save!?! Wow! That by itself is equivalent to the acquirining the feat Luck of Heroes three time! I don't know of any passive PL feats currently out there that matches it. Get a human PL and any one chosen cross-class skill can now be treated as in class!?! Another wow! If that was a limited duration active feat (like a skill boost), I wouldn't argue so much against it.

I guess what I'm trying to get across is that these should be beneficial but not overpowered, as well as being thematic. Let me try a hypothetical, let's say that I was a dog in a previous life (I said hypothetical!). Since I am a human now, what benny would that previous life, maybe not even barely remembered, maybe just instinctive response, give me...would I be more loyal, more territorial, like raw meat more, be hairier? Have a +2 to listen, spot, and search? A +2 to swim? Even a -2 to concentration (squirrel!)? For an active feat, when I "recall more about [my] past life", would I be able to jump better (+2 to jump), and get the chance once per day to howl to the sky to call my fellow doggies to me (cast Summon Monster I: Celestial Dog)? ;)

In that same theme, let's pick a Dwarf. According to the wiki (http://ddowiki.com/page/Dwarf), Dwarves tend to be broad, compact, and muscled, but if I reincarnated from a Dwarf into an Elf, would you expect that the new baby Elf to be shorter, broader, and have a beard? :eek: I would think not. Dwarves also have racial bonuses (and deficiencies too, of course). How can we thematically tie the past life into the current life, and kind of match the current way past life feats are implemented (http://compendium.ddo.com/wiki/Past_Life_Feats)? For the passive feat, use the +1 to social skill stuff I mentioned previously (not overpowered, certainly not required(!), but a nice benny nonetheless); or even bump it to +2 per past life to a max of +6 for three PL's. For the active feat: acquire the active racial past life feat and gain the first tier of all of that race's enhancements; or as a different argument, unlock them for your use in your current life.


To take the Dwarf who reincarnated into an Elf, I envision that the Elf now has +1 to Bluff, Diplomacy, Intimidate, and maybe Haggle vs. Dwarves because the Elf "really understands" Dwarves. Should the Elf care to burn a feat on the Dwarven racial past life, the Elf now has all of the following:

Dwarven Racial Axe Attack which matches Dwarven Axe Attack I but does not unlock Dwarven Axe Attack II.
Etc. for Dwarven Racial Axe Damage which matches Dwarven Axe Damage I but doesn't unlock Dwarven Axe Damage II
And etc. for the rest of the Enhancements that start with the word "Dwarven": thus, Giant Dodger, Goblinoid Hatred, Tactics, Shield Mastery,Armor Mastery, Armored Agility, Spell Defence, Poison Resistance, Faith, and also Constitution.
And three times per day can use the ability "Bearded Beerdrinker":rolleyes: which grants all of the Dwarven racial passive feats as your feats for 30 seconds. These feats would be Dwarven Stability, Giant Evasion, Orc and Goblin Bonus, etc.
That may be too overpowered, so the active feat might better just unlock all of the Dwarven enhancement lines. Come to think about it, that is probably the better way to do it, because then if a Dwarf reincarnates into a Dwarf, he'll get a small beneficial passive bonus, but the active feat will just mimic an ability that he already has (kind of like the way Turbine implemented Half-elf Dilletante...Dilletante: Fighter provides skill with all martial weapons - nice for a Rogue, not so beneficial for a Fighter).