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View Full Version : Why running DDO's store, on a retail B&M time scale (weekly sales) is bad for Turbine



IronClan
12-26-2012, 04:39 PM
Right now I MIGHT pay attention to the store once a week, sometimes I forget to. There's nothing to remind you, and no habit forming "check the daily deals" incentive to check. The only reason you could want players to only open the store once a week, is not wanting them to spend TP's because you're allergic to money :D

Brick and mortar shops need longer sale windows, lead time for news print/TV ads, word of mouth etc.

MMO's don't have the same problems a B&M store has. I'm going to guess the average active player logs into the game on an almost daily basis, and the consistent spenders, on a multiple hours per day basis. The DDO store then is kinda like a Wal-mart where a large number of regular shoppers come to the store EVERY DAY, but they don't buy things DON'T EVEN LOOK at the prices on stuff, they just chat with friends in the isles, watch the TV's, plays the Video Games, and then leave the store not having bought anything. If DDO was Wal-mart ;)

For this reason the store should be put on a smaller more rapid time scale. Get those people checking actively, incentivize browsing in the store (through flash sales)

1. There should be "Daily Special" with no preview, every 24 hours.
2. There should be flash sales AKA "blue light specials" (with a better name of course) announced (not too spammy now!) in general/trade chat two or three times a days during peak hours. "there are three items in the store that are 30% off" for the next 3 hours" is going to make people look at the store, believe me...
3. There should also be the weekly specials. and typical seasonal deals you currently have.
4. there should be an additional type of daily deal that IS announced ahead of time at the beginning of the week 7 deals, intended to make you put a "mark on your calendar" to log on that day and get that Item (and perhaps others)

The main purpose being to encourage and get people in the habit of logging in to check even if they aren't playing the game a lot.

Right now you only have #3, and you used to have #4 but for some reason stopped doing it while I was gone. I have no idea why.

I have ~5000 tps to spend, and I like supporting the game, but I also like to get the most value I can and usually wait until a sale to buy something. Yet I know there's utterly no point in opening the store for the next week... So I wont, and this often leads to me forgetting to check the next week, because no routine behavior is being encouraged.

In Tribes: Ascend (A F2P shooter with a cash shop) I log in every day, even though I haven't played but once or twice this whole month... I log in to check the daily deal, which are not announced, occasionally I play a round or 7, I remember what a great game it is, and spend the next block of free time playing. Point being the store/daily specials can actually keep players connected to the game.

Farayon
12-26-2012, 04:54 PM
If the DDO store gets any more annoying and spamming right in my face it would turn me away from the game as a whole pretty fast.

In the past, I enjoyed how relatively little the DDO store was advertised in the game compared to most other p2p MMO's.

I very much support your call for more daily/weekly/whatever sales, but once they start advertising their store with broadcasts and in general chat I might as well stop playing DDO.

For me personally, "incentives" that urge a player to log on every day are one way to try and get players hooked to a game in a somewhat addictive way, encouraging and advancing addictive patterns. Rewarding players for just simply logging into the game on a daily basis (without actually doing any quests or anything else) can promote addiction in certain people.

IronClan
12-26-2012, 05:48 PM
If the DDO store gets any more annoying and spamming right in my face it would turn me away from the game as a whole pretty fast.

In the past, I enjoyed how relatively little the DDO store was advertised in the game compared to most other p2p MMO's.

I very much support your call for more daily/weekly/whatever sales, but once they start advertising their store with broadcasts and in general chat I might as well stop playing DDO.

For me personally, "incentives" that urge a player to log on every day are one way to try and get players hooked to a game in a somewhat addictive way, encouraging and advancing addictive patterns. Rewarding players for just simply logging into the game on a daily basis (without actually doing any quests or anything else) can promote addiction in certain people.

Fair enough, everyone has different tolerance levels for ads. I look at it this way, if someones trade channel "WTS +1 Shattermantle Kama, Masterwork Great Crossbow (blah blah) doesn't bother me, then the occasional "flash sale" announced in channel that lasts long enough (a few hours) for people to not feel compelled to leave their dungeon instance wouldn't bother me.

Perhaps a better idea is to put a little hotspot next to the "&" (start button) make it short cut to the store, but also advertize flash sales by glowing unobtrusively or if a check box is ticked, makes itself known more obviously.

The main reason for the flash sale is to pull new players and people who might not check the store often in to; "see what the big deal is".

MsEricka
12-26-2012, 08:22 PM
Twitter, ddo.com, the ddo launcher and the ddo chronicle all list sales and specials. Why do you need more?


no routine behavior is being encouraged.

Patently untrue. They are announced every thursday on ddo.com and twitter. Just because you don't check them does not mean they don't exist or are not encouraged.

Gkar
12-26-2012, 08:28 PM
1. There should be "Daily Special" with no preview, every 24 hours.

This would make daily players happy, and most of the players in the game unhappy. Sounds like a bad idea.



2. There should be flash sales AKA "blue light specials" (with a better name of course) announced (not too spammy now!) in general/trade chat two or three times a days during peak hours. "there are three items in the store that are 30% off" for the next 3 hours" is going to make people look at the store, believe me...

People are already complaining about the store links and pop ups in game, adding more is going to **** off a lot of people.



4. there should be an additional type of daily deal that IS announced ahead of time at the beginning of the week 7 deals, intended to make you put a "mark on your calendar" to log on that day and get that Item (and perhaps others)

The main purpose being to encourage and get people in the habit of logging in to check even if they aren't playing the game a lot.

Once again, horrible for players with lives outside the game.

Jhenissa
12-26-2012, 09:19 PM
I would be happy....if it didnt...take forever....for the store...to load.

When I WANT to spend.....money....on the game....I am.....impeded....regularly...sometimes....I just say....$#%^ it....and close the window.

Brendae
12-27-2012, 05:41 AM
Please don't spam me with store adverts in ingame chat. That is possibly the worst idea I've ever heard.

Advertising specials in the launcher is enough.

Uska
12-27-2012, 09:49 AM
No thanks

danotmano1998
12-27-2012, 10:21 AM
Please don't spam me with store adverts in ingame chat. That is possibly the worst idea I've ever heard.

Advertising specials in the launcher is enough.

The build your guild event is on NOW!!!

lol..

Yeah, that was pretty annoying. No, don't spam the chat windows. It's bad. Kind of like crossing the streams.

/NOT Signed to more advertisements, though a daily DDO store special would be cool.

kaleid0star
12-27-2012, 10:45 AM
daily's are a skinner's box technique and I don't want those here so /no

IronClan
12-27-2012, 01:54 PM
This would make daily players happy, and most of the players in the game unhappy. Sounds like a bad idea.



People are already complaining about the store links and pop ups in game, adding more is going to **** off a lot of people.



Once again, horrible for players with lives outside the game.

I have a life outside of the game, so I think your characterization is a little presumptuous and insulting. I fully realize I'd miss some deals and I'm okay with that, so should any reasonable person. It certainly doesn't seem like a good reason to not have daily deals to encourage people to look at the store every day. There are after all a lot of hours in a day, where any active player could log in. Lets not pretend that it's any harder then checking email.

The pretense of hostility towards information (ads) is mostly internet bluster, people talk a good game, but then the Super bowl rolls around and record numbers of people tune in just to watch ads. I mean how often does anyone get all angry over someone selling stuff in trade channel? You mean to tell me you would be offended by Turbine announcing a sale, when there are people who spend hours doing lottery's every single day of the week? I'm not buying it... If you can ignore the trade chat lottery you can ignore a 8 word announcement about a store deal.

In fact you can IGNORE the store chat messages, just as you would a player. So that objection is no longer actually a consideration.

Anyway I like getting value and buying things on sale, right now playing maybe 2 or 3 hours a week, and nightly on the weekend, there's little to no reason to open the store more than once a week. That's a missed business opportunity for Turbine. It's just smart business to encourage people to look at the store more often.

Aurora1979
12-27-2012, 02:07 PM
I have a life outside of the game, so I think your characterization is a little presumptuous and insulting. I fully realize I'd miss some deals and I'm okay with that, so should any reasonable person. It certainly doesn't seem like a good reason to not have daily deals to encourage people to look at the store every day. There are after all a lot of hours in a day, where any active player could log in. Lets not pretend that it's any harder then checking email.

The pretense of hostility towards information (ads) is mostly internet bluster, people talk a good game, but then the Super bowl rolls around and record numbers of people tune in just to watch ads. I mean how often does anyone get all angry over someone selling stuff in trade channel? You mean to tell me you would be offended by Turbine announcing a sale, when there are people who spend hours doing lottery's every single day of the week? I'm not buying it... If you can ignore the trade chat lottery you can ignore a 8 word announcement about a store deal.

In fact you can IGNORE the store chat messages, just as you would a player. So that objection is no longer actually a consideration.

Anyway I like getting value and buying things on sale, right now playing maybe 2 or 3 hours a week, and nightly on the weekend, there's little to no reason to open the store more than once a week. That's a missed business opportunity for Turbine. It's just smart business to encourage people to look at the store more often.

They could just make the announcement and toggle option so you can assign it to which ever window you want, or none at all. Everyone's a winner.

IronClan
12-27-2012, 02:07 PM
daily's are a skinner's box technique and I don't want those here so /no

Not to get into philosophical territory but the entire game is. If you have an objection to reward/punishment mechanisms that are intended to encourage behavior then you've got a problem with most games. and certainly every MMO I've ever heard about.

Krelar
12-27-2012, 02:12 PM
Lets not pretend that it's any harder then checking email.


Whenever I try and open the store it takes about 10 minutes to fully load not to mention the time the first start up of the game takes. So while not harder it is substantially more time consuming for me than checking my email.



The pretense of hostility towards information (ads) is mostly internet bluster, people talk a good game, but then the Super bowl rolls around and record numbers of people tune in just to watch ads. I mean how often does anyone get all angry over someone selling stuff in trade channel? You mean to tell me you would be offended by Turbine announcing a sale, when there are people who spend hours doing lottery's every single day of the week? I'm not buying it... If you can ignore the trade chat lottery you can ignore a 8 word announcement about a store deal.

In fact you can IGNORE the store chat messages, just as you would a player. So that objection is no longer actually a consideration.


First thing I do when I make a new character is disable all chat channels except guild, party and combat. I can almost guarantee that if turbine implemented something there would be no way of disabling it. (If you know a way to disable the existing adverts in game let me know)

As to the super bowl I never watch it for ads or football. :p (Actually I hardly watch any TV anymore because of how many ads there are, I also haven't been to a movie theater in a couple years because I can't stand paying that much for a ticket only to have to sit through a bunch of ads before the movie even starts)


Overall the changes would annoy me but probably not be enough to make me quit yet.