PDA

View Full Version : Please reduce the amount of Shroud runs needed to get the Essence of Cleansing.



whitehawk74
12-22-2012, 03:19 AM
Each of my characters has to run the the Shroud 20 times to get the Essence of Cleansing (or whatever its called).
Some of them have to run more now that Resist Poison has been nerfed to try to get the Yellow Dopant to remake many of my items. (honestly, still no Fortitude save roll ever?)
It has dropped for me only once that wasnt a 20th run, and if its a choice between making and cleansing a new item or breaking one down, making a new one for a different slot will win every time.

If I wasnt running 1 character per day through the Shroud I would have more time to play the other content.
It takes almost an hour to get a party together and then run it. 45 minutes on a good day.

10 would be enough I think. Having a character Shrouding for 60 days if just too much. The time sink isnt needed any more now that we have so much more content at those levels.

Thanks.

Franke
12-22-2012, 03:42 AM
Not signed. I'm sorry but I must disagree with you. Whilst I understand the Shroud grind is a long and labourious one, it still provides some excellent equipment. Now, obviously it provides equipment that you yourself feel you need and I assure you, it does the same for the vast majority of players.
I believe that if the essence of cleansing dropped every 10th reward list, then new players starting the Shroud grind would be far short of ingredients with which to upgrade new items. This proposal would only assist those players who already have enough ingredients with which to craft and not the player base as a whole.

In addition can you imagine the furor if a specific 20th reward was altered whilst other raid loot remained as is? I think we need to be grateful that the essence is a static 20th reward and not a chance drop.

CaptainSpacePony
12-22-2012, 04:13 AM
How many GS does a toon need anyway? 2 weapons and 2 accessories? Extra tier 2 clickes? If the clickies are made on weapons, that set up on requires 1 clean piece. The mats would take MUCH longer to get for that collection than the cleanser.

I think it's fine as is. 2 months of regular raiding will get you about enough mats for a 5 LDS GS item--just in time for the cleanser drop! Bypass timers are available for the impatient ones.

sirgog
12-22-2012, 05:20 AM
/signed.

At least one and usually two Shroud accessories remains best in slot for almost every single build. (The OP's concern is only relevant when you need two, some builds can even want three).

The Shroud is just 'work' on capped toons now. And it's a lot harder to get a group for now that the weapons other than triple positives are no longer close to best in slot on capped toons, so 25s with accessories made don't Shroud.

The 20 Shroud rite of passage makes the game less entertaining than it would be without it.

nibel
12-22-2012, 07:26 AM
/Signed (http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=402313)

MRMechMan
12-22-2012, 08:08 AM
/$igned

But keep in mind that turbine probably views raid timer bypa$$e$ as the $olu$ion to this situation, and to them only needing 10 completions is fewer being $old in the ddo $tore.

Miow
12-22-2012, 08:11 AM
Heck just put it in the store then you won't have to run any content at all! ...

dotHackSign
12-22-2012, 09:02 AM
I'd actually rather see the raid timers reduced... though I suppose you can buy bypasses these days.

GoRinNoSho
12-22-2012, 10:15 AM
<snip/>(honestly, still no Fortitude save roll ever?)
<snip/>

The fortitude save for disease and poison are made when the timer expires.

So with your double/triple negative item on you will still turn green (scurvy effect); however, you will typically save successfully when the timer expires.

That is current impl.

So the effects are still working and I still find my triple negatives useful; however, it just took me a bit to get used to ignoring the timers for disease/poison.

As for Shroud and raids adjusting to 10 completions, I figured that they had positioned it around a spot to where it was possible to get enough ingredients to possibly make a tier 3 by the time you hit 20 completions.

I'm at the point right now where I have enough Shroud capable alts with enough completions for it not to matter and mainly run it for fun.

I expect a consequence of lowering the bar to 10 completions will cause an eventual cry to make the +3 raid tomes unbound amongst other things and lower the average running price of +3 tomes as it will be easier to run an equivalent raid 10 times.

Same thing as when they made tomes persist after TR. It killed the sale of +2 tomes in the store and caused a vertical power creep for ability tomes.

So from my standpoint, it doesn't bother me one way or the other, but be aware of the 2nd and 3rd order effects of what you ask for.

Alternative
12-22-2012, 10:27 AM
So a new great tank item appears for a slot where I have a greensteel accessory. The character is intimi tank and uses hp gs item and cha skills item for umd/intimi. Now despite the fact that I ran plenty of shrouds, and have about 30 lds in my bag, I have to run an old and easy raid 20 times to get another clenser.

That's good design according to some people, really?


/signed OP

Cyndrome
12-22-2012, 10:30 AM
Just sell them in the DDO Store.

Matuse
12-22-2012, 11:15 AM
So a new great tank item appears for a slot where I have a greensteel accessory. The character is intimi tank and uses hp gs item and cha skills item for umd/intimi. Now despite the fact that I ran plenty of shrouds, and have about 30 lds in my bag, I have to run an old and easy raid 20 times to get another clenser.

Cleanse the other item(s), then the cha skills item never needs cleansing, regardless of where you put it.

LordMond63
12-22-2012, 03:49 PM
/signed- if any ONLY if similar changes (in the form of guaranteed drops) are extended to ALL raids

The problem I see now is that, at least on Orien, Shrouds are few and far between, so it takes a good bit longer to make the 20 runs that it used to. I have four characters with over 20 runs and two more with under 20 and there's simply no doubt that it is taking MUCH longer for my newest Shroud-eligible characters to find and join runs than it did my earlier ones. Where I used to be able to Shroud pretty much nightly with one of my alts if I wanted to, now I'm lucky to see two a week.

One of the posters above nailed it: Shroud items are not the top of the list as far as desired equipment any longer, having been superceeded by various gear introduced in subsequent updates. Not only that but the newest gear from the Druids pack is not BtC and can be sold on the AH! To me, it makes sense that, as items are eclipsed in power, steps should be taken to lessen the grind necessary to acquire them.

Charononus
12-22-2012, 04:00 PM
If they reduced it yes you'd get the essence you need faster but it would have another effect, you wouldn't run it anymore from the sounds of it. More people not running it would make it harder for newer people or toons to run it. Look at reaver's fate, everyone farmed it when it changed to the new loot, got what they wanted, and now you never see it up anymore.

Missing_Minds
12-22-2012, 04:18 PM
Quite honestly, I'm amazed they haven't put the Gem into the store yet. While raid loot, to not have to run 20 shrouds is one heck of a convince.

kierg10
12-22-2012, 05:16 PM
/signed

I hate needing to run 20 shrouds, and it was painful getting the cleanser on my sorc for his conc opp goggles....

Bobthesponge
12-22-2012, 06:24 PM
No. The essence is a powerful device and shouldn't be available cheaply, much like ioun stones and stat tomes have. Making things easy to get so that you can be uber awesome dude without working for it is always a bad idea.

Suck it up and grind it out like everyone else.

sirgog
12-22-2012, 06:33 PM
No. The essence is a powerful device and shouldn't be available cheaply, much like ioun stones and stat tomes have. Making things easy to get so that you can be uber awesome dude without working for it is always a bad idea.

Suck it up and grind it out like everyone else.

It already is easy to get. When was the last time you saw a PUG with 10 or more players and some reasonable mix of classes fail an overlevel Shroud below Elite?

nibel
12-22-2012, 06:50 PM
Suck it up and grind it out like everyone else.

Most people I know that are NOT on a TR train, basically never run Shroud or ToD again. Because nothing on those raids are endgame item anymore. No, not even the HP item. before, a rogue going from 300 HP to 350 was a noticeable difference. Going from 450 to 500 is much less noticeable.

If Turbine keep the "suck up and grind like everyone else" as you ask, they will just suck up and not grind it because they can farm a FR quest on normal and get better gear.

Uska
12-22-2012, 07:09 PM
Sorry cant agree but I could see making them a rare drop as either an end reward or better yet as something in the extra chest for for doing it elite but then only as a rare chance.

Sidewaysgts86
12-22-2012, 10:46 PM
/signed, or at least feel something should be done.

The new content is releasing a lot of gear as good or better than what we can get with the shroud, (let alone having to work the shroud for a minimum of 2 months to simply equip one more piece), that can be obtained in a fraction of the time. I agree that its time to re-evaluate the time it takes to obtain shroud gear, and compare it to the time it takes to obtain the new gear thats as good/better.

Things change ladies and gents, just because "we had to grind it back in our day! Up hill! Both ways! In the snow! With no boots of propulsion!", is a ****-poor reason to ignore this.

yk49
03-03-2013, 08:30 AM
i dunno. cleansing thing is equivalent to +3 tomes isnt it?
back in the day i choose +3 tomes on main stat on some of my characters over the cleansing.
i see no reason they are sold in store either but uh...

MRMechMan
03-03-2013, 08:36 AM
There are raid bypass timers now, which make a lot of cash for DDO. I doubt they will be reducing the grind.

whitehawk74
03-03-2013, 08:39 AM
+2 tomes are cheap enough in the AH and +3 tomes are too rare.

Cleansing item is needed if you want GS goggles, necklace and a nice Cloak.

I suppose that now they have made Resist Poison next to useless I might start taking the Yellow Dopants. I'm sure they would have preferred us to all buy them in the DDO store. It was probably their intention when they made the changes.
I dont think Turbine really understands its core customers all that well.

Hutoth
03-03-2013, 08:44 AM
Can't have cleanser-run's down from 20 because... Epic Shroud.

(i hope)