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stefferweffer
12-18-2012, 08:54 AM
I just used the Stone of Experience last night to take my 8 Arti to level 16, so I can group with my friends/guildies. This means I have access to level 6 spells now, and I took Blade Barrier and Deadly Weapons (and purcahsed a Reconstruct scroll).

Now I want to know the fastest way to deal damage with the crossbows, since apparently I can only cast one buff on my weapon. Right now I have a + 3 repeater that does 2-12 electric damage + additional on criticals, and then 2-8 fire from my RuneArm. I have Improved Critical, so I THINK that each bolt gets a chance to crit on 17-20. I always have Insightful Damage on, with 34 INT, so that boosts damage tremendously. I also am a "Battle Engineer". Am I on the right track?

Before I used the stone I was casting Elemental Weapons to do 1-6 additional damage each shot. But now that I have Deadly Weapons, do I assume correctly that I should use this instead? What else can you think of that I might be forgetting? It's not that my damage is bad right now - I'm actually quite impressed. I just want to "be all that I can be" :)

Thanks for your help.

MartinusWyllt
12-18-2012, 09:05 AM
You can have deadly and elemental weapons on simultaneously. (but not deadly and dr bypass...metal or alignment) [Edit: I'm wrong, I got my DW and my insightful damage confused, sorry!]

you also have these feats?
point-blank shot, rapid shot, WF: ranged, precise shot, improved precise shot?

you can farm yourself the doublecross bow, silver slinger, make a lit II GS, get your hand of the tombs, tira's splendor, your glorious obscenity, work towards your lucid dreams and toven's hammer. (and have a crafting near 33 with enough cannith favor to get the marks to make masterful craftsmanship I shards and put them on those rune arms)

and other stuff, I expect.

Ushurak
12-18-2012, 09:10 AM
I just used the Stone of Experience last night to take my 8 Arti to level 16, so I can group with my friends/guildies. This means I have access to level 6 spells now, and I took Blade Barrier and Deadly Weapons (and purcahsed a Reconstruct scroll).

Now I want to know the fastest way to deal damage with the crossbows, since apparently I can only cast one buff on my weapon. Right now I have a + 3 repeater that does 2-12 electric damage + additional on criticals, and then 2-8 fire from my RuneArm. I have Improved Critical, so I THINK that each bolt gets a chance to crit on 17-20. I always have Insightful Damage on, with 34 INT, so that boosts damage tremendously. I also am a "Battle Engineer". Am I on the right track?

Before I used the stone I was casting Elemental Weapons to do 1-6 additional damage each shot. But now that I have Deadly Weapons, do I assume correctly that I should use this instead? What else can you think of that I might be forgetting? It's not that my damage is bad right now - I'm actually quite impressed. I just want to "be all that I can be" :)

Thanks for your help.


I have never ran the numbers for DW against EW so I am not sure if it does more overall damage than EW or if it is the fact that EW can be resisted or even negated whereas there is no immunity for DW.

Some quests such as Shroud have many different types of mobs that are each resistant to something different which makes having the correct EW active all the time a pita and, while minor, an unneeded so drain...DW is one stop shopping.

I would love to see someone run the numbers over the course of 30 or 50 or even 100 rounds though.

MartinusWyllt
12-18-2012, 09:12 AM
Oh...I'm forgetting to mention your spell damage assets have greatly improved with, like, prismatic strike, tactical detonation and blade barrier.

Your spell enhancements help...force for blade barrier.

Ushurak
12-18-2012, 09:13 AM
You can have deadly and elemental weapons on simultaneously. (but not deadly and dr bypass...metal or alignment)

you also have these feats?
point-blank shot, rapid shot, WF: ranged, precise shot, improved precise shot, improved crit ranged?

you can farm yourself the doublecross bow, silver slinger, make a lit II GS, get your hand of the tombs, tira's splendor, your glorious obscenity, work towards your lucid dreams and toven's hammer. (and have a crafting near 33 with enough cannith favor to get the marks to make masterful craftsmanship I shards and put them on those rune arms)

and other stuff, I expect.

I am lvl 14 on my 2nd article life so I don't have DW yet but I don't remember being able to put both on....

Book_O_Dragons
12-18-2012, 09:16 AM
You can have deadly and elemental weapons on simultaneously. (but not deadly and dr bypass...metal or alignment)

you also have these feats?
point-blank shot, rapid shot, WF: ranged, precise shot, improved precise shot, improved crit ranged?

you can farm yourself the doublecross bow, silver slinger, make a lit II GS, get your hand of the tombs, tira's splendor, your glorious obscenity, work towards your lucid dreams and toven's hammer. (and have a crafting near 33 with enough cannith favor to get the marks to make masterful craftsmanship I shards and put them on those rune arms)

and other stuff, I expect.red incorrect

deadly OR elemental OR metal OR +1 OR alignment

AND

insightful damage OR insightful strikes

+1 will boost spellcasting implements so give that to casters
deadly is more damage to all weapons that have a base die of at least 1d6 if they bypasses DR idk about others
I estimate deadly at 5.5 for a heavy repeater and 4.5 for a light repeater really slightly more due to crits so those are the thresholds where ill use a metal or alignment
insightful damage is more damage than deadly so use that if you can only afford 1

MartinusWyllt
12-18-2012, 09:18 AM
Doh! I'm wrong. got my DW crossed with my Insightful Damage. Sorry.

(Edit: which is what happens when your 3 arti lives are a couple of ranger lives behind you, apparently)

stefferweffer
12-18-2012, 09:18 AM
You can't do both. One drops as soon as I cast the other. Because DW was level 6, I assumed it was more powerful. But perhaps it depends on the circumstances.

MartinusWyllt
12-18-2012, 09:22 AM
...But perhaps it depends on the circumstances.

I take DR bypass over EW and DW where required.

I take EW for vulnerable element over DW.

I take DW where the others don't apply by virtue of no DR or repeater/rune arm overcomes it.

I take EW over DW when there's an inherent DR against piercing.

LOOON375
12-18-2012, 09:23 AM
+1 will boost spellcasting implements so give that to casters

The spell being referred to here is "enchant weapons".

MartinusWyllt
12-18-2012, 09:26 AM
Oh, and the spell Lightning Motes will help your repeater DPS esp. when using a Lit II with electric and Toven's Hammer against mobs not immune to lightning.

lronEnema
12-18-2012, 09:33 AM
How about taking the precision feat. 25% reduction in mob fortitude and +5% higher to hit.

Cloista
12-18-2012, 09:46 AM
Precision only affects melee.
However, precise shot and Improved Precise shot (especially as it now has the sub feat Archer's Focus) are amazing and required for a ranged build.

Gkar
12-18-2012, 09:51 AM
Oh, and the spell Lightning Motes will help your repeater DPS esp. when using a Lit II with electric and Toven's Hammer against mobs not immune to lightning.

Yes, I love this effect. 20ish seconds of purple numbers with your lightning weapons (and if there are also others using lighting weapons or spells, even better)

stefferweffer
12-18-2012, 09:54 AM
Yes, I did take Precision. Thank you.

I also did boost Force and Repair Spellpower all the way, and 1 level in all the others right now (except I forgot acid!) I'd like a + Potency item somewhere, but don't know where to put it.

I did not take Improved Precise Shot yet. I couldn't imagine many times when the mobs are lined up just right for this to be worth it. Am I incorrect on this?

Regarding the Doublecross and Silver Slinger, thank you for mentioning those. On my 16/2 Palemaster I just completed the 2nd quest in that chain, so I am slightly familiar with the story arc. Obviously I have done hardly any quests with this level 16 Arti though.

I like to run quests on Normal or Hard though. Are those repeaters available on Normal and Hard diffs? If I need to be running Elite I probably won't do it (or at least not yet). Are the items always in the chests, or do you have to run the quest multiple times until you get it?

Two more questions now that I'm wondering about this Artificer. 1) I see "Shards" on the AH that have abilities I am interested in, but I don't know how to use those. The only things I have ever crafted (if you can even call it that), is dropping items and guild shards in the machine and combining them for a while. Do these shards work the same way, in that device/machine, or do I need to have some crafting skill/experience to use those? 2) I took the Extend metamagic feat, but now I'm not so sure. Almost all of my buffs last 16 minutes, which should be ample to get to the next shrine. And others that I would be interested in extending, can't be extended. I think I should have taken Quicken instead. Would it be good for me to switch those at some point?

9Crows
12-18-2012, 09:55 AM
drag your runarm feat to a hotbar so you can toggle it easily and remap your arm fire button so its easy for you to shoot both weapons simultaniously... crafting bolts of bane or allignment damage will boost your dps alsoalso usinf the spell fire arrow bolt version will add 1d6 ..but to be honest with runearm charging and firing in tandem with xbow you dont really need the added dps of custom bolts

wayreth602
12-18-2012, 10:01 AM
Don't forget that your conjured bolts are now +5 when you are looking into crossbows.

madmaxhunter
12-18-2012, 10:04 AM
*snip* Regarding the Doublecross and Silver Slinger, thank you for mentioning those. On my 16/2 Palemaster I just completed the 2nd quest in that chain, so I am slightly familiar with the story arc. Obviously I have done hardly any quests with this level 16 Arti though.
*snip*

Both of those are bta (and ml16!), so farm away on your PM. EDIT: WAY WRONG BEFORE! Silver Slinger: Servants of the Overloard locked chest or Drow ritual chest; Doublecross Bow: Spinner of Shadows end chest.

Also, Lucid Dreams is bta (ml17 with masterful craftsmanship, ml19 without), found in the fruit loop chest at the end of Mindsunder chain.

An easy amp to your RHXB damage is haste pots OR ranged alacrity.

MartinusWyllt
12-18-2012, 10:07 AM
I did not take Improved Precise Shot yet. I couldn't imagine many times when the mobs are lined up just right for this to be worth it. Am I incorrect on this?

You can line them up, it requires kiting/strafing, works great with a paralyzing repeater. Circle strafing and using your blade barrier can probably kill them faster, you'll still be shooting more than one at a time with IPS on while doing this.




I like to run quests on Normal or Hard though. Are those repeaters available on Normal and Hard diffs? If I need to be running Elite I probably won't do it (or at least not yet). Are the items always in the chests, or do you have to run the quest multiple times until you get it?

The silver slinger can drop in the first chest you reach in the 2nd quest. Bring your open lock skill item.

The doublecross is in the end reward chest of the 3rd quest.

I'm only guessing they can drop on normal, know they can on hard.



Two more questions now that I'm wondering about this Artificer. 1) I see "Shards" on the AH that have abilities I am interested in, but I don't know how to use those. The only things I have ever crafted (if you can even call it that), is dropping items and guild shards in the machine and combining them for a while. Do these shards work the same way, in that device/machine, or do I need to have some crafting skill/experience to use those?

You have a default of 8 crafting levels in each school from your artificer levels. You'd have to level your crafting, but only upwards of 90 in each school to be able to make the bound shards. You've used unbound shards to actually add that effect to an item, the device on the left of that one is for making those shards. If you're going to play DDO for some time and are going to have alts I recommend looking into working those up. You can get BtA base items from some quests/chains and make items that can be used by all your toons through all their lives.


2)...I think I should have taken Quicken instead. Would it be good for me to switch those at some point?

I think you're right, switched extend out would be good. If you're WF and feel like you need quickened reconstruct that sounds good. Maximize/empower, sf: evocation are useful alternatives. Oh, and I've head quick draw helps in weapon swapping.

stefferweffer
12-18-2012, 10:09 AM
Precision only affects melee.
However, precise shot and Improved Precise shot (especially as it now has the sub feat Archer's Focus) are amazing and required for a ranged build.

Precision only affects melee? Seriously?

The symbol is an arrow bullseye, it requires 13 Dex, and the wiki specifically mentions an example of dragon-bane arrows. Please tell me that this does affect ranged weapons, because I will NEVER melee with this character, and I'd hate to think I just wasted a feat.

MartinusWyllt
12-18-2012, 10:10 AM
...
Also, Lucid Dreams is bta (ml17 with masterful craftsmanship, ml19 without), found in the fruit loop chest at the end of Mindsunder chain...

and also on the 3rd reward list in case you don't want to bring a full set of fruit loops every trip and would rather casual it.

Pank
12-18-2012, 10:17 AM
I did not take Improved Precise Shot yet. I couldn't imagine many times when the mobs are lined up just right for this to be worth it. Am I incorrect on this?


The archer stance from precision (Archer Focus, if I recall well) is better against single target, IPS is better against multiple mobs, even 2 of them. It is not hard to line them if you hard target the one further away (TAB or shift+TAB) and straffe left and right to have them in line. IPS is absolutely rulling when you use a CC xbow (paralyzing, Doublecross bow, etc). The only downside to IPS is that it can get you more aggro than desired, but damagewise it is a no brainer. Note that on difficult content (epic elites or difficult raids) you are better off focussing in single targets (Archer Focus) and not getting aggro as a general rule.


I like to run quests on Normal or Hard though. Are those repeaters available on Normal and Hard diffs? If I need to be running Elite I probably won't do it (or at least not yet). Are the items always in the chests, or do you have to run the quest multiple times until you get it?

I think they are. If I am not mistaken, tha chance for them dropping is lower than on elite, though.


Two more questions now that I'm wondering about this Artificer. 1) I see "Shards" on the AH that have abilities I am interested in, but I don't know how to use those. The only things I have ever crafted (if you can even call it that), is dropping items and guild shards in the machine and combining them for a while. Do these shards work the same way, in that device/machine, or do I need to have some crafting skill/experience to use those? 2) I took the Extend metamagic feat, but now I'm not so sure. Almost all of my buffs last 16 minutes, which should be ample to get to the next shrine. And others that I would be interested in extending, can't be extended. I think I should have taken Quicken instead. Would it be good for me to switch those at some point?

1) Cannith Crafting done at Cannith Crafting Station (accesible via House K or House C): http://ddowiki.com/page/Cannith_Crafting
You don't need crafting levels to apply shards to items, but you better read how it works on the wiki. I personaly have not messed much with it.

2) I prefer Quicken over Extend any day. First is because you can get uninterruptable reconstructs with Quicken, and that makes you very hard to kill (I would take also 1/1/1 on the repair enhancements line) and second because as you said at high levels you get long enough buffs, and when (if) you get the capstone most buffs you cast come from wands and clickies that you cast at caster level 20.

MartinusWyllt
12-18-2012, 10:20 AM
Oh, yeah, doublecross is just plain fun with the giants in the Lava Caves. The hill giant shaman will spend much of his short existence in the animations for yawning and lying down.

ReaperAlexEU
12-18-2012, 11:02 AM
bag a paralyser off the auction house, at your level range it will work a treat and get any other martial players to do the same in your group (eg non-magic users). paralysers are like the duracel bunny of crowd control, no SP needed! if any are TWF melee's get then to bag a paralyser for their main hand and a curse spewer for their offhand, not only is it a more effective combo than 2 para's but its also cheaper!

improved precise shot is great, my mechanic loves seeing a sea of red numbers float up, even better when the horde of mobs all get paralysed too!

you will have to do a bit of work to get the most from improved precise shot. try to target a mob near the back then see how many you can line up. when paralysing you can step left and right to get even more mobs paralysed.

just be wary that if you do it well you can generate a lot of aggro, but its nothing different to your wiz dropping a firewall or a fireball

stefferweffer
12-18-2012, 11:46 AM
I did not see any paralyse crossbows in the AH, but I may have just missed them. It's also possible, if they're as popular as you say, that I never saw them if they were out of my price range. My highest toons now are only 18 and this 16, both relatively new first lifers, and I have done zero raids. I think I have a total of 400K, maybe, between all my characters. It was my wizard who did a quick "poor man's twink" of my 16 Arti when I used the exp stone :)

MartinusWyllt
12-18-2012, 11:48 AM
I've seen them range from as low as ML 10 to ML 16, though I'm going to guess higher MLs exist. ML 8 or 9 (how low does racial restriction drop ML?) probably exist, too.

paralyzing of puncturing is very nice.

madmaxhunter
12-18-2012, 11:50 AM
You don't really need a paralyzer, you want them moving so your main damage dealer (BB) will continue doing its' job. Cursing or crippling are better options (curse will drop the saves and crippling will keep you out of their melee range).

MartinusWyllt
12-18-2012, 11:55 AM
You don't really need paralyzers, you want them moving so your main damage dealer (BB) will continue doing its' job.

Still situationally useful like if you get a lot of aggro in Running with the Devils and are getting smacked with multiple...or in challenges to stop a kobold from dying before you can get aggro. Another tool in the kit.

madmaxhunter
12-18-2012, 11:57 AM
Still situationally useful like if you get a lot of aggro in Running with the Devils and are getting smacked with multiple...or in challenges to stop a kobold from dying before you can get aggro. Another tool in the kit.

Agreed, it's just a hard item to find. Much easier to get the Doublecross Bow and make them go nap nap.

MartinusWyllt
12-18-2012, 12:14 PM
Agreed, it's just a hard item to find. Much easier to get the Doublecross Bow and make them go nap nap.

That's true, and funnier.

unbongwah
12-18-2012, 12:52 PM
Precision only affects melee.
That is incorrect: Precision affects both melee & ranged; you can also have Precision active at the same time as Archer's Focus or IPS (but not both).

However, precise shot and Improved Precise shot (especially as it now has the sub feat Archer's Focus) are amazing and required for a ranged build.AF is better than it was, but you can't use it at the same time as IPS; so the usual advice is to activate IPS for mobs and AF for boss fights. EDIT: also AF's bonus only applies when standing still, so don't use it w/kiting.

In short, a ranged build should have all three feats.

AbyssalMage
12-18-2012, 08:14 PM
How do you fit Precision into a Class that is already feat starved from 1-20? Or what can wait until 21/24?

To answer my own question, Quicken? It's the only feat that has very little use on non-WF early but I still like it for quickened BB and Fire Turret (Or what ever that spell name is). And I have already dropped Augment Summoning because I needed/wanted Empower/Maximize for BB. What's left to drop between 1-20?

As for the OP, I always keep DW on. Run House Denieth (sp?) Favor for bolts (150). This will give you 75% returning bolts/arrows with the correct DR bypass and a larger quiver. You can always use the spell for DR bypass but (2[1d10] + 2 "Battle Engineer + x "Weapon Enhancement" + 1 d Y "Rune Arm Elemental Enhancement") x 3 is nicer if you can carry the appropriate bolts around.

MartinusWyllt
12-18-2012, 08:18 PM
You find the artificer "feat-starved"? I've usually wound-up throwing skill focus:UMD towards 20 just for something to pick.

Singular
12-19-2012, 02:23 AM
I did not see any paralyse crossbows in the AH, but I may have just missed them. It's also possible, if they're as popular as you say, that I never saw them if they were out of my price range. My highest toons now are only 18 and this 16, both relatively new first lifers, and I have done zero raids. I think I have a total of 400K, maybe, between all my characters. It was my wizard who did a quick "poor man's twink" of my 16 Arti when I used the exp stone :)

For some reason, they are extremely rare right now - I started a thread on this to ask others if they had the same problem. Many replied that they do. After about 6 months of looking, I finally saw one on the AH for 500k plat - bought it immediately!

Good luck in finding one!

Draxis
12-19-2012, 10:23 AM
If you're willing to invest in the time, 3 ranger past lives gives you a +6 boost to ranged damage.

This also automatically opens the Shiradi Epic Destiny for you, which is a huge boost to ranged damage after lvl 20.

unbongwah
12-19-2012, 11:59 AM
How do you fit Precision into a Class that is already feat starved from 1-20? Or what can wait until 21/24?
Pure non-human arty gets 14 feats: 7 base + 5 arty + 2 epic. That enough for: Toughness, Precision, PBS, Rapid Shot, IC:Ranged, Prec Shot, IPS, Quik, Max, SF/GSF/ESF:Evo, and Combat Archery, with one left over for, e.g., Empower or Aug Summons. Did I miss anything?

stefferweffer
12-20-2012, 01:07 AM
OK, so I'm all excited about these 2 x-bows, silver slinger and doublecross. My 15 druid friend is on, so we do all 3 quests together (with my 16 arti), on Normal (my first time there). In the 2nd quest HE gets the Silver Slinger (reserved for him). And after the spinner battle, HE gets the Doublecross (reserved for him again). He's a stinking druid with no alts that use X-Bows. This is totally lame.

Is this what I have to look forward to with special loot from here on out? Stupid AI that doesn't care that a character actually wielding that type of weapon is in the party?

I know, I know - others may want them for their alts. Anyway, seeing them back to back go to the other guy, who would have gladly handed it to me but couldn't, was really frustrating.

BlackSteel
12-20-2012, 03:10 AM
I know, I know - others may want them for their alts. Anyway, seeing them back to back go to the other guy, who would have gladly handed it to me but couldn't, was really frustrating.

why couldnt he pass them to u in the chest?

ReaperAlexEU
12-20-2012, 03:33 AM
OK, so I'm all excited about these 2 x-bows, silver slinger and doublecross. My 15 druid friend is on, so we do all 3 quests together (with my 16 arti), on Normal (my first time there). In the 2nd quest HE gets the Silver Slinger (reserved for him). And after the spinner battle, HE gets the Doublecross (reserved for him again). He's a stinking druid with no alts that use X-Bows. This is totally lame.

Is this what I have to look forward to with special loot from here on out? Stupid AI that doesn't care that a character actually wielding that type of weapon is in the party?

I know, I know - others may want them for their alts. Anyway, seeing them back to back go to the other guy, who would have gladly handed it to me but couldn't, was really frustrating.

in the chest there is a drop down button next to each item of loot, this lets you pass bound to character items to someone who can use them. i believe the only exception is guild renown which cannot be passed.

time to kick your selves in the arse a few times as you just missed out on a double pull. still, you now know for next time :)

stefferweffer
12-20-2012, 07:33 AM
That is very cool, and very good to know. Like I keep saying - "New guy" :)

Thank you for your help.