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View Full Version : Make Dispel/Greater Dispel/Dysjunction Useful for Players



Alavatar
09-06-2012, 12:34 AM
I was running around in Epic Hard quests on my L22 wizard trying to fight some priestesses. Well, I thought ahead of time and figured I would load Dysjunction to get rid of their Deathward then Finger of Death them. Should be easy, right?

Dysjunction has to make a check of 1d20 + your caster level against 11 + enemy spell caster level. These priestess were casting 30 minute Deathward so I am assuming they are Caster Level 30. That means, on my L22 wizard (with 5 levels of Draconic Incarnation) I need to have a resulting roll greater than 41, so at least a 16+ on the d20, in order to over-ride their Caster Level.

It's useless. I was better served Otto's Irresistable Dancing these priestess and DoTing them. (3 FvS past lives, 3 Wizard past lives, and feats and enhancements placed my Spell Penetration at 51 to break their SR)

Please, Devs! Please make Dispel, Greater Dispel, and Dysjunction more useful to players! As it is there is absolutely no reason whatsoever for a player to ever load these spells.

KillEveryone
09-06-2012, 01:34 AM
I've asked for this several times, as well as seeing mobs buffed with other spells that can be debuffed. Happy to see someone else ask.

FoM would still be nice to see on mobs but right now without any ability to strip them, I'm not ready to see it on mobs. Really, that goes for any kind of buff until players spells that strip buffs actually have a real chance at working on mobs.

It is just wrong.

BlueSilence
09-06-2012, 01:40 AM
Please, Devs! Please make Dispel, Greater Dispel, and Dysjunction more useful to players! As it is there is absolutely no reason whatsoever for a player to ever load these spells.

I have been thinking about the usefulness of the dispel line recently as well. I know this is not PnP but these spells were always very useful to almost any kind of arcane caster and it would be cool to be able to use them here if worked on properly.

Worldcrafter
09-06-2012, 02:24 AM
I've had bad experiences with the various dispels myself. A mob will cast something like displacement or stoneskin. I dispel it, and then within the next second or two they just cast it again. The only time I've seen it useful was when I ambushed a ranger in a tavern brawl that had swaddled themselves with 8 or 9 buffs. They jumped up and scrambled, trying to re-buff again.

I was also extremely disappointed that Disjunction did nothing to the spell ward traps. The highest level magical dispel, doing nothing to suppress the magical ward.

Perhaps make it so that in addition to removing buffs, the target has to make a fort save, or maybe a will save. If they fail the save, they cannot cast spells for 3 seconds or 6 seconds, something like that.

Additionally, make some magical barriers that can be dispelled. You could have a wall of force that blocks off an optional chest or side objective, and needs to be dispelled to obtain it.

Dandonk
09-06-2012, 03:12 AM
I like the idea of dispels/disjunctions working better, making for more tactical gameplay and not just wail/fod/boomspellofyourchoice through the quests.

If the difficulty could be set so the spells have a decent chance of success, that would definitely be a start. But as another poster mentioned, they'll just rebuff right after.

So... how about these spells applying a short-duration debuff that prevents buffing? Maybe a 6 or 10 second window before buffs can be reapplied?

Or is this totally insane?

Alavatar
09-06-2012, 08:35 AM
Personally, this is what I would like to see:

Only change Player-cast spells below. Leave NPC cast Dispel/Greater Dispel/Dysjunction as they are.

Dispel


Add +5 to the Player's Caster Level check for removing effects
Add a 6 second debuff that prevents casting

Greater Dispel


Add +10 to the Player's Caster Level check for removing effects
Add a 6 second debuff that prevents casting
Reduce Spell Resistance by 5

Dysjunction


Add +15 to the Player's Caster Level check for removing effects
Add a 6 second + (1d3 second per 5 Caster Levels) debuff that prevents casting
Reduce Spell Resistance by 10

Musouka
09-06-2012, 05:16 PM
In response to the above post:

LoL... if you do that to those spells, you realize that you're totally overpowering them for use during at level content?

Alavatar
09-06-2012, 05:36 PM
In response to the above post:

LoL... if you do that to those spells, you realize that you're totally overpowering them for use during at level content?

Have you used any of those spells at level on Elite?

At level on Normal they probably would be overpowered. But, on Normal, it would be quicker and more SP efficient to just throw damage spells.