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1jazzz
08-23-2012, 11:32 PM
ok 1st off let me say, i do agree that they need to fix the CR scaling, that's a given.

2nd of all in case you didn't know, here's the list of the current summons and their schools

Abjuration: Epic Enchanted Armor
Conjuration: Random Epic Golem: Flesh, Iron, Clay and Stone
Enchantment: Epic Succubus
Evocation: Epic Living Meteor Swarm
Illusion: Epic Dream Reaver
Necromancy: Epic Lich
Transmutation: Epic Granite Gargoyle
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now this is my suggestion, have the summons be like the xoriat trinket, here's my list:

Abjuration: Watcher Construct, Enchanted Armor -normal, fire/cold shield(permanent on summon)

Conjuration: Golem: Stone, copper(same model as the cosmetic pet, size scaling is needed), flesh(the type in necro 4), arcane ooze

Enchantment: Succubus, Will-o'-Wisp, frost beholder

Evocation: Living spell: meteor swarm, Polar Ray, Chain Lightning, Magic Missile

Illusion: Dream Reaver, Invisible Stalker,Phase Spider

Necromancy: Lich, Wraith, Ghast, umbral gargoyle

Transmutation: Granite Gargoyle, Crimson Foot Herald, mimic

special: only has 1% chance to summon these irregardless of spell mastery pre-requisition
universal rare: living spell-Blade Barrier/Curative Admixture, minotaur berzerker, Rust Monster, Marut

NOTE:
living spell blade barrier:- use the same model as the blades in shroud(when fighting harry),
slashing damage on touch, and can uses blade barrier spell (cool down= 2*cr secs)

living spell Curative Admixture: white ball of light
nimbus of light as attack, will toss out medium healing pots at allies, or use any "Curative Admixture" removal pots

TYVM in advance for your 2 copper

Syllph
08-24-2012, 12:04 AM
Turbine, go do the quest: "Enter the Kobald" on Elite. Look at the damage and HP of the Living Meteor Swarms. These are epic mobs. Adjust this spell accordingly. thank you.

Aerach
08-24-2012, 12:16 AM
well do remember it's a free summon with a 1 minute cooldown... but... it does lower damage than the level 12 pale master summon.

That said i did try it on my PM and the Lich in a heroic instance (CR20) does ower damage than the level 12 palemaster summon in an epic instance (where it's hit by the abominable scaling bug to be even lower CR). That's... odd. It's actually spending a lot of its time casting magic missile... without metamagic. I cannot honestly believe any serious effort was spent looking at it if it's going to cast magic missile.

1jazzz
08-24-2012, 12:34 AM
well do remember it's a free summon with a 1 minute cooldown... but... it does lower damage than the level 12 pale master summon.

That said i did try it on my PM and the Lich in a heroic instance (CR20) does ower damage than the level 12 palemaster summon in an epic instance (where it's hit by the abominable scaling bug to be even lower CR). That's... odd. It's actually spending a lot of its time casting magic missile... without metamagic. I cannot honestly believe any serious effort was spent looking at it if it's going to cast magic missile.

i choose living spell magic missile as low tier of the list, in the same fashion as the taken from xoriat summoning. but i do agree that by itself is pose no treat; it'll prolly need something like a built in maximize or enlarge, personally i would like it to double cast when it attacks.

Aerach
08-24-2012, 01:35 AM
Not commenting on your selection so much as backing up your sentiment. The no-meta magic missile is what the epic lich actually ~does~ cast most often currently... @_@

1jazzz
08-24-2012, 02:06 AM
Not commenting on your selection so much as backing up your sentiment. The no-meta magic missile is what the epic lich actually ~does~ cast most often currently... @_@

i should be wrong, but from what i can see it's a cap lvl/cr scripting problem/error.
e.g.
max cap cr: 18
ED summon cr: 23 [-/+ dungeon scaling]

script (de)leveling rebalancing: [18] - [23] = 5 excess levels. cr 23 - 5 stat/abilities adjustments

instead of using the formula as intended, the script bug -5 levels from the cap; hence making the ED summon CR 13
---------------

since epic levels are new, alot of things needs re-balancing to account for the previously excess levels.

Cinos
08-24-2012, 06:01 PM
I'd say the Meteor Swarm is good enough, considering it costs nothing quickened and will hit mobs a bunch of times for ~300. It dies or runs out of mana quicky but that doesn't matter when it's free to cast.

thunir
08-24-2012, 06:57 PM
I don't really agree that having a Random summon is the answer. I do however think that we were sold short with these Spell school summons. I feel Gypt really. A living Meteor swarm, really that just sounds like lazy programing to me.

I dont claim to know about programming, but I do know about fun Game play, and that is unique ability and something NEW... Why didnt we have perhaps a Faire Dragon for Evocation? A Summoned Demon (ahhh the Gate spell we never got :) for Conjugation . Displacer Beasts, for Illusion, I DONT KNOW, but anything that is original to the game.

Again no expert here, but cant you just through tentacles on an existing panther skin and call it a displacer beast? Maybe use the existing UI with the exception of 1 or 2 new traits and crank it up to CR 30 and Voila?

When you guys slam something together like this, the Magister line that is, it really takes away from game play and were stuck with it. You got to sell it to me turbine, one of the things that make DnD such a fun experience is the rich landscape and campaigning system with very little boundaries.

Every time you make another NAMED docent and give it the same 3 tiered shoulder pad, I want to choke someone. The new look of the Faerun random loot gen kinda cool, but why didnt you change the shoulder pads, and chest plates, and waist belts? All you did is create some new skins for the clothing. That's why we all ran around HALF naked for a Month, because you only change ONE piece in the entire body kit and tried to pass it off as FAERUN ARMOR. Im not convinced, and I think its lazy. Sorry....but I want new.

My favorite character has always been a Mage, but no more. The magister line is boring, the only original enhancements "the sigils" all have the exact same graphic.... :(



PS. sorry to Troll you post OP, but this whole Destiny line just disapointed me.

azrael4h
08-24-2012, 08:12 PM
I agree that magister is pretty lackluster. I went Draconic, and my Wizard will run Draconic as well.

TBH, I would much prefer the summons stay either static, or display a list like the regular Summon Monster/Nature's Ally spells do. Beyond that, they need buffing. All summons do. Basically, they could give a doubled Augment Summoning to all hires and summons, and they would still be horrible.

Fefnir_2011
08-24-2012, 08:49 PM
I would rather see them beef up the summons. CR level = your caster level for that school.

I only played around with the lich, and he was pretty disappointing. His spell list should really be:

Web
Fear (acts like Mummy Despair)
Disintegrate
Niac's or Eladar's
Finger of Death

He should also get heighten and maximize. That summon would be worth casting, even if he is a little frail. The ones in-game are just fail no matter what you're doing.

1jazzz
08-24-2012, 09:20 PM
granted that this list is somewhat random, but i made it with the PrE in mind.

a living spell meteor storm is nice, but should not be limited in respect of archmage/elemental savant

@thunir - i don't consider this lazy at this point. i consider it as a starting point. with any good development you start out with the core and branch out, tweak and change as you move along.

since magistar is only 1 of many ED, there are more pressing matters.


as a DM i'd never allow my players to have anything too overpowering like a dragon(unless they have the preq or PrE).
summons are always presented as a list as you can only summon in your line of alignment/domain, since we do not get a full alignment, the list has to be reworked to a much shorter, general list

displacer beast - has a full round of 3 attacks in pnp and wont be as much fun in ddo as it's displacement is null via true sight(a rare thing to have in PnP)

no offence when i say this, but you are looking at wizard/magister as a streamline class. in dnd(in general), it's all about customizing. which is why(to me anyways) why you can get to ED tier 3 by the time you get to lvl 22. consider this:-

wizard 20 archmage/fateslinger
twist of fate:

endless faith- EA
running with the wind- GmoF
fey form- SC

while i did go out of my way to choose 1 twist from each sphere, there's a still alot you can do to improve and make the character your very own.