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Inthuul
08-23-2012, 12:48 PM
I would like to see more groups in the lfm panel.

How about an experience point bonus for being in a group? Plus possibly a bonus for leading a group? Not including hirelings or yourself as a player.

Maybe something like; 2% bonus per player member of the group (not including yourself) for the leader of the group. So, for a six man group, that would be 10%. For a raid, that would be 22%.

For non leaders of the group, a 1% bonus per player member (not including yourself). For a six man group that would be 5%. For a raid, 11%.

Ape_Man
08-23-2012, 12:51 PM
If Turbine wants to encourage grouping they need to remove quest-scaling. That's what makes it easier to solo/shortman stuff.

pie2655
08-23-2012, 12:53 PM
Hello 12 boxing

Galeria
08-23-2012, 01:16 PM
To see more grouping, we need more new players.

Veteran players are generally in closed off groups: guilds, channels, friends lists. Their groups are private, they don't play with newbs.

Without an influx of new players, the game becomes a private playground for people who feel the game is an autocomplete because they only run with people they know- often overgeared and overlevel (hard to find a raid these days at level.)

Word of mouth doesn't help when players are disgruntled and feel they are not listened to. The new Faerun content was placed out of the range of newbs, who were given cheater stones to reach it but once there as a new level 16... the content starts at 19. So they were undergeared, underexperienced and most likely gave up. Anecdotal evidence from my peers supports this- I know people who tried to play and gave up in frustration.

I kind of feel like the expansion missed its mark and a lot of potential was squandered through the promise of Forgotten Realms that realistically would take a player a few months in Eberron to reach and have some decent knowledge. Downplaying Eberron when players MUST learn there is a mistake, IMO.

The lack of any official training or help (http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=368893) is a deterrent to play as well.

Tshober
08-23-2012, 02:27 PM
To see more grouping, we need more new players.

Veteran players are generally in closed off groups: guilds, channels, friends lists. Their groups are private, they don't play with newbs.

Without an influx of new players, the game becomes a private playground for people who feel the game is an autocomplete because they only run with people they know- often overgeared and overlevel (hard to find a raid these days at level.)

Word of mouth doesn't help when players are disgruntled and feel they are not listened to. The new Faerun content was placed out of the range of newbs, who were given cheater stones to reach it but once there as a new level 16... the content starts at 19. So they were undergeared, underexperienced and most likely gave up. Anecdotal evidence from my peers supports this- I know people who tried to play and gave up in frustration.

I kind of feel like the expansion missed its mark and a lot of potential was squandered through the promise of Forgotten Realms that realistically would take a player a few months in Eberron to reach and have some decent knowledge. Downplaying Eberron when players MUST learn there is a mistake, IMO.

The lack of any official training or help (http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=368893) is a deterrent to play as well.


Yep, it's obvious that Turbine wanted MotU to attract lots of new players but the exp stone thing was just a really poor kludge that was not well though out at all. And the environment for new players in DDO is just really poor. There is no incentive for veteran players to mentor and help new players learn the game. In fact, there is every incentive not to do so. Honestly, I'm a little surprised that any new players stay very long.

CaptainSpacePony
08-23-2012, 03:44 PM
If Turbine wants to encourage grouping they need to remove quest-scaling. That's what makes it easier to solo/shortman stuff.

I've said this before as well. I support removing scaling entirely.

Ralmeth
08-23-2012, 06:09 PM
The OP has an interesting idea, but I'm not sure this is the solution. There's already a ton of XP in the game and people who are in groups with their friends already will just take the extra XP and continue on their way. Those people that prefer to solo...will still want to solo and not feel forced / penalized into grouping (penalized by not getting grouping XP).

Instead, either:
1) Bravery Streak should be removed, with the XP for completing Elite and Hard the first time bumped up to compensate. Or,
2) After some number of quests on a streak, you're allowed to break streak once in a while with no penalty (ex. after a streak of 10 quests, you can break streak for 1 quest or quest chain and still go back on your streak with no penalty).

The issue is that if someone puts up a LFM and wants to run normal (Shocking!) they'll have a bigger pool of people willing to join them. Also, if someone new to DDO wants to learn the quests on normal, vets will be able to join them to lend a hand without breaking streak.

As for removing scaling...No. Some people prefer to solo or short main. So let them instead of forcing grouping. I played long before scaling was introduced and basically every quest you HAD to have 6 people because every person you added made the quest easier. Which of course meant that filling your group took that much longer and I hate waiting for a group to fill.

V_mad_jester_V
08-23-2012, 07:34 PM
Yep, it's obvious that Turbine wanted MotU to attract lots of new players but the exp stone thing was just a really poor kludge that was not well though out at all. And the environment for new players in DDO is just really poor. There is no incentive for veteran players to mentor and help new players learn the game. In fact, there is every incentive not to do so. Honestly, I'm a little surprised that any new players stay very long.

Thats cuz most vet players forget they were noobs at one point and time.

I will hold hands with noobs and teach them the ropes, but i wont help them if they cant help themselves. For instance one noob sent me a group invite and was like "can i have 10k plat" i said sorry help yourself before asking me cuz 10k plat is easy, but if he sent me an invite and was like "hey i dont know what im doing how do i finish this quest/ what should i do to level up and make a better toon, or who do i do such and such" you have my full undivided attention.

Mainly saying that cuz i do help noobs as a vet player but dont give them handouts. Problem is thats growing less and less. I see more people on the /advice channel say "look it up in the ddowiki". wow, way to be helpful guys! Im sure more than one of you in these forums are guilty of that. Thats not being helpful at all and what it dose is show the noobs who come in that there is no help. Meaning they should just find a better game with people who will actually give you a hand rather than >insert link here<. Your better than this people, and if you want this game to stay alive then you must be helpful to your fellow gamers.

Again everyone here was a noob on this game at one point and time. When you go to a new game i bet those of you who hate on noobs are going to ask super noob questions and ask for help whenever possible. So dont forget where you are, and dont act like your better than everyone else cuz when it comes to games out of your league you are a NOOB, everyone here is a noob in a way shape or form. It may not be with this game, but you are a noob. I bet most of you are noobs on world of tanks, call of duty, diablo 3, city of heroes/villians, guildwars, the secret world (new mmo came out like a month and half ago), dc universe, champions, and many more. If you can stick your chest up and say "i am not a noob in any of those games or any of (games you insert here)" then put your chest back in and realize you live in a sad existence where all you know, eat, and sleep is gaming.

now im not saying you cant be knowledgeable in alot of games, im saying if you know it all then you have no life. and the point of that was again your a noob. Like it or not your a noob, go to a new game and feel small again, maybe that'll humble you down a bit.

now to the thread at hand, i think scaling should be removed. Make every quest fixed with mob counts, but bump up mob counts depending on difficulty.

casual- easy to complete
normal -10% harder than casual
hard -20% harder than normal
elite -30-40% harder than hard

scaling actually encourages smaller groups and solo play. Which i think is really dumb. Now for the bravery bonus, people have argued agasint me on that, but with current content out, and with the growing amount of content, i dont think its needed anymore. I have actually gotten a level 23 toon with only farming epic quest. I always farm gwylans stand, tear of dhkaan, and frame work cuz i can farm it. I farm Blockade buster cuz its fast and easy. People are going to farm quest in this game no matter what, bravery bonus or not. With tomes exp and exp elixirs that drop from chest leveling is made alot easier now. I think with the removal of the bravery bonus groups will be 20X easier to come across. For example

I cant join your group cuz i have BB and your too high a level. Aka im too ignorant about BB and wont join your group cuz im going to loose it. No you just wont get it, you wont break streak but you dont get BB either..idiot learn to read a little

Servant of the overlord hard (elite is doable with my toons but not all groups) - sorry cant join your group cuz it'll break streak. Gah if i had 1 plat for everytime i heard that i would literally never need to farm for scales, motes, or any money making items ever again. I can twink out 30 toons with the plate i could make every time i heard "im on bb"

Shroud hard open to min level-25- cant join im on bb and i wanna join an at level group on leet (psh like thats going to ever happen)

Bravery Bonus is a big mechanic failure, they need to take it out, and make exp tomes unbound rare drops. I leveled to 22 in a week cuz of the fact that i found 4 major exp elixirs in chest and had 1 minor for underdark preorder. No learning tome (the one i got was given to my main) and no voice or mantle.

one can argue " i dont wanna farm ques to level" get over it cuz say that all you want, but your still going to farm jungle of khyber, your still going to farm gwylans stand, tear of dhkaan, shroud flagging quest, tempest spine, wiz king, ect. So I ask is there really any difference at all? Nope none, you are still going to farm the same quest you did before BB, during BB, and if they remove it, after BB. So quit complaining about farming, open your eyes, and realize your still farming the same exp quest for the exp it offers.

Flavilandile
08-24-2012, 02:01 AM
Instead, either:
1) Bravery Streak should be removed, with the XP for completing Elite and Hard the first time bumped up to compensate. Or,
2) After some number of quests on a streak, you're allowed to break streak once in a while with no penalty (ex. after a streak of 10 quests, you can break streak for 1 quest or quest chain and still go back on your streak with no penalty).


Or
3) Bravery Streak should be removed, and replaced by a system that is similar to what was available long ago.
Doing quests of a level higher than the highest party member level brought an XP bonus... That's how LVL 5 parties went to VON3 [normal] to earn lots of XP... at LVL 5 in VON3 Normal you had a +50% bonus or something similar, add that to the first time bonus and you were having a jackpot.

It removes the problem of doing all on elite ( no streak to break ), and it put back the option to challenge the quests ( any quest ) by underlevelling the quest. ( and trust me the Beholders in VON3 are challenging with a LVL 5 party... you have to have good group tactics and a sane strategy if you don't want to wipe. )

1jazzz
08-24-2012, 02:21 AM
if there was a reward to be gained for questing party i'd have to goto the loot section

normal quests
group bonus: +0.2 to end chests and reward, +0.4% named loot chance - per ally
full group bonus: +1.5 to end chests and reward + 3% to get named loot

raids
group bonus: +0.4 to end chests and reward, +0.5% named loot chance - per ally
full group bonus: +6 to end chests and reward + 9% to get named loot

all of which does not count hireling(s)


well something along these lines anyways

Ralmeth
08-24-2012, 03:04 PM
Or
3) Bravery Streak should be removed, and replaced by a system that is similar to what was available long ago.
Doing quests of a level higher than the highest party member level brought an XP bonus... That's how LVL 5 parties went to VON3 [normal] to earn lots of XP... at LVL 5 in VON3 Normal you had a +50% bonus or something similar, add that to the first time bonus and you were having a jackpot.

It removes the problem of doing all on elite ( no streak to break ), and it put back the option to challenge the quests ( any quest ) by underlevelling the quest. ( and trust me the Beholders in VON3 are challenging with a LVL 5 party... you have to have good group tactics and a sane strategy if you don't want to wipe. )

Sure, I'm up for that too:)

dterror
08-24-2012, 03:15 PM
I really miss the old days of running quests several levels over your own level for the big bonus you could get.

Regarding all the per group member xp bonuses:
No additional bonus for being a leader. How exactly are you going to implement that...based on who has the star currently? Lots of groups pass the star around so people can be added to the party off tells / friend lists / etc.
I would wholeheartedly support a 2% per additional party member inside the quest, as long as that quest has no overlevel xp penalties, to a max of +10% for a full 6 player group. Raids are fine as is now, and should be left alone.