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RS-Makk
06-20-2012, 04:48 PM
Trying to plan out gear and enhancements - how much threat reduction should I aim for? What's 'enough'?

Bumbaragum
06-20-2012, 05:37 PM
One word. Treason.


that's all the treat reduction you will ever need (from gear). Tinker's Goggles one of the best out there to fill that

Rogann
06-20-2012, 06:16 PM
Just SubtleBackstab 4 is needed...With the legendary dreadnaught haste boost. Youll already have 10 AP free for anything.

karl_k0ch
06-20-2012, 06:58 PM
On my Str-based Halfling, I am running around with Subtle Backstabbing II and a Tharnes Set, if needed. I usual raid situations, this was enough.

Glenalth
06-20-2012, 08:10 PM
One word. Treason.


that's all the treat reduction you will ever need (from gear). Tinker's Goggles one of the best out there to fill that

20% reduction is often not enough, especially if you pug.

voodoogroves
06-20-2012, 08:19 PM
If you mostly raid, you may not need much. Tanks of seriously good amp these days.

If you plan on pugging epics with fleshie no-fort mobs (Lords of Dust, house D, etc.) you probably can't get enough if you're at all built for damage. I do a fair amount on my assassin and she ganks aggro pretty regularly. It doesn't take more than a few crits and some good procs on top of your pile of sneak damage to out DPS most folks.

I'd aim for one or two tiers of subtle using action points and one item, and hotbar diplomacy.




That, and work on killing stuff faster. ;-)

destiny4405
06-20-2012, 08:31 PM
you don't need threat reduction, you need improved deception :)

jcTharin
06-20-2012, 09:12 PM
If you mostly raid, you may not need much. Tanks of seriously good amp these days.



Good hate amp is available but people who try to tank don't always have it. Tanks in pugs seem to be having more trouble then ever holding agro.

MalarKan
06-21-2012, 12:19 AM
20% is enough. About "Treason", i rather weild a dps weapon... also, if you read it carefully its just a threat reduced to 80" (same as 20% treath reduce)... so its not that great to my eyes.

And as for your question, just ask yourself how often are you going to be in pugs, and what kind of pugs. To my Str human rogue i usually dont use any sort of threat reducers at all... but to be safe, sometimes i do ( -20% from venom set) even if i pull agro and i dont want to keep it i start Bluffin from time to time for an extra short threat reduce. Usually whoever is tanking has some sort of means to allow him maintain agro, wether through items or sets or through intimidate (despite the simplicity of Echrono, i must mention that ive been able to tank it just fine more than once ... on my Rogue, using just a +20% threat set (claw) and pulling Intimidates here and there.

So, how much its needed? 0% if the tank is good. How much is enough? As much as you can afford and from that you develop your DPS tactic (how early or late you jump into the dps... i used to give extra time to some tanks when i was puging a lot)

Hope it helped, cheers!

cru121
06-21-2012, 02:44 AM
About "Treason", i rather weild a dps weapon...
Note: when they say Treason, they probably don't mean the Treason that you have in mind: http://ddowiki.com/page/Treason

Imatotalnoob
06-21-2012, 03:32 AM
Well it depends on lvl and dps u put out
Lvl for what gear u can have
Dps .... Well nough said

Warning maths ahead!!!

So a dps tank thf should be 20-30 points
per glancing blow

If u have 80% threat reduction u can
do 100-150 damage per swing without
ever getting agro

Deception bluff diplo all help u lose it

Sap stun unbalancing strike all give u sneak


If u never get agro you're either a Realy
Good or really Bad rogue

If u can solo then u are a good rogue

Cheers

arroyo
06-21-2012, 07:19 AM
you don't need threat reduction, you need improved deception :)

/signed

Upgraded Ring of Lies, Golden Guile.

WangChi
06-21-2012, 08:54 AM
Remember - threat reduction is not additive, it's multiplicative, so you get diminishing returns the more you get. For example:

Subtle Backstabbing IV (40%) + Tharnes Set (20%) = 52% threat reduction NOT 60%

I use subtle iv and tharnes, it's probably overkill but on occasion I have pulled aggro, especially when I double-boost (haste iv + human versatility damage iv).

In poor groups, it won't matter what threat reduction you have, you'll get aggro as a rogue, the SA damage is just to much. In good groups, you won't need anymore than subtle iv, just depends on who you run with.

EpiKagEMO
06-21-2012, 07:18 PM
Depends how you play, but I calculate like this:
This is higher levels(I have not been to epics so I wouldn't know yet)
0% if you don't attack or if the trash is being one shot
10% if you barely attack or if the trash is being mowed down it doesn't even matter
20% if you stand back
30% if you can control yourself
40% if your dealing a bit too much damage
40%+Gear if you really are having trouble

0% if your soloing and if you are depending on bluff or even Imp Feint

My rogue is standing at 20% +10% from gear, no trouble from aggro 90% of the time >.>

My tips:
-Follow the tank and attack his monster. Don't get ahead of him. I find sneak very handy(assuming there are no archers). :)
-The easiest thing to do is stop attacking a trash once you get his aggro(see no sneak attack damage) and focus on another.