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View Full Version : When do Rangers get Pet system like homonculus?



WolfSpirit
08-19-2011, 08:46 AM
I don't even have a ranger currently but let me tell you guys this!
The way you've set up the Pet for Artificer is JUST what an actual lifelong (sort of) Animal companion should be. NOT just another summons that dies 3 mins after summoning. Not just a Moments distraction for Mobs.
A True companion that grows and gains strengths with levels just as we do.
I would LOVE to see fresh life breathed into The ranger class by implementing this for them. It is, after all, what their animal companions SHOULD be like after all.
On a side note, something small but similar for familiars would also work for mages...

patang01
08-19-2011, 09:05 AM
The problem I think with artificier is that they keep pushing out releasing all PREs and fixing all problems by introducing more problems, more spells, more classes (races) and then have to rebalance.

I like the pet idea but I hope they also add familiar and animal companion in the future. And please, for the love of gosh - stop releasing new classes and races until all the PREs are released. I don't mind new things, but the stuff on Lam is broken. And adding so much more requiring more and more resources takes away the time they should take to make sure the rest of the classes and races have everything they need.

I want a animal companion and I get the pet is a good test bed for it, but I also want all choices for everything else released.

Gkar
08-19-2011, 09:11 AM
Why don't you give them 6 months to see how this works so any potentially broken/underpowered/overpowered/lag inducing/etc problems are solved before they start moving the tech to ranger, wizards, and sorcs who should all have the option of companions.

Letrii
08-19-2011, 10:05 AM
Willing to give up one of twf or archery lines for it?

grodon9999
08-19-2011, 10:08 AM
Willing to give up one of twf or archery lines for it?

That pet better be friggin off the hook, but my first reactions is hell no.

dkyle
08-19-2011, 10:18 AM
Willing to give up one of twf or archery lines for it?

Eh, let the Rangers have their pets. Having both TWF and Archery isn't OP. Rangers need a little love.

But I do agree with letting the system shake out the bugs with Artificers first.

As for Familiars? I'm very disinclined to give Casters more stuff. They do not need the help, at all.

Letrii
08-19-2011, 10:32 AM
Eh, let the Rangers have their pets. Having both TWF and Archery isn't OP. Rangers need a little love.

But I do agree with letting the system shake out the bugs with Artificers first.

As for Familiars? I'm very disinclined to give Casters more stuff. They do not need the help, at all.

Familiars wouldn't really boost power level of arcanes. Minor skill bonus, and more a liability to caster than anything else.

dkyle
08-19-2011, 10:52 AM
Familiars wouldn't really boost power level of arcanes. Minor skill bonus, and more a liability to caster than anything else.

If the familiars would be that useless, I'd rather the Devs spend their time on useful things for other classes, that could actually use the help.

I'm assuming that Familiars would get a boost in their usefulness, compared to PnP. Otherwise, they'd be pointless in DDO.

Letrii
08-19-2011, 11:40 AM
If the familiars would be that useless, I'd rather the Devs spend their time on useful things for other classes, that could actually use the help.

I'm assuming that Familiars would get a boost in their usefulness, compared to PnP. Otherwise, they'd be pointless in DDO.

Maybe if they let arcanes use shield guardians, though that seems kinda what artificers have now.

mournbladereigns
08-19-2011, 11:45 AM
I don't even have a ranger currently but let me tell you guys this!
The way you've set up the Pet for Artificer is JUST what an actual lifelong (sort of) Animal companion should be. NOT just another summons that dies 3 mins after summoning. Not just a Moments distraction for Mobs.
A True companion that grows and gains strengths with levels just as we do.
I would LOVE to see fresh life breathed into The ranger class by implementing this for them. It is, after all, what their animal companions SHOULD be like after all.
On a side note, something small but similar for familiars would also work for mages...

I'd like to see some of the Upgrade path options implemented for PM summons. So the skeleton summons would be worth investing in.

Give Archer/Knight/Mage upgrade options. Moar Fort & other options, Blackbone/Frostmarroow upgrade options, and have them cost significantly less than current system. seriously.

redwolf51
08-19-2011, 01:58 PM
I'd like to see some of the Upgrade path options implemented for PM summons. So the skeleton summons would be worth investing in.

Give Archer/Knight/Mage upgrade options. Moar Fort & other options, Blackbone/Frostmarroow upgrade options, and have them cost significantly less than current system. seriously.

So boost PM more and leave AMs behind more so?

Symar-FangofLloth
08-19-2011, 04:32 PM
Rangers most likely won't get any sort of companions until after Druids are out and have theirs.

suszterpatt
08-19-2011, 04:58 PM
Willing to give up one of twf or archery lines for it?
I wouldn't mind seeing this:

Archery feats
TWF feats
Animal companion

Pick 2

DrNuegebauer
08-19-2011, 05:10 PM
I wouldn't mind seeing this:

Archery feats
TWF feats
Animal companion

Pick 2

Why would there be a problem in giving rangers all 3?

They're certainly not overpowered in the 2WF department.
The archery thing is pretty cool and all, but certainly not overpowered.

Those 2 alone are nice and all, but the powergamers are gonna pass on the ranger class since there isn't enough 'uberness' in there.

Having an animal companion who is better than a level 1 summon wouldn't be overpowered either - as long as the pet wasn't "uber"

Once you factor in all 3, it might actually bring rangers back as a 'viable' toon for the powergaming crowd?

Aashrym
08-19-2011, 05:15 PM
If they get them it would likely be the same update druids come out would be my guess.

I was giving it some thought with the number free feats that rangers get but in the grand scheme of things I have decided there is no point in giving up both combat styles for rangers to have pets or to restrict the usefulness of those pets.

Looking at how I would compare the classes right now I just have a hard time justifying the need to restrict the pet because the skills and spell power just don't have much impact. Ranged isn't exactly over powering and after U11 it might be better but I still don't expect it to do as well as melee or offensive casting.

I don't see a big issue with giving all pets with both combat lines.

QuantumFX
08-19-2011, 06:01 PM
SOON™

On a serious note: It would definately make the class more fun.

wiglin
08-19-2011, 06:13 PM
Rangers as a whole are not top dps contenders right now since we fight alot more than evil outsiders these days. Unless you run limited content, favored enemies no longer cover everything.

Giving rangers their animal companion should happen. They will not be overpowered with an animal companion. It will round out the class even more, making more appealing overall. Most rangers only pull out a bow when manyshot is off timer, most will not be taking pbs for the increased damage, so the fact that melee rangers get access to some of the bow feats should not limit them getting an animal companion.

With the new mechanics to artificer's, I would expect to see rangers get their animal companions.

AnYtHiNg23
08-19-2011, 06:20 PM
I'd like to see some of the Upgrade path options implemented for PM summons. So the skeleton summons would be worth investing in.

Eladrin has stated that they are looking into revamping the PM Undead summon system - most likely making the summons level staggered and not having such great AP reqs to get them. Ofc, it doesn't mean they'll get nice control bars (as much as i'd like to see them) - better than nowt i 'spose ^^

Grenada
08-19-2011, 06:33 PM
That pet better be friggin off the hook, but my first reactions is hell no.

http://132.209.40.23/w4/campagne/images/WotC_Art_Galleries/Monster_Manual_III/Rage%20Drake%20by%20Adam%20Rex.jpg

This good enough?

Letrii
08-19-2011, 07:18 PM
Why would there be a problem in giving rangers all 3?

They're certainly not overpowered in the 2WF department.
The archery thing is pretty cool and all, but certainly not overpowered.

Those 2 alone are nice and all, but the powergamers are gonna pass on the ranger class since there isn't enough 'uberness' in there.

Having an animal companion who is better than a level 1 summon wouldn't be overpowered either - as long as the pet wasn't "uber"

Once you factor in all 3, it might actually bring rangers back as a 'viable' toon for the powergaming crowd?

Iirc, the reason rangers got both lines was because they didn't give them animal companion. Having to choose a combat line would bring the class inline with dnd once they get animal companion.

grodon9999
08-19-2011, 07:22 PM
Iirc, the reason rangers got both lines was because they didn't give them animal companion. Having to choose a combat line would bring the class inline with dnd once they get animal companion.

that and a bucket of feces is worth a bucket.

If it involves taking away ANYTHING hell not to the animal companions.

wiglin
08-19-2011, 07:30 PM
Iirc, the reason rangers got both lines was because they didn't give them animal companion. Having to choose a combat line would bring the class inline with dnd once they get animal companion.

Rangers get both lines, because archery by itself has always been that bad. (except mabee for that short time during closed beta with a level 10 cap)

Adding companions would round out rangers. It takes more than the ranger free feats to excel at either on of the combat styles, they can have both and an animal companion and be fine. A melee ranger is spending feats on tempest, and an archer is spending feats to get the most out of it, the ones they get for free do not, in and of themselves, allow rangers to excel in the one area.

To say rangers would be overpowered with an animal companion is not true. The hit to tempest was huge, and having alot more enemies to fight at cap then what favored enemy covers is another setback.

Aashrym
08-19-2011, 08:15 PM
Iirc, the reason rangers got both lines was because they didn't give them animal companion. Having to choose a combat line would bring the class inline with dnd once they get animal companion.

In line with PnP wouldn't be an improvement in DDO. Not unless there is a much bigger improvement to ranged combat coming.

Dawnsfire
08-19-2011, 08:42 PM
Considering a Ranger's companion has traditionally been 4 levels below the Ranger I don't want one. If I want a weak pet I will summon one. The pnp companion was mostly a flavor/rp addition anyways.

Aashrym
08-19-2011, 09:38 PM
Considering a Ranger's companion has traditionally been 4 levels below the Ranger I don't want one. If I want a weak pet I will summon one. The pnp companion was mostly a flavor/rp addition anyways.

I thought it was 1/2 the HD of the druid companion. What I would recommend is just give rangers a standard companion similar to druids or at least close. I just can't see it over-powering rangers at this point.

Talon_Moonshadow
08-19-2011, 09:49 PM
Eh, let the Rangers have their pets. Having both TWF and Archery isn't OP. Rangers need a little love.

But I do agree with letting the system shake out the bugs with Artificers first.

As for Familiars? I'm very disinclined to give Casters more stuff. They do not need the help, at all.

There seems to be a huge number of players who think that Rgrs are the weakest class in the game....

And ranged combat DPS sucks.

Doesn't seem OP to me to give them their pets.



(plus...if I remember right, Rgr pets are actually half as powerful as Druid pets, and Artificer pets seem to be full powered like Druid pets are suppose to be... meaning Rgr pets will not be as good...., then there is that fact that I have so many Rgr 11 builds,,,that will have sucky pets. And all those Rgr18 builds will not have max power pets either.)
(but maybe my memory is off...not sure)

Dawnsfire
08-19-2011, 10:17 PM
I thought it was 1/2 the HD of the druid companion. What I would recommend is just give rangers a standard companion similar to druids or at least close. I just can't see it over-powering rangers at this point.

My mistake (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/classes/ranger.htm).

This ability functions like the druid ability of the same name, except that the ranger’s effective druid level is one-half his ranger level. :o

They get the ability at 4th level so maybe that was what I was thinking of.

I still don't think an underpowered pet would be of much use to a ranger in this game.

Aashrym
08-19-2011, 10:47 PM
My mistake (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/classes/ranger.htm).
:o

They get the ability at 4th level so maybe that was what I was thinking of.

I still don't think an underpowered pet would be of much use to a ranger in this game.

Me either, that's why a regular pet seems fine to me. ;)

FrozenNova
08-19-2011, 10:48 PM
No.
Adding pets to rangers would only result in a sizable drop in the developers' incentive to buff rangers where it matters - in the department of numbers flying from enemy heads.
PnP animal companions were just that, anyway - animals. Even a wolf was little match for an equivalent level ogre.

Of course, if they added ranger companions, they ought to add horses; and if they added horses, they ought to add mounted combat; and if they added mounted combat, I'll have a reason to play my paladin again.

kuro_zero
08-19-2011, 11:35 PM
My mistake (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/classes/ranger.htm).
:o

They get the ability at 4th level so maybe that was what I was thinking of.

I still don't think an underpowered pet would be of much use to a ranger in this game.

Their caster level is also supposed to be half their ranger level as well but in DDO they get full caster levels (ie rangers could not get full +5 barkskin as that requires 12 caster levels and rangers get 10 at 20).

With all the house rules in DDO, I do not see it as OP to give rangers full HD animal companions. I love my ranger, but certainly feel lacking against non-favored enemies. Hell, my BARD hits nearly as hard as my ranger.