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janave
07-18-2011, 08:48 AM
Title says it.

Crying [on]

I cant always afford to wait an hour for grouping. And it is pure insane, unfun, waste of time, feels like trash... you get the point. Please fix it or sell cookies of protection from neg levels if that better suits you

Hirelings are not helpful, they dont seem to respond 4-6 times out of 10.

Crying [off]

Thank you

Alternatively make it to have 25sec prep time and/or "on touch". It wont make a challenge difference for classes that can take care of them in one button hit from the distance, so i guess it is quite reasonable.

Impaqt
07-18-2011, 08:49 AM
Title says it.

Crying [on]

I cant always afford to wait an hour for grouping. And it is pure insane, unfun, waste of time, feels like trash... you get the point. Please fix it or sell cookies of protection from neg levels if that better suits you

Hirelings are not helpful, they dont seem to respond 4-6 times out of 10.

Crying [off]

Thank you

Alternatively make it to have 25sec prep time and/or "on touch". It wont make a challenge difference for classes that can take care of them in one button hit from the distance, so i guess it is quite reasonable.

There are a pair of goggles you can get from Tangleroot that cast Deathward 3 times per rest. Get them.

WangChi
07-18-2011, 08:50 AM
There are multiple hirelings that can cast deathward and items that have the deathward clicky. That'll fix it for you.

Unless you are talking beholders - then get a hireling with restoration (not lesser, but regular or greater), or scrolls.

Hope it helps.

NinjaNeed
07-18-2011, 08:53 AM
There are a pair of goggles you can get from Tangleroot that cast Deathward 3 times per rest. Get them.

This, except it only has 1 charge per rest IIRC.

There is also the silver flame neck item that absorbs up to 10 neg levels, and anti-beholder crystals and more.

Do NOT remove neg level casting ability from mobs, it is one of the few things that make some quests interesting.

redspecter23
07-18-2011, 08:53 AM
There are ways of stopping the negative levels. Deathward spell or clicky (from Tangleroot) or negative energy absorption item (from necro series). It's one of the reasons that beholders are still somewhat threatening. As a soloist you should make an effort to run the Tangleroot series for the clicky to help you with this issue.

I do agree that perhaps a few other ways to acquire deathward through clickies would probably be a good idea. Right now your options are Tangleroot or epic sands with an extremely rare shard. Many higher level divine hirelings have deathward hotbarred, but I'm not certain if many (any?) lower ones do.

Chai
07-18-2011, 08:56 AM
Play a warforged or wear deathward and always fight behind beholders when possible as it is the front eye that uses enervation.

Gkar
07-18-2011, 08:58 AM
No.

As others have said, clickies and hirelings exist to deal with it.

The threat is not that serious, you can fight while neg levelled.

If you are a soloist, you should be investing in UMD and/or a helf cleric/fvs past life, in which case you can also scroll the cure (restoration scrolls)

Sadly the neg levels wear off over time now (stupid change, they should have stayed permanent)

It's a balanced attack and there is no reason to remove it. They have dumbed down this game way too much already.

Gauthaag
07-18-2011, 08:59 AM
there are also Deathward cookies from Festivult

also when soloing on fleshie w hireling, i usuallz give command to hireling to attack beholder so he draws his agro and i rapidly kill it from flank or behind. Hireling seem take no ill effect from most of their attacks and have improved saves and some immunities, heh

TheDjinnFor
07-18-2011, 09:01 AM
Title says it.

Crying [on]

I cant always afford to wait an hour for grouping. And it is pure insane, unfun, waste of time, feels like trash... you get the point. Please fix it or sell cookies of protection from neg levels if that better suits you

Hirelings are not helpful, they dont seem to respond 4-6 times out of 10.

Crying [off]

Thank you

Alternatively make it to have 25sec prep time and/or "on touch". It wont make a challenge difference for classes that can take care of them in one button hit from the distance, so i guess it is quite reasonable.

Using Visor of the Flesh Render Guards (http://ddowiki.com/page/Visor_of_the_Flesh_Render_Guards) makes you immune to neg levels, as well as insta kills and inflict spells.

If you're talking about Beholders... well, they're supposed to be hard to fight.

puget
07-18-2011, 09:02 AM
There are multiple hirelings that can cast deathward and items that have the deathward clicky. That'll fix it for you.

Unless you are talking beholders - then get a hireling with restoration (not lesser, but regular or greater), or scrolls.

Hope it helps.

I covered this just the other day.


http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=329862

Not a single response in the thread. And it was just a day or so ago I posted the thread, but meh, oh well.

I do however think that getting hit 1 time with neg levels...even from a boss and getting 6 and even 10 neg levels all in one or to hits is absolutely BS though.

As far as hirelings with deathward, it's only useful in quests without a Beholder, then it is useless.

I think the FVS hirelings SHOULD have that niche taken, with the restore spells, since I think cleric should keep it's divine vitality as that is useful....VERY useful to several different classes.

But there is not much to choose from after level 14 for restore, and with the new madness quests, that is where the beholders start to get thick.

eruhuan
07-18-2011, 09:05 AM
You do realize what you're suggesting is an indirect nerf to the warforged race. Currently neg level immunity is the strongest point for me to even consider WF on my favored soul or my wizards.

This might not help, but dont solo those quests especially the beholder ones. Otherwise you can always get a hireling that can cast deathward or the aforementioned items.

As have said and done before, DDO was not really meant to be soloed, other than that, tailor your character to be solo focused.

eruhuan
07-18-2011, 09:07 AM
If you're talking about Beholders... well, they're supposed to be hard to fight.

This ^. Beholder's were meant to be deadly.

t0r012
07-18-2011, 09:09 AM
12 levels of paladin and hunter of the deadII would help your problem as well.

Darkrok
07-18-2011, 09:10 AM
If you're talking about casual difficulty then I guess why not. They've already dumbed it down enough on casual that another easy button isn't going to hurt anything. The people that would normally complain about easy buttons don't run casual anyways and there's pretty stiff xp penalties to casual. Anything other than casual though? Not a chance.

Superspeed_Hi5
07-18-2011, 09:11 AM
I do however think that getting hit 1 time with neg levels...even from a boss and getting 6 and even 10 neg levels all in one or to hits is absolutely BS though.

Energy Drain is 2d4 neg levels, and we can do it to them they should be able to do it to us. While I highly doubt you got 10 negs with a single energy drain I do think its possible you got hit with it twice on more than 1 occasion.

shores11
07-18-2011, 09:12 AM
Title says it.

Crying [on]

I cant always afford to wait an hour for grouping. And it is pure insane, unfun, waste of time, feels like trash... you get the point. Please fix it or sell cookies of protection from neg levels if that better suits you

Hirelings are not helpful, they dont seem to respond 4-6 times out of 10.

Crying [off]

Thank you

Alternatively make it to have 25sec prep time and/or "on touch". It wont make a challenge difference for classes that can take care of them in one button hit from the distance, so i guess it is quite reasonable.

/not signed

This is a very bad idea and I hope never happens. Negative level draining is part of D&D at its core. There are more than enough items in game now to prevent or remove this effective.

somenewnoob
07-18-2011, 09:13 AM
Silver flame trinket with 3rd upgrade......absorbs 10 neg level effects per rest. Also has deathblock on it. Beholder fighting dream trinket!

BurnerD
07-18-2011, 09:13 AM
No.

For all the reason stated in posts above.

We don't need to remove all challenge from the game do we?

Milfeulle
07-18-2011, 09:15 AM
Get a WF or PM, problem solved, next question?

Moltier
07-18-2011, 09:22 AM
There is also the silver flame neck item that absorbs up to 10 neg levels, and anti-beholder crystals and more.


The anti beholder crystal doesnt save you from neg levels, it protects from ray attacks like desintegrate. Still awesome. :)

janave
07-18-2011, 09:23 AM
Thanks for the input

It seems like i have the option to abandon my lvl20 fighter or grind for immunities so that i may stand a chance agains wizard gnolls and beholders. Next up i am getting grinded in a blade barrier or something anyway.

I know that soloing is a bonus 'option', i undestand group effort as well. The root of my problem is the difficulty to group for specific quests.

I dont want to ask dumbing down others experience, clearly it wasnt my intention.

Hendrik
07-18-2011, 09:25 AM
/sarcasmon

I can't wait forever for a Group to form and have not yet figured out how to work the LFG UI. Please fix it, bake cookies, or sell me something that protects me from damage - it is pure insanity, unfun, waste of time, and feels like trash too.

/sarcasmoff

NO!

Already been dumbed down whereas we no longer have persistent negative effects, regening rest shrines now and AUTOMATIC regen of neg levels. This game cannot survive if it is continually reduced to the LCD.

EvilI
07-18-2011, 09:32 AM
OP has a very valid point here, that has largely gone unnoticed in replies. By no means should this be removed form the game, but *why* is there no way to cure your or combat your own negative levels, and *why, oh god why* will a lvl 19 cleric hirleing not have restoration in his spell-book (or chose not to cast it on you, his benevolent employer)? When was the last time any of you built a cleric that, at lvl 19, did not have room in his spellbook for restoration? We have remove curse-pots, and with hirelings working the way they do would it be *that* unbalancing to sell restoration-pots?

P.S. Scrolling restoration repeatedly in-combat doesnt really count as spending that many skillpoints in concentration on a melee-toon doesn't fit my view of a wellbalanced action-rpg. D.S.

dkyle
07-18-2011, 09:36 AM
OP has a very valid point here, that has largely gone unnoticed in replies. By no means should this be removed form the game, but *why* is there no way to cure your or combat your own negative levels,

Because effects that everyone can't simply blow off make the game more interesting?

There are several ways everyone can protect themselves from neg levels. As in all things in this game, it's just a matter of playing wisely.


and *why, oh god why* will a lvl 19 cleric hirleing not have restoration in his spell-book (or chose not to cast it on you, his benevolent employer)? When was the last time any of you built a cleric that, at lvl 19, did not have room in his spellbook for restoration? We have remove curse-pots, and with hirelings working the way they do would it be *that* unbalancing to sell restoration-pots?

Yeah, this is unfortunate. All high level cleric hirelings (or at least most) should have Greater Restore.

puget
07-18-2011, 09:36 AM
Energy Drain is 2d4 neg levels, and we can do it to them they should be able to do it to us. While I highly doubt you got 10 negs with a single energy drain I do think its possible you got hit with it twice on more than 1 occasion.
Was exactly 6 on the first hit, bumped to ten on the second hit. And I had of course....a cleric lvl 14 hireling instead of skein, the level 14 FVS hireling with restore. was the final quest in the harbor side of the madness chain, final boss.

EDIT: But I did say getting 6 to 10 neg levels in one or two hits....................

Sarisa
07-18-2011, 09:45 AM
At its core, D&D is a group based game.

That said, DDO is solo'able in many, many areas, but you need fairly good game experience and access to a lot of good named gear to do so.

Things that help, most of which were already mentioned:

Being Warforged. Warforged are immune to spell and on-hit negative level damage. They are still not immune to alignment (ie wearing an Axiomatic item when Chaotic) or certain cursed item negative levels (Bracers of the Demon Consort). This is a P2P only solution.

Silver Flame necklaces. The tier two version has 5 charges of negative energy absorption, which will protect you from Harm, Inflict Wounds, Enervate, and Energy Drain. The tier three version has 10 charges. To make a tier 2 version, you need any one of Necro 2, Necro 3, or Necro 4. To make a tier 3 version, you need either Necro 3 or Necro 4. To make the necklace with Necro 4, you will have to flag for Litany of the Dead (complete sigil frame), then flag for the Abbot raid (all four bosses in Litany of the Dead), then run Abbot enough times to complete your upgrade. Necro 3 is the easiest way to do so. Note that these necklaces also work at absorbing the dangerous negative level drain from Beholders as well. Also a P2P only solution.

Visors of the Flesh Render Guards. This is a Tangleroot Gorge quest chain reward. They are bound to account, and not exclusive, so you can have multiples on you. I personally carry two of these on my wizard/rogue, and would carry another if I had enough room to. This item casts a CL:7 (7 minutes) Death Ward on the target. Since it's caster level 7, it's not likely to stick on you when you're in a dispel heavy area, and it is useless when facing Beholders. Also a P2P only solution.

Cleric and Favoured Soul Hirelings. Many of them, especially at higher levels, have the Death Ward spell. Others have (Greater) Restoration. These are the best for solo'ers without access to all the packs. The hirelings do require more micromanagment, and you have to avoid becoming too dependent on them as they have a serious habit of killing themselves. Their deathward can be useless in Dispel heavy areas, and against Beholders. This is a F2P solution.

Scarab of Protection. This is a rare drop trinket, which has 12 charges of negative energy drain. These will get destroyed extremely fast when you are near arcane skeletons using the Death Aura. They are fairly expensive, but are still useful as an emergency Beholder protection item. They are unbound, and occasionally available on the AH for usually too much plat.

If your problem is only Beholders, Beholder Optic Nerves are an option. This is a necklace that will absorb 8 eyebeams per rest, and is a rare drop if you get the Beholder named boss in Invaders. It's an unbound item, so it is available at high cost in the AH. This is a F2P solution.

Eye of the Beholder is the Doomsphere (undead Beholder) version of the Beholder Optic Nerves. It's a Litany of the Dead drop, but it's unbound. This is a very costly item on the AH, so while a F2P player without Necro 4 can't farm it him or her self, it is available for purchase. A pure F2P player, however, would have no need for one since Doomspheres are only currently present in Necro 4, Reaver's Refuge (Soami Gardens rare), and Harbinger of Madness.

Some prestige classes, namely Pale Master forms and the second tier of Hunter of the Dead give you immunity to level drain. Notably, Pale Masters are also immune to cursed item level drain, which makes the Bracers of the Demon Consort an incredibly potent item for them. This is only an option if you are a Wizard or a Paladin, but are easily done F2P solutions.

puget
07-18-2011, 09:58 AM
At its core, D&D is a group based game.

That said, DDO is solo'able in many, many areas, but you need fairly good game experience and access to a lot of good named gear to do so.

Things that help, most of which were already mentioned:

Being Warforged. Warforged are immune to spell and on-hit negative level damage. They are still not immune to alignment (ie wearing an Axiomatic item when Chaotic) or certain cursed item negative levels (Bracers of the Demon Consort). This is a P2P only solution.

Silver Flame necklaces. The tier two version has 5 charges of negative energy absorption, which will protect you from Harm, Inflict Wounds, Enervate, and Energy Drain. The tier three version has 10 charges. To make a tier 2 version, you need any one of Necro 2, Necro 3, or Necro 4. To make a tier 3 version, you need either Necro 3 or Necro 4. To make the necklace with Necro 4, you will have to flag for Litany of the Dead (complete sigil frame), then flag for the Abbot raid (all four bosses in Litany of the Dead), then run Abbot enough times to complete your upgrade. Necro 3 is the easiest way to do so. Note that these necklaces also work at absorbing the dangerous negative level drain from Beholders as well. Also a P2P only solution.

The trinket is difficult to obtain as solo, due to not all of the second part quests being easily....if even possible to solo, Even me as a well seasoned and very capable solo player have been on the fence about trying it since I found that while possibly possible, it is in no way easy to do by yourself/hire due to the levers being in odd locations. (taken from ddowiki on that info) I also believe they (devs) changed the text for the quest recently to state it needed 2 players as well.

EDIT: I cannot remember the quest name, but I am sure you vets know it.

Jay203
07-18-2011, 10:04 AM
There are a pair of goggles you can get from Tangleroot that cast Deathward 3 times per rest. Get them.

Imppy, you're losing your touch man~ :p
visor from Tangleroot is 1/rest clickie :D


OP, there are a couple options you can take, easiest is to roll a warforged for the immunity to negative energy drain. then there's going paladin hunter of the dead path, and finally there's always farming for items that lets you protect yourself against them,

Hendrik
07-18-2011, 10:05 AM
OP has a very valid point here, that has largely gone unnoticed in replies. By no means should this be removed form the game, but *why* is there no way to cure your or combat your own negative levels, and *why, oh god why* will a lvl 19 cleric hirleing not have restoration in his spell-book (or chose not to cast it on you, his benevolent employer)? When was the last time any of you built a cleric that, at lvl 19, did not have room in his spellbook for restoration? We have remove curse-pots, and with hirelings working the way they do would it be *that* unbalancing to sell restoration-pots?

P.S. Scrolling restoration repeatedly in-combat doesnt really count as spending that many skillpoints in concentration on a melee-toon doesn't fit my view of a wellbalanced action-rpg. D.S.

Natural regen of neg levels was put into the game for solo types.

Sit and wait them out, use a Hireling, the Store, Skills w/Scrolls, party members, rest shrine, or one of many items to combat/recover from neg levels.

Making it easier is NOT the solution; homework and self-sufficiency is.

EvilI
07-18-2011, 10:11 AM
Thank you for a well thought out response. However it seems, with the scarcity of the Scarab of Protection and (again) hirelings working the way they do, that everything more or less boils down to 2 items, one of which requires farming a specific low-level quest, and the other one an item that is exluded for a very long time if you make an alternate choice of paths when you first enter necropolis. That, or forcing you to be an ugly, squeaky, robot.

In all i would definitely prefer if there were ways to handle negative levels that did not exclude significant parts of the game (like being a fleshy, or finding out what you get when you fully upgrade the emerald claw trinket).

Thrudh
07-18-2011, 10:12 AM
Natural regen of neg levels was put into the game for solo types.

Sit and wait them out, use a Hireling, the Store, Skills w/Scrolls, party members, rest shrine, or one of many items to combat/recover from neg levels.

Making it easier is NOT the solution; homework and self-sufficiency is.

This.

Plenty of in-game ways to deal with it. You can buy remove neg level potions from the DDO store too I think.. Plus, when the Maba event comes back, I think you can turn in those motes for restoration potions there too... Stock up next time it comes back.

puget
07-18-2011, 10:29 AM
Title says it.

Crying [on]

I cant always afford to wait an hour for grouping. And it is pure insane, unfun, waste of time, feels like trash... you get the point. Please fix it or sell cookies of protection from neg levels if that better suits you

Hirelings are not helpful, they dont seem to respond 4-6 times out of 10.

Crying [off]

Thank you

Alternatively make it to have 25sec prep time and/or "on touch". It wont make a challenge difference for classes that can take care of them in one button hit from the distance, so i guess it is quite reasonable.

OP, I just found this on ddowiki, and its cost is 3 medium ebberon dragonshards--->http://ddowiki.com/page/Shard_Trinket_of_Greater_Restoration

Hendrik
07-18-2011, 10:35 AM
OP, I just found this on ddowiki, and its cost is 3 medium ebberon dragonshards--->http://ddowiki.com/page/Shard_Trinket_of_Greater_Restoration

Homework!

It's not just for school.....

:cool:

puget
07-18-2011, 10:40 AM
Homework!

It's not just for school.....

:cool:


Homework? that was like 17 years ago for me.....And it seems I do more now playing this game than I ever tried to do even when I was in school...........I resent your implications here. (joking, joking)

Infant
07-18-2011, 10:48 AM
Thanks for the input
It seems like i have the option to abandon my lvl20 fighter or grind for immunities so that i may stand a chance agains wizard gnolls and beholders.

Many people have mentioned it, I can only add my own experience. I hate farming, thus I never managed to farm Beholder Optic Nerves. I really don't like NecroII, thus I never managed to get the Silver Flame Necklace higher than 5 charges. However I was able to solo through most of the game on a melee-oriented class (bard, admittedly, which makes it easier imho).

Gnolls/Undead, etc should be no problem if you take a cleric hireling with deathward spell (or the Tangleroot clicky). If they dispell you, you have to kill them faster :)...

That being said, Beholders, especially groups of Beholders (Invaders!) or bosses (GoP, new chain, some in Threnal, etc.) still are really tough enemies (on elite). For fighting them, there are several threads about tactics/equipment/etc.

But some content is just not supposed to be easy to solo (and consider that fighter, at least pure is probably not the most flexible/soloable class!)

Infant

licho
07-18-2011, 10:49 AM
Better idea: restoracion potion.
Yeah, i know its OMGZ eazy button, but:
- there is already easy button for this in shape of WF
- some classes can cast it (they have inherit easy buttons)
- some others can use UMD

So the classes which will benefit mostly from this will be classic fighters.
Now considering the attitude to drinking anything other than ale by melee, havinf restoracion pots could be count as part of skills.
And in current state of game, im totally not scared of adding more independence to melee.

Maybe make it part of favour system.

Infant
07-18-2011, 10:57 AM
Better idea: restoracion potion.
Yeah, i know its OMGZ eazy button, but:
- there is already easy button for this in shape of WF
- some classes can cast it (they have inherit easy buttons)
- some others can use UMD

So the classes which will benefit mostly from this will be classic fighters.
Now considering the attitude to drinking anything other than ale by melee, havinf restoracion pots could be count as part of skills.
And in current state of game, im totally not scared of adding more independence to melee.

Maybe make it part of favour system.

Ummm... I think that is exactly the point of different classes/builds. Some can do things which other can't! Rogue's or Bard's UMD comes qith a tradeoff. And if fighters could do everything clerics can, they would be clerics instead. WF is not a easy button, it is abuild decision, which comes with tradeoff too...

Infant

TheDjinnFor
07-18-2011, 11:03 AM
However it seems, with the scarcity of the Scarab of Protection and (again) hirelings working the way they do, that everything more or less boils down to 2 items, one of which requires farming a specific low-level quest.

Not really farming. Just complete the chain once and its almost always a choice of end rewards.


In all i would definitely prefer if there were ways to handle negative levels that did not exclude significant parts of the game (like being a fleshy, or finding out what you get when you fully upgrade the emerald claw trinket).

You can just drag the necklace out of your inventory and pick up the silver flame one.

I think you're exaggerating the trouble you need to go through. That, and you're trying to solo on a fighter.

QuantumFX
07-18-2011, 11:11 AM
The trinket is difficult to obtain as solo, due to not all of the second part quests being easily....if even possible to solo, Even me as a well seasoned and very capable solo player have been on the fence about trying it since I found that while possibly possible, it is in no way easy to do by yourself/hire due to the levers being in odd locations. (taken from ddowiki on that info) I also believe they (devs) changed the text for the quest recently to state it needed 2 players as well.

You don’t need to do the Bloody Crypt/Shadow Crypt/Cursed Crypt trifecta to make an amulet. You can simply do Cursed Crypt 3 times in a group to get an upgraded trinket. (Or Shadow Crypt twice for the tier 2 amulet with it’s 5 charge absorbsion.) Lots of nice named equipment drops in that quest to make it worth your time. (Scourge Choker, Docent of Defiance, Jinx’s Vexation.)

Hokiewa
07-18-2011, 11:11 AM
Yeah, this is unfortunate. All high level cleric hirelings (or at least most) should have Greater Restore.

I believe this is intentional.

All of them should have it.

licho
07-18-2011, 11:13 AM
Ummm... I think that is exactly the point of different classes/builds. Some can do things which other can't! Rogue's or Bard's UMD comes qith a tradeoff. And if fighters could do everything clerics can, they would be clerics instead. WF is not a easy button, it is abuild decision, which comes with tradeoff too...

Infant

The current list of spells avaiable on pots is not given by Gary Gygax himself, but its result of decision made by some developer. As we know the decisions, they are changing.
There are already status removing potions like blidness, curse, disease, cure line, poison.
Should we remove them, so there will be more tradeoff betwean the classes?

Kourier
07-18-2011, 11:14 AM
You wanted great soloing with a pure fighter? Anyways, no. Negative levels are supposed to be a pain. They are a pain.

somenewnoob
07-18-2011, 11:16 AM
Just FYI: If you go pick up the silver flame nugget, and find soembody who is flagged for The Cursed Crypt (necro 3 final quest) you CAN run that quest without being flagged as long as 1 group member is, so you could pick up the nugget, run cursed crypt 3 times, and have a 3rd upgrade for the trinket without ever doing another necro quest.

I wish I would have known that when I did necro 1 and 2! (So much hate for necro 2!!!)

So just run Cursed Crypt a few times, it's a fairly quick run, and only one person needs to be flagged.

Asmodeus451
07-18-2011, 11:17 AM
while i agree that completely removing neg leveling from the game would be a BAD THING i do see where the OP is comiing from.

it is COMPLETELY rediculous that a level 20 character can't solo a level 12 quest (Invaders)

my suggestion: make it so that neg level causing spells and abilities cause 1 neg level at a time

this would make neg levels still dangerous, while not being as completely ridiculous as they are now

Gkar
07-18-2011, 11:17 AM
Better idea: restoracion potion.
Yeah, i know its OMGZ eazy button, but:
- there is already easy button for this in shape of WF
- some classes can cast it (they have inherit easy buttons)
- some others can use UMD

So the classes which will benefit mostly from this will be classic fighters.
Now considering the attitude to drinking anything other than ale by melee, havinf restoracion pots could be count as part of skills.
And in current state of game, im totally not scared of adding more independence to melee.

Maybe make it part of favour system.


Ummm... I think that is exactly the point of different classes/builds. Some can do things which other can't! Rogue's or Bard's UMD comes qith a tradeoff. And if fighters could do everything clerics can, they would be clerics instead. WF is not a easy button, it is abuild decision, which comes with tradeoff too...

Infant

I agree with infant. Your build choices should impact the game for you. Everything has tradeoffs.

Paleus
07-18-2011, 11:18 AM
It seems like i have the option to abandon my lvl20 fighter or grind for immunities so that i may stand a chance agains wizard gnolls and beholders.

The tangleroot visors are the preferable solution and they are a fairly common end reward drop for that chain. While its a series of quests, they should be fairly easy to do relatively quickly. However, they will not help you against beholders.

For that, you'll want to work on your combat tactics, by that I mean playstyle. You've run into a challenging scenario and your regular approach is not working. There are two things you can do, either post on the forums for a nerf and get the deluge of 'feedback' you've just witnessed or adjust your strategies. Work on how you approach spell-casters and beholders, use terrain to your advantage, perhaps try out something with range that does strength damage to immobilize them quickly (does that still work?).

I had to deal with the same issue recently when I was TRing. I normally play warforged so beholders aren't scary to me. I'm used to running straight up to them with only deathblock on and poking their eyes out with a vengence. Then, I decided to level up a fleshy and used the same tactics. Within a few seconds of my first fight I realized, "Oh right...they do neg levels too." Needless to say, a change of tactics and gear was in order. And that is part of the quintessential DnD experience = BP.....be prepared (it also coincides with boyscout mottos, I'm sure there is a joke in there somewhere). Recognize that different enemies require different tactics and gear, and learn to adapt and prepare for fights. Don't try to avoid that part of the ddo experience.

Delt
07-18-2011, 11:19 AM
while i agree that completely removing neg leveling from the game would be a BAD THING i do see where the OP is comiing from.

it is COMPLETELY rediculous that a level 20 character can't solo a level 12 quest (Invaders)

my suggestion: make it so that neg level causing spells and abilities cause 1 neg level at a time

this would make neg levels still dangerous, while not being as completely ridiculous as they are now

A level 20 fighter can...he just better bring the right gear if he is going up against magic. Or better yet, use some tactics.

The game is easy enough.

puget
07-18-2011, 11:31 AM
A level 20 fighter can...he just better bring the right gear if he is going up against magic. Or better yet, use some tactics.

The game is easy enough.


Agreed. I play solo fighter as my server mains on most servers, I really have no BIG issues with it, as I almost always plan ahead and get the right hire for the quest......now, there are some exceptions, I am not perfect, but I honestly have no real problems.

OP, if you read the hireling item descriptions before you buy, check out the favored soul hirelings, they are excellent heals, a few of the have restore/greater restore (should be all the FVS hires in my opinion) and you can set them to active so they actively help you fight at the same time.

I would not recommend you setting any cleric hirelings on active, they frankly are just too dumb and can't handle "defend" without aggro'ing everything with searing light as it is.

Thrudh
07-18-2011, 11:45 AM
The tangleroot visors are the preferable solution and they are a fairly common end reward drop for that chain. While its a series of quests, they should be fairly easy to do relatively quickly. However, they will not help you against beholders.

For that, you'll want to work on your combat tactics, by that I mean playstyle. You've run into a challenging scenario and your regular approach is not working. There are two things you can do, either post on the forums for a nerf and get the deluge of 'feedback' you've just witnessed or adjust your strategies. Work on how you approach spell-casters and beholders, use terrain to your advantage, perhaps try out something with range that does strength damage to immobilize them quickly (does that still work?).

I had to deal with the same issue recently when I was TRing. I normally play warforged so beholders aren't scary to me. I'm used to running straight up to them with only deathblock on and poking their eyes out with a vengence. Then, I decided to level up a fleshy and used the same tactics. Within a few seconds of my first fight I realized, "Oh right...they do neg levels too." Needless to say, a change of tactics and gear was in order. And that is part of the quintessential DnD experience = BP.....be prepared (it also coincides with boyscout mottos, I'm sure there is a joke in there somewhere). Recognize that different enemies require different tactics and gear, and learn to adapt and prepare for fights. Don't try to avoid that part of the ddo experience.

Excellent post... Don't come to the forums and ask for a potion that will make you invulnerable. Instead adapt your playstyle, or find the in-game items that will help you survive that particular challenge.

porq
07-18-2011, 11:51 AM
No thanks. Not /signed or whatever.


It may be annoying, but it's an another obstacle to overcome. I solo often, and I don't want to degrade the difficulty even more than it already is.



No challenge, no fun.


That being said, options are good. You can tackle negative levels with prevention(silver flame necklace, deathward clickies, using terrain and ranged combat to hide and shoot, etc). Removal options are hireling cleric(they do remove curses and such - not entirely sure if they cast to remove neg levels now) and I'm fairly sure the ddo store sells neg level removal potions now, if you feel that makes your gaming experience more enjoyable.

puget
07-18-2011, 12:02 PM
No thanks. Not /signed or whatever.


It may be annoying, but it's an another obstacle to overcome. I solo often, and I don't want to degrade the difficulty even more than it already is.





That being said, options are good. You can tackle negative levels with prevention(silver flame necklace, deathward clickies, using terrain and ranged combat to hide and shoot, etc). Removal options are hireling cleric(they do remove curses and such - not entirely sure if they cast to remove neg levels now) and I'm fairly sure the ddo store sells neg level removal potions now, if you feel that makes your gaming experience more enjoyable.

I am pretty sure there are at least 4 Favored soul hirelings that have restore for sure, as I use them oftn, and they heal well also. lvl 20 as well if I remember right.

Pretty sure not many clerics have it, or I would use them more often, but I am often wrong.

porq
07-18-2011, 12:15 PM
I am pretty sure there are at least 4 Favored soul hirelings that have restore for sure, as I use them oftn, and they heal well also. lvl 20 as well if I remember right.

Pretty sure not many clerics have it, or I would use them more often, but I am often wrong.
Hireling favored souls too, good point. Not all spells are available for us to command use of, some of them they automatically cast now to remove things like curses or disease. I just don't know if high level divine hires have some form of the Restoration spell and/or if they auto cast to remove negative levels.

puget
07-18-2011, 12:20 PM
Hireling favored souls too, good point. Not all spells are available for us to command use of, some of them they automatically cast now to remove things like curses or disease. I just don't know if high level divine hires have some form of the Restoration spell and/or if they auto cast to remove negative levels.

Not that I have seen with restoration, it would be a great thing to put in instead of searing light, that is the bane of all divine hires in my opinion.

The FVS hires you have to target yourself and then tell them to cast it on you.....But I am not sure on the level 20 FVS, but I feel fairly safe in assuming it is the same.

Frankly my favorite hireling in the game is skein, the level 14 FVS hireling, he casts HEAL, so a couple hundred normal heal to I think my biggest was a tad over 400 on a crit, he has restoration, and if you put him on active, he is a tough arse melee as well, WHILE keeping you healed. He makes about 3 or 5 swings with his Gsword....stop....heal.....repeat.

Love that hireling.

The_Phenx
07-18-2011, 12:22 PM
There are also silver flame trinkets that absorb neg energy,

slimkj
07-18-2011, 02:21 PM
Please don't.

Hoglum
07-18-2011, 03:28 PM
My son and I completed Invaders at level.

...no, wait.

We were only like 2nd level.

redspecter23
07-18-2011, 05:03 PM
My son and I completed Invaders at level.

...no, wait.

We were only like 2nd level.

2 man Invaders completion at level 2? Now that's a screenshot I'd like to see.