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View Full Version : Sorcerer savant + store sp pots = no fun



aggravated
07-15-2011, 09:42 PM
was in a group on my tr. there was a wf air savant in group. pretty nice fella. he mentioned that he had over 300 store bought sp pots. he then proceeded to nuke the entire quest chain. it was very easy yes, but it was increadibly boring for the rest of the group. im not one for tellin folks how to play, but when it starts to affect my enjoyment of the game there is a problem. some will say its my problem and i can choose to not group with these people. i say inturn.. why would u even want a party if thats what u want to do. if u want to solo it, please do so. dont ruin the pugs fun (the group which u the sorc, are leading). nobody is impressed with ur three stacks of pots

HarveyMilk
07-15-2011, 09:49 PM
Aggravated:

I'm on Sarlona, too. (Not that it's relevant)

But, many people like finishing quests asap and are happy to have a nuking sorc chug pots if they wish to use their real life money to further DDO. Just don't quest with him again if you don't like to play with him. Really, that's your answer, as you mentioned in your post.

You could also try making a group yourself and typing the words "no zerging" in your LFM. You could also try static or perma-death group that doesn't use mana pots.

Have fun!

toughguyjoe
07-15-2011, 09:49 PM
If you didn't want to go for the ride, bow out. It's that simple.

Would you have been happier if he put "Going to nuke whole chain, come cheer me on" in his LFM? :D

aggravated
07-15-2011, 09:57 PM
i dont mind zerging or fast xp. i do mind having the fun extracted from the game. yes, as i said before. i could have bowed out, but i dont like quiting. i chased every kill i could get. tried my best to give him a run for his money in the kill count. and ur compleatly right, i could have posted my own lfm but i had already joined.

and yes, if he had posted "im gonna solo it with my monster sp pot stacks, come watch in awe!" i would have not bothered. again, i dont like to quit.

broolthebeast
07-15-2011, 10:04 PM
the sad news is that he actually needed to use the sp pots in the first place. If your using sp pots outside of epic dungeons you might be doing it wrong. :D

Vellrad
07-15-2011, 10:13 PM
Is it going to evolve to next "NERF TEH CASTORS NOW PLAX!!!1!" thread?

/popcorn

azrael4h
07-15-2011, 10:15 PM
Title corrected. Doesn't matter what class, blues bars + store pots = no fun.

Khurse
07-15-2011, 10:20 PM
Again.

If you don't like how someone is playing in a quest ,be it a blue bar consuming pots, a non healing cleric, rogue who won't do traps, zergers,pikers/whatever.
Don't run with them.

If you do decide to run with them, especially more than one adventure, you have very little right to claim they're ruining your fun.

It's really very simple.
Don't continuously run with people whom you're not having fun with.
Don't run a second time with someone who's playstyle annoys you.

Raithe
07-15-2011, 10:23 PM
It's really very simple.
Don't continuously run with people whom you're not having fun with.
Don't run a second time with someone who's playstyle annoys you.

No more savants in my groups then, check.

Oh wait... I am a savant. How do I not run with myself?

aggravated
07-15-2011, 10:23 PM
and we wonder how folks get to shrouding lvls without heavy fort or learning to play there toons. i recall the clr in group asking how to use a scroll. he was 12 or 13ish. its simple really. when u get carried by folks like this u dont have to learn the game. some fresh 17 ftr runs into the middle of prt 4 and gets his grey matter splattered all over the floor in two hits starts cussing about heals but then u my ddo him and find 0 fort and base 10 con. then u ask him why no fort and he says hes never needed it before...

im not sayin this guy is the downfall of ddo obviously. but u cant tell me that this many easy buttons hasnt had some very negative effects on the game.

Khurse
07-15-2011, 10:26 PM
No more savants in my groups then, check.

Oh wait... I am a savant. How do I not run with myself?

Good point, if you find yourself so annoying that you have to come to the forums to complain about it, I must admit I don't know if there is a solution.

aggravated
07-15-2011, 10:29 PM
Is it going to evolve to next "NERF TEH CASTORS NOW PLAX!!!1!" thread?

/popcorn

lol, no. im not in favor of nerfing another class. i have a pure 20 sorc. hes a blast. i just tend to solo with him cause.. why wouldnt u?

so my solution is to not run with sorcs that are savants.. hmm. im sure that will go well

Raithe
07-15-2011, 10:31 PM
Good point, if you find yourself so annoying that you have to come to the forums to complain about it, I must admit I don't know if there is a solution.

The point was that suggesting that we discriminate against other people or classes to avoid being "annoyed" by the game should be a last resort, especially when a particular person might have a character that fits their profiling.

Savants need fixed. Mana conservation needs to be restored. It's really pretty simple to explain why, and the OP expressed it pretty succinctly.

Khurse
07-15-2011, 10:32 PM
and we wonder how folks get to shrouding lvls without heavy fort or learning to play there toons. i recall the clr in group asking how to use a scroll. he was 12 or 13ish. its simple really. when u get carried by folks like this u dont have to learn the game. some fresh 17 ftr runs into the middle of prt 4 and gets his grey matter splattered all over the floor in two hits starts cussing about heals but then u my ddo him and find 0 fort and base 10 con. then u ask him why no fort and he says hes never needed it before...

im not sayin this guy is the downfall of ddo obviously. but u cant tell me that this many easy buttons hasnt had some very negative effects on the game.

Pretty much everything they've done since they went F2P has had an arguable negative consequence on the game.
OTOH if they hadn't gone free to play there's a decent chance the game would be gone now so..

And again, it was your choice to run with them, it was your choice to continue running with them when you realized they were chugging pots.

Just finished a TR run myself, the very few times I ran with someone who's playstyle I didn't like, I stopped runninq quests with them.
Worked out well.

Khurse
07-15-2011, 10:38 PM
The point was that suggesting that we discriminate against other people or classes to avoid being "annoyed" by the game should be a last resort, especially when a particular person might have a character that fits their profiling.

Savants need fixed. Mana conservation needs to be restored. It's really pretty simple to explain why, and the OP expressed it pretty succinctly.


No,
What the OP posted was a suggestion that this Savant was drinking pots.
You know how many players drank pots for the pugs on my recent TR run? None.

I'm saying if you have a problem with a player who's chugging pots, (or zerging/not healing/whatever) stop playing with them.
If you want to rule the kill count, set up a group with someone who can't take it away.

And before you argue it's not about the kill count

i dont mind zerging or fast xp. i do mind having the fun extracted from the game. yes, as i said before. i could have bowed out, but i dont like quiting. i chased every kill i could get. tried my best to give him a run for his money in the kill count. and ur compleatly right, i could have posted my own lfm but i had already joined.

and yes, if he had posted "im gonna solo it with my monster sp pot stacks, come watch in awe!" i would have not bothered. again, i dont like to quit.

It is.

Don't get me wrong- if someone's chugging down pots to blow through low level quests,I think they're an idiot.
But they have every right to do it, just as people have every right to not play with them.

aggravated
07-15-2011, 10:44 PM
If you want to rule the kill count, set up a group with someone who can't take it away.

And before you argue it's not about the kill count


It is.

Don't get me wrong- if someone's chugging down pots to blow through low level quests,I think they're an idiot.
But they have every right to do it, just as people have every right to not play with them.

so i should have piked then? yes, i was tryin to contribute to the group. was i tryin to own it? no. if i want the soul owner ship of everything being done right, i'll solo it. if i wanna be part of a team i'll join a group. lets not bring kill count into it cause that aint the issue. i have no problem with anything else u said though. i should have left if i wasnt having fun.

mournbladereigns
07-15-2011, 10:46 PM
If you didn't want to go for the ride, bow out. It's that simple.

Would you have been happier if he put "Going to nuke whole chain, come cheer me on" in his LFM? :D

Actually I wish I could join more LFM's like that I could uber pike if only there was a reverse DDoor spell (I smell a new store item!), it'd be better than multi-boxing! Think of all the useful stuff I could get done while still leveling:)

insaneuou
07-15-2011, 10:49 PM
This new age sorcs will be nerfered sooner or later in coming days like the rest. Lets have lil patience.

aggravated
07-15-2011, 10:50 PM
Actually I wish I could join more LFM's like that I could uber pike if only there was a reverse DDoor spell (I smell a new store item!), it'd be better than multi-boxing! Think of all the useful stuff I could get done while still leveling:)

lol, i should have ninja afk'ed and made dinner! good call sir

Rydlic
07-15-2011, 10:51 PM
SP pot are the one thing that I think are bad about the store.

Res Cake: I can handle

Healing Pots: ok sure

The sp pot make light of the one major resource (outside of Hit Points) in the game.

/rant
Example:
Vision of Destruction:

During the first round of Orthons both clerics have used 3/4 sp and the sorc had used all of his sp. The Sorc proceeded to refill his bar with sp pots... 4 times over the quest. The clerics also just chugged back to top.

What this taught is how to not do the quest. People were all over the place, no one was handling agro correctly. Just so many things that went wrong that had no reason but were pulled out and not learned from due to pots.

I think store pots should go away. Majors were just fine before and can be again. Make new players think, so what if their lvl 2 Wizard can't Magic Missile the whole quest with Max and Emp going. They need to learn how to manage resources.

/rantend

Beld
07-15-2011, 11:01 PM
SP pot are the one thing that I think are bad about the store.

I think store pots should go away. Majors were just fine before and can be again. Make new players think, so what if their lvl 2 Wizard can't Magic Missile the whole quest with Max and Emp going. They need to learn how to manage resources.



While I agree completely with this sentiment in principle, I don't believe that Turbine, as a business, and in business to make money is going to remove these items.

This leaves us all with the 'effects' of the pots, which is players with less experience getting to higher content without the benefit of understanding the mechanics of the game completely....what the answer to this is, I am not sure.

I also have an Air and Earth Savant, and even without pots, I sometimes burn thru content without thinking about how the others in the group feel about me burning down the quest.

Man, now you have made a post that I will have deep thoughts about....maybe even till tomorrow. On board with store SP pots = no fun tho.

Sydril
07-15-2011, 11:03 PM
When I run with people that blow through stuff that quickly I usually recommend elite quests and higher level quests. Eventually everyone is going to hit the wall and start slowing down, and its usually at that point that groups tighten up and start working together, or wipe and give up.

Either way its more fun in my experience.

aggravated
07-15-2011, 11:06 PM
When I run with people that blow through stuff that quickly I usually recommend elite quests and higher level quests. Eventually everyone is going to hit the wall and start slowing down, and its usually at that point that groups tighten up and start working together, or wipe and give up.

Either way its more fun in my experience.

ahh! that idea has merit! certainly better than " ban sorc from ur group list" +1 to u sir. wish i had thought of that

Rydlic
07-15-2011, 11:13 PM
When I run with people that blow through stuff that quickly I usually recommend elite quests and higher level quests. Eventually everyone is going to hit the wall and start slowing down, and its usually at that point that groups tighten up and start working together, or wipe and give up.

Either way its more fun in my experience.

While agree, what I see is more like a group leader makes a quest for say... Tear..
I get in and say he does not know the quest and asks if anyone does and know how far the shrine is. Say I pipe up and give an estimate.

He say ok, just use pots then if you run out till the shrine, and off he goes.

Me, on my healer, is over looking at my floor trying to figure out how my cat is whacking my jaw. So I pick it up and go, said leader then jumps into battle (on elite) wearing tissue paper and wielding what must be a soup spoon and bragging about how great is ac is and how much damage he does because he never seems to die in quest anymore. I'm thinking ok but unable to talk as I'm dancing the keyboard keeping everyone up.

This really happened, and not just in that quest, There is a belief, and to some an expectation, that if someone has a blue bar that they are going to keep it topped off like the red one. Most players get over this after a few month, but those who are spending another's money on the game take longer.

DoctorWhofan
07-15-2011, 11:17 PM
the sad news is that he actually needed to use the sp pots in the first place. If your using sp pots outside of epic dungeons you might be doing it wrong. :D

This.

Feithlin
07-16-2011, 03:43 AM
Well I almost never use mana pot. I have no problem with ppl who shug pots all the time, but tbh I never met one, or didn't realize if I did. The only problem I would have would be if Turbine were making a quest where you would need to, but this isn't the case yet. It just makes the game easier for them. If I were falling in a group like this, I would enjoy the quick ride, then switch to another group: at least, it doesn't last long, it's a lot worse when you're with a group taking 5 times the normal duration of the quest to complete it...

Silent-Death
07-16-2011, 04:04 AM
While I agree with almost everything posted here, lets take a look at the sorc's point of view.

If he didn't nuke the bajeepers out of the quest, where would his fun be? It's his role to make big numbers. He probably thought he was doing a good job at his role. And the sp pot using is okay, it's part of the game and no one said youre not allowed to use it. Although you have made yout point clear, one of them why not the sorc just solo the quest.

Im noy disagreeing with you, just taking a look at the situation from a different perspective.

testing1234
07-16-2011, 04:10 AM
well the sorc using sp pots was doing a great job nobody can say he didnt pull his own in the quest.
hes playing by the rules turbine added to the game so your issue isnt with him but with turbine adding sp potions to the store

Barium
07-16-2011, 04:16 AM
While I agree with almost everything posted here, lets take a look at the sorc's point of view.

If he didn't nuke the bajeepers out of the quest, where would his fun be? It's his role to make big numbers. He probably thought he was doing a good job at his role. And the sp pot using is okay, it's part of the game and no one said youre not allowed to use it. Although you have made yout point clear, one of them why not the sorc just solo the quest.

Im noy disagreeing with you, just taking a look at the situation from a different perspective.

I agree with you here. Did you ask the nuker to tone it back a bit? I find most times in game that people are very passive aggressive when it comes to expressing things in parties, especially pug parties. You don't know 'til you ask. Simple as that.


Pretty much everything they've done since they went F2P has had an arguable negative consequence on the game.
OTOH if they hadn't gone free to play there's a decent chance the game would be gone now so..

And again, it was your choice to run with them, it was your choice to continue running with them when you realized they were chugging pots.

Just finished a TR run myself, the very few times I ran with someone who's playstyle I didn't like, I stopped runninq quests with them.
Worked out well.

I'm not sure where the idea that the game was faltering financially came from. There seems to be a widespread idea that the server populations were dwindling into non-existence. This simply is not true. I find it more difficult now to find a group to suit the needs of my toons now than ever before. And I play on Khyber, which as everyone should know was the default server for all new players for a very substantial amount of time. Once Turbine was taken over by WB, which I refer to as Umbrella Corp., profitability was examined and the idea of Pay to Win was infused into our beloved DDO systems.

Malky
07-16-2011, 04:22 AM
It's not like i would deny a heavy pot chugger from my group, but imo it brings the light on either a poor playing skill or an e-peen that is worth showing to your local psychologist for studying purpose. Or sometimes both.

Bring those ones in e-cof / e-adq1 and have a laugh counting the pints, i bet your favored barman would chuckle about having such a customer in his establishment :p

Barium
07-16-2011, 04:26 AM
when I Run With People That Blow Through Stuff That Quickly I Usually Recommend Elite Quests And Higher Level Quests. Eventually Everyone Is Going To Hit The Wall And Start Slowing Down, And Its Usually At That Point That Groups Tighten Up And Start Working Together, Or Wipe And Give Up.

Either Way Its More Fun In My Experience.

+1!

twix
07-16-2011, 06:27 AM
People who replace skill and game knowledge with sp pots really erk me ..its one of my pet peaves in this game..
Why people do this when you can just use your brain and a little strategy to get the same results is beyond me.
Guess some people make too much money or just have no lives and spend their money on **** so they can feel they have accomplished something...Its especially funny when they expect their fellow group members to be in awe..

Nothing makes you look more like a tool then chugging sp pots for no reason..I also love the healers who will chug 25 pots just to make it through healing a shroud or something and then pat themselves on the back about how good of a healer they are ..kinda amusing.

Khurse
07-16-2011, 08:12 AM
I'm not sure where the idea that the game was faltering financially came from. There seems to be a widespread idea that the server populations were dwindling into non-existence. This simply is not true. I find it more difficult now to find a group to suit the needs of my toons now than ever before. And I play on Khyber, which as everyone should know was the default server for all new players for a very substantial amount of time. Once Turbine was taken over by WB, which I refer to as Umbrella Corp., profitability was examined and the idea of Pay to Win was infused into our beloved DDO systems.

And here I had thought that the store SP pots were introduced when the game went F2P in 2009. Not when WB bought it in 2010.
Guess I was wrong, and the store in 2009 sold nothing but good intentions. :D

Uska
07-16-2011, 10:18 AM
If someone is dumb enough to buy store pots let them either just take the free xp and loot or drop group and have some fun.