PDA

View Full Version : Monk TR advice please



Felix_the_Rakshasa
04-28-2011, 10:37 AM
Greetings,

I currently have a level 20 halfling light monk I want to TR. I have put some thought into what I want my feat selection and stats to be and would appreciate any advice or obvious blunders I might have missed.

I want to go as much healing amp as "I" am able to get in my play style(only raid I can/have done is Shroud pugs, and never done an epic quest) so all that very nice gear is out of the question. I do have Jidz-Tet'ka, and will be using hand wraps in fire stance.

Human/Lawful Good

str 17 (+5 level ups here)
dex 15 (+2 tome at 7 for I2wf/gtwf)
con 14
int 09 (+1 tome at 3 for skill points)
wis 14
cha 08


1 Past life monk-fu thingie(+1 die step)
1 two weapon fighting (human bonus)
1 stunning fist (monk bonus)
2 toughness (monk bonus)
3 power attack
3 light monk (philosphy)
6 toughness (monk bonus)
6 cleave (shinto prereq)
9 improved two weapon fighting
12 improved critical bludgeoning
15 greater two weapon fighting
18 toughness

total Amp
30% Monk Improved Recovery
30% Human Improved Recovery
25% Jidz-Tet'ka
10% Dragontouched Eldritch Rune (possible with a bit of farming)
20% Dragontouched Tempest Rune (possible with a bit of farming)



On my current monk I have spring attack (and prereqs)and will be losing it on this build. Do you think I will miss it a lot?
Is there something better I could put instead of the level 6 and 18 toughness?
Would this be enough healing amp to actually matter for the loss of AC (coming from a wis/dex halfling build)?



Thanks for your time.

Felix_the_Rakshasa

voodoogroves
04-28-2011, 10:40 AM
You probably don't need 2 toughnesses and I think you could go Half Elf and get some additional AMP there (it's what the solar builds do/did).

Also keep in mind the PASSIVE past life feat is +1 damage ... the ACTIVE feat that requires you to spend a feat on it is the one that increases the die type.

Puppetian
04-28-2011, 10:54 AM
First thing - don't go LG, there's no point. Handwraps don't require alignments and going neutral will significantly reduce incoming damage in some areas.

Second - what's the point of 14 wis? With a +2 tome and a +6 item you'll reach the whopping bonus of +6, which won't raise your dcs high enough for them to matter(36ish). Either put those points into STR/CON or CHA for kukan-do and umd. (Provided you're interested in epics and elite raids)

Third - Active past life feat that increases your unarmed damage can be taken at level 3 at the earliest.

eulogy098
04-28-2011, 11:00 AM
I'm seeing the healing amp build more and more often and I just don't get it.

It's done on builds that are low enough on hp to get 100% filled up with one spell anyhow so what's the point?


I understand healing amp on items, there is almost no sacrifice for it, but with choosing your race and enhancements? It's overkill, your hp will be (relatively) low and so one heal spell will top you off even with 0 healing amp.

Is the idea just to be self healing for soloing? Wouldn't you end up more efficient just trying to kill things faster and then UMD a heal scroll from time to time and then you're less gimppy in groups?

I duno, I just can't for the life of me understand why lowish-hp builds go all out for healing amp.

Felix_the_Rakshasa
04-28-2011, 11:03 AM
I would need to buy the helf to roll that up and it doesn't seem like a huge improvement over a human, but am willing to spend points to buy both(horc/helf) if there is a great arguement for them.

I took into account spending a feat for the die step I get 3 feats at level 1 (human/monk/normal free one)


Honestly I am not 100% sold on the extra toughness, but not sure what else would be good in there. I did think about maybe going skill focus UMD and trying to get my UMD up to teleport scrolls and other useful wands. The problem was that I could only get to +18 (11 in level ups/3 skill focus/3 Golden Cart/+2 charisma bonus) and didn't really give me much.

Felix_the_Rakshasa
04-28-2011, 11:15 AM
Greetings,


I understand healing amp on items, there is almost no sacrifice for it, but with choosing your race and enhancements? It's overkill, your hp will be (relatively) low and so one heal spell will top you off even with 0 healing amp.

Is the idea just to be self healing for soloing? Wouldn't you end up more efficient just trying to kill things faster and then UMD a heal scroll from time to time and then you're less gimppy in groups?

I duno, I just can't for the life of me understand why lowish-hp builds go all out for healing amp.

the Monk healing amp is a choice for Shinto 3 which is more useful IMO than the rise of the pheonix, so that isnt' out of my way at all.

I do solo a lot (considering hireling solo) or small guild groups where we just go with what we have. I don't think i Have the skills (gear as well) to UMD heal scrolls unless i am missing a big something.



First thing - don't go LG,

Second - what's the point of 14 wis? With a +2 tome and a +6 item you'll reach the whopping bonus of +6, which won't raise your dcs high enough for them to matter(36ish). Either put those points into STR/CON or CHA for kukan-do and umd. (Provided you're interested in epics and elite raids)

Third - Active past life feat that increases your unarmed damage can be taken at level 3 at the earliest.

first- good point, thank you
second- True, was thinking more of a more wis=more ac, but if it's not high enough to matter then.. well it doesn't matter!
third- excellent! did not know that, was hoping to boot some head right off the bat!



Thank you for the quick responses! i do appreciate all input!

Felix_the_Rakshasa

Caprice
04-28-2011, 12:13 PM
Since you are building for STR, you might consider Stunning Blow to complement your Stunning Fist and Shintao strikes. Blow has a longer CD timer than Fist (15s vs Fist's 5s) but does not cost ki, and gives you a second active stun ability.

SetofBs
04-28-2011, 12:39 PM
The arguments for half elf:
1. You don't need the human extra feat, and probably not the skills.
2. Human improved recovery 3 is expensive and helfs get up to tier 2 so that difference is minor.
3. Dillies : fighter for stunning fist/blow DCs and +1 str, rogue for 3D6 sneak attack, cleric so you can throw those heal scrolls. All 3 are pretty amazing and do not require a sacrifice in build stats for most monks.

For my light monk (level 13 now) I chose rogue, but so far I take so much aggro in groups and solo so much that I think I made a mistake. Not a big mistake but I think I would chose differently today. I'm hoping my opinion will change at higher levels when the melees aren't so gimpy in PUGs and soloing is less of an option.

SensaiRyu
04-28-2011, 03:23 PM
...
For my light monk (level 13 now) I chose rogue, but so far I take so much aggro in groups and solo so much that I think I made a mistake. Not a big mistake but I think I would chose differently today. I'm hoping my opinion will change at higher levels when the melees aren't so gimpy in PUGs and soloing is less of an option.

I'm maxing Diplomacy to shed aggro. This is helping a lot. In my first life I never used Diplo.
Mine is HElf with Rogue dillys and Dark for the Ninja Spy sneak bonuses and short swords and ToD.

thecreechmmo
04-29-2011, 01:41 AM
First thing - don't go LG, there's no point. Handwraps don't require alignments and going neutral will significantly reduce incoming damage in some areas.

Confusion sets in here. While HW don't *say* they require you to be good to wield, any PG HW say in the Pure Good text on the HW "...and can only be wielded by Good aligned characters."

So confused on two fronts 1) Why you would suggest this when the text of Pure Good trait is opposite to what you are suggesting and 2) that nobody has caught this or corrected this which would lead me to believe that while the text of the PG trait *says* you need to be good, you in fact don't need to be.

Either way, why would you risk it? If you go Lawful Neutral and then can't wield PG HW you are gimping yourself or setting yourself up the need to purchase an alignment change.

But please, correct me if I'm wrong here, I'd love to find out why nobody else has said anything about this.

Kargraz
04-29-2011, 04:09 AM
I have a pair of Force Burst PG handwraps that I can use on my LN monk.

Can provide screenshot when I get home from work if word isn't good enough.

thecreechmmo
04-29-2011, 05:16 AM
Your word is fine, but I'll be reporting this asap to see why it isn't required that you be of Good alignment to wield a Pure Good Handwraps, when the text of Pure Good says that only Good aligned characters may wield them.

ProdigalGuru
04-29-2011, 05:41 AM
I have a Chaotic Neutral character that dual-wields Pure Good swords without a single point invested in UMD.

The trick there is that the swords also have to be True Chaos :)


As for the build, I would advise not locking yourself into something hard to change around when the game changes.

For instance, maybe in the future you want to try out Void IV. This means you have to have 3 of your 4 prime requisites at a natural 16, and the other one at natural 18.

As for the healing amp, people that have never played Light Monk can not really appreciate the subtle power and beauty of near-constant small ticks, 80 point Healing Ki, and 35 point per second Wholeness of Body.

Carpone
04-29-2011, 08:55 AM
Confusion sets in here. While HW don't *say* they require you to be good to wield, any PG HW say in the Pure Good text on the HW "...and can only be wielded by Good aligned characters."

So confused on two fronts 1) Why you would suggest this when the text of Pure Good trait is opposite to what you are suggesting and 2) that nobody has caught this or corrected this which would lead me to believe that while the text of the PG trait *says* you need to be good, you in fact don't need to be.

Either way, why would you risk it? If you go Lawful Neutral and then can't wield PG HW you are gimping yourself or setting yourself up the need to purchase an alignment change.

But please, correct me if I'm wrong here, I'd love to find out why nobody else has said anything about this.
Regardless of what the text states, you do not need to be good aligned, nor use UMD to bypass it, in order to equip Handwraps of Pure Good. It's functioned this way for as long as I've played DDO.

Unless you're going to splash Paladin levels, there is no reason for a monk to be Lawful Good in DDO. In fact, it's a detriment. Many creatures do additional damage against good-aligned targets.

Felix_the_Rakshasa
04-29-2011, 10:27 AM
Greetings,

Thanks you all for your replies, there is a lot of useful information for me to think over.

Right now I am thinking that this would suit me best, any thoughts are always appreciated! I understand how HW of PG doesn't need UMD to use, but that just SCREAMS bug to me and will be fixed in an update or two and I would need/want to alignment change.

Half Elf Lawful Good
str 17
dex 15
con 14
int 09
wis 14
cha 08

1 Two Weapon Fighting
1 Cleric Dilitante
1 Stunning Fist(monk bonus)
2 Toughness (monk bonus)
3 past life
3 Light Monk(Philosophy)
6 Cleave
6 Power Attack (monk bonus)
9 Improved Two Weapon Fighting
12 Improved Critical:bludgeoning
15 Greater Two Weapon Fighting
18 Stunning Blow


+1 int tome at 3
+2 dex tome at 7
Stat level ups into STR


One question I do have is about Heal scrolls being a level 11 Cleric spell and Cleric Dili only bringing you up to level 10. I am guessing there will be about a 5% chance to fail a Heal scroll still, is that correct?

Carpone
04-29-2011, 11:13 AM
I understand how HW of PG doesn't need UMD to use, but that just SCREAMS bug to me and will be fixed in an update or two and I would need/want to alignment change.
Developers have known about for a long time and hasn't been fixed. No reason to think it will get any more attention in the future.

And besides, even if it does change next update and you need an alignment change, then TR. Another monk past life or picking up the paladin past life is useful.

Caprice
04-29-2011, 11:59 AM
For the scroll question, I have not tested exhaustively but my understanding is that it should be 5% due to the one level difference between your effective caster level and the level at which you could cast it. However that will not be until level 15 when you can get dilly 3. You can start using Heal scrolls earlier because your character level is high enough but at steeper penalty to success chance because your effective caster level will be low. For example at character level 10 you can only get dilly 2 for effective caster level 6, at which point you should see a 55% chance on Heal scrolls from the 5 caster level difference.

The handwrap alignment issue has been around for a long time so I do not expect a sudden fix soon. However a few other well-established bugs have been recently (e.g. Monk Light x3 finisher effective level) and crafting could theoretically improve the handwrap selection options, so you may well be right that this could change sooner than expected. Note that there is at least one named handwrap that does still have an alignment/UMD check (e.g. Devotion from Delera's (http://ddowiki.com/page/Devotion_%28handwraps%29)), so going LG is not absolutely useless even now. It does however cause problems at higher levels without much current upside. You seem to understand the implications and not mind so I can't disagree too much with your choice to future-proof yourself.