PDA

View Full Version : Improved/Additional AC Feats



AcesWylde
04-15-2011, 09:46 AM
DODGE [GENERAL]
You are adept at dodging blows.
Prerequisite: Dex 13.
Benefit: During your action, you designate an opponent and receive a +1 dodge bonus to Armor Class against attacks from that opponent. You can select a new opponent on any action.
A condition that makes you lose your Dexterity bonus to Armor Class (if any) also makes you lose dodge bonuses. Also, dodge bonuses stack with each other, unlike most other types of bonuses.
Special: A fighter may select Dodge as one of his fighter bonus feats.
Source: Player’s Handbook, page 93.


Dodge [Passive]
Prerequisite: Dexterity 13+
Benefit: This feat grants +1 dodge bonus to the character's Armor Class.
Suggestion: When fighting defensively, this bonus increases to +2
Special: A fighter may select this feat as one of his fighter bonus feats. A monk may select this feat as one of his martial arts feats.



Fighting Defensively as a Full-Round Action
benefit:You can choose to fight defensively when taking a full attack action. If you do so, you take a -4 penalty on all attacks in a round to gain a +2 dodge bonus to AC for the same round.


Defensive Fighting [Toggled Stance]
Prerequisite: Base attack bonus of +1 or higher
Benefit: This feat reduces the character's attack rolls by 4 but adds 2 to his or her Armor Class.
Special: This is the standard defensive stance and is granted automatically to all characters once they meet the prerequisite. Casting a spell ends this mode.
Suggestion: Allow the Dodge feat to grant an additional +1 to AC while fighting defensively.



COMBAT EXPERTISE [GENERAL]
You are trained at using your combat skill for defense as well as offense.
Prerequisite: Int 13.
Benefit: When you use the attack action or the full attack action in melee, you can take a penalty of as much as -5 on your attack roll and add the same number (+5 or less) as a dodge bonus to your Armor Class. This number may not exceed your base attack bonus. The changes to attack rolls and Armor Class last until your next action.
Normal: A character without the Combat Expertise feat can fight defensively while using the attack or full attack action to take a -4 penalty on attack rolls and gain a +2 dodge bonus to Armor Class.
Special: A fighter may select Combat Expertise as one of his fighter bonus feats.
Source: Player’s Handbook, page 92.


Combat Expertise [Toggled Stance]
Prerequisite: Intelligence 13+
Benefit: While using Combat Expertise mode, you suffer -5 to your attack rolls but gain +5 Armor Class. Spell point costs are doubled while this mode is active.
Note: This feat does not replace the basic Defensive Fighting stance granted automatically to all characters with a BAB of at least +1. However, it is generally better than Defensive Fighting, and only one stance can be active at a time. As of Update 5, Combat Expertise no longer breaks on spellcast or triggering Finishing Moves. Instead, spell point costs are doubled while in the stance.
Suggestion: Reduce spell point cost to +50% instead of doubling, and add 50% to the casting time. Allow the Dodge feat to grant an additional +1 to AC while fighting defensively.
Special: A fighter may select this feat as one of his fighter bonus feats. A monk may select this feat as one of his martial arts feats.



IMPROVED COMBAT EXPERTISE [GENERAL]
You have mastered the art of defense in combat.
Prerequisites: Int 13, Combat Expertise, base attack bonus +6
Benefit: When you use the Combat Expertise feat to improve your Armor Class, the number you subtract from your attack roll and add to you AC can be any number that does not exceed your base attack bonus.
Normal: With Combat Expertise, the number can be no greater than +5.
Special: A fighter may select Improved Combat Expertise as one of his fighter bonus feats.
Source: Complete Warrior, page 100.


Suggestion: I’d rather see this as an enhancement line for fighters and rogues (and maybe halflings) similar to the Power Attack enhancement line.

Improved Combat Expertise I
Your Combat Expertise feat grants 1 additional point to your Armor class but also has an additional -1 to your attack bonus.
Cost: 1 action point
Spent: 11 action points
Requires: Level 4 fighter or rogue, Combat Expertise

Improved Combat Expertise II
Your Combat Expertise feat grants 2 additional point to your Armor class but also has an additional -2 to your attack bonus.
Cost: 2 action points
Spent: 34 action points
Requires: Level 10 fighter or rogue, Improved Combat Expertise I

Improved Combat Expertise III
Your Combat Expertise feat grants 3 additional points to your Armor class but also has an additional -3 to your attack bonus.
Cost: 3 action points
Spent: 57 action points
Requires: Level 16 fighter or rogue, Improved Combat Expertise II

Improved Combat Expertise IV
Your Combat Expertise feat grants 4 additional points to your Armor class but also has an additional -4 to your attack bonus.
Cost: 4 action points
Spent: 74 action points
Requires: Level 20 fighter or rogue, Improved Combat Expertise III



MOBILITY [GENARAL]
You are skilled at dodging opponents and avoiding blows.
Prerequisites: Dex 13, Dodge.
Benefit: You get a +4 dodge bonus to Armor Class against attacks of opportunity caused when you move out of or within a threatened area. A condition that makes you lose your Dexterity bonus to Armor Class (if any) also makes you lose dodge bonuses.
Special: A fighter may select Mobility as one of his fighter bonus feats.
Source: Player’s Handbook, page 98.


Mobility [Passive]
Prerequisite: Dodge
Benefit: Mobility grants a +4 dodge bonus to Armor Class while the character is tumbling. After tumbling the +4 bonus to Armor Class remains until the Character takes an action. Stacks with the Armor Class bonus granted by Monk in Water Stance.
Suggestions: In addition, you gain a +2 dodge bonus vs melee attacks while you are moving, or monsters attacking you from behind don't receive a flanking bonus against you.
Special: A fighter may select Mobility as one of his fighter bonus feats. A monk may select this feat as one of his martial arts feats.



TWO-WEAPON DEFENSE [GENERAL]
Your two-weapon fighting style bolsters your defense as well as your offense.
Prerequisites: Dex 15, Two-Weapon Fighting.
Benefit: When wielding a double weapon or two weapons (not including natural weapons or unarmed strikes), you gain a +1 shield bonus to your AC. See the Two-Weapon Fighting special attack.
When you are fighting defensively or using the total defense action, this shield bonus increases to +2.
Special: A fighter may select Two-Weapon Defense as one of his fighter bonus feats.
Source: Player’s Handbook, page 102.


Two Weapon Defense [Passive]
Prerequisite: Dexterity 15+, Two Weapon Fighting
benefit: Two Weapon Defense grants the character a +1 shield bonus to its Armor Class when fighting with two weapons.
Suggestions: Tempest I grants this feat automatically ( with an additional +1 enhancement bonus?).
Special: A fighter may select this feat as one of his fighter bonus feats.



IMPROVED TWO-WEAPON DEFENSE [GENERAL]
You gain a significant defensive advantage while fighting with two weapons.
[b]Prerequisites: Dex 17, Two-Weapon Defense, Two-Weapon Fighting, base attack +6.
Benefit: When weilding two weapons (not including natural weapons or unarmed strikes), you gain a +2 shield bonus to your AC.
When you are fighting defensively or using the total defense action, this shield bonus increases to +4.
Special: A fighter may select Improved Two-Weapon Defense as one of his fighter bonus feats.
Source: Complete Warrior, page 101.


Improved Two Weapon Defense [Passive]
Prerequisite: Dexterity 17, Two-Weapon Defense, Two-Weapon Fighting, base attack +6.
benefit: Improved Two-Weapon Defense grants the character a +2 shield bonus to its Armor Class when fighting with two weapons. When fighting defensively, this shield bonus increases to +4.
Special: A fighter may select this feat as one of his fighter bonus feats. Tempest II grants this feat automatically (with an additional +1 enhancement bonus?).



GREATER TWO-WEAPON DEFENSE [GENERAL]
When fighting with two weapons, your defenses are extraordinarily strong.
[b]Prerequisites: Dex 19, Improved Two-Weapon Defense, Two-Weapon Defense, Two-Weapon Fighting, base attack +11.
Benefit: When weilding two weapons (not including natural weapons or unarmed strikes), you gain a +3 shield bonus to your AC.
When you are fighting defensively or using the total defense action, this shield bonus increases to +6.
Special: A fighter may select Greater Two-Weapon Defense as one of his fighter bonus feats.
Source: Complete Warrior, page 100.


Greater Two Weapon Defense [Passive]
Prerequisite: Dexterity 19, Improved Two-Weapon Defense, Two-Weapon Defense, Two-Weapon Fighting, base attack +11.
benefit: Greater Two-Weapon Defense grants the character a +3 shield bonus to its Armor Class when fighting with two weapons. When fighting defensively, this shield bonus increases to +6.
Special: A fighter may select this feat as one of his fighter bonus feats. Tempest III grants this feat automatically (with an additional +1 enhancement bonus?).



QUICK STAFF [STYLE]
You have mastered the style of fighting with a quarterstaff, and have learned special maneuvers that complement this unique weapon.
Prerequisite: Combat Expertise, Dodge, Two-Weapon Fighting, Weapon Focus (quarterstaff)
Benefit: When you use Combat Expertise to gain a dodge bonus while wielding a quarterstaff, you gain a dodge bonus 2 points higher than the penalty you take on your attack rolls. For example, if you take a -1 penalty on your attack rolls, you gain a +3 dodge bonus to your AC.
Source: Complete Warrior, page 114.


Quick Staff [Passive]
Prerequisite: Combat Expertise, Dodge, Two-Handed Fighting, Weapon Focus (bludgeoning)
Benefit: You gain a +2 shield bonus to AC when weilding a staff. When fighting defensively, this shield bonus increases to +4.
Special: A fighter may select this feat as one of his fighter bonus feats. Thief-Acrobat II grants this feat automatically?


Thoughts?

grodon9999
04-15-2011, 09:52 AM
We'll never see it because this in no helps half-orc barbarians.

AcesWylde
04-15-2011, 10:15 AM
We'll never see it because this in no helps half-orc barbarians.

me um confoosed by post, me smashum post with big stick

AcesWylde
04-15-2011, 11:20 PM
me smashum thread real good

TheHolyDarkness
04-16-2011, 06:15 PM
I really like the idea of a CE enhancement line. Only critique is that this line would be too limiting were it for fighters and rouges only. Expand its prerequisites to include paladins, monks and rangers as well. Otherwise, the CE enhancement line is one of the best ideas I've ever heard in addressing the complaints concerning AC.

Haven't thought too much about the other stuff, but CE enhancement line = /signed.

~TheHolyDarkness Out~

jennick52
04-16-2011, 06:23 PM
To many large words close together confuses and angers me.

AcesWylde
04-16-2011, 09:18 PM
Me bashum big words with bashum stick




Dodge = +1 AC, +2 defensive


Mobility = +2 (situational), +4 tumbling


Combat Expertise = +5 AC, -5 attack


Improved Combat Expertise = up to +9 AC, -9 attack


Two Weapon Defense = +1 AC, +2 defensive


Improved Two Weapon Defense = +2 AC, +4 defensive


Greater Two Weapon Defense = +3 AC, +6 defensive



Quick Staff = +2 AC, +4 defensive

wonkey
04-18-2011, 03:35 PM
I know this sounds counter-intuitive, but the more they add stuff like this, the more useless AC will be (unless the various bonuses are exclusive from eachother, so are various ways to the same thing, but cannot stack).

The reason AC is so useless is because of the gap between the max you can get, and what most people have. Increasing the max you can get just means to-hit will be boosted to hit a maxed out AC toon once in a while, making it harder to have meaningful AC.

I don't think its possible to reverse the AC power creep, so, as I've said before, my opinion of the best way to make AC viable again, is to increase the to-hit die size (increasing as you level for both toons and monsters) [to, say, a d40 or d50 at leel 20], and balancing monster to-hit and AC accordingly.

suszterpatt
04-18-2011, 04:00 PM
I know this sounds counter-intuitive, but the more they add stuff like this, the more useless AC will be (unless the various bonuses are exclusive from eachother, so are various ways to the same thing, but cannot stack).

The reason AC is so useless is because of the gap between the max you can get, and what most people have. Increasing the max you can get just means to-hit will be boosted to hit a maxed out AC toon once in a while, making it harder to have meaningful AC.

I don't think its possible to reverse the AC power creep, so, as I've said before, my opinion of the best way to make AC viable again, is to increase the to-hit die size (increasing as you level for both toons and monsters) [to, say, a d40 or d50 at leel 20], and balancing monster to-hit and AC accordingly.While your diagnosis is spot on, I disagree with your method of treatment. I'd go the other way, reducing the max attainable AC, probably by making some of the current bonuses non-stacking.

AcesWylde
04-18-2011, 07:06 PM
(unless the various bonuses are exclusive from eachother, so are various ways to the same thing, but cannot stack).

Umm, dude, you do realize that except for dodge bonuses, AC from different sources DON'T stack, don't you?

DODGE BONUSES

Dodge = +1 AC, +2 defensive
The suggested change would only grant +1 more AC, and only when fighting defensively (taking a penalty to hit)

Mobility = +2 (situational), +4 tumbling
situational bonus to a worthless feat

Combat Expertise = +5 AC, -5 attack
as is

Improved Combat Expertise = up to +9 AC, -9 attack
this would allow a fighter or rogue to bump up their AC 4 more points, but with an additional -4 to hit, and spending 10 enhancement points

as they stand now the feats we have would grant a constant +6 dodge bonus to AC fighting defensively, with a -5 penalty to hit, with the suggested changes these feats would grant a constant +11 dodge bonus to AC when fighting defensively, with a -9 to hit, that's +5 more AC, and -4 more to hit. and only if the enhancement line is taken

SHIELD BONUSES

Two Weapon Defense = +1 AC, +2 defensive
Improved Two Weapon Defense = +2 AC, +4 defensive
Greater Two Weapon Defense = +3 AC, +6 defensive

Except for the suggested additional AC while fighting defensively, which is part of the core rules from which DDO is base upon already, Tempests already get these +1 additional, changing them to feats would allow a TWF spec'd Fighter to take them. These feats only grant +2 AC more than a Tempest already gets, and only when fighting defensively (taking a penalty to hit)

Quick Staff = +2 AC, +4 defensive
another shield bonus from blocking with a staff





The reason AC is so useless is because of the gap between the max you can get, and what most people have.

Most of that gap is to to uber gear, this could help close that gap a little for those that actually care about AC, but whatever dude.

Zilta
04-18-2011, 07:10 PM
If I remember correctly, back when there were only four enhancements you could get there was an option for fighters to get improved combat expertise. I always thought they should bring that back.

Zirun
04-18-2011, 07:17 PM
Umm, dude, you do realize that except for dodge bonuses, AC from different sources DON'T stack, don't you?

He means that having so many types of AC (armor, dex, wis, natural, deflection, luck, misc., etc.). What he meant when he said that was to consolidate the AC bonuses so there aren't 15 (or whatever) types of AC that all stack with each other. Reducing it to 6 or 7 would reduce the max AC you can have while also making it easier for people to attain a worthwhile AC.

To the OP, I agree with wonkey. Something needs to be done to reduce the max AC so that it isn't basically worthless for most people.

AcesWylde
04-18-2011, 07:33 PM
He means that having so many types of AC (armor, dex, wis, natural, deflection, luck, misc., etc.). What he meant when he said that was to consolidate the AC bonuses so there aren't 15 (or whatever) types of AC that all stack with each other. Reducing it to 6 or 7 would reduce the max AC you can have while also making it easier for people to attain a worthwhile AC.

The problem seems to be that DDO is based on D&D 3.5 edition rules which work in exactly that way. D&D used different types of bonuses, so you didn't have one single source of AC which all stacked so you wouldn't have an extremely and highly illogical AC, however in PnP, you would have had to reach L30 (demigod) status, before you had the stats and gear some of us have at level 12.