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View Full Version : No more 'gather the whole party' mechanics pls.



Nick_RC
02-17-2011, 03:20 AM
I HATE these mechanics with a passion. Just running diplo immunity and having to get the whole party there is a pain. Its easier to have stragglers just wait outside until that part is done.

Awful mechanics please dont implement them. DA was bad enough to stop zerging this stuff is silly.

N

Krag
02-17-2011, 03:40 AM
/signed

Sucks waiting on strugglers or, God forbid, AFKers.

SirAggravator
02-17-2011, 04:15 AM
You must gather your party before venturing forth! :)

Happened to me once in Misery's Peak. Hireling leeroyed and died near the start and I just left his soulstone. Couldn't complete the quest without going back to grab his soulstone and taking him back to the end room. Also couldn't dismiss the hireling unless they were in range.

Kza
02-17-2011, 04:24 AM
/signed

furbyoats
02-17-2011, 04:29 AM
/signed

doomboy
02-17-2011, 04:37 AM
well, it depends on the member you are leaving behind. wouldn't want to leave out the cleric!

Arkadios
02-17-2011, 04:39 AM
You must gather your party before venturing forth! :)

Happened to me once in Misery's Peak. Hireling leeroyed and died near the start and I just left his soulstone. Couldn't complete the quest without going back to grab his soulstone and taking him back to the end room. Also couldn't dismiss the hireling unless they were in range.

You know you can just dissmiss your hireling by right clicking on it's name on the left of your screen right?


anyway i like the mechanic, stops zerging which by all means is a good thing.

/not signed

CaptainPurge
02-17-2011, 04:42 AM
Kind of like in Ghosts/Perdition? It's mean so people don' LEEROOYYY ahead, but, at that point the players should understand that anyway..

SirAggravator
02-17-2011, 04:46 AM
You know you can just dissmiss your hireling by right clicking on it's name on the left of your screen right?

That's true but only if the hireling is in range. If you're at the end of the dungeon and the hireling is out of range you can't.

Clay
02-17-2011, 04:47 AM
/signed

Nothing like your play time being micromanaged by a DM not even present.

dunklezhan
02-17-2011, 04:47 AM
I can see that sometimes it's necessary for plot purposes:so how about they just put a timer on this sort of mechanic - after one minute the NPC or whatever says 'well, I just can't wait any longer to eat your face, so lets get to it' and then things carry on?

Tumarek
02-17-2011, 05:20 AM
/not signed

If you are in a pug:
-stop zerging and let them have some fun too
-stop pugging if this annoys you

if you are in a guild group:
-whip your guildies into shape... they can do better
-slow down... this is not "need for speed"

Satinavian
02-17-2011, 05:31 AM
well, i do remember some MP run, where someone lagged and we had to wait for auto-DC. Was no fun.

On the other hand, i would not like zerging made even easier as it is.

Krag
02-17-2011, 05:32 AM
/not signed

If you are in a pug:
-stop zerging and let them have some fun too
-stop pugging if this annoys you

if you are in a guild group:
-whip your guildies into shape... they can do better
-slow down... this is not "need for speed"

Not every pug consists of 6 worthless morons behind 6 crippled toons. If you can't keep up and have fun with the zerging party, maybe you shouldn't have joined ZERG/fast run/no handholding/BYOH/etc. group?

donfilibuster
02-17-2011, 05:57 AM
That thing is supposed to prevent pikers from piking misery's peak, etc.
But pikers gonna pike no matter what, and naturally it's a pain if someone goes idle.

Sometimes it's because of quest events, e.g. on the snitch the party must keep up with the NPC halfling for every single fight.

The alternative was to have quests that lock the stragglers out, but then people will get annoyed if someone goes ahead rather than stay behind.
I believe there's more quests that lock you behind than quests where the party must gather up.

CherryHaze
02-17-2011, 06:01 AM
Gues it dipends on how lucky u are ... and I perfectly understaind your though.
It is a real pain in teh behind when I have to wait for everyone to come to the quest, speciali if it takesd the 40 minutes o_O (yes it has happended) ... and in the midle, other people just quit the party becous they dont want to wait for an hour.

Thelmallen
02-17-2011, 06:12 AM
/signed


/not signed

If you are in a pug:
-stop zerging and let them have some fun too
-stop pugging if this annoys you

if you are in a guild group:
-whip your guildies into shape... they can do better
-slow down... this is not "need for speed"

You play your way, I'll play mine. If I want to speed through stuff, that should be my decision, not yours and not the devs.

Jahmin
02-17-2011, 06:20 AM
I HATE these mechanics with a passion. Just running diplo immunity and having to get the whole party there is a pain. Its easier to have stragglers just wait outside until that part is done.

Awful mechanics please dont implement them. DA was bad enough to stop zerging this stuff is silly.

N

/signed

far better to have them log in and out to take take advantage of scaling :rolleyes:

Lorien_the_First_One
02-17-2011, 06:22 AM
This is definately a case of the left and right hand and Turbine not knowing what the other is doing.

They removed that mechanic from WW BECAUSE it was a bad idea in the very same release that they put the mechanic in MP.

It's a bad mechanic, it shouldn't be used.

fuzzy1guy
02-17-2011, 06:25 AM
Gather your party to submit this suggestion to turbine.


/signed

Kmnh
02-17-2011, 06:30 AM
Please, remove these silly mechanics. Why do I need to gather my party near roedric nettle? I'm sure I can deliver the beatings by myself :)

Kreaper
02-17-2011, 06:35 AM
/signed

It happens to me and I run solo. I especially get annoyed in MP when the only missing person is that stupid little rogue they sent to get me.

The funnest part of that quest is seeing if I can shut the door before he gets back!

Sad, I know... :(

voodoogroves
02-17-2011, 06:40 AM
I'm torn.


For one, I have my elite completion time (solo) on that quest on most of my toons down to a respectable number, even hitting the optional chests. I can't do this in a party as it usually burns clock just telling people where to go and what to do. It's just plain easier for me to do the first 70% of the quest and then let others/guildies/etc. in to chase towards the last fight. Removing this mechanic would definitely save me time.

... But it is kinda "cool" and gives the quest a flavor/feeling that others don't have. For that reason, I like it. I accept it's nifty-ness and when I want to run it fast (usually) I solo it.

katana_one
02-17-2011, 06:44 AM
Please, remove these silly mechanics. Why do I need to gather my party near roedric nettle? I'm sure I can deliver the beatings by myself :)

I guess I haven't been playing long enough to understand. Why are you in a group if you want to solo it?

This isn't directed you personally Kmnh, it's to all zergers who PuG. You obviously don't need the rest of the party, you know there will be people who can't keep up and will only make you lose the 10% XP bonus, yet you join the group anyway. I would think this would be just as frustrating for the zergers as it is for the flower sniffers.

Don't get me wrong, I've zerged and had a good time (when everyone was ok with doing it). But if I'm in a group it's because either I need help with the quest, or I want to play *with* a group (as opposed to soloing the quest for an audience of 5).



These "gather the party" mechanics don't really bother me.


P.S.: Not criticizing play styles - play in whatever way you most enjoy, as long as it doesn't negatively impact my fun, and I'll try to do the same for you.

parvo
02-17-2011, 07:00 AM
This is definately a case of the left and right hand and Turbine not knowing what the other is doing.

They removed that mechanic from WW BECAUSE it was a bad idea in the very same release that they put the mechanic in MP.

It's a bad mechanic, it shouldn't be used.

What he said. Why we need this in Misery's Peak, I have no idea...

Dartwick
02-17-2011, 07:03 AM
I agree. Ity make the unexpected piker in your pug a real problem for everyone.

katana_one
02-17-2011, 07:03 AM
What he said. Why we need this in Misery's Peak, I have no idea...

They probably intended to teach new players that they should stick together in a group. /shrug

sirgog
02-17-2011, 07:12 AM
/signed.

Misery's Peak is a boring enough quest without a stupid mechanic forcing you to not accept PUGgers.

I'd like to PUG MP again, just for the occasional laughs, but it seems one run in 5 has some little griefer baby that gets off on wasting other players' time.

Epic Snitch can be bad too - someone gets a phone call that goes much longer than they thought, and it's basically a party wipe.

clkpacker
02-17-2011, 07:39 AM
I like it in some instances. I don't understand why Misery's Peak needs that mechanic, but I think it has value in quests like Diplomatic Impunity--after you talk to the guy above the beach, Droaam forces spawn all over the map. One idiot could cause a wipe by advancing the quest before the party's ready. Quests in which advancing causes a big change to the encounter, I feel the gather mechanic has validity.

darkminstrel
02-17-2011, 07:41 AM
I have to say that I like it. Not only does the function force players to keep up(when they do) it's an excellent tool for me to exclude pikers and slowbies from my future PuGs. Like any tool there's a learning curve, but once you know how to use it you can pick the best zergers out of the herd with it.

/not signed. not even for cookies.

LookingForABentoBox
02-17-2011, 08:58 AM
In most cases it's mostly an inconvenience, but I remember when I was leading an epic Partycrashers and near the end of the quest one of our party members decides to go AFK to eat dinner. We couldn't complete it until he came back, the boss fight doesn't start until all party members are in the last room. Maybe have it that after a certain amount of idle the gather-your-party factor is waived?

Nick;

Diplomatic Impunity!

FlyingTurtle
02-17-2011, 09:59 AM
You must gather your party before venturing forth! :)


You Must Ga- You must Gath - You - Yuyuyuyu - You must gather your party before venturing forth, you must gather your party before venturing forth!!!

*turns into slayer and kills the whole party*

I think they put it in MP because it's a horrific pain of a quest, and they don't want to have people complete it, and then broadcast to the whole of Korthos: "Just finished MP, pop in the entrance and we'll FO together for favor." thus allowing people to basically skip this nightmare of a noob quest.

Memnir
02-17-2011, 10:01 AM
Yes. Agreed. /signed.
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http://i300.photobucket.com/albums/nn12/EnPsyane/mis.jpg
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.
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justplayingthegame
02-17-2011, 10:16 AM
/not signed
if you are in a guild group:
-whip your guildies into shape... they can do better
-slow down... this is not "need for speed"




sez who?
after 2-3-400 runs through the same quests no need to flower sniff.

Cyr
02-17-2011, 10:17 AM
I would be okay with Turbine keeping this if when it happened you only had to wait 30 seconds for the quest to advance regardless of if people were there or not.

sweez
02-17-2011, 10:39 AM
/signed with a passion

Chai
02-17-2011, 10:40 AM
This is a damned if you do, damned if you dont scenario. If you make us gather the entire party, all it takes is one griefer, afker etc to mess everything up. If completion = running to the end, then people who havent learned the quest are 10 rooms behind people who know it, and dont learn anything, while the zergers are back in town getting their end reward.

I dont believe in Turbine having to put quest mechanics into the game to curb peoples poor attitudes toward newbies however.....

azrael4h
02-17-2011, 06:20 PM
/not signed

If you are in a pug:
-stop zerging and let them have some fun too
-stop pugging if this annoys you

if you are in a guild group:
-whip your guildies into shape... they can do better
-slow down... this is not "need for speed"

So I'm zerging when you pretend to go AFK at quest entrance in order to pike a completion?

Maitland
02-17-2011, 06:29 PM
/signed

I hate waiting...

Bluntt

bobbryan2
02-17-2011, 06:39 PM
Everyone needs to get on the same page... and not only not put these in in the future, but also stamp out the ones that exist.

tgun
02-17-2011, 06:43 PM
/not signed

If you are in a pug:
-stop zerging and let them have some fun too
-stop pugging if this annoys you

if you are in a guild group:
-whip your guildies into shape... they can do better
-slow down... this is not "need for speed"

What was that? Sorry, I can't hear you because i'm halfway thru the quest and you are still buffing at the entrance. :)

Cetus
02-17-2011, 06:43 PM
/signed


those of you who use the argument "you don't like it, don't group with people then* fail to understand the fact that situations exist when a buddy of yours needs an afk, you have a latecomer, or are twoboxing. This shouldn't hinder your progress in the quest.




anyway i like the mechanic, stops zerging which by all means is a good thing.

/not signed


No, with the amount of XP we need to cap our TR's, you can go ahead and count every grain of sand between the beginning and end of every quest. However, those of us who are trying to cap, who have ran each quest hundreds of times, are going to zerg to the best of our ability.

Postumus
02-17-2011, 06:44 PM
I've run Diplomatic Immunity about forty times this week with different PUG members each time. The longest I've ever had to wait b/c of this gather mechanic is a minute - maybe two.


The time I had to wait a whole two minutes was so horrible that I actually had to refill my drink. Oh noes!


/not signed.


If 60 seconds of your life is so precious, then run a different quest or just don't pug.

Postumus
02-17-2011, 06:48 PM
/signed

No, with the amount of XP we need to cap our TR's, you can go ahead and count every grain of sand between the beginning and end of every quest. However, those of us who are trying to cap, who have ran each quest hundreds of times, are going to zerg to the best of our ability.


But my TR!! MY TR!!!


I could give a flying monkey bark about your TR.


You chose to climb that xp mountain when you TR'd, so please quit using it as an excuse for why the quests should be changed for everyone else.


XPs/min should never drive this game.

Cetus
02-17-2011, 08:39 PM
But my TR!! MY TR!!!


I could give a flying monkey bark about your TR.


You chose to climb that xp mountain when you TR'd, so please quit using it as an excuse for why the quests should be changed for everyone else.


XPs/min should never drive this game.

Your definition of changing quests includes making it so that people can complete em without being glued to each others behinds?

I'm not going to hold your hand to get through a quest- and forcing your party to come together in order for the quest to proceed is exactly what that is saying.

My decision to TR is the same decision people make whether to zerg, whether to smell the roses, or whether to play the game at all.

bobbryan2
02-17-2011, 08:46 PM
But my TR!! MY TR!!!


I could give a flying monkey bark about your TR.


You chose to climb that xp mountain when you TR'd, so please quit using it as an excuse for why the quests should be changed for everyone else.


XPs/min should never drive this game.

Spoken like someone who hasn't TRed. Be sure to post when you catch up. Cuz none of us can move on with this thread until everyone's gathered.

bobbryan2
02-17-2011, 09:54 PM
anyway i like the mechanic, stops zerging which by all means is a good thing.

/not signed

I don't see how it stops zerging... It makes you wait till everyone catches up to continue on the quest... that's not really the same thing.

sirgog
02-17-2011, 10:11 PM
I would be okay with Turbine keeping this if when it happened you only had to wait 30 seconds for the quest to advance regardless of if people were there or not.

That would be a perfect solution (timer can vary from quest to quest).

Diplomatic Immunity - 2 minutes would be fine. 'Gather your party here. I'll wait up to two minutes for stragglers, I think there could be trouble'. Just like VON4 (although VON4 is not without its problems in this regard).

sirgog
02-17-2011, 10:13 PM
I've run Diplomatic Immunity about forty times this week with different PUG members each time. The longest I've ever had to wait b/c of this gather mechanic is a minute - maybe two.


The time I had to wait a whole two minutes was so horrible that I actually had to refill my drink. Oh noes!


/not signed.


If 60 seconds of your life is so precious, then run a different quest or just don't pug.

Just because you've never had someone go AFK for 15 minutes in Misery's Peak, then come back and turn their character, then go AFK again, doesn't mean it doesn't happen.

GMs should give people a 1 week ban (minimum) for doing that, but they do not.

doubledge
02-17-2011, 10:15 PM
/signed

bobbryan2
02-17-2011, 10:17 PM
That would be a perfect solution (timer can vary from quest to quest).

Diplomatic Immunity - 2 minutes would be fine. 'Gather your party here. I'll wait up to two minutes for stragglers, I think there could be trouble'. Just like VON4 (although VON4 is not without its problems in this regard).

2 minutes is a pretty long time... Takes care of the griefing aspect... but not the annoyance of being slowed down for no reason.

karnokvolrath
02-17-2011, 10:26 PM
Totally agree, this is a horrid mechanic.

Please remove all instances of it.

As far as zerging goes, at this point does zerging really even exsist? I mean, im by no means a zerg demon but doing things fast and efficient is ....like the whole basis of mmo's right? Maybe i just run with differnt folks or something, but our runs are - (goof off, make fun of so and so's mom, enter quest, blast though as quick as possible hitting all exp relevent optionals and chests, complete, grumble about how long this tr is taking) --- repeat

sirgog
02-17-2011, 10:40 PM
2 minutes is a pretty long time... Takes care of the griefing aspect... but not the annoyance of being slowed down for no reason.

2 minutes is IMO suitable for quests where all hell breaks loose after you gather up. 30 seconds would be more appropriate in most cases.

sweez
02-17-2011, 10:41 PM
The longest I've ever had to wait b/c of this gather mechanic is a minute - maybe two.

That's half of a Framework run right there. :p