PDA

View Full Version : War-Forged J u G g eR N a U T



Boromirs
10-15-2010, 07:43 AM
http://fc06.deviantart.net/fs43/f/2009/139/e/9/Warforged_Juggernaut_by_BenWootten.jpg

It is the ultimate killing machine, the coupling of Cannith Industries design and ancient Eberron magic, to see this perfect tornado of destruction on the battlefield is to see art and godliness entwined in a violent orgy of death....

And I would be willing to pay an additional 1200 Turbine Points (ON TOP of normal WF cost) to access this PrE/sub-race line.

Thats right you heard right, over 2000 TPs for WF race AND the PrE-line/sub-race line (1200 TP JUST for a PrE-Line).
Now for 1200 TP's Im expecting almost an entirely new race (not quite but at least heavily modified).

What I would like to see for WF Juggernaut.

+ A newer body style (slightly modified, bigger (obviously), more beefier, far FAR more armoring/spikes, starts with mithril can add admantium)

+ Glyph warded armor (enhancement), spell immunity 28~30, +8 on Fort/Will Saves.

+ +4 strength automatic.

+ 1d8 spike damage...just for touching your opponent (doesn't need to be attacked or attack) ,spikes can be upgraded with elemental or one disintegration guard.

+ Additional compounding +1 to DR & AC & HP each level automatic.

+ All toughness improvements are doubled, can fight while in negative HP.

- CANNOT be healed by divine magic...EVER. Healing augmentation has no effect. You cast heal on a WF juggernaut his HP bar will NOT move EVER.

- CANNOT use ANY wands or scrolls.

- CANNOT use MOST potions (other then the obvious repair pots etc.)

- CANNOT gain HP from rest shrines (without repair skill from someone else)

- CANNOT cast ANY spells.

- CANNOT swim EVER. Must walk on the bottom of the surface.

Awesome! Please give feedback. Thanks!

Gumbolo
10-15-2010, 08:20 AM
What I would like to see for WF Juggernaut.

+ A newer body style (slightly modified, bigger (obviously), more beefier, far FAR more armoring/spikes, starts with mithril can add admantium)

fits nicely as it should be fairly sturdy construct


+ Glyph warded armor (enhancement), spell immunity 28~30, +8 on Fort/Will Saves.

spell resistance* ? Anyway, it should be immune to will and death effects (I think I've readed about such stuff from pnp manual while checking out what kind this pre would be) and that fort boost would be fairly understandable (but pnp? Prolly not)


+ +4 strength automatic.

Horcish boost


+ 1d8 spike damage...just for touching your opponent (doesn't need to be attacked or attack) ,spikes can be upgraded with elemental or one disintegration guard.

Hmm, spike aura? Anyway, 1d8 once a every few seconds wouldn't really affect in the end game, while disintegration guard could work


+ Additional compounding +1 to DR & AC & HP each level automatic.

Dr (uhm, as you suggested it would be fairly huge) and hp increase is fairly understandable, but AC on huge sturdy thing eh?


+ All toughness improvements are doubled, can fight while in negative HP.

Massive hp pool? Nice, but neg hp fightning? Till -10hp or?


- CANNOT be healed by divine magic...EVER. Healing augmentation has no effect. You cast heal on a WF juggernaut his HP bar will NOT move EVER.

Well, this is the reason that only the static group people would benefit from this, but still. You wouldn't get next to never into the raids


- CANNOT use ANY wands or scrolls.

Uhm, I don't really understand why they couldn't do it, but anyway. This would increase even further their penaltys


- CANNOT use MOST potions (other then the obvious repair pots etc.)

Definion "most" sounds bit nasty, would mainly depends what stuff would be left out


- CANNOT gain HP from rest shrines (without repair skill from someone else)

Even more reasons not to be really starter friendly or wanted for partys


- CANNOT cast ANY spells.

So in the end this would be barbarian w/o any reasonable capability to heal up?


- CANNOT swim EVER. Must walk on the bottom of the surface.

would require huge amount of "fixing" maps to be juggernaut friendly (and if you consider juggernaut player base, it would take really long time for devs to fix em).

Overall this would require static group with wizard or sorcerer willing to keep you healed up while giving you absurdly low boost over the normal wf barb as in stats, but far behind in the dmg (juggernaut count as barb pre).

Optimistic_Guardian
10-15-2010, 08:28 AM
Defiantly all for the juggernaut, although this will be a hard thing to balance in game.
Plus what is someone combines this with rage or bladsworn.... some crazy stuff.

Boromirs
10-15-2010, 08:28 AM
fits nicely as it should be fairly sturdy construct

spell resistance* ? Anyway, it should be immune to will and death effects (I think I've readed about such stuff from pnp manual while checking out what kind this pre would be) and that fort boost would be fairly understandable (but pnp? Prolly not)

Horcish boost

Hmm, spike aura? Anyway, 1d8 once a every few seconds wouldn't really affect in the end game, while disintegration guard could work

Dr (uhm, as you suggested it would be fairly huge) and hp increase is fairly understandable, but AC on huge sturdy thing eh?

Massive hp pool? Nice, but neg hp fightning? Till -10hp or?

Well, this is the reason that only the static group people would benefit from this, but still. You wouldn't get next to never into the raids

Uhm, I don't really understand why they couldn't do it, but anyway. This would increase even further their penaltys

Definion "most" sounds bit nasty, would mainly depends what stuff would be left out

Even more reasons not to be really starter friendly or wanted for partys

So in the end this would be barbarian w/o any reasonable capability to heal up?

would require huge amount of "fixing" maps to be juggernaut friendly (and if you consider juggernaut player base, it would take really long time for devs to fix em).

Overall this would require static group with wizard or sorcerer willing to keep you healed up while giving you absurdly low boost over the normal wf barb as in stats, but far behind in the dmg (juggernaut count as barb pre).

Hrm true, I think I gave it too many severe negatives. Perhaps roll back on some of them. AC should be boosted because it represents Armor Class or ability to penetrate armor (not neccesarily evade an attack), so WF jugs get kind of 2 layers of protection, high AC and if penetrated a high DR. Coupled with natural Barb DR and WF admantium body + the 3 enhancement feats...we're talking 40 "standing around" DR.

Lord_WC
10-15-2010, 08:31 AM
Why does an otherwise naked warforged wear a loincloth?

Sorry, only this came to my mind.

Edit: oh yes, one thing:
Ok, he cannot be arcane because of the bulky body (not that i understand it too much, but whatever).
I don't think it makes any sense to restrict him with divine or armored arcane casters.

Cratecrusher
10-15-2010, 08:37 AM
Why does an otherwise naked warforged wear a loincloth?
Fortification (http://compendium.ddo.com/wiki/Item:Bloodknuckle%27s_Loincloth_Waistband) :D

Gumbolo
10-15-2010, 08:45 AM
Hrm true, I think I gave it too many severe negatives. Perhaps roll back on some of them. AC should be boosted because it represents Armor Class or ability to penetrate armor (not neccesarily evade an attack), so WF jugs get kind of 2 layers of protection, high AC and if penetrated a high DR. Coupled with natural Barb DR and WF admantium body + the 3 enhancement feats...we're talking 40 "standing around" DR.

40dr reduces most of normal attacks dmgs, also drs doesn't stack like that =/

Boromirs
10-15-2010, 08:47 AM
40dr reduces most of normal attacks dmgs, also drs doesn't stack like that =/

It will with WF Juggernaut. Barb DR + Jugg DR + Addy body DR + 3 Enhancment DR (the last two stack anyways).

zztophat
10-15-2010, 11:01 AM
http://eberronunlimited.wikidot.com/warforged-juggernaut

From what I've been reading the advantage of juggernaut is the ability to charge headlong at things and or block like a champ.

SINIBYTE
10-15-2010, 11:06 AM
Fortification (http://compendium.ddo.com/wiki/Item:Bloodknuckle%27s_Loincloth_Waistband) :D

win. +1

Zuldar
10-15-2010, 11:15 AM
- CANNOT be healed by divine magic...EVER. Healing augmentation has no effect. You cast heal on a WF juggernaut his HP bar will NOT move EVER.


This right here kills the pre for the same reason so few people take the improved fortification feat. It would only be taken by a few static groups. It would be a waste to spend so much time creating something nobody would use.

A better option would be to gradually reduce the healing amp by say 5% per tier. So a wf without any healer's friend enhancements would get 35% healing, it's pretty bad but at least not completely broken.



- CANNOT cast ANY spells.


This right here also seems a bit unnecessary. It has no real connection to the base prestige class and suffers from the same problem the Bladesworn Transformation and will remove a lot of multiclassing potential from it. At most it should just make spell casting more expensive, in the same manner as combat expertise but with no option to turn off.



- CANNOT swim EVER. Must walk on the bottom of the surface.


Probably also not a good idea since it would hinder any potential quests involving water.


Other then those issues, it still needs a bit of balancing, some parts could be potentially ovepowered. +1 for effort though.

Fetchi
10-15-2010, 11:34 AM
[IMG]
And I would be willing to pay an additional 1200 Turbine Points (ON TOP of normal WF cost) to access this PrE/sub-race line.

PrE's dont cost anything. Why would you want to pay for something that is free? I understand that you are excited about the idea, but let's be realistic.:cool:

zztophat
10-15-2010, 11:38 AM
This right here kills the pre for the same reason so few people take the improved fortification feat. It would only be taken by a few static groups. It would be a waste to spend so much time creating something nobody would use.

-snip-


I have a feeling that the juggernaut will be immune to divine healing because that is what they are in PnP but my guess is that it will be incremental when implemented in DDO, with the third tier removing all diving healing.

It is true that for that reason alone it won't be adopted everyone, at least not to it's fullest extent. However I have a WF wizard12/fighter6/rogue2 that would as I don't use divine healing to begin with.

Boromirs
10-15-2010, 11:42 AM
PrE's dont cost anything. Why would you want to pay for something that is free? I understand that you are excited about the idea, but let's be realistic.:cool:

This isnt exactly a regular PrE, it's really an entire race on it's own. I'm saying that people will pay for PrE's as well as races. What I DON'T WANT is for them to slap on a extra few bonuses here an there and call it a Warforged Juggernaut, I would rather I pay 1200 TP's (or more!) to get a nicely fleshed out PrE. And they can do this for other prestige classes as well, they can start selling prestige class lines!

Fetchi
10-15-2010, 11:49 AM
This isnt exactly a regular PrE, it's really an entire race on it's own. I'm saying that people will pay for PrE's as well as races. What I DON'T WANT is for them to slap on a extra few bonuses here an there and call it a Warforged Juggernaut, I would rather I pay 1200 TP's (or more!) to get a nicely fleshed out PrE. And they can do this for other prestige classes as well, they can start selling prestige class lines!

Well, I hate to burst your bubble, but it is going to be a regular PrE. It was announced a long time ago with all of the other PrEs. So it won't be "special" and require you to pay for it.

Boromirs
10-15-2010, 11:51 AM
Well, I hate to burst your bubble, but it is going to be a regular PrE. It was announced a long time ago with all of the other PrEs. So it won't be "special" and require you to pay for it.

I'd rather that it be a "special" line and I will back this up with $$$...so would many many many others. Don't believe that Turbine will do this? I direct you to update 7 and a little addition called Halforcs.

EyeRekon
10-15-2010, 11:56 AM
And and...

3 WF in the same party can combine to form... Devastator... err. WF Titan!


http://ddo.stratics.com/content/news/images/warforged_titan.jpg


TRANSFORM!

Fetchi
10-15-2010, 12:00 PM
I'd rather that it be a "special" line and I will back this up with $$$...so would many many many others. Don't believe that Turbine will do this? I direct you to update 7 and a little addition called Halforcs.

Don't get me wrong, I would love for them to come out with "special" prestige lines that maybe you could pay for. But juggernaut is not in the cards. Here is the list from Eladrin of PrEs that will eventually come out:


Prestige En (http://i620.photobucket.com/albums/tt283/itsapuzzle/01101010.jpg?t=1243551705)hancements planned over the next few modules are:

Barbarian: Frenzied Berserker, Occult Slayer, Ravager
Bard: Spellsinger, Virtuoso, Warchanter
Cleric: Exorcist of the Silver Flame, Radiant Servant, Warpriest
Favored Soul: Divine Avenger, Beacon of Hope, Angel of Vengeance
Fighter: Kensai, Purple Dragon Knight, Stalwart Defender
Monk: Henshin Mystic, Shintao Monk, Ninja Spy
Paladin: Defender of Siberys, Hunter of the Dead, Knight of the Chalice
Ranger: Arcane Archer, Deepwood Sniper, Tempest
Rogue: Assassin, Mechanic, Thief-Acrobat
Sorcerer: Acolyte of the Skin, Air Savant, Cold Savant, Earth Savant, Fire Savant
Wizard: Archmage, Pale Master, Wild Mage

Human: Cannith Dragonmark Heir, Deneith Dragonmark Heir, Orien Dragonmark Heir, Tharashk Dragonmark Heir
Dwarf: Kundarak Dragonmark Heir, Dwarven Defender [Counts as Fighter]
Elf: Arcane Archer [Counts as Ranger], Phiarlan Dragonmark Heir
Halfling: Jorasco Dragonmark Heir
Warforged: Warforged Juggernaut [Counts as Barbarian]
Drow: Scorpion Wraith [Counts as Rogue]

Half-orc and Half-elf are new races, so it makes sense to charge for them, maybe. But as far as the PrEs go. They are already set, and there will be no charge for the one's that have been announced. I doubt jugger will be any better or "special" than bezerker.

Zuldar
10-15-2010, 12:12 PM
I have a feeling that the juggernaut will be immune to divine healing because that is what they are in PnP but my guess is that it will be incremental when implemented in DDO, with the third tier removing all diving healing.

It is true that for that reason alone it won't be adopted everyone, at least not to it's fullest extent. However I have a WF wizard12/fighter6/rogue2 that would as I don't use divine healing to begin with.

I don't believe they'll make it completely immune to healing, not after the fiasco that is the improved fortification feat. Doing that would be the equivalent of deleting all their hard work. A reduced healing amp is probably the most that will happen, although I wouldn't be entirely surprised if they just leave out the reduced healing.

deathtouch
10-15-2010, 12:22 PM
and And...

3 Wf In The Same Party Can Combine To Form... Devastator... Err. Wf Titan!


http://ddo.stratics.com/content/news/images/warforged_titan.jpg


Transform!

Lmfao!

Boromirs
10-15-2010, 12:49 PM
Well, they are going to need the spike damage thing. Thats a definite, if it's a silly guard type thing (that would be utterly pointless as theres plenty of ways to get guards and an additional 1d8 d10 d12 wouldnt make much difference)..especially if Barbarians forgo Frenzied Berserker.

They will need to be highly defense, a tank in the truest sense of the word. DR is a must, so is AC. They should gain 2~4 strength points. They should be immune to death effects,blindness, all charm, stun effects.

They should still stay below the halforc threshold for damage (because this PrE will directly compete with halforc), and should focus more on defense, TRULY USEABLE Defense (not decorative defense).

They would also require different models to reflect their more construct nature (slightly bigger, armor is beefier, and of course spikes).

dormetheus
10-15-2010, 11:35 PM
Escalating DR (stacking with body dr and feats) for each tier
escalating immunities
escalating guards
Second tier knockdown clicky (charge)
"Immovable object" (no knockdown)

If this is going to be the equivalent of FB3, but on the defensive side, then it needs to be pretty damn buff.

If you ask me, a full on WF Jugg should have 30+ standing DR, more with feat investments.

Their top guards should be about 3-5d6 physical damage.

Also, Juggs should have their own toughness enhance line.

Cratecrusher
10-20-2010, 02:59 AM
win. +1
Thanx :o

Gennerik
10-20-2010, 08:52 AM
For the Healing (De)Amplification, just make it so that each level of the PrE gives a -20% to divine healing sources added on to the WF 50% already. That would mean that at the 3rd tier, you've got a total of -10% (obviously rounded to 0%, but still there to offset Healer's Friend effects), and each line of Healer's Friend would give you 5% divine healing benefit. That kind of gives healer's a little while to get used to it (since you could completely offset the penalty of WF Juggernaut I by Healer's Friend II), and around midgame when you pick up the second level of the PrE, you could also already have Healer's Friend III, so you would still get 35% healing benefit from divine sources.

I think making the immunity more of a tier of effects would give players much more incentive to try the class. Especially since by the end-game, you could still be kept somewhat alive by Mass Heal (with Healer's Friend III and some critical spells) long enough for the caster to realize they need to heal you.

systemstate
10-20-2010, 09:09 AM
And and...

3 WF in the same party can combine to form... Devastator... err. WF Titan!

TRANSFORM!

You forgot the sound effect (http://www.4shared.com/embed/25070714/e8fe9562)!

shortdevils
10-24-2010, 10:57 PM
they should have grease guard!


what...grease is a party buff

Malveon
01-11-2011, 04:36 PM
Wf Jugger lfg, I'm in the market laying by the bridge, can't miss me.

http://i65.photobucket.com/albums/h234/drklord138/Warforgedroadblock.jpg

voodoogroves
01-11-2011, 04:58 PM
Let's not confuse the WF Juggy w/ the Spellcarved Soldier. Both would be hot, but the Juggy needs to be a charging / tripping hulk.

LordPiglet
01-11-2011, 05:04 PM
Fortification (http://compendium.ddo.com/wiki/Item:Bloodknuckle%27s_Loincloth_Waistband) :D

My lord of blades wore one of them for a couple level (swapped to a normal Mod fort belt at 7).

Khanyth
01-12-2011, 09:59 AM
Also, Juggs should have their own toughness enhance line.

They make silicon implants much more duriable so they wouldn't break a long time ago or have been even smarter and replaced them with saline.

Juggs have never been tougher. Much more motorboatable.

EDIT: wait.... are we talking about breasts here?