View Full Version : Need help with a 18/2 wiz rogue halfing

07-18-2010, 08:04 PM
Not having taken a wizard higher than a few levels (and then only following pregen paths), I need help picking skills/feats/spells since I'm not really sure what will be useful at higher levels and what kind of cool synergies one can produce. I only have 28 point builds available at this point (yes I'm a noob) and my starting stats are: STR 10, DEX 10, CON 14, INT 18, WIS 10, CHA 8. I spend my time 50% soloing/ 40% duoing or small groups/ 10% PUGing. I'm looking for a fairly self sufficient build but which will still be useful in groups.

I took rogue at lvl 1 and plan on taking wizard up till I get firewall, then another level of rogue and then finish wizard. I've taken insightful reflexes and I've heard halflings have access to a useful healing dragonmark. I've searched around on the forums, but it seems like all the builds assume you either have more points to start with or are using Drow or Warforged, and so haven't found anything useful. So I'm basically flying by the seat of my pants and could really use some helpful advice from more experienced players.

Many thanks in advance!

07-18-2010, 11:43 PM
oops its a halfling im doing nvm sorry but this work well and try elf to spice it up with arcane archer not drow
i have a nice build goin
id drop dex and wis
put in str and con
must have feats are insightful reflexes toghness
put youre points in int
4 skilles repair(more useful than u think)
disable device and search(with items i can disable epis traps)
ok so youre stats are(no tomes or enchants)(end game)
str 14
dex 8
con 16
int 23
wis 6
cha 6
fort 11
reflex 16
will 8
bab 10(dp clicks help this)(with items im great with melee melee epic stuff)
my search is 51 and dd is 49 no feats (with items)
so ya its goes a long way hope it helps

07-19-2010, 12:06 AM
Stick with your halfling.

Feats for wizard are the metamagic line. Take them with your wizard feats. You really want Empower, Extend, Maximize, Heighten and Quicken. You should also have Spell Penetration and Greater Spell Penetration.

As a wizard you'll lag behind sorcerers for spell points. It is very common to take the Mental Toughness and Improved Mental Toughness feats to help compensate a little bit. Also, take the full line of enhancements to increase spell points. You'll still be behind but not as far behind....

Remaining feats, if you have room for them, are Toughness. Really, you could be alright with just that. But, you'll need Insightful Reflexes for your DEX saves. But, other than that you could get away with just Toughness.

If you really want to be a trap master you could add Skill Focus: Disable Device and Nimblehands.

Hope this is useful.

07-19-2010, 12:15 AM
Skills? Are you going for trapskills or taking rogue just for evasion and other skills? That's the big question.

I forget exactly what level the wizard bonus feats are at, but this is a good feat selection even if you're not going for Pale Master (having a high necro DC helps a lot in Vale - Amrath it probably won't work anyway)

If going for trapskills, taking Nimble Fingers can help you get epic trap DCs without a shroudcrafted item. Take UMD and don't worry about spot - you'll get to know where the boxes are and you can't afford the skillpoints for it. :(

Insightful Reflexes
Nimble Fingers
Skill Focus: UMD
Spell focus: Necromancy
Spell Pen
Greater Spell Focus: Necromancy (or a different Spell Focus if you want)
Greater Spell Pen

To have dragonmarks:

Insightful Reflexes
Least Mark
Lesser Mark
Greater Mark
Spell Pen
Greater Spell Pen

For the wizard bonus feats, you have to take them from a reduced list of wizard-specific feats. The spell pen feats don't count.

Best thing to do is to grab the character planner and build it in there.

Also you will really want a +2 int tome at lvl7 if you are planning on traps. You will need the extra skillpoints badly to spend on things OTHER than trapskills.

07-19-2010, 10:20 AM
The nice thing about the Marks is they're functionally identical to spells, so they benefit from metamagics, items, and any relevant enhs. With the halfling Marks, the Least & Lesser ones benefit from Empower & Maximize for 150% boost; and all three will benefit from Devotion items. [They also benefit from Empower Heal, but as a wizard you can't take that feat.] The tradeoff is they take up 3 feat slots, so you have to give up something else to get them, naturally.

Were I to do a 28-pt Dragonmarked halfling rogue / wizard, it would probably look something like this:

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.5.1
DDO Character Planner Home Page (http://www.rjcyberware.com/DDO)

Level 20 True Neutral Halfling Female
(2 Rogue \ 18 Wizard)
Hit Points: 166
Spell Points: 1172
BAB: 10\10\15\20
Fortitude: 9
Reflex: 16
Will: 11

Starting Feat/Enhancement
Abilities Base Stats Modified Stats
(28 Point) (Level 1) (Level 20)
Strength 12 12
Dexterity 10 10
Constitution 14 14
Intelligence 18 23
Wisdom 8 8
Charisma 8 8

Level 1 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Least Dragonmark of Healing

Level 2 (Wizard)
Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Maximize Spell

Level 3 (Wizard)
Feat: (Selected) Insightful Reflexes

Level 4 (Wizard)

Level 5 (Wizard)

Level 6 (Wizard)
Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Empower Spell
Feat: (Selected) Lesser Dragonmark of Healing

Level 7 (Wizard)

Level 8 (Wizard)

Level 9 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Greater Dragonmark of Healing

Level 10 (Wizard)

Level 11 (Wizard)

Level 12 (Wizard)
Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Extend Spell
Feat: (Selected) Toughness

Level 13 (Wizard)

Level 14 (Wizard)

Level 15 (Wizard)
Feat: (Selected) Quicken Spell

Level 16 (Wizard)

Level 17 (Wizard)
Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Heighten Spell

Level 18 (Wizard)
Feat: (Selected) Spell Penetration

Level 19 (Wizard)

Level 20 (Wizard)

I took Maximize & Empower first mostly to boost your Mark heals; you won't have the SPs to spare to use them on regular spells at low lvls, IMHO. For skills you want max Concentration, UMD, Search & Disable, with any extra skill points spread as you see fit; Open Lock might be a good choice. Mage Armor (or Black Widow Bracers) + Shield + Cat's Grace will provide you with +10 AC; add in a Deflection ring and maybe a Barkskin potion and that will boost your survivability at low levels. Later on, your AC won't matter and you'll rely on buffs like Blur, Displacement, and Stoneskin to keep you alive.

07-19-2010, 05:57 PM
I've downloaded the latest character planner (I assume it includes the update 5 changes) and I'm going to spend some time planning this before I level up again.

Any suggestions for spells. Obviously everyone wants firewall. Are there any other must haves? Any don't bothers? Any cool and unexpected tricks I should be aware of?

Thanks again.

07-19-2010, 06:08 PM
Before you take an odd level of wizard, go to the scroll vendors and inscribe all of the spells from the level you are about to choose from.

This is the easiest way to ensure you only pick spells that cannot be purchased from a vendor.

07-19-2010, 06:18 PM
As a wizard you get to play with spells and pick the ones that you like best for the dungeon that you're entering.
You definitely want haste and firewall.

I like to always have ddoor and teleport.

For damage, apart from firewall you can get as much or more effectiveness out of the acid/elec line and the fire/cold.

I wouldn't take repair as a skill but would load at least one repair spell whenever wandering in a group with a WF. Although you could also hit them with a dragonmark as well.

For skills, I like to eat a +1 tome at 3 and a +2 tome at 7 to go with the level up bonuses.
7sp gets concentrate, disable device, search and umd.

Extras on your second rogue level can fill out umd and add to spot and open lock.

Move silently also helps with invisibility for quickly soloing some quests.

07-22-2010, 09:27 AM
Your comments have all been very helpful and I'm slowly starting to get a better feel for how to build and run this character.

As for tomes, what's the best way for a 3rd lvl character to pick up a +1 tomb. Do you have to run the higher level quests and just hope one drops before leveling up too much? Are there any quests that are more likely to drop tomes? Do you go to the auction house and hope to get lucky? (I'm definitely taking Phidius' suggestion and picking up all the vendor spells I can inscribe, so I may be spending most of my money on that.)

Also, can anyone point me to a good thread that discusses minimum useful skill levels. I'm still deciding what skills I need to focus on and how far I can spread my limited points around.

07-22-2010, 03:59 PM

This thread suggests taking Search & Disable Device, leaving you with nothing else short of Concentration.
Leveling skills mechanics is the following:
It cost 1 skill point to get 1 rank of a class skill &
2 skill points to get 1 rank of a cross-class skill.
If you are NOT multiclass, you can only spend 0.5 point per level for that cross-class. However, if you're Rogue/Wiz, at each Wiz level you are allowed to spend 2 points on the same skill per level to get that +1 rank of rogue skill.

btw, As long you're in a party, a character will have spot or a player will know where the secrets are.

IMO The thread of the shadow wizard is also interesting. it's a pure Wizard with (less) ranks in Stealth.

Halflings are cute, but don't kid yourself: the +1 AC will not make the difference!

have fun

07-22-2010, 04:58 PM
Halfling wiz/rogues are definitely fun to play. I don't have all my stats available but I do know that I started with a 6 STR. I put extra points into Dex and Con. I did take Toughness early, but later on used my free feat swap and swapped it out for Insightful Reflexes. I got tired of failing my reflex saves on traps. I maxed disable device, search, and spot each level. UMD got some love 1st level (rogue), but didn't get a whole lot until I took my 2nd level of rogue at 9th level. The real trick to keeping up the rogue skills is going to be having the max equipment for your level. Finding race-restricted gear will get you higher levels even earlier.

For feats, I took empower, maximize, extend, heighten, quicken, spell pen, greater spell pen, all 3 dragonmarks, insightful reflexes. I am currently sitting at 284 life (includes Minos Legens and GFL item) and 1589 spell points. I did not take mental toughness as I couldn't squeeze it in with the other feats.

At level 20, I can get my disable device up fairly high. I have +15 disable goggles, +3 exceptional int skills on my DT outfit, Ventilated bracers from Reaver's Fate raid which gives me an additional +3 to disable that stacks. My int topped out at a standing 34. That included a +2 int tome, all level ups to int, and all wizard int enhancements. Hope this helps you out a little bit.

07-23-2010, 11:28 AM
As for tomes, what's the best way for a 3rd lvl character to pick up a +1 tomb.
Find a sugar daddy. ;)

Tomes can either drop as quest rewards or be bought from the Auction House or DDO store. The problem for you is the quests which drop +1 tomes are way higher than 3rd level (maybe starting at 7 or 8?) and prices on the AH will be way beyond what a 3rd-lvl newbie is gonna have saved up. Heck, scraping up enough gold to inscribe every scroll will be enough of a challenge. That leaves the DDO Store, and as a F2Per you may be reluctant to pony up some actual dough so soon in your career.

That said, I wouldn't worry about tomes. Yes, having INT tomes right off the bat would give you some extra skill points. But unlike many builds, yours won't actually require one for anything. You'll still have enough skill points to max out your primary skills (Concentration, UMD, Search & Disable), with some left over to spread around to other skills.

11-15-2010, 04:51 PM
I created this character but I didn't know what was suggested for enhancements... I ended up retweaking to remove the dragonmarks and took Archmage PrE instead. Not smart? How would the enhancements look for a norm 18/2 halfling rog/wiz with this build?

11-15-2010, 05:08 PM
As for skills, with the first level in rogue you'll be able to get the max of 4 ranks in just about everything you want. After that, you'll only be able to max out a couple per level when you take wizard levels.

Open Lock can pretty much be left at the base 4 that you grab at first level. Between item boosts, your rogue skill boost (definitely get that enhancement) and the +'s from your thieves tools, you won't need to advance the Open Lock skill at all. The reason being that with picking a lock, you can keep trying until you roll high enough to open the lock. It doesn't quite work that way with trap boxes. Plus, I think it's an Intelligence enhanced skill, so you'll be gaining benefits as you level up in wizard.

11-16-2010, 04:42 AM
So that's in regard to skills - how about enhancements? At level 9 I only have 70 hp... I'm pretty squishy. I changed my feats to allow for Archmage instead of using the dragonmarks? Smart? Not smart? Hopefully the original builder can let in some light on this.

11-23-2010, 08:35 AM
I'm not really an expert on wizards; in particular, my build predates the Archmage PrE, so I don't really have any advice to offer as far as it goes. You're better off looking for advice in the wizard forum.

As for extra HPs, though, you have several options: take Toughness and all available Toughness enhs (if you haven't already); equip the best False Life & +CON items you can find (or self-buff with Bear's Endurance); take a +2 CON tome; get buffed with spells like Aid which provide temporary extra HPs. Also use spells like Blur & Displacement to avoid being hit; and spells like Stoneskin to reduce dmg taken. A permanent DR item like the Golden Greaves (http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s220/jgould2005/DDO/Items/Boots/GoldenGreaves.jpg) (Demon Sands, Chain of Flames, minotaur chest) wouldn't hurt either. And don't forget your energy resistances too and Nightshield to protect against magic missiles. Most of all, though, let someone else draw aggro before you whenever possible! The best defense is letting some other poor schmuck take the hits. :cool: