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Genisto
07-17-2010, 08:23 PM
It could be a good idea to put an attribut on equipments like "Proof Against Poison" or a potion that immune to this kind of spell, especially for solo players because this spell can kill a player too easily in a solo play. I try to beat a level 4 Quest with my Paladin level 7 with a high will power and Light Fortification (25%), and I still get killed by this spell in 2 or 3 secondes (Full HP to empty). Enemies always get critical damage regardless of the damage reduction (DR).

Almost of the time that I have been killed, is by this spell.

There are protections against Death spell, but not for Hold Person.

kaidendager
07-17-2010, 08:25 PM
Freedom of Movement
100% Fortification
Spell Resistance

Elmaster_Thay
07-17-2010, 08:25 PM
Warforged are immune vs paralysis

Xeraphim
07-17-2010, 08:33 PM
Kill the caster first.

FIRST.

The rest, clean up as you go.

Also, Trip and Stun work great on caster types. SPAM RELIGIOUSLY.

badbob117
07-17-2010, 08:34 PM
you should stock up on the Freedom of movement ones " Suulomades cookies". It is a 10 minute potion that wards against hold spells n stuff.

They are awesome for low level!!!

WeaselKing
07-17-2010, 08:34 PM
It could be a good idea to put an attribut on equipments like "Proof Against Poison" or a potion that immune to this kind of spell, especially for solo players because this spell can kill a player too easily in a solo play. I try to beat a level 4 Quest with my Paladin level 7 with a high will power and Light Fortification (25%), and I still get killed by this spell in 2 or 3 secondes (Full HP to empty). Enemies always get critical damage regardless of the damage reduction (DR).

Almost of the time that I have been killed, is by this spell.

There are protections against Death spell, but not for Hold Person.

Freedom of Movement.

Ukenburger
07-17-2010, 08:56 PM
And because sometimes pictures say it better...

http://content.turbine.com/sites/compendium.ddo.com/images/icons/spell/sp_freedomofmovement.png (http://compendium.ddo.com/wiki/Spell:Freedom_of_Movement)

http://content.turbine.com/sites/compendium.ddo.com/images/icons/item/eq_quest_boots_kundarak_delving.png (http://compendium.ddo.com/wiki/Item:Kundarak_Delving_Boots)

http://content.turbine.com/sites/compendium.ddo.com/images/icons/item/eq_potion_suulomades_cookie.png (http://compendium.ddo.com/wiki/Item:Suulomades_Cookie)

http://content.turbine.com/sites/compendium.ddo.com/images/icons/spell/sp_fav_spellresistance.png (http://compendium.ddo.com/wiki/Glossary:Spell_Resistance_%28SR%29)

KKDragonLord
07-17-2010, 09:15 PM
Lol...

these threads against Hold are so cute.

t0r012
07-17-2010, 10:06 PM
jeez and they just completely nerfed mobs hold spells. They last all of what .00235 seconds now?

it was annoying at 30 seconds+ but the silly sort time they last now I'm glad they wasted a spell casting hold now. It circles the melees around me just in time for me to jump over them and kill the casters with out one or two of them on my back.

LoveNeverFails
07-17-2010, 10:12 PM
And because sometimes pictures say it better...

http://content.turbine.com/sites/compendium.ddo.com/images/icons/spell/sp_freedomofmovement.png (http://compendium.ddo.com/wiki/Spell:Freedom_of_Movement)

http://content.turbine.com/sites/compendium.ddo.com/images/icons/item/eq_quest_boots_kundarak_delving.png (http://compendium.ddo.com/wiki/Item:Kundarak_Delving_Boots)

http://content.turbine.com/sites/compendium.ddo.com/images/icons/item/eq_potion_suulomades_cookie.png (http://compendium.ddo.com/wiki/Item:Suulomades_Cookie)

http://content.turbine.com/sites/compendium.ddo.com/images/icons/spell/sp_fav_spellresistance.png (http://compendium.ddo.com/wiki/Glossary:Spell_Resistance_%28SR%29)

+1 for helping the slower people... ;)

urukthemage
07-17-2010, 10:21 PM
I can't remember the last time i was killed by hold person.
It don't last that long,6 secs i think it was.
By the way its not the spell that kills you,its the enemy melee mobs.

heres a few things that may help.
If i recall right hold person is a will save.
Find a item that raises your will save.
get better fort,you can get 75% fort at your level.
freedom of movement.
spell resistance.
if you don't mind remaking and have it...Warforge are immune vs paralysis.
going after the caster first in order to kill them,triping and/or stuning them will make it less likely they will get off a hold person before they die.

You can all ways lure there melee friends away form them.Kill off the melee mobs then kill the caster.Got hold person?Not a big deal all the casters friends are dead.maybe one of these tips will help you.

Gkar
07-17-2010, 10:23 PM
And because sometimes pictures say it better...

http://content.turbine.com/sites/compendium.ddo.com/images/icons/spell/sp_freedomofmovement.png (http://compendium.ddo.com/wiki/Spell:Freedom_of_Movement)

http://content.turbine.com/sites/compendium.ddo.com/images/icons/item/eq_quest_boots_kundarak_delving.png (http://compendium.ddo.com/wiki/Item:Kundarak_Delving_Boots)

http://content.turbine.com/sites/compendium.ddo.com/images/icons/item/eq_potion_suulomades_cookie.png (http://compendium.ddo.com/wiki/Item:Suulomades_Cookie)

http://content.turbine.com/sites/compendium.ddo.com/images/icons/spell/sp_fav_spellresistance.png (http://compendium.ddo.com/wiki/Glossary:Spell_Resistance_%28SR%29)

No picture but...

Having a will save works too.

lazylaz
07-17-2010, 10:30 PM
I say get over it, mate. If we can use it against them then they can use it against us.

Talon_Moonshadow
07-17-2010, 10:32 PM
A lot of soloers choose WF chars for this reason, btw.

But there are alternatives, as mentioned above.

Plus spells have a limited range.....so killing casters at a long distance is possible too.

As well, as taking on things one at a time. The same casters that cast Hold Person seldom melee you. So killing the monsters one at a time, using some pulling method works as well.

It often amazes me that people can solo quests, without learning any kinds of tactics other than rush and melee everything.....and complain when that fails to work.

DaggomaticDwarf
07-17-2010, 10:35 PM
SO his only option is the cookies eh

tunabomber
07-17-2010, 10:39 PM
funny how a new guy with only a lvl 7 char has no clue and gets owned by casters and wants to make another dumb change to the game,go back to wow dude ;)

Gkar
07-17-2010, 10:42 PM
SO his only option is the cookies eh

Or a will save
Or an SR item
Or strategic attack that makes it less likely for him to be hit
Or be WF
Or the Therenal cloak

Orratti
07-17-2010, 10:42 PM
Hold person is the most effective spell used against a low level party's melees. If you became immune to it tactics, as little as there already are, would become non existant.

ProdigalGuru
07-17-2010, 10:44 PM
I remember the first time I got held....

Hokiewa
07-17-2010, 10:49 PM
jeez and they just completely nerfed mobs hold spells. They last all of what .00235 seconds now?

it was annoying at 30 seconds+ but the silly sort time they last now I'm glad they wasted a spell casting hold now. It circles the melees around me just in time for me to jump over them and kill the casters with out one or two of them on my back.

Spot on. If you don't have the HP to last 6 seconds solo, then you shouldn't be soloing.

GeneralDiomedes
07-17-2010, 10:57 PM
hold me ..

Ikem
07-17-2010, 10:58 PM
Delving Boots

nuff said

Xaearth
07-17-2010, 11:00 PM
I know they're cute, but maybe if you quit trying to cuddle with kobold shamans and killed them instead you wouldn't have this problem... :rolleyes:

Orratti
07-17-2010, 11:04 PM
I believe by lvl 7 you can equip a spell resistance 13 item. Next to warforged, drow are very good at not getting held. They are not immune but have natural spell resistance that mostly protects them.

GeneralDiomedes
07-17-2010, 11:04 PM
Look, if anything, I think the casters in this game need a boost. More metamagics on non-Epic, remove the frickin laughable melee attacks from everything except Troll and Ogre casters, speed up the casting animations, improve their targeting. Make the AI learn, i.e. if that force missile just bounced off you, cast something else.

Given almost every spell can be counteracted or highly mitigated in some manner, or is ineffective if it does land, I'm willing to bet 90% of the damage I take is from physical attacks.

Rakian_Knight
07-18-2010, 10:16 AM
Look, if anything, I think the casters in this game need a boost. More metamagics on non-Epic, remove the frickin laughable melee attacks from everything except Troll and Ogre casters, speed up the casting animations, improve their targeting. Make the AI learn, i.e. if that force missile just bounced off you, cast something else.

Given almost every spell can be counteracted or highly mitigated in some manner, or is ineffective if it does land, I'm willing to bet 90% of the damage I take is from physical attacks.

Agreed then every npc caster can be like the players :) SPAM WLLL OF FIRE!!!

Just kidding but casters do need a buff besides lets deal more damage. Maybe making a caster that cast Finger of death once in a while or even wail of the banshee, or Mass Hold Spells for those without FoM or SR. Maybe making necromancer who cast ray of enfeeblement on someone besides the parties caster. Make the AI smarter and the game challenging! (just no skynet)

diamabel
07-18-2010, 10:24 AM
It could be a good idea to put an attribut on equipments like "Proof Against Poison" or a potion that immune to this kind of spell, especially for solo players because this spell can kill a player too easily in a solo play. I try to beat a level 4 Quest with my Paladin level 7 with a high will power and Light Fortification (25%), and I still get killed by this spell in 2 or 3 secondes (Full HP to empty). Enemies always get critical damage regardless of the damage reduction (DR).

Almost of the time that I have been killed, is by this spell.

There are protections against Death spell, but not for Hold Person.


My only advice for a level 7 Paladin would be: Spell Resistance.


A caster will first have to roll to bypass the target's spell resistanbce. If this roll succeeds then the caster has to do the standard roll. This will improve your chances to withstand a hold spell (as well as some other spells).

You can buy belts and armours with spell resistance on the auction house or find it while questing.

Maybe you would like to handle fewer monsters at a time. Mixed groups are very nasty. Seperate the monsters. Use a ranged weapon to pull only a few monsters instead of running into the whole bunch.

The other things the other posters mentioned (items and spells) will not be available to a Paladin at this level, nor the equipment (unless you're twinked).

AyumiAmakusa
07-18-2010, 10:32 AM
It could be a good idea to put an attribut on equipments like "Proof Against Poison" or a potion that immune to this kind of spell, especially for solo players because this spell can kill a player too easily in a solo play. I try to beat a level 4 Quest with my Paladin level 7 with a high will power and Light Fortification (25%), and I still get killed by this spell in 2 or 3 secondes (Full HP to empty). Enemies always get critical damage regardless of the damage reduction (DR).

Almost of the time that I have been killed, is by this spell.

There are protections against Death spell, but not for Hold Person.

No.

Why?

Because, what to stop them from giving us Proof against Cometfall, Proof against Firewall, Proof against Otto's Irresistable Dance, Proof against Trip, Proof against Cleave, Proof against The Easy Button?

However, I will agree with you that Hold Person will completely dominate you at the lower levels so they might want to evaluate the spell a bit.

Missing_Minds
07-18-2010, 10:34 AM
Also, block while you are held.

jmelanie7
07-18-2010, 10:39 AM
The other things the other posters mentioned (items and spells) will not be available to a Paladin at this level, nor the equipment (unless you're twinked).
That's not true. Freedom of movement comes in cookies, all you got to do is turn those shiny festival coins. And moderate fort IS available, for dirt cheap at the AH for lvl 7.

GlorkTheInvader
07-18-2010, 10:42 AM
Lol...

these threads against Hold are so cute.
Cute, yes, but it will probably result in another needless dumbing down of lowbie gameplay. :/

Pugsley
07-19-2010, 12:32 PM
Wouldn't Protection from Evil do the trick? It's a mind-altering effect...

Angelus_dead
07-19-2010, 12:36 PM
Wouldn't Protection from Evil do the trick? It's a mind-altering effect...
Protection From Evil is not defined as giving immunity to "mind-altering" effects. The benefit of Protection From Evil is more specific than that.

In addition, DDO has been known to not follow the stated Protection From Evil rules precisely.

Uska
07-19-2010, 12:40 PM
Get FoM or become a WF that is all that is required we dont need more stuff poluting the loot tables.

Missing_Minds
07-19-2010, 12:50 PM
I believe by lvl 7 you can equip a spell resistance 13 item. Next to warforged, drow are very good at not getting held. They are not immune but have natural spell resistance that mostly protects them.

Forget level 7, try lvl 0 and SR 20.

Scarab of Protection - (Trinket) Spell Resistance (20), Scarab of Protection Ward (12 charges)

Just have to be careful that your local RS or arcane skeletons don't drain it.

parvo
07-19-2010, 12:51 PM
It could be a good idea to put an attribut on equipments like "Proof Against Poison" or a potion that immune to this kind of spell, especially for solo players because this spell can kill a player too easily in a solo play. I try to beat a level 4 Quest with my Paladin level 7 with a high will power and Light Fortification (25%), and I still get killed by this spell in 2 or 3 secondes (Full HP to empty). Enemies always get critical damage regardless of the damage reduction (DR).

Almost of the time that I have been killed, is by this spell.

There are protections against Death spell, but not for Hold Person.

DDO is a complicated game. Although the environment is very easy to progress through, expert players find all kinds of ways to improve their chances. If you are really having trouble in a level four quest with a level seven character, you are simply beyond your capability. If you are smarter than a trained monkey, trust me when I say, some day soon, you'll laugh at how easy this really is. Here's some suggestions:

Hold is a Will save. Boost that save by:
Owls Wisdom (Will is adjusted by Wisdom modifier)
Eagles Splendor (Paladin's also add thier charisma modifier to all saves)
Protection from Evil (adds +2 to your saving throw)
Paladin saving throw enhancements (use a few action points on higher saves)

You could also be a Warforged who aren't persons and therefore immune to Hold Person. Or you could be Drow and pump up your spell resistance which will greatly reduce the chance for being held personed. Both are fine solo paladin classes.

Also try
Casters first (learn to identify and kill casters first)
Quit zerging (slow down, sneak into new areas and get a look at what's there first, try pulling only one or two enemies back from the larger group)
Smite the casters with a two hander (you should be able to often one-hit kill a caster with smite evil)
Boost damage for killing fast (increase your strength and charisma as much as you can, use divine favor + bless)
Trip them (if your first smite doesn't kill it, your second shot should be Trip, kobolds trip very easily)

Another tip (although I rarely get held anymore, this is the way it used to work). You can shield block after being held. It increases your AC and DR. Turn to face your attacker and go into shield block mode. Kinda stupid to work that way, but that's how it worked for a very long time. Can't say for certain if it still does, but try it.

KKDragonLord
07-19-2010, 12:54 PM
I can't imagine how when i was new to the game way before mod 9, ever managed to solo up to lvl 8 quests with just the stuff i got from quests, no dungeon scaling and a PnP Gimp build with 28pts.

patience and tactics matter more than any easy button in the end.

i didn't even need the free awesome stuff they added when Korthos came along.

parvo
07-19-2010, 01:02 PM
Protection From Evil is not defined as giving immunity to "mind-altering" effects. The benefit of Protection From Evil is more specific than that.

In addition, DDO has been known to not follow the stated Protection From Evil rules precisely.

As you know, Protection from Evil used to make the recipient immune to Hold Person. However it was changed a good while back when Turbine re-interpreted the rule on it. I'm in favor of the change. Low level characters can already get enough AC that melee attacks are a joke. Most harbor quests on hard, add fire resist and immunity to hold, and it's absurd.

Folonius
07-19-2010, 01:15 PM
And because sometimes pictures say it better...

http://content.turbine.com/sites/compendium.ddo.com/images/icons/spell/sp_freedomofmovement.png (http://compendium.ddo.com/wiki/Spell:Freedom_of_Movement)

http://content.turbine.com/sites/compendium.ddo.com/images/icons/item/eq_quest_boots_kundarak_delving.png (http://compendium.ddo.com/wiki/Item:Kundarak_Delving_Boots)

http://content.turbine.com/sites/compendium.ddo.com/images/icons/item/eq_potion_suulomades_cookie.png (http://compendium.ddo.com/wiki/Item:Suulomades_Cookie)

http://content.turbine.com/sites/compendium.ddo.com/images/icons/spell/sp_fav_spellresistance.png (http://compendium.ddo.com/wiki/Glossary:Spell_Resistance_%28SR%29)

http://www.westerntrans.com/graphics/praying_hands.gif

http://www.channel4.com/life/microsites/B/bratcamp/images/pointing_finger.gif

http://www.onnyturf.com/subway/images/4.gif

http://media.strategywiki.org/images/0/06/BullyAchievement_HelpingHand.jpg

Genisto
07-22-2010, 12:38 AM
No.

Why?

Because, what to stop them from giving us Proof against Cometfall, Proof against Firewall, Proof against Otto's Irresistable Dance, Proof against Trip, Proof against Cleave, Proof against The Easy Button?

However, I will agree with you that Hold Person will completely dominate you at the lower levels so they might want to evaluate the spell a bit.

#1: Because some spell immunity already exists like: Proof against Poison, Blindness Ward, Death Ward... We don't need to put immunity to damage based spells, because they don't kill the player with full HP in one shot or doesn't paralyse and weaker until death.
#2: Any badlucky player can die from full HP by using any possible strategy.

I have a spell resistance of 13, Will Power of 13, Str of 18, Wis of 14, Cha of 20, an Holy Weapon, Lite Fortitude. I don't have enough cash to purchase an item that absorb any spell effects.

Having more HP doesn't change anything, because it will only give an extra second or two of freezing by the Hold Person spell.

I already know both stategy: killing the caster first or pulling one by one. Almost of the time, I kill the ennemies back of a wall or something that make me invisible from the casters.

What we can do when we get stock in a room where the door close back of us and we don't have time to reach the caster before he cast Hold Person from the other side of the room?

MrCow
07-22-2010, 12:50 AM
What we can do when we get stock in a room where the door close back of us and we don't have time to reach the caster before he cast Hold Person from the other side of the room?


Pray you make your save.
If failing the save, pray you survive the next two seconds so you can make your next save.
Repeat until you are free from the effect to engage in combat or dead.
Learn from the encounter and try to think of things to prevent the situation from reoccurring either later on in the quest or on repeat treks (entering the room in stealth or while invisible, entering the room with a summoned creature for a decoy, activating Paladin Saves Boost, entering with something that increases your movement speed to close the distance faster, recognizing environmental objects for cover in the future, etc.).


Yes, it is painful in gaming when luck can play such a pivotal factor to your success. However, there are so many options to consider that luck can be a minor factor depending on how you match your options with the given situations.

theb
07-22-2010, 12:55 AM
Pray you make your save.
If failing the save, pray you survive the next two seconds so you can make your next save.
Repeat until you are free from the effect to engage in combat or dead.
Learn from the encounter and try to think of things to prevent the situation from reoccurring either later on in the quest or on repeat treks (entering the room in stealth or while invisible, entering the room with a summoned creature for a decoy, activating Paladin Saves Boost, entering with something that increases your movement speed to close the distance faster, recognizing environmental objects for cover in the future, etc.).


You forgot: complain on the forums that hold person should be nerfed because it is too powerful. Justify your position by explaining that you can't solo every quest without a such a nerf, even though as a cleric you can cast the spell.

samthedagger
07-22-2010, 01:00 AM
Freedom of Movement
100% Fortification
Spell Resistance

Really, this thread should have ended here.

h4x0r1f1c
07-22-2010, 02:53 AM
It could be a good idea to put an attribut on equipments like "Proof Against Poison" or a potion that immune to this kind of spell, especially for solo players because this spell can kill a player too easily in a solo play. I try to beat a level 4 Quest with my Paladin level 7 with a high will power and Light Fortification (25%), and I still get killed by this spell in 2 or 3 secondes (Full HP to empty). Enemies always get critical damage regardless of the damage reduction (DR).

Almost of the time that I have been killed, is by this spell.

There are protections against Death spell, but not for Hold Person.

Get your paladin up to 451 HP and he'll be immune to Power Word Stun.

Turn him into an undead and he won't be Danced.

Delacroix21
07-22-2010, 06:34 PM
Whats strange is my capped monk still sometimes gets held (one a 1) in DQ 1 Epic by the Wildmen Shaman. Personally I thought being an outsider made me immune to this spell until I realized that they are casting Hold MONSTER at me, instead of Hold Person, how odd!