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Lord_Winn
06-09-2010, 09:14 AM
I have a lvl 8 wizard ready to level 9. She is also 10K pass the threshold for leveling, but I am having a difficult time assessing the usefulness of the higher level spells. Based on all your experiences, what would you get for a level 3-Level 5 spells.

She already has firewalls and phantasmal killer spells, both are awesome to use.

At level 5, my three picks are "cone of cold", summon monster 4 (elemental) and "hold monster"

At level 4, I already have phantasmal killer, can't think of any good spells for that level

At level 3, I already have fireball, lightning bolts, haste (very useful); should I get "protection from energy" to replace the "resist energy" in level 2?

Please let me know your thoughts. By the way, I'm always confused as far as the inscription materials. How do you know what level of inscription materials you need for each spell you want to inscribe. Is it written on the spell itself? Sometimes I would buy the wrong one and the dang spell just wouldn't inscribe. Thanks for your input.

hecate355
06-09-2010, 09:17 AM
You can try all of em, most spells have their use and are good in different quests, look for forums for spells you can only pick up when levelling, others can be bought and scribed

Dingdongtudelu
06-09-2010, 09:24 AM
There are very few 'best spells' out there, really. It's more what you find most fun to use. I'm sure endgame raiders will tell you of the vital importance of having finger of death, firewall, wail of the banshee, cone of cold and polar ray, but trust me, by the time you get to raiding, you'll likely have all those anyway. Just pick what you think is most fun.

To clear up some confusion though, resist energy and protection from energy have 2 different ways of working, and they stack with eachother. Resist energy subtracts a fixed amount from the incoming damage of the type of element you've selected, protection from energy absorbs the remainder, after the damage has been reduced, to a certain maximum.

For example, having a fire spell hit you for 60 damage, with a 30 "resist energy: fire" on and a 120 "protection from energy: fire", will reduce the 60 by 30 first, then absorb the 30 remaining points of fire damage. You could absorb four similar fire spells this way. If you had only "protection from energy: fire" active, you could absorb 2 of those fire spells, before your protection dropped.

No worries though, this is probably the most common mistake new arcane players make.

KillEveryone
06-09-2010, 09:53 AM
Resist energy subtracts a fixed amount from the incoming damage of the type of element you've selected, protection from energy absorbs the remainder, after the damage has been reduced, to a certain maximum.

Actually, protection will get used first and once that is used up then the resist will kick in.

If you have protect from fire 120 and a resist fire 30, the 120 will get used up before the 30 points of resist kick in and start subtracting from the damage.

Dingdongtudelu
06-09-2010, 09:58 AM
Really? I was certain of the oposite, but I don't use protection from energy all that much. If you're right, I apologize for the misinformation! Can anyone confirm this?

Lord_Winn
06-09-2010, 10:06 AM
There are very few 'best spells' out there, really. It's more what you find most fun to use. I'm sure endgame raiders will tell you of the vital importance of having finger of death, firewall, wail of the banshee, cone of cold and polar ray, but trust me, by the time you get to raiding, you'll likely have all those anyway. Just pick what you think is most fun.

To clear up some confusion though, resist energy and protection from energy have 2 different ways of working, and they stack with eachother. Resist energy subtracts a fixed amount from the incoming damage of the type of element you've selected, protection from energy absorbs the remainder, after the damage has been reduced, to a certain maximum.

For example, having a fire spell hit you for 60 damage, with a 30 "resist energy: fire" on and a 120 "protection from energy: fire", will reduce the 60 by 30 first, then absorb the 30 remaining points of fire damage. You could absorb four similar fire spells this way. If you had only "protection from energy: fire" active, you could absorb 2 of those fire spells, before your protection dropped.

No worries though, this is probably the most common mistake new arcane players make.

Thanks for the vital information. So if they do stack up, why not get both, since they are both in the spellbook.

Montrose
06-09-2010, 10:17 AM
Thanks for the vital information. So if they do stack up, why not get both, since they are both in the spellbook.

Protection is usually a poor mana/mitigation ratio. Wait until you get mass prot (much higher level spell). At that point the mana/mitigation ratio is much better (especially for raids).

Basically, at low level 20 to 30 points of resist should be sufficient for most quests.

FuzzyDuck81
06-09-2010, 11:37 AM
for 3rd level spells Displacement is great, especially at higher levels or with extend (or both) as no matter how good the AC, DR etc. of you & allies are, not getting hit is still the best defence.. buff it before big fights & it'll save your healer a lot of mana & hassle.

cone of cold is a great AoE damage spell & will be a staple of your burst damage in quests, particularly when facing those annoying mephits, fire ellies & fire giants that you'll be seeing a lot more of (house K stuff, stormcleave outpost & others as you get higher)

if you havent got it yet, stoneskin is excellent to reduce incoming physical damage - unfortunately it needs special reagents which are relatively expensive so until you've got more cash together you'll probably have to use it sparingly, however combined with the appropriate prot/resist energy & displacement it'll make a person very durable in the quick & dirty fights

the earth ellie is handy since he draws a lot of aggro and can hold enemies.. however as he draws aggro so easily he may not survive very long (the forthcoming augment summoning feat may make it better but whether its enough to make it viable who knows.. still if it works with the pale master summons too it could be worth taking)

Some other suggestions:
Sleet storm: used tactically, can be very nice indeed in large fights if a divine caster can buff FoM as it'll slow enemies down & blind them, making them vulnerable to sneak attacks - i've seen suggestions of wiz/acrobat characters using it to drastically boost melee dps capabilities
Halt Undead: obviously rather situational, but great in stuff like Deleras etc. & can make quests into a cakewalk
Dimension Door: useful for convenience in quests that require a lot of running around from end to end of the quest area, or if you get lost, or as a great emergency getaway
Fire Shield: halves the damage you take from fire or cold, as well as dealing damage to anyone that hits you in melee - its almost like having evasion for certain spells & traps, and combined with prot/resistance is a very powerful defence.. you can even go diving in lava for short periods if you feel like it, or need to retrieve a soulstone.
Ice Storm: since it does bludgeoning damage as well as cold, its one of the few lower level spells that you can use to directly effect golems
Solid Fog: great crowd control
Prismatic ray: very random but its sweet when u pull off an insta-kill with it

piggiecrdf2
06-09-2010, 11:37 AM
To Lord_Winn:

The best way (esp if you can spare the cash) is to check what scrolls you get buy from vendor, then choose the spells you can't get from vendor when leveling. Portable hole have vendors for most lv1-7 arcane scrolls. Find out what they sell before you level up.

There're a few spells recommanded to take for the levels you suggested though if you really can't afford the cost to scribe all the spells.

Lv3: displacement, rage
Lv4: dimension door, fireshield
Lv5: cloudkill, cone of cold, teleport(if you really can't afford teleport scrolls), protection from elements (before you can get lv7 spells, you get a mass version of this from lv7 spells), which basically casts protection of all 5 elements on you in 1 shot.

If you know good enough what lv that spell is, then you shouldn't have any problem figuring out what lv inscribe materials needed to scribe the scroll of that spell. There's an easy way to tell though. Let's say you have a scroll of waves of exhaustion, the description says no umd check for wiz 13 or sorc 14. Wiz lv13 or sorc lv14 is the min level to aquire lv7 arcane spell (I'm sure you can figure out what's the lowest class level to get certain level of spell). This means the spell 'waves of exhaustion' is a lv7 arcane spell, so you'd need lv7 material to scribe it. Easy enough?


To everyone that concerned about how resist/protection works:

Resist and protection will only be actived once per damage check, and the only the highest leftover will be used. Let me put up an example, including absorptions too. Let's say you have 120 points fire protection, 30points fire resist and fireshield(cold version) on you.

When you get hit by a 200 points fire damage delayed blast fireball, it'll first check to see if you make the reflex save. Let's say this time you fail the save and you don't have improved evasion, you'd need to deal with full 200 points of fire damage. It'll first check if you have fire resist or fire protection. If you have both, it'll check which got higher points. Since your fire protection offers higher numbers, it'll use fire protection, and subtract all 120points. It'll only activate either but not both resist and protection. This leaves you with 80 points of fire damage. Fireshield (cold version) will further absorb 50% damage which leaves 40points of fire damage actually lands on you. Up to this point, fire protection is used up, fire resist and fireshield(cold) remains until the time runs out or dispelled. Next time when a 200 points delayed blast fireball hits you, and if you fail the reflex save again, you'll end up taking [200-30(fire resist)]*(1-50%)=85points of damage. Fire resists kicks in everytime after it, before you cast a fresh, higher points of fire protection on yourself again.

Be aware though, let's say first time you make your reflex save of that delayed blast fireball, which you'd only need to deal with 100 points of fire damage. It'll subtrace 100 points off fire protection and you take 0 damage from that hit. Next time you get hit again, since your fire resist offers a higher number (30 vs 20 from leftover fire prot), it'll use fire resist to do the calculation, but it'll also take away the leftover fire protection even it's not used in the attack.

To sum this up, resist and protection don't stack with each other and only 1 will take effect, fire resist lasts for the time being but offers less protection, while fire protection is much like 1 shot thing to help you avoid taking big damage from 1 hit. It's the situations that for you to decide which to use is the best. Generally if you expect to take a hits of such elements, like 10 mobs spamming fireball on you, it's the best to put on fire resist first. If you expect to take some large number elemental damage, might as well put a protection on yourself to save your squishy butt.

One little trick if you're not very familiar with the quests. You can ask the group before the start. If really no one knows, just cast protection from ELEMENTS (the lv5 spell), and cast resist when you see the need of whichever elemental resist should be used.

vVAnjilaVv
06-09-2010, 11:48 AM
Stoneskin is also a very nice level 4 spell...tho if you can afford it you can just cast it off of wands.

jellyfish21
06-10-2010, 12:42 AM
Every caster should read the appendix of the pen and paper D&D book
The Monster Manual.
Then read spell descriptions, every one for every level, memorized.
Assess each mobs weakness, based on monster type and class.
Apply the correct spell based on their weakness.
Furthering your wizards development, understand the most powerful attack of each monster and class.
Then assess your spell list to counter such an attack.

Good luck.

samthedagger
06-10-2010, 12:49 AM
Every time my wizard has leveled up to an odd level I have chosen the spells that can't be bought by scrolls and bought the rest on scrolls. That way I can toy around with spells a lot and see what works. Is this expensive? Yes. But experience is the best teacher and I've come up with some interesting tactics this way. Not to mention I have some fun spells to toss out when I dive into the PVP pit.

vVAnjilaVv
06-10-2010, 06:38 AM
I have mentioned this a few times in other threads so sorry if people are getting tired of reading it, but the collectible bags the monsters drop in the Necro 1 series can be turned in to sometimes get rare pull only scrolls and inscription materials....they are super easy to farm too.

This is a perk for a brand new wizards who may be tight on plat....as inscription materials tend to be rather expensive.....so are scrolls that can't be bought.

Boldrin
06-10-2010, 06:49 AM
I have a lvl 8 wizard ready to level 9. She is also 10K pass the threshold for leveling, but I am having a difficult time assessing the usefulness of the higher level spells. Based on all your experiences, what would you get for a level 3-Level 5 spells.

She already has firewalls and phantasmal killer spells, both are awesome to use.

At level 5, my three picks are "cone of cold", summon monster 4 (elemental) and "hold monster"

At level 4, I already have phantasmal killer, can't think of any good spells for that level

At level 3, I already have fireball, lightning bolts, haste (very useful); should I get "protection from energy" to replace the "resist energy" in level 2?

Please let me know your thoughts. By the way, I'm always confused as far as the inscription materials. How do you know what level of inscription materials you need for each spell you want to inscribe. Is it written on the spell itself? Sometimes I would buy the wrong one and the dang spell just wouldn't inscribe. Thanks for your input.

Lvl 3 haste, displace, Fireball ,rage

Lvl 4 Firewall(most powerful spell in the game), PK, Dimension door

Lvl 5 Cone of Cold, cloudkill, and teleport or ball lightning

Whatever you do do NOT replace resist energy, very important buff to have.

Rusty_Can
06-10-2010, 07:44 AM
At level 4, I already have phantasmal killer, can't think of any good spells for that level


Actually, lvl 4 spells are often considered quite good and, back when the lvl cap was lower, sorcerers had hard time, having to pick only some of them.

- Wall of Fire: powerful spell, mainly due to dumb AI;
- Phantasmal Killer: first single-target "insta-kill" spell; later on can be replaced by Finger of Death;
- Fire Shield: this spell can save your "squishie" life in many situations (e.g. when some raid-bosses start "fireballing" you; when you decide to take a lava bath and so on ^^);
- Enervation: having hard time landing your PK? Enervate your target; when you get lvl 9 spells, use Energy Drain;
- Dimension Door: utility spell; it allows casters to solo some interesting stuff (e.g. green puzzle in Titan raid);
- Lesser Globe of Invulnerability: utility spell; still useful at high level (e.g. Hound raid);
- Bestow Curse: nice (single-target) debuff; it even works on some raid bosses;
- Solid Fog: used to be a nice AoE debuff; it still affect "trash" foes;
- Crushing Despair: AoE debuff;
- Charm Monster: it provides decent crowd control at low levels;
- Force Missiles: only few foes can resist force spells;
- Stoneskin: decent spell, but you can resort to wands;
- Remove Curse: useful spell, but available via wands, potions, items.

I actually think lvl 4 spells are much more useful than many lvl 5 spells.

Rubiconn
06-10-2010, 07:55 AM
One of the reasons I chose wiz or sorc is the easy ability to change spells and you have access to all arcane spells. Play around with differnt combos, an earlier poster mention bestow curse, enrvation, flesh to stone. In another level or two you will wander out to gianthold and the combo of enervation or drain energy plus flesh to stone will stone giants in their tracks then even a poorly equiped rogue can take em down.
Later when you get FoD the same type of combo will work drain energy or enervate + FoD drops em quick. My wizzy is a lot of fun to play.