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Dylos_Moon
06-03-2010, 05:28 PM
With the new Arcane spells being added in U5, I would love to see Necropolitan added to ddo.

What is a Necropolitan?
A Necropolitan is a type of undead without a level adjustment, or any abilities beyond undead traits, basically it would be Shroud of the Lich/Wraith without the Shroud buff.

Why do we need Necropolitan?
Pale Masters need a way to stay undead, to insure that they get healed by themselves and/or others. Clerics and Favored Souls often get annoyed because there is no way to know when a Wizard is a Pale Master, and when that Pale Master is in an undead form (healers don't spend time looking at a character when they are trying to heal them, they look at the health bar.)

How should Necropolitan be implemented?
I have a few alternatives here,

Implement Necropolitan as a feat, allow any player to take this feat, even warforged (no the template cannot be normally applied to warforged).
Require a player to undergo the Ritual of Crucimigation. This ritual can fail - Note that in pen and paper, this ritual takes 24 hours, and most of the ritual is waiting for the petitioner to die. I think that 2 hours of sitting in a single quest doing almost nothing, but yet requiring the player to be there for some reason would suffice for the 24 hour requirement. After the ritual succeeds or fails, the character in question loses xp, the xp loss should be enough to cause a loss of a level, and 10,000XP more (this should be negative xp, not actual xp loss, much like xp loss for dying under the old system, note that xp regen still exists in the city regen.)
Alternately Necropolitan could be an enhancement, one that requires pale master 1, and locks you out of both shrouds.


Once a player becomes a Necropolitan, their health bar should change colors, if possible, it would also be nice if a pale master in undead form had their health bar change color as well. In addition, the characters skin tone should change, this is already possible as proven by the risia pots.

The advantage of being necropolitan is always being undead, I believe this advantage alone is enough to cover the xp cost of the second option or the feat cost of the first option. The third option may be combined with the others, to make the cost of being undead all the time more severe.

Rakian_Knight
06-03-2010, 07:56 PM
I love the ideas and would gladdly give up both of the Shroud enhancements to get the Necropolitan enhancement. However, the best ideas are the change of the health bar color. Not only does this add to the flavor of the idea in general but it also gives the cleric an idea that you have turned so they can't yell at you if they missed you telling them about it. I've always thought that if they did this it would end up being more like a capstone (giving you a -50% healing like warforged in exchange for the permanent undead effects on top of the +2 int.) but that was my thinking.

Again I would love to see something like this in play since we are getting the new spells. Also another side effect of this might be that the Warforged Wizard becomes less dominant because they aren't the only self healing caster.

Again just my thoughts so don't feel the need to personally bash me.

~Rakian_Knight

Doxmaster
06-04-2010, 05:47 PM
Too OP I say. Any non WF doing this basically becomes a warforged, without the charisma penalty, wisdom penalty and with whatever their race normally gets as a bonus. It's just a time investment, like farming for torq or crafting. On human, it doesnt even really cost a feat.

Making shouds permanent, toggle-able or longer lasting would be much more delicious.

Conversely, a spell that gives some undead traits for a short while, with an expensive material component...say black onyx, would be great. Tenser's Reanimation anyone? Giant glowing spikes take away the cleric's right to rage after not hearing you yell out a million times "Undead form! RAWR!!!!" while you selfheal.

Ganolyn
06-04-2010, 05:57 PM
Oooh, I love Necropolitans! :D


http://www.areyouprepared.com/v/vspfiles/photos/57523-2T.jpg

Devonian
06-04-2010, 06:02 PM
Ah, so served with the Karnath Heavy Vanguard too? I mean I'm all for Dead Mens Shoes as a means of promotion in a high turn over unit, but Host be dammed, they aren't meant to be getting worn by the dead man!

(That is to say, I must admit, I like the idea, and having more, shall we say non-standard healing types will reduce the stigma on them.)

Ashnon
06-04-2010, 06:06 PM
Oooh, I love Necropolitans! :D


http://www.areyouprepared.com/v/vspfiles/photos/57523-2T.jpg

This was my first thought too. Then I realized that I may not like the flavors in a necropolitan.

Ganolyn
06-04-2010, 06:13 PM
This was my first thought too. Then I realized that I may not like the flavors in a necropolitan.

What have you got against Frankenberry, Booberry and Count Chocula besides thousands in dental bills? ;)

Dylos_Moon
06-05-2010, 04:40 AM
Too OP I say. Any non WF doing this basically becomes a warforged, without the charisma penalty, wisdom penalty and with whatever their race normally gets as a bonus. It's just a time investment, like farming for torq or crafting. On human, it doesnt even really cost a feat.

Making shouds permanent, toggle-able or longer lasting would be much more delicious.

Conversely, a spell that gives some undead traits for a short while, with an expensive material component...say black onyx, would be great. Tenser's Reanimation anyone? Giant glowing spikes take away the cleric's right to rage after not hearing you yell out a million times "Undead form! RAWR!!!!" while you selfheal.

I do not feel that it is OP, while it does allow any arcane caster warforged or otherwise to become self healing, it, like warforged, provides them with certain disadvantages, unfortunately a fair deal of these disadvantages are null in DDO, because the shrouds do not suffer from them. The only clear disadvantage of being a player controlled undead in DDO currently would be only having one source of healing, Negative Energy - which in Update 5, is available from both arcane and divine energy - Although all bar Harm are very very limited range.

While I feel that making Shrouds Toggle-able or Permanent would indeed be a more appealing choice to many, I felt that offering a weaker option might get dev attention and become a possibility.

A spell that allows you to become undead are more or less what the shrouds are, but if they had a spell cooldown, that is a cooldown shorter then their duration, they would accomplish the same goal of both my suggested Necropolitan, and your suggested spell.

Rakian_Knight
06-05-2010, 05:21 PM
I don't understand how this would be overpowered so could someone please explain how a pale master casting neg. energy spells and being able to heal themselves would be more overpowered then a warforged sorcerer running around soloing epic raids that everyone is complaining is too hard? Might just be me but I really think that the lack of healing from a cleric/favored soul (even when your out of shroud forms because they don't hear you or you can't type) easily makes pale master a more realistic option instead of the deathtrap that it was/is without the spells.