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Vanhiel
05-20-2010, 12:24 AM
So I want to make a Warforged Bard. Not optimal I know, but that's besides the point.

I'm thinking pure Bard unless there is a compelling reason to multiclass. And I don't have access to 32 point builds but plan on reincarnating once I do have access to them so I can get a bit better stats and whatnot. Might wind up doing it more than once for more stats and the 2nd reincarnated ability.

I'm pretty new to the game and am looking for some suggestions on feats and all that jazz.

Thanks in advance!

BoBoDaClown
05-20-2010, 02:37 AM
So I want to make a Warforged Bard. Not optimal I know, but that's besides the point.

I'm thinking pure Bard unless there is a compelling reason to multiclass. And I don't have access to 32 point builds but plan on reincarnating once I do have access to them so I can get a bit better stats and whatnot. Might wind up doing it more than once for more stats and the 2nd reincarnated ability.

I'm pretty new to the game and am looking for some suggestions on feats and all that jazz.

Thanks in advance!

You could make a good 28 pt Warforge Melee focussed Warchanter.
20 Bard
Str: 18----> level ups
Con: 16
Wis: 8
Cha: 10

Cast Master's Touch to wield TWo Handers.

Feats:
1) Toughness
3) Weapon Focus: SLash
6) Power Attack
9) Extend
12) Improve Crit: Slash
15) Two Handed Fighting
18) IMproved Two Handed FIghting

GhoulsTouch
05-20-2010, 03:16 AM
Multiclassing especially for 28 point builds to get a couple gains for two abilities is a good idea sometimes. And being able to use a Two handed weapon without sacrificing a spell or spell points to do so is another.

Bacab
05-20-2010, 03:45 AM
I currently have a 15BRD/3ROG/2 FTR build that is WF and is a blast to play.

I was thinking about making something EXACTLY like what Bobo sugested. Only difference is, I will not need Imp Crit due to Min II Greataxe.

The 15/3/2 Split will be more "personal damage" while the Pure is more party damage. Also with the pure build you have a better chance to effectively crowd control and heal/buff more due to spell pen and more SP.

So synopsis...

15/3/2 Great melee capability. Good Buffs. Bad Crowd Control.

20 Pure Warchanter Good Melee. Great Buffs. Good Crowd Control.

20 Pure Spellsinger Bad Melee. Great(but different from warchanter) Buffs. Great Crowd Control.

If you want to go Spellsinger...I would not pick Warforged.

Pithrin
05-20-2010, 04:04 AM
I currently have a 15BRD/3ROG/2 FTR build that is WF and is a blast to play.

I was thinking about making something EXACTLY like what Bobo sugested. Only difference is, I will not need Imp Crit due to Min II Greataxe.

The 15/3/2 Split will be more "personal damage" while the Pure is more party damage. Also with the pure build you have a better chance to effectively crowd control and heal/buff more due to spell pen and more SP.

So synopsis...

15/3/2 Great melee capability. Good Buffs. Bad Crowd Control.

20 Pure Warchanter Good Melee. Great Buffs. Good Crowd Control.

20 Pure Spellsinger Bad Melee. Great(but different from warchanter) Buffs. Great Crowd Control.

If you want to go Spellsinger...I would not pick Warforged.

Synopsis. Simple. Solid. Well said. +1

Vanhiel
05-20-2010, 10:19 AM
Thanks for the build BoBo & the simple synopsis Bacab. :D

I only need 10 Chr? Glad I came here first, was going to use a lot more of those points in raising it to 14. lol

And since spellsinger seems more "magic oriented" it wouldn't be my first choice. I'm used to mainly melee buffing and meleeing if the Bard happens to have enough melee skill in whatever game I'm playing.

A questions about feats. I don't see Mithril Body listed. Should I not take that? I figured it would be important to give me the AC of light armor?

And one last question, would going with two weapons over a 2 hander be impractical due to stats and the lower number of feats that Bards get or could I tweak the stats a little and just swap the two feats?

EDIT:: To add what I was thinking and get what you guys think.
Str: 16 + 4 from level ups = 20
Dex: 15 +1 from level up = 16
Con: 14
Int: 8
Wis: 8
Chr: 10

Feats:
1- Mithril Body
3- Two Handed Fighting
6- Toughness
9- Extend Spell
12- Power Attack
15- Improved Crit / Weapon Focus
18- The other from 15 or Oversized TWF

Though after looking at the Warchanter Prestige (I guess it would still be called that) I'll have to switch up when I take the feats. But I'm more looking for if the feats are any good. And are there a II and III to the Warchanter path like other classes have on their paths? And if so are they worth taking as well?

BoBoDaClown
05-20-2010, 02:37 PM
-Don't take mithril body - as a bard your AC won't reach relevant numbers.(I have never played a WF, so let me know if it is needed for another reason).

-RE: cha - cha is affects your spell DCs, UMD, spell points, ability to cast spells and fascinate.

Spell DCs: Yours will be so low anyway, as a melee centred bard, that you won't be able to land offensive spells anyway, so no need to raise charisma for this.

UMD: Extra points for UMD is always useful, especially for a new player who will struggle with gear (in fact Skill Focus: UMD is always a feat option until you are happy with where your UMD is at).

Spell Points: Raising or decreasing your cha doesn't make a huge difference to SP, and your SP is only use for buffing.

Fascinate: is naturally really high anyway - don't really need too much cha.

ABILITY TO CAST SPELLS: this bit is vitally important. You need a charisma of the spell level +10 to be able to cast it at all. i.e. To cast 6th level spells you need a charisma of 16. You could get this by (for example) 6 starting charima, +6 item, +3 tome (not an option for a new player), +1 enhancement,

So, you can see, you could start a WF Warchanter with a cha anywhere from 6-14, but 10 seems a happy medium.


Two Weapon Fighting:
- You need all 3 feats to be more efective than wielding a two hander - i.e. all the way up to greater two weapon fighting (no room for oversized). You won't have enough room, which means splashing fighter levels or dropping Improved Crit.
- On a 28 pt starting build it is harder to spread the stats, because you need a high str, high dex (17 to qualify for GTWF-tomes can be used), high con.
- It is twice as expensive to get good weapons.

Warchanter:
Is really good and really worthwhile. Get those two feats - Power Attack (awesome feat), and Weapon Focus in early, so you can grab warchanter at 6.

Personally, on a 28pt pure Warchanter, for a new player, I would go THF, and be happy with it.

Vanhiel
05-21-2010, 12:14 AM
Thanks for the reply explaining everything BoBo.

I'll give it a go with THF tomorrow. I started a FVS tonight and am currently loving it, but I need a character to play with my buddy who doesn't play quite as much as I do and a Bard seems like a good one to use since they can do a bit of a lot of things to to keep a duo going and will be a good asset to a group when we need more people.

oweieie
05-21-2010, 10:39 AM
Mithril or body is fine at low level. Remember you get a free feat swap and feat swaps are pretty cheap regardless before level 13. Mithril or adamantine body will make things pretty easy for you until level 8 or so when your lack of shield starts to hurt your AC enough to not be stopping as much for you.

1st level of two handed fighting is pretty useless, power attack earlier is better.

sumnz
06-09-2010, 01:09 AM
What Im currently leveling up, hoping for a carnifex soon. Fun class, but I wish I knew more about the 15 bard/3rogue/2 fighter type builds. I want something that does ok buffing, but really kicks the shiz out of stuff too.

BoBoDaClown
06-09-2010, 02:08 AM
What Im currently leveling up, hoping for a carnifex soon. Fun class, but I wish I knew more about the 15 bard/3rogue/2 fighter type builds. I want something that does ok buffing, but really kicks the shiz out of stuff too.

What do you want to know about them?

16/2/2 Good dps, evasion, survivability -> can build in traps with some sacrifice to int. Still have otto's irresistible and MCMW.

15/3/2 Good dps (fractionally better), -> can build in traps with very little sacrifice to int, loses those two spells.

People normally build for twf, but THF can work and is certainly a lot easier on a 28pt build.

Rough guide (32pts):
Stats:
16-18 Str - levels ups here. I would try to get to maximum.
15 Dex if you can get a +2 tome - or 16 with a +1 tome
Con: at least 14
Cha: Anywhere from 6-12 depending on how comfortable you are with min cha for spell levels and getting a decent UMD. Personally I would start with minimum.
Int will be required if you want to do traps.

Assuming you want a TWF build (otherwise dump some of the dex):
Feats to choose from:
Toughness
Weapon Focus
Power Attack
Extend
Two Weapon Fighting
Improved TWo Weapon FIghting
Greater Two Weapon Fighting
Improved Critical
Khopesh

The above are in no order - you can grab them all assuming two fighter levels on a non-Human. On a human you might want Maximise (or Empower Healing) or OTWF for your extra feat.

Humans: Adaptability, Versatility, extra feat, healing
Halflings: Sneak Attacks, Heroes' Companion. -1 to dam from str. Easier to hit 17dex.
Dwarves: Good Hp, Dwarven Axes.
Warforge: Lots of hp. Prob THF. Immunities. DIfficulty healing via sp.
Elf: Scimmy. Easier to hit 17dex, hard on the con.
Drow: Hard on con and str. Easier to hit 17dex. Rapier enhancements.

Humperdink
06-09-2010, 05:23 AM
So I want to make a Warforged Bard.
Thanks in advance!

-Taking all 4 tiers of Wand/Scroll mastery allows you to wand whip yourself for 45-55 points or so each from a repair critical wand

-Work to get at least a 39 UMD so you can cast Reconstruct scrolls for 195 points

-Spend one action point on the Warforged Inscribed Armor I enhancement to remove the 5% Arcane Spell Failure on non-bard scrolls and wands