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View Full Version : Why Robes instead of LA ?



VanHalen72
05-09-2010, 06:31 AM
Im a casual DDO player and have never played D&D tabletop. So im not that familiar with all of the rules.

Thing is, I dont get the point about wearing a robe or an outfit as a ranger, as often advised in the forums.

As I understand, i would always wear the "biggest" light armor with highest possible AC, + Dex Bonus.

Im Lvl 13 now, doin the Arcane Archer path. My stats:

http://my.ddo.com/character/cannith/aranel

Im soon Lvl 14, and therefore ive bought me a +5 Lesser Lightning Guard Mithral Chain Shirt of Hammerblock.

Dont ask me if this gear makes any sense, I bought it over the time without thinking too much about it.

Im normaly playing with my mates, doin the pure ranger and attacking from the back. But sometimes I have to be the 2nd tank and with 25AC its not that easy.

Tx for advise guys.

Visty
05-09-2010, 06:33 AM
robes get advised because if you cant reach certain ac threshholds at certain levels you can also forget about it. and robes can be swapped fast for various effects like deathblock, greater elemental resists, DR, whatever

at 13 you should aim at 40-45. anything lower means robes

Beherit_Baphomar
05-09-2010, 06:37 AM
LA caps your DEX bonus to AC. So robes/outfit + AC bracers gives you more AC than you'll ever get from LA.

And Icy Raiments only come in outfit.

VanHalen72
05-10-2010, 03:22 AM
No I get it, tx guys.

So 32 AC, with barskin, means - go for robe + bracer.

But Robes have no AC, correct ? Just enhancements.

That means, to reach 45 AC I need a lot more AC-Stuff than just +5/+6 bracers.

Maldavenous
05-10-2010, 04:00 AM
Robes have no maximum dexterity bonus. So if you have a very high dexterity score you'll actually get more armor than most armor can provide just from your DEX bonus.

However, what really makes it is the fact that you can get Bracers that add up to 8 to your armor class. 8 AC is better than a lot of +5 light armor can do.

Now you combine your 8 AC with the fact that your Robe has no Max Dex Bonus to get a really nice AC. Also this means you can wear an Icy Raiment which is a 4 Dodge bonus to AC.

Another great bonus to robes is that they have no time to equip unlike armor. This means you can swap from one robe to another mid-combat without any issues or real slow down.

grodon9999
05-10-2010, 10:20 AM
That means, to reach 45 AC I need a lot more AC-Stuff than just +5/+6 bracers.

Correct, it's a matter of getting stuff that stacks. Prot cloak, Icy raiments give you dodge AC, Tempest III gives you 4 for shield.

Below's a breakdown of the "Exploiter's" AC with what type each bonus is:

AC
10 Base
1 Dodge feat (Feat)
4 Icy Raiments Dodge (DODGE)
1 Alchemical Dodge (DODGE)
3 Chattering Ring Dodge (DODGE)
8 Dexterity (DEX)
6 Wisdom (Wisdom - Monk Only)
4 Insight (Shroud Crafted) (Insight)
5 Protection (Deflection)
5 Barkskin (Natural)
8 Armor Bracers (Armor)
4 Tempest III (Shield)
5 Combat Expertise (Feat)

64 (Self Buffed in AC Mode)

All feat and dodge bonuses stack, others do not. If you were wearing both a cloak and a ring of protection the two DEFLECTION bonuses would not stack, you'd get the higher of the two.

Phidius
05-10-2010, 10:29 AM
Rangers that care about AC usually have at least one level of monk for the Wisdom bonus to AC which works with robes but not light armor.

arminius
05-10-2010, 10:51 AM
Are robes still advised for Strength-based Rangers that never see Dexterity above 26-28-30?

I had planned on getting Dragontouched something, but I don't like the outfit's drapey look (plus so many people have it), or the robe's look on anyone but a spell caster. That just leaves leather (bc the breastplate isn't mithril), which I don't know what it looks like but I really can't get too enthused about.

ArichValtrahn
05-10-2010, 10:57 AM
Are robes still advised for Strength-based Rangers that never see Dexterity above 26-28-30?

Just run the numbers. Compare the armor bonus on your armor to the armor bonus you get from dex+wis (/monk)+armor bonus (bracers, generally).


All feat and dodge bonuses stack, others do not.

Not to nit-pick, but I thought only dodge bonuses of differing amounts stack. Ie +1, +3, +4 all stack but if you had 2 +3 bonuses, they do not stack. (IE icy and chattering)

Right?

Drakos
05-10-2010, 10:58 AM
No I get it, tx guys.

So 32 AC, with barskin, means - go for robe + bracer.

But Robes have no AC, correct ? Just enhancements.

That means, to reach 45 AC I need a lot more AC-Stuff than just +5/+6 bracers.
I have actually seen robes that do provide an armor bonus (Valroon Dervish I think). But the main issue is the capping of your dex bonus to AC. If you have a sufficiently high DEX bonus you are better off going for non-armor based armor bonus items like barcers or the robes above, because robes/outfits allow for your full DEX to ac.

Example: the +5 Mithral Chain shirt will grant you 9 armor and Max Dex Bonus of +6. so your looking at +15 AC total from it. Now if you have a DEX of 28, which normally would allow +9, you are loosing 3 from your potential because of the cap. This same person could where Armor Bracers +8 and gain their full dex +9 for a total ac bonus of +17, two higher than the Mithril chain shirt. The could have as low as a 24 DEX and still tie the Chain Shirt, or have AC6 barcers.

Now add to this that alot of Ranger Builds are splashing monk to get the Wis bonus to AC as well, they only get that if unarmored (rode/outfits). Addmittedly, you may not be splashing Monk but several popular Ranger builds do.

VanHalen72
05-10-2010, 12:20 PM
Pretty good guys, now Im enlighted. Cheers guys !!

One bubble to go for 14 - 1st thing is visiting the Subterrane and take a look for Garamol.

Wish my luck ;)

Shaftronics
05-10-2010, 12:28 PM
Personally, I find myself using elemental resist outfits in conjunction with my cloaks for maximum elemental protection. As of those levels, you'll find that enemy casters and bards will start to dispel you often, and hence, your elemental resistance can be comprimised way too often for comfort.

Also, outfits/robes can be switched instantly, so you can adapt to situations and different enemies within a click of a button, if you set up your otufits/robes up in the hotbar like I do. This is definitely not true for light armor, however.

markusthelion
05-10-2010, 12:28 PM
Pretty good guys, now Im enlighted. Cheers guys !!

One bubble to go for 14 - 1st thing is visiting the Subterrane and take a look for Garamol.

Wish my luck ;)

Don't go alone! You won't last 30 seconds in the SubT without a sufficent party at lvl 14.

karnokvolrath
05-10-2010, 12:41 PM
Rangers that care about AC usually have at least one level of monk for the Wisdom bonus to AC which works with robes but not light armor.

This.

grodon9999
05-10-2010, 12:43 PM
Are robes still advised for Strength-based Rangers that never see Dexterity above 26-28-30?

There's no reason an STR-based ranger can't hit 26-30 DEX. Mine currently has a 30/30 split with gear and he's human.



I had planned on getting Dragontouched something, but I don't like the outfit's drapey look (plus so many people have it), or the robe's look on anyone but a spell caster. That just leaves leather (bc the breastplate isn't mithril), which I don't know what it looks like but I really can't get too enthused about.

You don't wear DT for AC, forget it. Leather or robes will not get you to the level of effective AC. For AC it's Icys and Bracers. You wear DT if you want guards or special effects.

sigtrent
05-10-2010, 01:00 PM
Assuming no dex improvement...

Mithral shirt is 9 armor/6 dex = 15
Bracers go to 9 so that makes +6 dex bonus (22) the break even point, which is really low for a ranger, even a STR based one.

Most end up in robes past the teen levels.

A dwarf with low dex may wear light armor since they can take armor mastery and it could put them even or better than with robes, and it has the advantage of requiring less gear slots to do it.

Of course you can make a dex = dump stat ranger but I don't think I would. 14 is about as low as I'd go since I'd want to take advantage of their free ranged feats from time to time as well as evasion etc...

Rogues also typically end up in robes for the same reasons.

Maldavenous
05-10-2010, 01:01 PM
Are robes still advised for Strength-based Rangers that never see Dexterity above 26-28-30?

I had planned on getting Dragontouched something, but I don't like the outfit's drapey look (plus so many people have it), or the robe's look on anyone but a spell caster. That just leaves leather (bc the breastplate isn't mithril), which I don't know what it looks like but I really can't get too enthused about.

It really depends on your AC and what's on your robes.

If you're only going to have 40 AC fully buffed then it really doesn't matter what you wear. If you can hit 50+ AC you can at least cause some misses and prevent some damage... until you get to epic.

Work out which way you'll have the highest AC and what amount of AC that'll be. If your AC is too low choose the one you like best/has the best benefits for you.

Generally I go with robes in this case because they're easy to switch out. However there are several sets of Epic Light Armor that I'm trying to get.

grodon9999
05-10-2010, 01:05 PM
Generally I go with robes in this case because they're easy to switch out. However there are several sets of Epic Light Armor that I'm trying to get.

yeah - I'm thinking of switching to a Breastplate of Destruction so I can keep power-attack on in Epic. I just need to pull one :)

Maldavenous
05-10-2010, 01:10 PM
yeah - I'm thinking of switching to a Breastplate of Destruction so I can keep power-attack on in Epic. I just need to pull one :)

You should check these out. They'll help you hit quite a bit and you can use a switch in a destruction weapon for a few swings for even more to-hit ability.

Vulkoorim Fighting Leathers Armor +6 Leather (+8 Armor, MDB 8): Greater Fire Resistance, Attack Bonus +4, Hide + 15 Colorless Augment Slot, Blue Augment Slot

Spectral Gloves Accessory Gloves: Ethereal, Dexterity +7, Attack Bonus +4 Yellow Augment Slot

Gercho
05-10-2010, 01:17 PM
yeah - I'm thinking of switching to a Breastplate of Destruction so I can keep power-attack on in Epic. I just need to pull one :)

every time i run the hound, there are 2 bp of destruction for roll, and nobody rolls for it, so the wfg sorc ends looting it and i presume, trash vendoring it...

grodon9999
05-10-2010, 01:20 PM
You should check these out. They'll help you hit quite a bit and you can use a switch in a destruction weapon for a few swings for even more to-hit ability.

Vulkoorim Fighting Leathers Armor +6 Leather (+8 Armor, MDB 8): Greater Fire Resistance, Attack Bonus +4, Hide + 15 Colorless Augment Slot, Blue Augment Slot

Spectral Gloves Accessory Gloves: Ethereal, Dexterity +7, Attack Bonus +4 Yellow Augment Slot

Well aware of that stuff but epic-grinding has bored me to tears after only three weeks, I doubt I'll have the attention span to really go after any of that stuff. it's just more fun to run up alts and TR.

I still do it when friends request my assistance but the obscenely slow rate of return on epic gear has made it not worth my time.

VanHalen72
05-10-2010, 01:28 PM
Don't go alone! You won't last 30 seconds in the SubT without a sufficent party at lvl 14.

No, my desire to die is not that big ;)

Im getting my guildmates with me and waste them on the way to Garamol. One for all - all for one...

Just got me +6 AC Bracers, and an fearsome outfit of SR.

With my 28 Dex i´ve got now 26 AC instead of 25 with chainshirt. At least 1 point better than before and much less repair costs.

Learned the lesson !

Bobthesponge
05-10-2010, 01:49 PM
Learned the lesson !

Then my work here is done...

(walks off into the sunset while shamelessly taking credit for everyone else's comments)