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Gorkulon
04-26-2010, 02:55 PM
Can anyone give me tips on how they steal the horn at the end of the swim in "The Crucible"? I made the swim on hard without losing any hitpoints only to be beat to death by the gnolls guarding it. Next time I was doing quest on normal I
equipped some +13 boots of elvenkind and chugged an invisibility pot before trying
to swipe the horn, and they still detected me and beat me to death. My move silently skill is 45 with these boots equipped. Is this good enough for this sneak on normal? Can I at least chalk up the failure on normal to a bad roll? I already know I didn't touch the mobs so I am dumbfounded. Read on the forums before that some rogues solo this entire quest so I figure there is some effective strategy that exists. Thank you in advance for any help.

Karranor
04-26-2010, 03:00 PM
Are you certain you didn't touch them? Sounds like a bump if your skills are really that high.

I usually sneak in, grab the horn then, start slicing and dicing. If it gets bad, into the water with the horn.

If for some reason you can't sneak up. Try the olé toss the dagger into the wall near them and re-stealth trick. They will move over to look at the dagger in the wall and you can sneak in behind them and snatch it while their backs are turned.

xoowak
04-26-2010, 03:01 PM
I've done this on my monk (who has no ranks in MS) with just an invis pot and hugging the wall. If you get right in front of them mobs will often start swinging even if you are invisible. If you get detected just run to the horn and Backspace to target it, then U to pick it up, and run back out, don't try to fight them.

Gorkulon
04-26-2010, 03:24 PM
Are you certain you didn't touch them? Sounds like a bump if your skills are really that high.

I usually sneak in, grab the horn then, start slicing and dicing. If it gets bad, into the water with the horn.

If for some reason you can't sneak up. Try the olé toss the dagger into the wall near them and re-stealth trick. They will move over to look at the dagger in the wall and you can sneak in behind them and snatch it while their backs are turned.

Only way I am uncertain I didn't touch them is that I am uncertain about what it takes to touch something in this game. What I mean by this is I get hit by the mad swinging ogre or troll at least once per day when whats on the screen indicates that even with their long swings there is no way they can hit me. Maybe I did touch them if it is a game bug like the one I described above. I have thought about killing them in the past. My rogue is an assassin with two-handed fighting and I have actually used the assasinate skill to one hit two targets at once several times before. Just not confident I can take all of them down. I am going to try the dagger into the wall trick-I am still fairly new to this game and never even heard about that one before. Thanks.

Karranor
04-26-2010, 03:48 PM
Mobs have an invisible area around them. You do not necessarily have to physically touch them to still "touch" them. They seem to have a bit more in front of them then to the sides or back. It usually does not extend too far out but sometimes can stretch out further then you might think.

I don't think I can explain it any better then that. I would suggest practice stealthing somewhere safer and experiment with bumping, detection and distractions. They are all very important and once understood can be used in quest to give you more of an advantage.

You can also use break ables to distract mobs as well. Shoot a crate just a bit away from them. Make sure you have the auto targeting off by hitting G, then you can go to mouselook mode with T or hold down left mouse to get a target reciticle. Aim just like a FPS.

wamjratl1
04-26-2010, 03:53 PM
run like hell. jump. tumble. run some more. swim. or any combination of those things.

But mostly what Karranor said.

Hawksen
04-26-2010, 03:58 PM
groovy cat, sneak and use invisibility, run as close to the horn as you can and hit "U" to grab, and run out super fast back in the water. It can be done. Sneak and grab and GTFO :D

~Hawk

kamimitsu
04-26-2010, 04:12 PM
Are you certain you didn't touch them? Sounds like a bump if your skills are really that high.

I usually sneak in, grab the horn then, start slicing and dicing. If it gets bad, into the water with the horn.

If for some reason you can't sneak up. Try the olé toss the dagger into the wall near them and re-stealth trick. They will move over to look at the dagger in the wall and you can sneak in behind them and snatch it while their backs are turned.

This is actually one of the tasks for R.O.G.U.E.... grab the horn WITHOUT getting any aggro.

The simplest method is to sneak and hug the right wall, go all the way behind the monsters and over to the horn. Come back the way you came. You will need to diplo Daggertooth at the beginning of crucible to make the gnoll guard drink the poison (he will then be 'inactive' and look like he is sleeping next to the gold.) You can walk right over him then.

Karranor
04-26-2010, 04:26 PM
This is actually one of the tasks for R.O.G.U.E.... grab the horn WITHOUT getting any aggro.

The simplest method is to sneak and hug the right wall, go all the way behind the monsters and over to the horn. Come back the way you came. You will need to diplo Daggertooth at the beginning of crucible to make the gnoll guard drink the poison (he will then be 'inactive' and look like he is sleeping next to the gold.) You can walk right over him then.

Nice good tip. I have actually looked at the R.O.G.U.E. stuff before and there are some impressive stuff there. I will of course defer to the experts, now that they are here. :P

Though I would suggest looking at their stuff. A nice long list of rogue challanges which are fun and challanging!

Vahyor
04-26-2010, 04:34 PM
There's a very easy to hit box to the left of the gnolls. Break it out of their line of sight with a returner/bow, sneak past the now very out of the way gnolls gone to investigate.

Sneak back or grab the gold pile and run.

Rydin_Dirtay
04-26-2010, 06:36 PM
There is a valve (located underwater, just to the right of the start of the water part of the Cruci) that, when turned, will reduce the water flow in there. Is that not correct? In 2 years of playing, I've seen groups that DID and DID NOT turn that valve, so I'm just curious what your groups standard operating procedure is there.

Razcar
04-27-2010, 07:27 AM
There is a valve (located underwater, just to the right of the start of the water part of the Cruci) that, when turned, will reduce the water flow in there. Is that not correct? In 2 years of playing, I've seen groups that DID and DID NOT turn that valve, so I'm just curious what your groups standard operating procedure is there.I never bother with that valve. Around the levels when I'm running Crucible I carry a +Swim item so I can swim faster and manouver more quickly, but even without that I don't feel the flow is a big problem.

My best tip to anyone learning this swim is to learn the sequence of turns, maybe write them down (autorun/autoswim into a corner to be able to write). Then you can do it with any character. Just don't swim forward (you will be moving too fast and might not be able to avoid spears when turning), let the stream carry you, and just go left/right/up/down. And use mouse-look of course. Also, just like in Reaver, the spears' damage extend further than they do on screen, so give them some extra space when moving.

Clay
04-27-2010, 07:35 AM
I never bother with that valve. Around the levels when I'm running Crucible I carry a +Swim item so I can swim faster and manouver more quickly, but even without that I don't feel the flow is a big problem.

My best tip to anyone learning this swim is to learn the sequence of turns, maybe write them down (autorun/autoswim into a corner to be able to write). Then you can do it with any character. Just don't swim forward (you will be moving too fast and might not be able to avoid spears when turning), let the stream carry you, and just go left/right/up/down. And use mouse-look of course. Also, just like in Reaver, the spears' damage extend further than they do on screen, so give them some extra space when moving.

so you are saying:

"go with the flow"

Are you some kind of surfer-hippie?

aldan
04-27-2010, 07:54 AM
Back when you could get extra xp for running quests below your level I was running Crucible at level 9.

All you need is a swim item, a decent swim helps. Nice to have a fair amount of Hp as well in case you get speared. The first part of the swim to the valve there is a spot where you must go over the wall, just backswim to slow down, then aim up and swim over the wall, its easy. I have never used the valve no need to.

All the other posters are right, just sneak in with invis and backspace "U" the horn and get out.

Razcar
04-27-2010, 08:40 AM
so you are saying:

"go with the flow"

Are you some kind of surfer-hippie?
Dude, what I'm saying is just go easy on the carves to shred those gnarly spears

Future
04-27-2010, 09:00 AM
You could use the valve if need be, but it's not mandatory. Just make sure to carry cure potions, because if you do take a hit underwater you can drink them underwater. The fan stops for a few seconds for you to swim through without hitting the valve. It's timed. None of my characters have any swim skills and can make the swim just fine, even my squishy casters.

You could either go with someone to take the aggro, like take a caster-for crowd control, and you can run in there and take the horn. OR make sure you are hasted etc... target the horn and pick it up by hitting U, and run like heck to get out of there.

Not sure why they detected you. I've never invis'ed myself in there, I just usually run for it.

Eladiun
04-27-2010, 10:59 AM
I didn't see anyone else mention it but in case things go wrong, make sure you have Freedom of Movement so you don't end up stuck while they beat you to pulp.

Quikster
04-27-2010, 11:11 AM
I usually hit an invis clickie, walk up to the horn and grab it, and run out.

As far as the swim, the only thing you really need is some patience. UA helps, healing pots help, but nothing is really necessary if you go slow.

You can sit at the bottom of the walls with pikes on them to heal up, then slowly move up the wall through the pikes. If you go slow enough you dont have to make a save and take no damage. Takes a little practice but it can be done on lvl 9 drow sorc who dumped con and has no hp boosting items, no UA and no healing pots........dont ask how I know just trust me :)