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View Full Version : How many stunners=to many?



vindicater
04-14-2010, 06:48 PM
Dont get me wrong I love the idea of a stunner build, already have my two laden cloud hammers just waiting to cap my fighter to TR him to start. My question is since the bosses are so tough in epic and unstunnable how many stunners(= lower boss DPS) do you want in your group. Just wondering?

Khellendros13
04-14-2010, 07:12 PM
Why can't a Kensai or Barb specced for stunning switch to DPS weapons for boss fights?

Wouldn't a stun specced Kensai be better than a khopesh specced Kensai in Wiz King for example?

Or do you mean TWF stunner VS THF DPS barb ?

BlackSteel
04-14-2010, 07:15 PM
I'd probably only bring 1 monk to an epic 6 man quest. But a ranger/fighter/barb should be able to do both roles just fine.

vindicater
04-14-2010, 07:26 PM
Why can't a Kensai or Barb specced for stunning switch to DPS weapons for boss fights?

Wouldn't a stun specced Kensai be better than a khopesh specced Kensai in Wiz King for example?

Or do you mean TWF stunner VS THF DPS barb ?

I did not mean to say that a fighter or barb that can stun couldent be a top DPSer. What I see is builds being built to be pure stunners maxing all they can for higher stun DCs. Except for the case were blunt weapons are your choice weapon aginst the boss you are facing someone built his way would have to give up DPS aginst the boss to max stun DC aginst the trash.
My question without trying to run anyones build down is how many stunning speced fighter,barbs are going to be wanted in a epic group? 1,2,4? and deal with the boss when you get there, or like you pointed out everyone with decent DC stun on the way to the boss?

Kintro
04-14-2010, 07:32 PM
Since Stun DC goes by strength how much DPS are you really losing by having stun focus?

BlackSteel
04-14-2010, 07:42 PM
you can have max stun DC and still have max DPS on red names. You just wont have max damage while stunning too. Stun DC has nothing to do with to hit or damage really. If you can hit the mob while not being specced for bludgeon then its not a huge concern.

vindicater
04-14-2010, 07:51 PM
Since Stun DC goes by strength how much DPS are you really losing by having stun focus?

Well on my 20 FB I have to chose between toughness and crit slashing if I have taken stuning blow.
One costing me beloved HP the other crit range.
Or I could splash some fighter for the extra feats but then loose capstone.
Or I could splash deeper and loose FB all together.
Or I could go mostly figter or pure fighter and be clickey dependent for my DPS.

Personaly I hate being boost dependant thats why when I get this fighter capped (at 15 now) I am TR him into barb and not making another one.

Quikster
04-14-2010, 07:51 PM
I dont see it mattering much. I run epics every night on my defender, with another defender usually, and a caster, sometimes a healer. Epic really isnt so hard you need to exclude builds imo.

vindicater
04-14-2010, 07:53 PM
you can have max stun DC and still have max DPS on red names. You just wont have max damage while stunning too. Stun DC has nothing to do with to hit or damage really. If you can hit the mob while not being specced for bludgeon then its not a huge concern.

Thanks

vindicater
04-14-2010, 07:55 PM
I dont see it mattering much. I run epics every night on my defender, with another defender usually, and a caster, sometimes a healer. Epic really isnt so hard you need to exclude builds imo.

Thanks

Kintro
04-14-2010, 08:33 PM
Well on my 20 FB I have to chose between toughness and crit slashing if I have taken stuning blow.
One costing me beloved HP the other crit range.
Or I could splash some fighter for the extra feats but then loose capstone.
Or I could splash deeper and loose FB all together.
Or I could go mostly figter or pure fighter and be clickey dependent for my DPS.

Personaly I hate being boost dependant thats why when I get this fighter capped (at 15 now) I am TR him into barb and not making another one.

That's true. I splashed two fighter levels so I'm down 3 STR on pure.

vindicater
04-14-2010, 08:51 PM
That's true. I splashed two fighter levels so I'm down 3 STR on pure.

In the two years I have been playing the onley toon I Min/Maxed was my cleric just dident think it made that much differince. A month ago I lesser rezed my 18 barb 2 fighter into 20 barb wow what a differance. I am not saying my 20 barb is better than your 18/2 split or anyone elses eather. What i am saying is with my player skills I noticed a real jump in DPS where it came from I cant tell you other than trying to do only one thing (maxing dps) made a noticable differince in my case.
Shoot mabey I just suck at multiclassing I dont know.

Khellendros13
04-14-2010, 08:54 PM
I did not mean to say that a fighter or barb that can stun couldent be a top DPSer. What I see is builds being built to be pure stunners maxing all they can for higher stun DCs. Except for the case were blunt weapons are your choice weapon aginst the boss you are facing someone built his way would have to give up DPS aginst the boss to max stun DC aginst the trash.
My question without trying to run anyones build down is how many stunning speced fighter,barbs are going to be wanted in a epic group? 1,2,4? and deal with the boss when you get there, or like you pointed out everyone with decent DC stun on the way to the boss?

I understand what you are saying, but I think it really depends on how someone builds for stunning.

To max out stun on a Kensai WF or Dwarf, it is quiet a lot of AP's. Around 30? Then Kensai on top, that wont leave a lot of AP. I don't have time (at work haha) to run the numbers on it, but I can see how it may impact taking the usual enhancements.

Now I'm thinking more about how DPS might be impacted.

I get what you mean though, speccing for warhammer vs khopesh on a WF or Human fighter would have less DPS on end fights due mainly to lack of crits (18-20vs 16-20). That would be 200~dmg less per 20 attacks?

More interesting question than I first thought. Sorry for the mishmash of ideas.

MeliCat
04-14-2010, 10:07 PM
/watches thread with interest

Doing my first fighter on the fly with guildie just throwing over their shoulder "do this!". It appears I have good stun and max strength but really **** saves. Only 13 so far and I was basically just going to leave him as Shroud runner and mule. Don't know if his build is good enough for epic but am now curious. Pure WF Kensai figher Khopesh specced.