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View Full Version : Healer vs. Cleric and Favored Souls



Kalari
04-08-2010, 10:34 AM
Okay after reading many topics on “High level clerics or healers needed” I started thinking about the subject. I did not want to rant on this just state my opinion take or leave it. There has been a lot of talks on needing healers for all areas of the game be it low level mid level or high levels. People are under the general impression that there are not any playing and we need more incentive to get people to play them.

Dont be ridiculous :p

Okay after laughing at the posts I think hmm between the characters on all the servers I have rolled up I have between 2-4 alts on each server that would classify as divine. On my main server I have currently 2 capped clerics a nearly capped favored soul and another being made in the wings. Its not that they are not out there being made, it’s the way people expect us to play said characters that make it easier for these versatile divine classes to either solo or group with appreciating players.

Appreciation goes a long way :)

What is an appreciating player? Well your mileage may vary on that one. To me the best players to group my divine classes with are ones who know they do not need me to complete a quest or even a raid. They are smart players they utilize strategy in taking on areas they have never been in, will care for minor ailments if they an and do their best via weapons or armor to defend against damage unless they are specced to do so. And even then if they are damage dealers they are doing enough to show that yes im taking a pounding but I am cutting down work for the entire party (looking at you mister raging barbarian and showing some love).

Pigeons but im a cleric/favored soul...:mad:

Point blank its really easy for me to tout why divine classes shouldn’t be pigeon holed into one role, but lets face it we have the ability to heal our party members. The only problem is many people forget that while we have this ability we also have other spells, other ideas for how to make the class fun and balanced for our own enjoyment.

No one likes cry babies :(

If you wish to play heal bot watch bars and run looking at behinds fine, but don’t make threads about being broke and how hard it is to cleric when the resources pile up and believe me they will. Also with heal bots many divines will think that they are gods gift to a party expect donations and get snippy. This attitude has hurt many plights of the cleric a class I feel could benefit now more then ever for stuff that makes it stand out especially since favored soul utilizes everything a battle or even a combat casting focused divine needs and has wings!


But when you get the constant “people don’t appreciate what I do and im broke poor me” type posts its hard to sympathize for me. A. because I know that as a cleric you can pretty much guarantee yourself a party slot and if you put up an lfm you have a better chance then anyone to fill up a party or raid. B. Unless you get a profound bad reputation for your attitude or lack of abilities it is extremely hard to find clerics everyone will avoid. So when people who have played divines or work with divines who know what they are doing it makes your argument look even worst especially since for many of us who learned and grew as we leveled our cleric/favored soul has learned enough tricks to make plat in the game.

Breaking it down :D

Point blank the issue at hand is people who even love to play divines are tired of being told how to play their role. If you went up to a barbarian and told them “hey don’t rage this way, or only use x weapon ever” they would be ticked. If you told casters to buff and stay out the way you’d better believe you’d catch it. And rogues as trap monkey’s only? Please. Anyone who thinks this way would clearly be mocked and shunned by those who know better.

Yet for some reason divine classes (yes I call them this because just saying healer would mean I give into the fact that’s all they can do) That’s what many people believe. That clerics/favored souls are here to heal them only. Forget that they can melee, crowd control, combat cast. Forget that there are times when the party does not need healing and why give a spot to someone who would just stand around waiting for a boo boo when you could have someone helping the quest go smoother faster?

Well what should I do miss know it all? :confused:

My advice to those who think to make threads starting with “Need more healers” Or listing that healing classes need love due to no one playing them that instead of saying “play one yourself” you should try to learn to play without them. Utilizing strategy taking your time in places you do not know getting to know what mobs are venerable to, using spells and weapons that immobilize and finding out what potions cure what ailments goes a long way. And before people harp on “im new I cant afford..” The game has ways and resources that help get you free potions from hp cures to blindness and curse. So please for the love of all that is divine stop looking for babysitters and learn to watch yourself you are your own best asset in surviving a quest and if your putting your life in the hands of another even if you think its their job to do so your playing at your own risk.

******

This is just my take on the "issue" of healers vs divine classes. Many other classes can heal only two seem to be expected to do it only because they have the ability to. But making someone do only one role because it suits you is selfish and why many with the ability to heal better use it to heal ourselves soloing.

MrFister
04-08-2010, 10:40 AM
I basically agree with Kalari's patented WALL OF TEXT!

What we really need is for everyone to play warforged and make all the arcanes "healers".

Original
04-08-2010, 10:41 AM
The problem isnt DDO or classes or Turbine... we have alot more people playing these days.

I'll let you fill in the blanks. There ******* SPECIAL!

Kalari
04-08-2010, 11:07 AM
I basically agree with Kalari's patented WALL OF TEXT!

What we really need is for everyone to play warforged and make all the arcanes "healers".

hehe dont get me started Kalari is force/repair spec even if she is an elf and I love crit healing wf :)

LOL Butter true dat :)

Zenako
04-08-2010, 11:37 AM
Shouldn't you be cranking tax forms this month Kal (only 7 days left)? ...you got a lot of new threads going...:D

As usual, those who know the power of the divine classes, know what they can do (pretty much anything in the game without help), while those crying out for healbots are generally clueless about anything beyond the toon on their character screen.

"must spread it around..." you know the drill...:cool:

Kalari
04-08-2010, 11:49 AM
Shouldn't you be cranking tax forms this month Kal (only 7 days left)? ...you got a lot of new threads going...:D

As usual, those who know the power of the divine classes, know what they can do (pretty much anything in the game without help), while those crying out for healbots are generally clueless about anything beyond the toon on their character screen.

"must spread it around..." you know the drill...:cool:

lol ugh ive been up since 7 am doing said work its boring filled my relatives forms just now and needed something to break up the monotony of it all :) besides these forums keep me from weeping as people try to claim stuff they know they should not or the "im being audited omg fix it fix it fix it nonsense I deal with." lol

Zenako
04-08-2010, 12:00 PM
lol ugh ive been up since 7 am doing said work its boring filled my relatives forms just now and needed something to break up the monotony of it all :) besides these forums keep me from weeping as people try to claim stuff they know they should not or the "im being audited omg fix it fix it fix it nonsense I deal with." lol

So can you claim all your virtual dependants? I mean you have support costs for them (monthly sub, store purchases, etc)...

lets see, 2010 1040 EZ Form (Dependants = 38), net deduction=huge, the Feds are gonna be paying me to play for decades....:D:D. Of course since they are all still children gonna get the child tax credits too (none of them over 5 years old yet....). Hard part will be coming up with that many legit SS #s...

Heck if Ted the Turtle can register to vote, then my Jareko should count on the form too...
harumph!...

When the US Census suddenly shows the State of Mass going from 7 million to 90 million citizens...that might trigger some flags....


So what is the standard itemized deduction Healbot Clerics get????

Kalari
04-08-2010, 01:07 PM
So can you claim all your virtual dependants? I mean you have support costs for them (monthly sub, store purchases, etc)...

lets see, 2010 1040 EZ Form (Dependants = 38), net deduction=huge, the Feds are gonna be paying me to play for decades....:D:D. Of course since they are all still children gonna get the child tax credits too (none of them over 5 years old yet....). Hard part will be coming up with that many legit SS #s...

Heck if Ted the Turtle can register to vote, then my Jareko should count on the form too...
harumph!...

When the US Census suddenly shows the State of Mass going from 7 million to 90 million citizens...that might trigger some flags....


So what is the standard itemized deduction Healbot Clerics get????

LOL ugh must spread it around before pos repping you again but I do owe you for that it made me giggle so hard tea almost came out my nose :)

Narmolanya
04-08-2010, 01:34 PM
The problem is definaty the melees perception of what a divine caster should be. With a few exceptions if a melee is taking so much damage they can't stay alive they definatly have hp and or ac issues they need to work on.

My favorite is running a quest you can easily solo and then throwing up a MAX EMP blade barrier that just sits there while the melees run past it and fight in front of it taking tons of damage expecting you to heal them all the while. Don't they see those swirling blades there that do a whole lot of damage to the baddies?

Kalari
04-08-2010, 01:37 PM
Oh yes thats a peeve of mine or worst the ones who dare say "stop throwing those blades use your sp to heal me.."

say what?

But sadly there are so many with that attitude that I just found it easier to run alone that way if my blade barriers are detrimental or "a waste of my sp" its only detrimental to my own tush lol.

Krag
04-08-2010, 01:48 PM
Just curious. How can caster-cleric contribute to epic quest outside healing?

dasein18
04-08-2010, 01:50 PM
Wish I had enough free time to read all of that... I bet it has some good points. lol

Zenako
04-08-2010, 01:59 PM
Just curious. How can caster-cleric contribute to epic quest outside healing?

Caster clerics can contribute in a number of ways. Many mobs still take damage from Blade Barriers, or might even have WILL saves low enough to get Greater COmmanded (however they will save very fast anyway).

Look at the spells on you list that either have no Saves or SR to worry about. They are there.

The other thing to keep in mind, the nature of the mobs and their vulnerability varies from quest to quest, just like on the N/H/E quests.

Summon up a MSIX for example. An extra body to draw some attention away, that will also manage to hurt the mobs a bit along the way.

Personally I also go for effects like Weighted or Destruction/curses to help the main melee pounders drop the mobs a bit quicker. Shift a few spells around to become a contributing melee (Divine Favor and Divine Power go a long way). You only need to be able to hit the mobs to drop some of those effects on them. Since you might be doing squat for damage, you often fail to draw aggro (at least you better fail to draw aggro or the group has some serious other issues to deal with, and you being a caster cleric is the least of them...:eek:)

Kalari
04-08-2010, 02:34 PM
Basically Krag it comes down to tactics, with my group while dps gets the job done its a slaughter to send melees in to take on all the mobs at once. Case in point wiz king on epic, having the cleric/fvs or caster throw down a damage spell and kite while the melees take down small groups at a time prevents the mobs from gaining too much of an upper hand. Even with us armed with green steels with the inflated hp on some of the mobs its far easier to use the "divine bait" trick. Its not for everyone and if your cleric, favored soul cannot run and do not know what they are doing it can be a mess.

But I have seen cleric/favored souls do more then heal in epic which is why instead of arguing with people who keep throwing it up I just do what I do. Its too easy to get upset by those who have not seen it in action without thinking that they probably cant find people who can do such things. But I know it can be done and has helped mitigate damage while making the quest run smoother for the whole epic group.