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View Full Version : Toolset Suggestion



Bhadazz
04-01-2010, 09:54 PM
I played NWN for several years, have a Hall of Fame module on IGN NWN Vault (Lands of Intrigue: Castle Spulzeer), was on the Toolset/Client beta for NWN2. Played WoW for a while, now I am trying DDO.

I suggest you release the toolset for this game, then charge people to host thier servers. Then throw in a DM client cause you're cool. Like Bioware cool with TNO and 1.69.

The heart and soul of D&D is make your own adventure.

Overall, Very good! Much better than NWN2, just give me a toolset and 100 bottles of pop and I will make you a whole new world! lol

Bhadazz
04-05-2010, 03:33 PM
In all honesty, I did not expect much in the way of a response to this suggestion.

I was just reading some gossip on the web about some "misunderstandings" between Turbine and Atari regarding a potential upcoming release.

Not that this is the proper forum, but I hope if NWN is turned into an mmo, it will include a toolset.

It is sad to see some of the awful rush jobs that have been pushed out the door in recent years. Dungeons and Dragons has a legacy, I hope that legacy isn't tarnished by greedy corporate fat cats trying to wring every penny they can out of it.

Once again, the heart and soul of D&D is create your own adventure.

Cylinwolf
04-05-2010, 04:51 PM
Dungeons and Dragons has a legacy, I hope that legacy isn't tarnished by greedy corporate fat cats trying to wring every penny they can out of it.

Because greed is totally the only reason anyone would ever not just hand their creation toolkit out to the masses and produce a completely new system that would change everything they've done so far.

User-created content is not something you can just "splash" into a game without tons of effort and consideration. You'd have to test and fix the exploits (or else imbalance the game entirely), you'd have to consider loot comparable to the quest difficulty/length (or else imbalance the game entirely), and per your suggestion, they'd have to branch out and open up a complete new system to host servers and allow you to join them.

Here's the deal on this one: You want Neverwinter Nights. I know, I love the game, I haven't played your mod in particular but I have played a lot of them and played online quite a good bit. But here's the problem: This is not Neverwinter Nights. They can't just, at the drop of a hat, screw everything they've built so far in the game and just sell the engine out to be a small-scale multiplayer game.

This is an MMORPG. It's designed to be an MMORPG. Neverwinter Nights was an engine and development toolkit with a campaign attatched. It's two entirely different things and you can't just hop on one day and find that a median between the two has been reached.

Karranor
04-05-2010, 05:12 PM
Yes please!

I would love to be able to build dungeons. Modding is a second love of mine and I am a firm believer that some of the best content for any game has been made by modders.

This is a MUST for DDO, it is the very essence of this game. There are many different ways this could be implemented. I don't think that is quite the discussion here. This is a plea to get it into the game! hehe

Bhadazz
04-05-2010, 06:29 PM
Cylinwolf, I understand your point of view. I beg to differ though. A toolset created the content in the official servers, the same toolset could be used by the community. User created content and official content could be on seperate servers.

Regarding what particular game this is, NWN or DDO, I say niether. This is Dungeons and Dragons. As a long time consumer of these very DIY products, and this being a suggestions thread, I felt that this was an appropriate place for my input, as well as Cylinwolf's.

Regarding p2p server hosting, that would be an additional income stream, thus satisfying the greedy corporate fat cats too.

In my estimation, more people played user created content than official content in NWN. Thus 1% of the NWN population provided content for the other 99%. Groups like Community Expansion Pack (CEP), City of Doors Initiative (CODI) hundreds of smaller groups and individuals , and Dragon Lance Adventures (DLA) who later became a professional production house. All done for free to benefit the game they loved. The hipster lingo for this is Crowd Sourceing.

I am no Warren Buffet, but it doesn't take a finacial wizard to see the move from p2p to f2p for DDO wasn't because they were making so much money. Perhaps, the custom content (cc) community could help generate more interest in Hasbro/Atari/WotC products.

Once again, let me reiterrate, I really like DDO, and the heart and soul of D&D is create your own adventure.

Uska
04-05-2010, 07:59 PM
NO thanks it would slow develepment down since devs would have to check and work through submissions that would be 99% **** and 99% of the stuff that was even mildly good would be full of exploits so I would figure only 1 out of a thousand would be acceptable and to much work to check through.

Cylinwolf
04-06-2010, 07:56 AM
Regarding what particular game this is, NWN or DDO, I say niether. This is Dungeons and Dragons. As a long time consumer of these very DIY products, and this being a suggestions thread, I felt that this was an appropriate place for my input, as well as Cylinwolf's.

Well see, you missed my point then. I'm telling you not to bring all this into DDO because DDO is not the same game. Turbine isn't experienced at handling this sort of thing (and look at how bad they botch some things they ARE experienced at handling) and it's not their style. So I'm saying don't bring this here, leave it to the NWN MMO or whatever Atari wants to go make.

SWG and CoH/CoV has user-created dungeon content currently. And it's riddled with exploits and bugs because neither of the developers have any idea what they're doing in that market.

Silver_Shadow
04-06-2010, 09:03 AM
I like the idea, but I can also see potential problems so let combine the ideas together. I say let people make mods but they have to be submited to DDO and they will determine if it should be implemented, edited, or rejected all together.

Silver_Shadow
04-06-2010, 09:24 AM
I think the toolsets should also let users make armor, weapons, sheilds, items, NPCs, and creator notes so that the developers know what you were try to do. DDO should also let you see the final version that might be placed in the game and get your comments, approval, disapproval on changes. Remember it's your creation, and ideas.

Myrdinn
04-06-2010, 09:55 AM
Hi all,

Just so people know, there is a reason there is no tool as of now.

Right now, player created content is impossible, cause there is no edition tool easily usable even for the devs themselves, but be sure that they want to find a way for us to create dungeon too, just will be hard to implement, that's all.

I asked this same question about a tool in august 2009 and a dev replied to me saying that they want to give that option to the player, just that it is gonna take a while to figure out how to work that out. Since I deleted the pm, I cannot recall exactly what he said or even which dev answered me but I remember that he said they were trying to find a way to do it.

Bhadazz
04-06-2010, 07:46 PM
Thank you for that hopeful news, Myrdinn.

Using this thread as a test it seems like about 50/50 for support of the toolset idea. It is my guess that the 50% who are against the idea would quickly change thier mind when they finish thier first quality module.

Cylinwolf
04-07-2010, 12:33 AM
Using this thread as a test it seems like about 50/50 for support of the toolset idea. It is my guess that the 50% who are against the idea would quickly change thier mind when they finish thier first quality module.

If they implemented it without a hitch and it worked perfect, I'd be happy with it. But yeah, that's not going to happen.

And I wouldn't get your hopes up that if a bunch of people support your idea that it's going to happen. Ever. Because people have been talking about this from probably the first week of beta. You can search and find six or seven threads on the the topic JUST since DDO:EU went live back in September; it's not any kind of a new or whimsical idea.

I'm also going to question the literality of "the devs want us to have this." Fernando Paiz has said in interviews before that they wanted to look into user-created content, but I've never heard anything close to "we want to give you this and we will as soon as we figure out how."

Bhadazz
04-07-2010, 02:03 AM
Blah blah blah. Bitter cynicism. Blah blah blah. Parade raining.

If it's been suggested before, it's because it's a good idea. If this D&D doesn't do it, someone else will. Maybe me, certainly not a bitter forum troll.

I'm done here.

Cylinwolf
04-07-2010, 03:18 AM
If this D&D doesn't do it, someone else will.

You know I sat there and told you that was my point, right?

Uska
04-07-2010, 03:25 AM
Thank you for that hopeful news, Myrdinn.

Using this thread as a test it seems like about 50/50 for support of the toolset idea. It is my guess that the 50% who are against the idea would quickly change thier mind when they finish thier first quality module.

Me not likely for every mildly decent player made dungeon in NWN I had to dig through dozens if not more that were total ****. just not worth my time and in fact I would insist that they provide no favor

vettkinn
04-07-2010, 03:37 AM
Blah blah blah. Bitter cynicism. Blah blah blah. Parade raining.

If it's been suggested before, it's because it's a good idea. If this D&D doesn't do it, someone else will. Maybe me, certainly not a bitter forum troll.

I'm done here.

Comrade, I've heard reports that a game called city of heroes (or villains?) have this kind of feature and it's ruining their game.

I like NWN and I like making mods myself, but I don't think it will work well in MMOs.