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NuclearCoffee
03-18-2010, 03:40 PM
To the devs,
Dont do it not under any condtions! I think the peeps that want it are WoW refugees that want to bring it to our beloved game!!
PvP = Smack talk , yeah more stress!
PvP = The days plans get ruined by getting killed when all I was doing was minding my own busness!!
PvP = Ambushed while all I was doing was walking from point A to point B!
PvP = Stop drop what your doing even if your 3/4 through a raid the guild is taking a hit!
PvP = Stress inside a guilds! Peeps leaving guilds or getting booted more often.
PvP = The only "winners" are peeps the spend their pc life in the game!!
PvP = DDO will become one of the herd, remain a stand out!
PvP = New guilds never get anywhere, ok guilds will whither and die.
PvP = "Ok you dont spend 18 hours a day in game grinding we don't want you in our guild."
Even with the "this side" ,neutrals and "that side" the neuts get accused of not truly being neutral and taken out anyway!
We don't want it, plenty are here because of the lack of it.
So just say NO to PvP!!!

KillEveryone
03-18-2010, 04:37 PM
/so totally signed.

Dutch01
03-18-2010, 04:40 PM
http://www1.istockphoto.com/file_thumbview_approve/1535790/2/istockphoto_1535790_i_agree.jpg

Baahb3
03-18-2010, 04:45 PM
Agreed

And don't have the upcoming guild housing tied to it in any way, shape or form.

Missing_Minds
03-18-2010, 04:56 PM
Agreed

And don't have the upcoming guild housing tied to it in any way, shape or form.

That I'll agree with, but they did say we'd get leadership boards back in Mod 3. This was stated, and while I don't give a care about PvP, they said it, so I want them to deliver.

DoctorWhofan
03-18-2010, 05:02 PM
That I'll agree with, but they did say we'd get leadership boards back in Mod 3. This was stated, and while I don't give a care about PvP, they said it, so I want them to deliver.

Definitally the leaderboards. Maybe some more PvP areas when they have time, but nothing more than what we have now.

/signed

Thredd
03-18-2010, 05:07 PM
This is a response for pvp in general. I haven't played in a while but I enjoy pvp. If this is some messed up new system that's coming out then ignore what I'm posting.


PvP = Smack talk , yeah more stress!

OH man smack talk in a videogame i mean wow i've never heard of such. Seriously when i started online gameing it was nothing BUT smack talk. Get over it.

PvP = The days plans get ruined by getting killed when all I was doing was minding my own busness!!

Eh people have their own opinions about this but it is a negative effect of pvp. Also your ENTIRE DAYS plans are dead when you get ganked?

PvP = Ambushed while all I was doing was walking from point A to point B!

You already said that.

PvP = Stop drop what your doing even if your 3/4 through a raid the guild is taking a hit!
Dose that even make any sense?

PvP = Stress inside a guilds! Peeps leaving guilds or getting booted more often.

I have NEVER seen a guild break up because of PvP.

PvP = The only "winners" are peeps the spend their pc life in the game!!

This is a common saying yet I've seen people who play mmos all day long just tank when faced with something besides internet dragons. I've also seen people pick up the combat system really fast and do well right off the bat(It REALLY depends on the system for that)

PvP = DDO will become one of the herd, remain a stand out!

Honestly even with PvP implemented DDO will still shine with the only reason I ever come back to this game. The well thought out dungeons What would help this greatly would be an implementation of some sort of randomization of the dungeon so that the traps aren't in the same place every time.

PvP = New guilds never get anywhere, ok guilds will whither and die.

What.

PvP = "Ok you dont spend 18 hours a day in game grinding we don't want you in our guild."

Double what? How does PvP relate to grindan for a guild? I see PvE guilds say/do this all the time.

AZgreentea
03-18-2010, 05:08 PM
Agreed, no public PvP outside of the area's. Spend time on it if the Dev's want, but no public PvP.

Gladiator_206
03-18-2010, 05:15 PM
yea, public pvp would be HORRIBLE. keep pvp the way it is, not worth anything (ie no prizes / buyables) in the game, but still a fun way to kill time.

The pvp pits are a great implementation, cause they offer no rewards and no-one is accidentally thrown into it.
(unlike wow were one wrong click can make you turn pvp on instantly.

Keep pvp the way it is!

/signed.

BitkaCK2
03-18-2010, 05:47 PM
Seems to me PvP in DDO is just fine as is. Old saying, "If it ain't broke don't fix it." The suggestions to 'make PvP better' are, in my opinion, trying to fix something that isn't broken. Further, from what I gather, PvP was never to be the focus of DDO in the first place. This says to me that the people who want to 'make PvP better' are trying to fix something that isn't even a focus of the game that isn't even broken (see where I'm going with this). I would hope the Devs are paying more attention to suggestions related to things in game that are of primary focus and/or broken.

In closing I will say this, the minute after any appreciable PvP rewards are put in game two things will happen
1) a rift between PvPers and non-PvPers will form and
2) PvPers will be screaming on the boards for class balance in PvP.

bitkaCK2

ProdigalGuru
03-18-2010, 05:56 PM
Although I would not like to see world PvP, I do sometimes enjoy a trip to the Brawling Pit.

I would like to see Rogue stealth fixed in brawls.

Other than that I can't see spending much development time on anything PvP related.

jerray1973
03-19-2010, 03:59 AM
DDO was never about PvP. Please don't make it so.

/signed

HeavenlyCloud
03-19-2010, 04:30 AM
I wish they would allow unlimited PvP for just one day

QFT!

I wouldn't mind some pvp love :P but looks like most of the forum posters don't want it so probably won't see it. :) I respect that.

Psyker
03-19-2010, 04:50 AM
So far this thread mostly seems to have suggestions to not have PVP, but the OP says PVP suggestions should be ignored, therefore it appears the OP is asking for this thread to be ignored...interesting.

BoBoDaClown
03-19-2010, 05:24 AM
While I realise/hope you are being trite...

I hope they don't take an attitude of ignoring suggestions that affect any area of the game... that would be rather short sighted...

I'd rather they looked at a suggestion and weighed the pros and cons based on its merits...

BoBoDaClown
03-19-2010, 05:27 AM
If this isn't sarcasm then your a moron.

I wish they would allow unlimited PvP for just one day so I could slay you, then corpse hump you for hours on end.

This is the type of attitude that gives pvpers a bad name.

I'm glad you are such an articulate proponent of a system that I support...

Iambeastx
03-19-2010, 05:48 AM
If i want Pvp i'll pop into eve online and go lowsec, thats pvp.

Dunno if i'd like all area pvp in DDO, though i do pop into brawl area's every now and then.

Might be nice to have a single specific Pvp Slayer/rare area - upon entering get a big flashy warning about PVP etc. That way its contained pvp but in a small way also 'open pvp'.

Possibly even implement a level difference system like runescape has/had (haven't played in many many years) - have to go so far into area before a level20 can attack a level2 etc etc.

Make item damage from pvp happen as it is a Slayer/rare area.

Make roaming mobs 'patrol' likely ambush spots in order to give ambushers/griefers something to possibly worry about with increased 'patrols' of increasing strength mobs for really active spots (less camping).

Give instance entrance area's a non-pvp area buffer zone for those people with slower connections/pc's or suffer zone-in crashes.

Pvp should not count towards slayer but have its own killcount, but with no rewards for it (If you like pvp then you don't need rewards imo).

Sweetsoul86
03-19-2010, 05:55 AM
I don't care if they wanna spend some time on pvp but if it was a worldwide thing I wouldn't stick around, if I wanted to get all my non fighting or lowbie toons slaughtered regularly I'd join wow. I don't agree that all suggestions should be ignored but I do agree that pvp is not something that this game is focused on and many of the players feel that it's fine the way it is or that it shouldn't be a main focus when there are so many better things to work on. I also agree that pvp being involved in any way shape or form in the new guild requirements to get rewards should never happen. Very few people I know would have any interest in completing any of the guild goals if pvp is involved.

BoBoDaClown
03-19-2010, 06:33 AM
I don't care if they wanna spend some time on pvp but if it was a worldwide thing I wouldn't stick around,

I can't imagine this would ever been on the cards - I've never even seen it seriously suggested.

Spisey
03-19-2010, 06:36 AM
QFT!

I wouldn't mind some pvp love :P but looks like most of the forum posters don't want it so probably won't see it. :) I respect that.


You just want to lure Maydie back to the game! :p

Sutekx
03-19-2010, 02:19 PM
To the devs,
Dont do it not under any condtions! I think the peeps that want it are 1. WoW refugees that want to bring it to our beloved game!!
PvP = 2. Smack talk , yeah more stress!
PvP = 3. The days plans get ruined by getting killed when all I was doing was minding my own busness!!
PvP = 4. Ambushed while all I was doing was walking from point A to point B!
PvP = 5. Stop drop what your doing even if your 3/4 through a raid the guild is taking a hit!
PvP = Stress inside a guilds! Peeps leaving guilds or getting booted more often.
PvP = 6. The only "winners" are peeps the spend their pc life in the game!!
PvP = 7. DDO will become one of the herd, remain a stand out!
PvP = [b]8. New guilds never get anywhere, ok guilds will whither and die.
PvP = 9. "Ok you dont spend 18 hours a day in game grinding we don't want you in our guild."
Even with the "this side" ,neutrals and "that side" the neuts get accused of not truly being neutral and taken out anyway!
We don't want it, plenty are here because of the lack of it.
So just say NO to PvP!!!


Isn't this something that was in another thread? The bolded statements were marked due to their irony.

1. That and the total misnomer applied to those who want more updated for PVP as people coming from WoW, there is a plethora of MMOs out there which people are coming from. This was addressed before. Just because some people have come from WoW and had a bad experience does not mean they have to reflect that experience onto others.

2. Smack talk. Interesting that you would jump to a thread, not read the entire thing throw a few words up and then start another to be derogatory about PVP suggestions when some wasn't even about altering the game and still kept PVP as a background item. Smack talk doesn't have to always be about "Dude you suck! I going to @#$% you hard and whip you silly! [insert annoying loud laugh]" - It is also related to how one presents themselves to others.

3. So you have had experience with open instance PVP, that's great. Did you realize DDO is closed instance for PVE areas like slayers and quests and raids where you can join a party or invite others to party? Shocking isn't it. I highly doubt that they would allow PVP inside a closed instance UNLESS it was a PVP request, so while you are walking through the marketplace minding your own business, if you get hit into PVP, you might want to see an ophthalmologist, because you might have some difficulties seeing the screen when a pop up message comes up for PVP, you might also have issues with Greater Teleport as well.

4. After seeing the ophthalmologist hope they have an in site optomitrist for that new set of glasses you need. See response to number 3 again.

5. Stop what you are doing in a raid ... if it comes to that, then you would need a new guild, because raids do count as quest completions, which would possibly be a part of the new guild grind coming in update 4.

6. This could also be counted as a [2.] because grinding shroud or for runes or essences will allow you to have better equipment which could also make you more valuable in end game content (of course not all top gears that you could make means that you are a better player, even so in a PVP MMO... It all about how effective your build and equipment and game style is overall - but we will stick to grinding for materials for gears)

7. DDO still stands out but I guess you missed the articles regarding how Beckett awarded DDO in three categories, 2 out of 3 were runner ups. So I highly doubt adding a siege style map to the PVP options (which is background options mind you, like it is now.) will make DDO a part of a herd.

8. Where have you been regarding guilds? This occurs in any MMORPG. My first guild had over 100 people in it, the guild leader was recruiting those who just came from Korthos - the guild didn't survive too well last I saw since most of those level 2s and 3s haven't been online over 3 months and I decided at that point it was time to find an active guild.

If you wanted to look at a guild dynamic most people will leave a smaller guild for a larger more active guild, why?

a.) If there is more people on doing quests, raids, slayers at different times of the day, you will stand a better chance of getting a party together rather than a guild that has 50 and only 5 are on at a time with a wide level spread from people you would know instead of PuGing.

b.) A guild is as good as their leadership. Leaders and officers also have to be effective on setting an example to others in the guild, also to be an efficient organizer for guild activities (guild raids, quests, etc) - It can be disappointing to some when a guild quest day is setup and you are the only person on after it was planned out.

But if you are wanting to go into other MMOs with PVP GVG that have end rewards*(see bottom on opinion for DDO regarding if someone suggests PVP rewards) for GVG PVP events - it still takes (a.) and (b.) to make (c.) a guild that other people would want to join due to a guild name standing out - but we can argue this point quite well from both sides: But have you taken the point of view of what the leadership has to deal with in that circumstance - Guild drama (this can happen in PVE or PVP based MMOs), as for PVP portion - Other guild drama due to other guilds leadership, or actions of member(s) or other guilds member(s). There is a lot of stress leadership can go through even without PVP, so thank your leadership today and leadership thank your members of your guild. If you haven't seen guild drama occur, be thankful for that as well.

9. I can see this happen for some "biased" guilds with update 4. I state biased, because they would state they are biased due to looking for active members, until they top out for the guild reward (or buy it if it's on the DDO store) - So yes that is present in DDO, but the solution is to find a better guild to suit your needs. Of course we can look back on (8.) for reasons of (a.) and (b.) as well.

PVP is a part of DDO, literally (since mod 3), meaning that the options are already there, while some only know of the tavern brawls, but were not aware of the PVP challenge option, where you can challenge an individual or party to a death match, capture the flag. It is just not as "in your face" as the tavern brawls.

Has Mod 3 introduction of PVP effected your game play so far? No, and as an opinion yes, for those who made it effect their game play. Is there an opinion that it should never been added? Yes, but that is opinion.

Now for the the situational purpose for the developers, as an opinion:

Should the developers listen to those who want to alter the PVE game mechanics where it can suit an entirely different set of game mechanics developed just for PVP?

As seen from previous thread the popular consensus was no. What effects PVP will effect PVE is what has been stated by people in the forums.

My opinion: I do agree, PVP players should use what game mechanics is available currently in the game. If certain spells or items are hampering your ability in PVP - You will have to get past it. An option that was brought up is to form your own type of PVP guild - much like permadeath or role playing guilds - setup a list of rules that are agreed upon via (if) other PVP guilds that are around. It's much easier to do that then try to change the game, permadeath guilds and players didn't change the aspect of the game mechanics to enjoy the options they had setup - it's called being creative with what you have.

Should the developers read PVP suggestion posts in the forums? This is an argument in the forums, between those who fear the game would completely be changed from how it is now due to the suggestions, this is supported by these types of threads.

My opinion: The developers can read what they want and incorporate what they want into the game, regardless of what your opinion on a subject might be. Look at the argument of the F2P model (not start one) as an example. That is not to say they do not listen to us, but just don't be surprised if something is added to the game because of a suggestion of one or two posts. They are looking at the business model, what can keep them making a profit, it wouldn't be a business if it didn't would it?

Should developers listen to PVP suggestions regarding PVP rewards? An Argument in the forums as well - but was stated in mod 3 that PVP was added for fun and a change of pace.

My opinion: Sticking to no XP penalty for death and no XP gain on winning, but doing it for fun and for a change of pace from grinding quests or raids. I do believe there should NOT be rewards for PVP. My reasons are due to past experiences in other games where people would try to use hacking tools to cheat the game (speed hacking, as an example). People can be very competitive in nature, and it (PVP rewards) could also bring out a darker side of some individuals (meaning happy laid back person doing a Dr. Jeckyll and Mr. Hyde in the time frame that it becomes available) - which could also lead the the exaggerated and overblown version of (2.) - the worst nightmare.

Has there ever been a feasible PVP suggestion? Argument as well.

My opinion: Yes there has been, regarding the tavern brawls, making it have level limits to each tavern area, why? so some level 1-5 does go into the brawl with a level 20 and get slammed, or worse, hit with some sadism and left there for someone to clean up (heroic surge has hopefully fixed this issue) but it would also mean that a higher level doesn't have to keep running out to the Wayward Lobster each time he or she wants to be in a PVP tavern brawl where there is a group of people - I have noticed the House D taverns are pretty empty for Tavern brawls.

An option of adding to the PVP challenge request a siege type option along with death match and capture the flag - siege options are already in place in the game (Irestone Inlet, Gwyland's Stand) so it doesn't seem too far fetched where it will change the mechanics of the game, just map positions and flagging of sides on the map for the items to be used. - And of course this "siege option" will still be in the background, like capture the flag and death match, so it will not intrude upon your existing experience.

Conclusion: DDO has had PVP since Mod 3, some people have to live with that dirty secret. An a general consensus of opinion, DDO's forefront strength should always be focused on PVE content and player options (races, classes, prereqs) - same stuff, different day... and that PVP should be held in the last place in priority, since it is used for just fun and change of pace from what is currently available. But to outright ignore suggestions, I would say a no to that, but to look at options that would be feasible and does not effect current state of game play nor would cause human sacrifice, dogs and cats living together... mass hysteria!

*edit: was for a bold I forgot to close.

mws2970
03-19-2010, 02:23 PM
Just say no to PvP!

Cyr
03-19-2010, 02:26 PM
/signed on basic premise

Not that I agree with the OP's individual statements I do think PvP is a useless distraction in DDO. Keep it that way. Once the devs actually spent any time working on pvp they might be tempted to 'balance for pvp'. That would be disastrous for the game. Not to mention with the devs limited work output I would hate to see them wasting time on this sideshow.

kafrielveddicus
03-19-2010, 02:45 PM
Make a PVP server (available to F2p and at an additional premium for VIP)

Make each hour of fighting cost DDO Store points even if it is only 5

Force all the 12 year olds from WOW(And others that act that way(<-People that use words like "r0xX3r'd) onto that server)

Figure out new ways(such as elite PVP gear that can be bought with store points) to milk as much money out of them as possible

Use the funds to boost the game for all the non PVP servers!!!

I think pushing all these people of the same mentality into one spot would enhance their gaming experience!!!

Coming out with new items available in the store usable in PVP only, and have them cost exuberant store points, will lead to a better game for those that play on the regular servers.

Robi3.0
03-19-2010, 03:06 PM
Dear Turbine,

Please ignore any suggestions for game improvements that don't directly improve my gaming play style or experience, because even though there have been a million new players since relaunch my play style and opinions are the only ones that matter. Anyone that doesn't play my way or want the same gaming experience I do is a noob and should not be listened to at all. Their opinions don't matter and are invalid just because I say so, because after all I know the most and am the best.

Kthaxbi,

BoBoDaClown
03-19-2010, 04:12 PM
Dear Turbine,

Please ignore any suggestions for game improvements that don't directly improve my gaming play style or experience, because even though there have been a million new players since relaunch my play style and opinions are the only ones that matter. Anyone that doesn't play my way or want the same gaming experience I do is a noob and should not be listened to at all. Their opinions don't matter and are invalid just because I say so, because after all I know the most and am the best.

Kthaxbi,

/signed!!!!

prowessss
03-19-2010, 09:33 PM
Nothing in the OP makes any real argument against pvp...
This game doesn't even have public COMBAT how could there ever be public pvp?

MsEricka
03-19-2010, 09:37 PM
/signed

prowessss
03-19-2010, 10:32 PM
If they enhance the pvp experience, they'll ruin the game!!!

The only arguments ever posted against pvp are just fearmongering...

And how do you think turbine feels about the ole "if you want pvp go to a different game" remark that keeps getting thrown around? I'll tell you, they don't want people to go to a different game.. that's bad for business.

I originally quit this game because of the complete lack of pvp. In fact, turbine had a pretty big following from asheron's call that started giving their money to other companies because of this.

I really enjoy this game the way it is but i will not hold my subscription open as long as i did for Asheron's Call unless they impliment some sort of pvp-end-game. and I'm not alone...

If you think the boards are actually reflective on popular opinion, you're kind of silly... the vast majority of players don't post on the boards.
The bulk of people who support pvp typically don't post on boards. PvP is a kind of gameplay that attracts those who want fast action. the boards are exactly the opposite of this...

People who want PvP really might even outnumber those of you on the boards.
I'm sure the 10-15 of you who troll these boards are going to argue this but the fact is there's a very small number of individuals who posted on both of the pvp threads currently on the front page.

gavagai
03-19-2010, 10:47 PM
The only arguments ever posted against pvp are just fearmongering...

Not even close. There are some good reasons posted here why Turbine shouldn't dedicate energy to implement a "PvP endgame." They are the same reasons why Turbine shouldn't implement a "Pony Design and Trading Endgame." It just isn't consistent with where the game currently is, and where it is going.

Look at your own complaints for the answer: You didn't leave DDO because it lacked PvP. You left DDO because you didn't like its PvP. There is something intrinsic to D&D character development that limits the possibilities for PvP. DDO has PvP, and that PvP is underwhelming. Spells are powerful. Rogues are useless. The whole thing is whimsical.

Do you take the worst element of a game and make it the centerpiece of endgame? No, that would be silly.

If everyone agreed DDO's PvP was the bee's knees, it would be a different story. A company should play to their strengths, and if PvP were strong Turbine should well enrich it.

Instead of making straw men out of the dissent and pretending the masses crave a PvP-laden endgame, why don't you specifically point out what you don't like about DDO's PvP, and what steps you'd like to make it better. Because your past comments (giving saves on powerful spells that people use to beat you, getting rid of Greensteel, allowing ganking in Wilderness instances) don't really have any direction, and aren't very well thought out.

jcTharin
03-19-2010, 10:57 PM
oh god the forms are being attacked by another PvP argument.
i just have two things to say

1. there is nothing anyone here can say that hasn't been said already on the forms. unless someone started signing the john jacob jingleheimer smith song or something.

2. I'm going to go hide until this blows over

prowessss
03-19-2010, 10:58 PM
Not even close. There are some good reasons posted here why Turbine shouldn't dedicate energy to implement a "PvP endgame." They are the same reasons why Turbine shouldn't implement a "Pony Design and Trading Endgame." It just isn't consistent with where the game currently is, and where it is going.

Look at your own complaints for the answer: You didn't leave DDO because it lacked PvP. You left DDO because you didn't like its PvP. There is something intrinsic to D&D character development that limits the possibilities for PvP. DDO has PvP, and that PvP is underwhelming. Spells are powerful. Rogues are useless. The whole thing is whimsical.

Do you take the worst element of a game and make it the centerpiece of endgame? No, that would be silly.

If everyone agreed DDO's PvP was the bee's knees, it would be a different story. A company should play to their strengths, and if PvP were strong Turbine should well enrich it.

Instead of making straw men out of the dissent and pretending the masses crave a PvP-laden endgame, why don't you specifically point out what you don't like about DDO's PvP, and what steps you'd like to make it better. Because your past comments (giving saves on powerful spells that people use to beat you, getting rid of Greensteel, allowing ganking in Wilderness instances) don't really have any direction, and aren't very well thought out.


Wow... I wonder how many of you failed to see the satire I laid by saying get rid of green steel and allow ganking in wildernesses. i was trying to be the steriotype you already saw me as. and continue to see in me.
AGAIN I guess I'll reiterate... I don't want to see pvp the focus of this game. ever. PvP endgame doesn't mean you have to end up in pvp...

And, as I did get into DDO's beta test, and I did stop playing it during the beta test, I DID leave DDO for the reason that I gave... There was absolutely no pvp.

Alright I won't dissapoint you...

What i don't like about the current pvp
Bar brawls and duels aren't a PvP system...
My suggestions to improve rogues I think have a fantastic direction and I don't think i'm going to be able to think them out any better... Add some kind of ability to cut down fortification.. and I would really love it if rogues could be trapmasters and not just trapmonkeys...

My major complaint about pvp is that it's pointless and a skeleton of a system that could be...

jcTharin
03-19-2010, 11:13 PM
John Jacob Jingleheimer Schmidt,
His name is my name too,
Whenever we go out,
The people always shout,
There goes John Jacob Jingleheimer Schmidt!
La, La, La, La, la, la, la

Aashrym
03-20-2010, 12:10 AM
/not signed

I am not a PvP fan and don't expect to be. I also don't want to sign in agreement with a statement that limits another posters right to his or her opinion or right to express that opinion and be heard.

################################################## ############################
My reasoning behind not focusing on PvP:

1) I like to play PvE. Pretty straight forward. I find it more entertaining that PvP.

2) I have other ideas regarding what the dev's should or should not consider a priority. Druids, or more spells, or more PrE's for example. Other opinions may vary. That's fine, this one's mine ;)

3) Game balancing issues.

It's not balanced for PvP and shouldn't be altered to be balanced for PvP. That balance is just not in the core structure of the ruleset. I feel concerned that any real focus on PvP will draw balance for PvP more into debate and attempts will be made to balance.

This would affect my game whether I choose to participate or not because my spells, or skills, or feats, or equipment will need a lot of adjustments for something I don't want. Or;

This would affect my game whether I choose to participate or not because Druids, or more spells, or more PrE's, for example, would be slower to develop as a PvP version and a non-PvP version are created. One each for the PvP environment or PrE environment in the event someone decides that effects/spells/feats/etc function differently in the PvP vs PvW environment thru instancing. That does slow down development.
################################################## ############################

The PvP in the game is fine for player who want it. Except maybe the floating names if that never was fixed. Other than that, I agree with not adding to it or focusing on it. I don't agree with telling players they can't make suggestions. Maybe some good can come from some them on some odd off chance. :D

Psyker
03-20-2010, 12:15 AM
Make a PVP server (available to F2p and at an additional premium for VIP)

Make each hour of fighting cost DDO Store points even if it is only 5

Force all the 12 year olds from WOW(And others that act that way(<-People that use words like "r0xX3r'd) onto that server)

Figure out new ways(such as elite PVP gear that can be bought with store points) to milk as much money out of them as possible

Use the funds to boost the game for all the non PVP servers!!!

I think pushing all these people of the same mentality into one spot would enhance their gaming experience!!!

Coming out with new items available in the store usable in PVP only, and have them cost exuberant store points, will lead to a better game for those that play on the regular servers.

I'm not sure if I agree with you or not, but I definitely like the way you think.

Twerpp
03-20-2010, 12:16 AM
People who suck at video games are afraid of PvP.

jcTharin
03-20-2010, 12:16 AM
I'm not sure if I agree with you or not, but I definitely like the way you think.

so do i. i still think its elitist though

Missing_Minds
03-20-2010, 01:48 AM
If this isn't sarcasm then your a moron.

I wish they would allow unlimited PvP for just one day so I could slay you, then corpse hump you for hours on end.

I don't mind players wanting PvP...

But seriously, if you want to have sex with a corpse, you have issues.

vettkinn
03-20-2010, 01:58 AM
People who suck at video games are afraid of PvP.

Comrade Twerrp, you speak with wisdom. I don't quite understand why they are so afraid of pvp, when pvp is fun and exciting (except for those who suck).

prowessss
03-20-2010, 03:20 AM
i think everyone can agree that PvP should never be the primary focus of this game. That being said, I think everyone can agree that this game should continue to expand its feature-set until it is comparable or superior to all other games on the market.

PvP is one of these features.

gavagai
03-20-2010, 09:09 AM
I think everyone can agree that this game should continue to expand its feature-set until it is comparable or superior to all other games on the market.

PvP is one of these features.

I'm not against adding features to make PvP more fun. But I think you have to be a little more realistic; "comparable or superior" is not going to happen, even if we allow 50-team battles or allow rogues to sneak and cut fortification in barrooms. PvP in DDO will continue to suck.

"Superior" PvP requires, IMO, some basics:

<1> High HP to DPS ratio, so players live long enough to make strategic choices. DDO's small HP pool and limited SP makes combat too rush and dump. Our DPS is geared to massive numbers of enemies with vastly more HPs than us, so reducing that DPS to "sensible PvP levels" will gimp PvE.

<2> A complex dynamic allowing all classes to counter other classes, leaving none out. DDO's PvP disadvantages most non-casters except AA Rangers. Rangers, Paladins, and Rogues are especially crippled by the lack of good PvP abilities (unless the Ranger takes F.E. in player races, or players become E.O., &c.).

<3> An intricate reward system that makes PvP profitable. DDO isn't geared to make PvP more important than PvE, which means its PvP will suffer. Period. In Shadowbane and other MMOs I've passingly flirted with, your guild targeted regions on the map to gather wealth and resources to craft powerful weapons no-one else could; or receive titles and gear with special l33t properties. Those devices guarantee that (a) there are people beyond gankers willing to PvP, and (b) there is rhythm to the PvP madness.

Judging by the framework DDO has, it will not have even "comparable" PvP even with a few minor tweaks. It will only have "comparable" PvP with a pretty major overhaul -- too much overhaul, IMO.

Best idea to integrate PvP beyond the barroom brawl is to just design a quest that allows two teams. Storming a castle to retrieve an artifact or something. You can marble PvE questing with optional PvP, everyone contributes towards quest completion even if they belong to a "bad at PvP" class. Pop a couple chests with normal per-level loot tables, and call it a day. It won't even be "comparable" to other MMO's for PvP -- but DDO is a different kind of MMO, and doesn't need to worry about those kinds of comparisons.

fatherpirate
03-21-2010, 02:22 PM
To the devs,
Dont do it not under any condtions! I think the peeps that want it are WoW refugees that want to bring it to our beloved game!!
PvP = Smack talk , yeah more stress!
PvP = The days plans get ruined by getting killed when all I was doing was minding my own busness!!
PvP = Ambushed while all I was doing was walking from point A to point B!
PvP = Stop drop what your doing even if your 3/4 through a raid the guild is taking a hit!
PvP = Stress inside a guilds! Peeps leaving guilds or getting booted more often.
PvP = The only "winners" are peeps the spend their pc life in the game!!
PvP = DDO will become one of the herd, remain a stand out!
PvP = New guilds never get anywhere, ok guilds will whither and die.
PvP = "Ok you dont spend 18 hours a day in game grinding we don't want you in our guild."
Even with the "this side" ,neutrals and "that side" the neuts get accused of not truly being neutral and taken out anyway!
We don't want it, plenty are here because of the lack of it.
So just say NO to PvP!!!

for the record am against open pvp and am against SPECIAL armor sets for pvp ect..
that takes care of about 100% of your worries.

as for adding an outdoor area, exclusive for PvP - no quests, just a big outdoor area for folks that
like beating on eachother. - fine
I can understand that the tavern pvp area is very small and most folks that do that (I am not one of them)
are kinda burnt out on it, it also doesn't allow much in the way of strategy ect..

so, >>> IF <<< they were to add a outdoor PvP are, I would include an entrance to the area
from all the houses (that lead to a different starting area) I would also flag any
player with the house that they started in so there would be 'sides'.
so if you and your friends started from house P, all 'house P' PvPers would be on the same side.

also make a protected area for each house starting point, no spawn camping and let them fight it out
in 'no mans land' - for bragging rights only.

I could live with that - totally ignorable if you have no interest with it.

Some may say NO NO NO, it will start a chain reaction causing the game to march toward
total PvP mayham ! -- get a life...lol we should throw the PvP folks a bone now and then.

NuclearCoffee
03-23-2010, 01:25 AM
Ok. to me Open PvP is the only way Ive played PvP in a MMO. that is what I'm making referece to, sorry about that.
PvP in this game IMO is not real PVP, it's fun I've done some of it, it's ok.
If DDO was to make some big battlefields along the line of tav brawls fine.

Smack talk,
I have no use for it.
When it's been on my servers, warnings and kicks were done.
Friend's Servers same diffrence. that was HL or UT or CS
Or a public server I'd leave if a could not put them on a iggy list, but then they would just stalk you if they could.
The server I'm on all the time I just can't leave like that, I've got so much time invested on it, not counting guild friends and such.

Not a good player,
I play rather well but this goes back to my point, in Open PvP only the power players would do well IMO, that why peeps multiclass now isn't it ?
Multiclassing is fine
There is so many of us that wish not to do that.

Inspire
03-23-2010, 01:44 AM
A real man's man PvP suggestion;

Friendly Fire.

Dandull
03-23-2010, 04:54 AM
Well i wrote a post about it so il just say yesyesyes to pvp.
First of all we need pvp becouse when u do all quests what else to do.
Second of all some rewards should be made for it, xp and money.
Those of u who dont like it, dont play it kill AI same monster 1000 times and let us fight.
And people cmon let them make some money, this engine is ok and i posted earlyer what should be done to make it work.
PvP is a great thing and we should make it work. Neglecting this part of game is a total mistake and i know that this game would be far much better if we had more pvp action.
MAKE IT WORK PLSPLS!!

fatherpirate
03-23-2010, 09:53 AM
ok, tough love time.

99% of the folks playing DDO...dislike - hate PvP.
that is why they play here.

so if your looking for support to ANY kind of 'wow' style PvP..or warhammer ect. save your breath,
wrong group.

nothing against ya, just the wrong player base to be asking that.

Dandull
03-24-2010, 05:50 AM
Ok by ur theorie so far Wizards should ignore us ha. And why shouldnt they give more pvp materials u can do both in game. No one can make u go pvp so why do u people even bother writing stuff like that. I think this post is total mistake that can hurt this company if they listen to you. They allready gave u what u wanted so dont be selfish its our turn now if we wanna fight guild vs guild etc. thats cool if u ask me. We can both play this game like we want no one should be neglected. 99% well if u wrote 90% i would maybee agree, but let them double or triple nubers on servers, let them have more players. I personaly enjoy pvp so please be fair, let us have more fun and let more people come all im saying. We all know D&D is the core all other games like wow, warhammer, aion are bad copyes and they took most of players just becouse pvp. Im just saying let DDO take what is rightfully theirs if u ask me.

Visty
03-24-2010, 05:58 AM
Ok by ur theorie so far Wizards should ignore us ha. And why shouldnt they give more pvp materials u can do both in game. No one can make u go pvp so why do u people even bother writing stuff like that. I think this post is total mistake that can hurt this company if they listen to you. They allready gave u what u wanted so dont be selfish its our turn now if we wanna fight guild vs guild etc. thats cool if u ask me. We can both play this game like we want no one should be neglected. 99% well if u wrote 90% i would maybee agree, but let them double or triple nubers on servers, let them have more players. I personaly enjoy pvp so please be fair, let us have more fun and let more people come all im saying. We all know D&D is the core all other games like wow, warhammer, aion are bad copyes and they took most of players just becouse pvp. Im just saying let DDO take what is rightfully theirs if u ask me.

the reason is simple: we have full pvp already in game, you can do 6vs6 matches and all that, even CTF

and noone is doing it

theres no point in putting work into something noone does anyway, only what gets used brigns in money

NuclearCoffee
03-25-2010, 12:48 AM
Ok by ur theorie so far Wizards should ignore us ha. And why shouldnt they give more pvp materials u can do both in game. No one can make u go pvp so why do u people even bother writing stuff like that. I think this post is total mistake that can hurt this company if they listen to you. They allready gave u what u wanted so dont be selfish its our turn now if we wanna fight guild vs guild etc. thats cool if u ask me. We can both play this game like we want no one should be neglected. 99% well if u wrote 90% i would maybee agree, but let them double or triple nubers on servers, let them have more players. I personaly enjoy pvp so please be fair, let us have more fun and let more people come all im saying. We all know D&D is the core all other games like wow, warhammer, aion are bad copyes and they took most of players just becouse pvp. Im just saying let DDO take what is rightfully theirs if u ask me.

NO OPEN PvP NO!!! Never saw PvP in Forgotten Relms handbook anywhere wonder why... ah PvP was not part of DnD!!

Iakona
03-26-2010, 01:51 AM
To the devs,
Dont do it not under any condtions! I think the peeps that want it are WoW refugees that want to bring it to our beloved game!!
We don't want it, plenty are here because of the lack of it.
So just say NO to PvP!!!

Agreed! I left RoM because of unprovoked guild vs guild pvp and pimped end game guilds ganking the lowest level guilds and lowest level characters then farming the respawn points over and over just for numbers. And I will guarantee Turbine right now that open pvp in this game will cost them my account here as well. Immediately with no questions asked or other comments made. Someone posted they didn't know of any guilds ever closing shop because of pvp? Go to RoM where ANY level 4 or higher guild can be put in a server wide open pvp situation for a few thousand gold. And there are no level limitations on kills for it either. Yeah I saw many, many guilds close up shops once the jerks started their ganking in that game.

NONONO leadership boards. It just promotes the above type action from what amounts to childish immature bullies and braggarts.

OMG PvP in DnD? Gary Gigax would be rolling over in his grave!!! "Hold there Wizard, I shall slay thee with this raspberry and coconut covered Zinger then wash the blood off my boots with this high caffeine energy drink." "No rake, I will bash thee about the head and shoulders and blind thee with this handfull of 12 sided die, and while you are dodging that your life shall be taken by stuffing this purple snowball down your throat." <The DM looks about the gaming table at the drunken idiocy of the players, throws his hands in the air and commands: GAME OVER> PvP in DnD? What a thought.

Keep pvp exactly what it is: a way to waste time while looking for a group to play the game the way dnd has always meant to be played - as a grouping social game.

Jasimine
03-26-2010, 02:17 AM
Comrade Twerrp, you speak with wisdom. I don't quite understand why they are so afraid of pvp, when pvp is fun and exciting (except for those who suck).

This is the mentality that drives many people away from PvP in the first place. Thanks :-)

I personally love PvP. I'm not to shabby at it in the games that I have done PvP. Those games include Ultima Online (Original Pre-Trammel UO were EVERYWERE was a PvP zone), Anarchy Online (Actually have areas were you can only get certin rewards by participating in PvP when I played), Guildwars (none of the crazy 8v8 GvG stuff, but some fun random assembly team stuff), and Eve Online (During my stint here I was a member of the White Rabbits).

All these systems have something in common, they were BUILT for PvP. Dungeons and Dragons was not. It was designed at it's core to be a team game. Stop at look at the solo builds out there. The top ones have many things in common, and ones that are not great soloists but work great in teams have many things in common. What are they?

Soloists
======
Fantastic self healing to heal through obscene amounts of damage
Evasion to make AoE spells near useless against them
Freedom of Movement to beable to avoid being held

Team Players
==========
Outstanding DPS OR Outstanding AC

No granted that discription is limited but it gets the general idea across. Certin classes will stack up 1v1 against other classes as better constantly. Rogues will get shafted due to heavy fortification, Wizards and Clerics will have the hands up due to their ability to imobilize opponants. Melee characters are some were in between. When you take out the team dynamic and just try paring each class up against one another suddenly things SEEM very unbalanced. That is because the rule system being used was never MENT for that kind of comparison. Each class has a one or more roles to fill. Many classes (FvS and Cleric mainly) Can fill ALOT of roles all at once. In the end, trying to mesh a visable form of PvP from the Dungeons and Dragons ruleset just won't work well. You would have to re-write everything from the ground up and I personally would rather have them working on fixing known bugs and bringing new content in the form of quests and finishing the PrE's instead.