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Kage72
01-16-2010, 07:14 PM
I was wondering wether a level of sorcerer might work well with a ranger build. A ranger could really use the extra SP a sorcerer would provide. It also seems like a ranger would be able to benefit from the "Shield" spell if using TWF. I'm sure there is a basic reason why people don't use this combo. Can somebody please point out what i'm missing/forgetting about this combo!!

Visty
01-16-2010, 07:18 PM
rangers will have a sufficient spellppol at higher levels
and a lvl of sorc is a waste for full caster classes and for semi casting classes like ranger and paladin its the same, not worth it

it might help abit at lover levels but youll regret taking it at higher levels

Sirea
01-16-2010, 07:19 PM
The Shield spell you could cast from 1 level of sorc would only be a minute long (2 minutes with Extend), so you'd have to cast it repeatedly. Also, if you go Tempest, the Shield spell wouldn't stack with the shield bonus to AC you get from the PrEs. If for some reason you weren't going Tempest and still wanted the Shield spell, you'd be better served by going a level of rogue and getting the UMD to use Shield 10th wands, which last 10 minutes.

Dandonk
01-16-2010, 07:19 PM
The SP gained might seem like a lot at low level, but later on it won't amount to a big deal.
The shield spell's ac does not stack with the ranger prestige enhancement Tempest that most rangers take, so while it does still protect against magic missile attacks, it's not that useful. Get shield clickies instead, or get umd high enough and use wands instead if this is an issue for you.

With all that said, many rangers do multiclass since 18 levels of ranger supplies most of the benefits of the class. And on a warforged ranger, a level of an arcane caster can be nice for selfrepair with wands without bothering with umd. But in that case, I would go for a level of wizard instead, for a free magic related feat. EDIT: Not that I endorse this build as such, just mentioning the option.

Nyvn
01-16-2010, 07:22 PM
Bad idea, you won't get all that many SP, especially since rangers don't use charisma. Also posting the same topic in different forums is not a good idea.

gavagai
01-16-2010, 07:28 PM
In short: you give up too much (level 20 Ranger) for too little.

Rangers don't need the extra spell points. Admittedly, ranger SP is terrible early on; but once you get to level 8 with spells lasting 8 minutes and costing 10-15 SP each, you won't worry about SP anymore. Meanwhile, with that extra level of ranger you get 20BAB (faster attack), a new Favored Enemy and +2 damage against them, the possibility for +25% ranged attack speed increase.... in short, level 20 is a nice thing.

Since SPs really aren't that useful (a 20 Ranger can have >700 SP, plenty for most purposes) you don't gain anything with sorcerer. Level 1 spells lasting maybe a minute or two. Which you would have to take off your armor to cast without arcane spell failure. You'll quickly outgrow the use of Mage Armor, and the Shield spell (+4shield AC) doesn't help a ranger Tempest with AC, since the Tempest already gets +4 shield AC when dual wielding.

Mixing ranger with 1 level of sorcerer sounds like a bad idea. =[

Kage72
01-16-2010, 07:29 PM
Ahh, their sp pool increase dramatically at some point? Just at lower levels, a Ranger's sp seems like an utter joke. I had forgotten that the tempest AC bonus was shield, too. :/ So, that does make sorcerer less attractive. An extra meta feat sounds kinda nice... But just a waste to add a level of arcane caster everyone thinks?

I'd like enough mana to cast buffs and heal self when solo'ing.

So, their are upper level wands that require high UMD to use huh? Are their resist energy wands that last longer than 3 mins? If i could cast them with a wand it could relieve sp usage alot.

Dandonk
01-16-2010, 07:35 PM
Ahh, their sp pool increase dramatically at some point? Just at lower levels, a Ranger's sp seems like an utter joke. I had forgotten that the tempest AC bonus was shield, too. :/ So, that does make sorcerer less attractive. An extra meta feat sounds kinda nice... But just a waste to add a level of arcane caster everyone thinks?

I'd like enough mana to cast buffs and heal self when solo'ing.

So, their are upper level wands that require high UMD to use huh? Are their resist energy wands that last longer than 3 mins? If i could cast them with a wand it could relieve sp usage alot.

Yes, at high levels rangers get enough sp for most purposes, as someone else said.
An extra meta feat can be nice for a very few select builds, but I would not recommend them to a new player. Do not multiclass for this if you don't know exactly what you're doing.

Buffing you should get more than enough mana for. Selfhealing will take a little longer and a few items. But buy wands for healing instead, they're relatively cheap to use.

You can use umd to use wands from other classes. So, if you want to use a stoneskin wand, say, but do not have a level of wizard or sorcerer, you can (with high enough umd) use it anyway. Getting a high enough umd skill can be tricky on a newbie ranger, though, so do not expect this to help you out for a while yet.

Resist wands come in level 7 and 11 versions, too, that last the corresponding amount of time. And give 20/30 points of resistance instead of 10.

Nyvn
01-16-2010, 07:39 PM
Ahh, their sp pool increase dramatically at some point?
...
I'd like enough mana to cast buffs and heal self when solo'ing.


My 18/1/1 Ranger has over 600 SP

http://my.ddo.com/character/argonnessen/sazed/

Not nearly as much as a full caster, but more than enough for buffs, and some heals.

Kage72
01-16-2010, 07:41 PM
Yes, at high levels rangers get enough sp for most purposes, as someone else said.
An extra meta feat can be nice for a very few select builds, but I would not recommend them to a new player. Do not multiclass for this if you don't know exactly what you're doing.

Buffing you should get more than enough mana for. Selfhealing will take a little longer and a few items. But buy wands for healing instead, they're relatively cheap to use.

You can use umd to use wands from other classes. So, if you want to use a stoneskin wand, say, but do not have a level of wizard or sorcerer, you can (with high enough umd) use it anyway. Getting a high enough umd skill can be tricky on a newbie ranger, though, so do not expect this to help you out for a while yet.

Resist wands come in level 7 and 11 versions, too, that last the corresponding amount of time. And give 20/30 points of resistance instead of 10.

Thanks alot for the feedback? Do you happen to know where these upper level wands are bought? I'm assuming they ea require the corresponding level of character to use? Or, can a lev.1 ranger use a lev.7 wand with spell of it's class(no umd required)

Kage72
01-16-2010, 08:02 PM
My 18/1/1 Ranger has over 600 SP

http://my.ddo.com/character/argonnessen/sazed/

Not nearly as much as a full caster, but more than enough for buffs, and some heals.

cool, thanks alot. I'll check it out. I've basically been going thru that "figure everything out" stage for the last couple months. I've rerolled 15-20 times, lol.

Kage72
01-16-2010, 08:22 PM
My 18/1/1 Ranger has over 600 SP

http://my.ddo.com/character/argonnessen/sazed/

Not nearly as much as a full caster, but more than enough for buffs, and some heals.

Kinda curious what was the reason for a lev of rogue? UMD? sneak attack?

ArkoHighStar
01-16-2010, 08:27 PM
Kinda curious what was the reason for a lev of rogue? UMD? sneak attack?

UMD would be the big one, also you can keep the basic trapping skill maxxed as you level and do both

Nyvn
01-16-2010, 10:30 PM
UMD is the main one; sneak attack, intimidate, and open lock are nice as well. I don't have full rogue skills on my ranger.