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ShadowcatX
11-19-2009, 04:51 PM
So I was thinking about a Ranger / Bard as those seem to be very good soloist classes. This would get Tempest II and Warchanter, as well as haste and displacement. Would that be worth it?

spifflove
11-19-2009, 04:55 PM
Id personally go 11 ranger /8 bard/1 rogue

16 + level ups
16
12
12
08
14

honkuimushi
11-19-2009, 05:44 PM
It's a solid build, but I wouldn't necessarily call it a good build for soloing. The problem is that it's pretty backloaded. Once you pick up Haste, Warchanter, Tempest, Evasion and GTWF, it's a beast, but that's level 18 or so. You're also really feat starved. You need Dodge, Mobility, Spring Attack, Power Attack, and Weapon Focus for your PrEs. That's 5 feats so a non-human has 2 more and a human 3. Extend and Toughness are almost required and I would want Improved Critical as well.

The mid levels before most of you class features kick in and when you haven't taken some key feats will be pretty tough going solo. Grouping would make thgings a lot easier. The trap abilities that spifflove suggests would be nice, but you'll probably find just maxing Concentration, Haggle, Perform and UMD to be challenging. The Rogue skills might be a bridge too far. Also, starting wisdom at 8 will delay your Ranger spells until level 7 or so and require a slot for a wisdom item. It might be worth it, but you will have to keep that in mind.

winsom
11-19-2009, 06:12 PM
Bards need Maximize Spell feat to be a good healer in the middle of a tough combat at mid-high level. You need good healing when soloing unless doing a stealth + hit & run approach.

you probably need to drop some ranger levels to pick up a class that gives bonus feats. It would also help to get those bard levels as soon as possible. Fighter 1/Bard 8, then consider what to do next. Maybe more fighter levels and no ranger levels, or 1 or 3 more bard levels, or stick with your plan of ranger levels.

Fighter Kensai and fighter bonus feats might give you all/most that you are looking for from the ranger class bonuses.

Bilger
11-19-2009, 06:33 PM
Playing up a similar build accept went 11/8/1 ranger/bard/fighter it is a late lvl build for sure but will be a beast at end game., Still so far while leveling have had np 2 manning or soloing anything to the point I am at 8/1/1 atm going for 9 ranger (evasion) then bard till hit 8 bard then last 2 ranger.
Believe started my stats at

16
14
16
8
10
12

Skill points are plenty especially with a +2 int tome
+2 wisdom gets ya the wisdom score you need for lvl 2 spells and suggest fitting in an item later as ac will not be worth it in end. With self displace, blur, evasion, umd scrolling, and such will be as much as ya need.
Now to me 12 ranger compared to the 1 lvl of fighter is a good trade off.
extra feat
10hp from fighter toughness
haste boost
and lose
2 ac 1 from bark and 1 from tempest and +1 to hit basically so the trade was worth it IMO
Went human (wanted Kopeshes)
Wf would be nice to prob would go with picks if went WF
feats
dodge, mobility, Spring, toughness, extend, kopesh, PA, IC slashing, and WF slashing

That how I went and loving it will be a beast with +4 +6 songs (I believe I know +6 to damage is right) Favored enemy and all the lovely self buffing and healing.

As far as Maximise with the scroll healing and such and lower mana pool not worth it IMO but can be fit in with human feat and using picks if wanted just my op. With cure mod being highest cure not worth it though IMO

ShadowcatX
11-20-2009, 07:16 AM
Bards need Maximize Spell feat to be a good healer in the middle of a tough combat at mid-high level. You need good healing when soloing unless doing a stealth + hit & run approach.

you probably need to drop some ranger levels to pick up a class that gives bonus feats. It would also help to get those bard levels as soon as possible. Fighter 1/Bard 8, then consider what to do next. Maybe more fighter levels and no ranger levels, or 1 or 3 more bard levels, or stick with your plan of ranger levels.

Fighter Kensai and fighter bonus feats might give you all/most that you are looking for from the ranger class bonuses.

Ranger gives me a large number of bonus feats, including the whole twf chain (allowing me to save points on dex), evasion, and good spell buffs as well as favored enemy. Not really interested in replacing more than half the build to use fighter.

But thank you to everyone for the advice. Now another question, would this build be worth a spot on most teams? I know self sufficiency isn't always a team's highest priority, but still, its a tempest build so it shouldn't be entirely worthless even to people who only want max dps, right?

I've began wondering if Ranger 11 / Bard 9 wouldn't be better. Inspire greatness vs. 2 points of attack .

Bilger
11-20-2009, 06:07 PM
Ranger gives me a large number of bonus feats, including the whole twf chain (allowing me to save points on dex), evasion, and good spell buffs as well as favored enemy. Not really interested in replacing more than half the build to use fighter.

But thank you to everyone for the advice. Now another question, would this build be worth a spot on most teams? I know self sufficiency isn't always a team's highest priority, but still, its a tempest build so it shouldn't be entirely worthless even to people who only want max dps, right?

I've began wondering if Ranger 11 / Bard 9 wouldn't be better. Inspire greatness vs. 2 points of attack .

As far as party viability why wouldn't it be self sufficient, decent bard songs, high dps, can take bard spot and hit as hard as most if not harder than alot of tanks, haste, resists, blur....
Very viable for grouping especially in end game can fill many roles and do it very well.

As far as 9 bard all you get is the new song and couple sp. The song doesn't stack with items like tumbleweed and such with the +2 attack bonus(same Bonuses) which alot of players have or will have at the higher levels. So IMO 8 bard is as high as ya need to go.

I already posted an alternative above with just 1 lvl fighter gain more IMO

But any way you decide to go 12/8, 11/8/1, 11/9 it still will be a beast at end game.

ShadowcatX
11-21-2009, 11:15 AM
Thank you all very much. I'd initially been thinking about this for a toon far down the road but the more I think about it, the more I like it for the bard I'm playing now. I didn't know that about not stacking, so its either Ranger 11 / Bard 8 / Fighter 1 or Ranger 12 / Bard 8.

KoobTheProud
11-21-2009, 01:12 PM
I've began wondering if Ranger 11 / Bard 9 wouldn't be better. Inspire greatness vs. 2 points of attack .

Ranger 12 gets you +1 attack, +1 AC (from Barkskin), +10 more resist (from Protection from Energy) and +1 to all saves from Ranger level 12.

Bard 9 gets you +2 attack (when Inspire Greatness is active), 11% extra duration on buffs and +2 to Fort saves (+1 base and +1 to the target when Inspire Greatness is active.)

It's a trade off. I think for soloing the odds are that Ranger 12/Bard 8 is better. For grouping I have no clue since Inspire Greatness is a single person buff that requires the use of a song to activate.

dormetheus
11-21-2009, 03:27 PM
Think about the flip of this build as well (though it loses evasion):

Whirlwind of Rock (http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=206789)

Bilger
11-22-2009, 07:49 PM
Ranger 12 gets you +1 attack, +1 AC (from Barkskin), +10 more resist (from Protection from Energy) and +1 to all saves from Ranger level 12.

Bard 9 gets you +2 attack (when Inspire Greatness is active), 11% extra duration on buffs and +2 to Fort saves (+1 base and +1 to the target when Inspire Greatness is active.)

It's a trade off. I think for soloing the odds are that Ranger 12/Bard 8 is better. For grouping I have no clue since Inspire Greatness is a single person buff that requires the use of a song to activate.



Inspire greatness is a group buff your thinking heroics that is a lvl 15 bard song.

ShadowcatX
11-23-2009, 10:41 PM
I've decided to go Ranger 11 / Bard 8 / Fighter 1

I'm going dwarf, mainly because I like Pella from LFG and this build makes me think of her.

My level up schema has started Bard 1 / Ranger 3, I'm probably going to take ranger up to evasion, then switch over up to warchanter, then back and forth, taking the fighter level at maybe 18 ish.

My stat distribution is:

Str 16
Dex 14
Con 16
Int 8
Wis 12
Chr 12

I hate my spell point total, and will probably always hate it. I might try and work in a mental toughness late game since I'm not going to have to take exotic weapon Kopesh (of course, on that note, I'm not getting the human bonus feat, either).

samagination
01-18-2010, 08:16 PM
Inspire greatness is a group buff your thinking heroics that is a lvl 15 bard song.

Inspire greatness is the level 9 single-target song.

Kage72
01-19-2010, 12:17 AM
I tried a TWF ranger for a solo char., but it just didn't seem like the best solo class since lower AC. It was great at the starter levels when things didn't hurt that much anyways. But, the higher the level I got, that lower AC really hurt when solo'ing mobs. So, i ended up going back to a Cleric with level of fighter for feat and martial weapon proficiency. Get better healing earlier and a shield for extra AC. Also love the good SP for long duration buffs. Just hate the skills. They blow!

honkuimushi
01-19-2010, 06:01 AM
Inspire greatness is the level 9 single-target song.


Seems AOE to me. On my Warchanter I've had other people targeted when I used my Inspire Greatness and I've never had it fail to affect me.



I tried a TWF ranger for a solo char., but it just didn't seem like the best solo class since lower AC. It was great at the starter levels when things didn't hurt that much anyways. But, the higher the level I got, that lower AC really hurt when solo'ing mobs. So, i ended up going back to a Cleric with level of fighter for feat and martial weapon proficiency. Get better healing earlier and a shield for extra AC. Also love the good SP for long duration buffs. Just hate the skills. They blow!

AC is very effective for most of the content below level 10 with just normal loot. Once you start getting into the desert and especially Gianthold, it's hard to keep your AC high enough to be a reliable way to avoid damage without several rare drops and raid loot. At that point, the best defense is a good offense.

Clerics do well solo from about that level because they get a few instakills, a persistant AOE damage spell and a healing spell that is much more sp efficient than anything they've had so far allowing them to heal though a lot of the damage that they're now taking.

When you compare a Ranger and a Fighter, the sword and board Fighter will probably take less damage up till level 10 or so. But the Ranger's wand use can balance that. At later levels, the AC you get from a shield is less likely to balance out the loss of DPS. At this point the Ranger begins to shine, especially becaus eof self healing and buffs. But a hireling Cleric can even things up a bit.

These are just general trends. Things will vary greatly depending on build and multiclassing can change the whole picture. A Monk splash on that Ranger suddenly means you can reach useful AC while still dual wielding and a Rogue splash can eliminate traps as a barrier. Fighters don't multiclass quite as well as Rangers, but there are the Fighter 12/Ranger 6/ Monk 2 or Fighter 12/Ranger 6/ Rogue 2 builds that give you a lot of the benefits of both classes.

kingfisher
01-19-2010, 11:33 AM
human khopseh 11ranger/8bard/1barb ftw