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Deathknight_Xael
11-16-2009, 06:20 AM
Hello, If someone where to build a death knight (aka Lord Soth, etc) How do you think it could be done and still be playable endgame? It would be mainly a melee character, wearing heavy armor with some spells that include self buffs, and probably some paladin levels (of course can be lawful evil and can't have even basic paladin abilities without lawful good so it would be mostly flavor)

I was thinking about the following:

11 Levels of Cleric (at least for blade barrier and create undead)

3 levels of paladin (deathknights would be fearless, as well as have some basic paladin abilities like smite etc.)



However the rest of the build seems to be a bit vague as I lack experience in ddo, I was thinking fighter levels for the feats and maybe 6 for kensei (either TWF or THF), or if it was going to be mainly TWF I was thinking a few range rlevels for reflex save and some other misc divine spells. Any thoughs and probable builds would be appreciated,a s there is still 5 hours until the game restarts. Thanks, something to pass the time.

Deathknight_Xael
11-16-2009, 06:25 AM
Also a sword and shield Tank type could also be interesting instead of the THF/TWF DPS types

Velexia
11-16-2009, 06:29 AM
My advice? If you want to play a Deathknight, play WoW.

Just sayin'...

Deathknight_Xael
11-16-2009, 06:30 AM
My advice? If you want to play a Deathknight, play WoW.

Just sayin'...

Their heretical blasphemy of a death knight is not what I'm looking for, but thanks for the sarcasm.

EDIT: Anyone got real advice?

Althor
11-16-2009, 06:48 AM
Hello, If someone where to build a death knight (aka Lord Soth, etc) How do you think it could be done and still be playable endgame? It would be mainly a melee character, wearing heavy armor with some spells that include self buffs, and probably some paladin levels (of course can be lawful evil and can't have even basic paladin abilities without lawful good so it would be mostly flavor)

I was thinking about the following:

11 Levels of Cleric (at least for blade barrier and create undead)

3 levels of paladin (deathknights would be fearless, as well as have some basic paladin abilities like smite etc.)



However the rest of the build seems to be a bit vague as I lack experience in ddo, I was thinking fighter levels for the feats and maybe 6 for kensei (either TWF or THF), or if it was going to be mainly TWF I was thinking a few range rlevels for reflex save and some other misc divine spells. Any thoughs and probable builds would be appreciated,a s there is still 5 hours until the game restarts. Thanks, something to pass the time.

My recommendation would be to play a DeathKnight on WoW, since thats where it was invented, vs. trying to use an inferior game mechanics build on a superior system.

Deathknight_Xael
11-16-2009, 06:49 AM
My recommendation would be to play a DeathKnight on WoW, since thats where it was invented, vs. trying to use an inferior game mechanics build on a superior system.

Deathknight was not invented on WOW, deathknights were invented way before MMORPGs, or have you not played pen and paper before?

BurningDownTheHouse
11-16-2009, 07:00 AM
If you want end game dps viability, scrach sword and board...

That said, how about a sword and board user for tanking/greatsword user for dps. I can toatly see lord soth swinging a huge Sulamanian blade.

I would try somthing like 12clr/6pal/2ftr.
with 12 clr you will be eligible for the second level of warpriest enhancements when comes, which with any luck will be sinrgetic with the build.
6 Pally will give you access to one of the paladin first tier prestige enhancements (i think knight of the chalice will work here for the tanking option).
2 levels of fighter will give you 2 feats, tower shield proficiency and will unlock intimidate as a class skill - very usful for tanking.

Now mind you this is just an initial tought, you will need some serious planning to make this build work, but it should be viable if built correctly.

Good luck.

Deathknight_Xael
11-16-2009, 07:04 AM
If you want end game dps viability, scrach sword and board...Good luck.

Thanks for real thoughts, yeah I'm just looking for off the top theoretical thoughts about a build like this, so it seems like a deathknight would be more of a spelltank than a DPSer of any viability at endgame.

BurningDownTheHouse
11-16-2009, 07:09 AM
Thanks for real thoughts, yeah I'm just looking for off the top theoretical thoughts about a build like this, so it seems like a deathknight would be more of a spelltank than a DPSer of any viability at endgame.

Not at all, at least not with what i had in mind.

It's true, you wont get the DPS of a frenzied barb, but with devine might and devine favor (and maybe devine rightuesness) you can get a prety viable end game dps.

Mind you, you will have to play him more like a batle cleric than a standard melee, but the only problem with that is that people might expect you to heal them. :p

Deathknight_Xael
11-16-2009, 07:14 AM
Not at all, at least not with what i had in mind.

It's true, you wont get the DPS of a frenzied barb, but with devine might and devine favor (and maybe devine rightuesness) you can get a prety viable end game dps.

Mind you, you will have to play him more like a batle cleric than a standard melee, but the only problem with that is that people might expect you to heal them. :p

Right now I have a 3pali/3cleric/1fighter about to take 5 more levels of fighter to get kensei, then polish of the other 8 levels with cleric, by the time cleric is showing up as my main class I'll have CCW but not heal. I don't really get the kills much unless I'm saving everyone else, but my survivability is rediculous (which is probably why I'm saving everyone else). Unfortunately I have 8 int so not many points

BurningDownTheHouse
11-16-2009, 07:23 AM
Right now I have a 3pali/3cleric/1fighter about to take 5 more levels of fighter to get kensei, then polish of the other 8 levels with cleric, by the time cleric is showing up as my main class I'll have CCW but not heal. I don't really get the kills much unless I'm saving everyone else, but my survivability is rediculous (which is probably why I'm saving everyone else). Unfortunately I have 8 int so not many points

With the level spread you are intending to go with, you will loose on a theortical tier II of cleric enhancements.
The build might might work but i think it will end up not focused enough on anithing and thus not very viable at end game.

Of course if you are having fun with it, just go with it and worst case scenario just build a MKII later.

sephiroth1084
11-16-2009, 07:24 AM
Ignore all the ridiculous "Go play WoW advice." Whether deathknights are associated with that game doesn't really matter, as D&D (and subsequently, though to a lesser degree, DDO) is partly about creating characters you like with the tools available.

I think you'd need to provide some more info about what you want to be doing with such a character. If it's just self-healing, AC and heavy armor, I'd probably just go paladin.

Create Undead is incredibly underpowered in DDO (and is fairly mediocre in PnP as well, except that you can make a LOT of undead). Flavor-wise, it may be fun for a little while, but I wouldn't expect that the novelty and flavor of it would last long enough to warrant building a character just to get it.

Perhaps an intimitank-base paladin w/ Hunter of the Dead instead of Defender of Siberys, and some self-healing spec, like Maximize and maybe Quicken, though this sort of character really needs a particular raid item to be truly viable. Thankfully, though, that is a fairly low-level raid (lvl 12), so you could get started on it around halfway through your level progression, hopefully getting the Torc by the time you pick up Maximize and such.

Deathknight_Xael
11-16-2009, 07:25 AM
With the level spread you are intending to go with, you will loose on a theortical tier II of cleric enhancements.
The build might might work but i think it will end up not focused enough on anithing and thus not very viable at end game.

Of course if you are having fun with it, just go with it and worst case scenario just build a MKII later.

Yeah I'm probably going to build the same thing on every server in different variations to farm up some TP to unlock content, then after I've lvl 20'd on every server I'll try to perfect it. until then though its just theory, most likely I wont get any powergamer's approval about this...

Deathknight_Xael
11-16-2009, 07:29 AM
Sephiroth, Actually mainly its for Blade Barrier, the create undead was mainly for flavor and I'm sure there are better spells int he 7th slot. Really I want him to be a high saves TANK, with a bunch of different ways to DPS at once, melee/BB/eleguardarmors?/spells etc. with some self healing for a tough spot, or when the cleric is lagging v.v

BurningDownTheHouse
11-16-2009, 07:31 AM
Yeah I'm probably going to build the same thing on every server in different variations to farm up some TP to unlock content, then after I've lvl 20'd on every server I'll try to perfect it. until then though its just theory, most likely I wont get any powergamer's approval about this...

Well, having a level 20 toon on every server is a prety power-gamerish thing to do. :)
After all not many people have 7 level 20 toons even on one server.

I would say that if you go this path, by the time you are leveling your build for the fourth time you will know enough to build it in a way that no power gamer will have any problems with it.

Deathknight_Xael
11-16-2009, 07:34 AM
Well, having a level 20 toon on every server is a prety power-gamerish thing to do. :)
After all not many people have 7 level 20 toons even on one server.

I would say that if you go this path, by the time you are leveling your build for the fourth time you will know enough to build it in a way that no power gamer will have any problems with it.

Thats the general Idea :) I'd expect the build would get better and more refined after each journey to 20 therefore improving my knowledge about it but I was hoping someone had some insight about similar builds or playstyles, could you elaborate on what you were thinkin gof the build as doing?

sephiroth1084
11-16-2009, 07:45 AM
Sephiroth, Actually mainly its for Blade Barrier, the create undead was mainly for flavor and I'm sure there are better spells int he 7th slot. Really I want him to be a high saves TANK, with a bunch of different ways to DPS at once, melee/BB/eleguardarmors?/spells etc. with some self healing for a tough spot, or when the cleric is lagging v.v

In that case, I'd go with one of the following:
-Pure cleric with some decent melee stats (AC will be pretty poor, but your guard effects will trigger more often)
-Cleric 18/Monk 2 (slight boost to saves, Evasion, some melee ability and almost full Blade Barrier damage, oh, and 2 bonus feats)
-Cleric 18/Paladin 2 (access to martial weapons, jacked-up saves, a real reason to use Divine Vitality)
-Cleric 18/Fighter 2 (access to martial weapons, 2 bonus feats, +1 Str)

I'm not a cleric player, but I'd probably go with one of the first two--the paladin level just doesn't add enough, and the monk levels synergizes with cleric and adds more than the fighter levels do, though the monk won't be very deathknight-y, as you won't be wearing armor.

If you really want Blade Barrier to be effective, I wouldn't skimp on cleric levels. You could also do this build as a Favored Soul, as they have some more melee ability built-in than a cleric does. In that case, I'd still recommend going pure, or splashing 2 levels of either paladin or fighter.

Clerics naturally have decent saves (good Fort and Will, and Wis is their main stat, and prob want a decent Con as well), so you probably don't need to be splashing paladin for saves. The only risk you run in being a mostly cleric tank is that groups will expect you to be healing.

Now, if you play with some decent groups, or open-minded players, they certainly won't mind you wading into melee or tossing offensive spells, so long as you also keep them healed when needed (less often than normal since you're helping to kill/stop things), but it will be hard to justify taking you along in a non-cleric spot, as your melee ability will be less than that of a true melee, your tanking ability less than that of a true tank, and your nuking won't really be any more effective than that of an arcane or other divine caster.

I'm not one to bash battleclerics just for the sake of being battleclerics, but that is the reality of the situation--if a group is looking for a cleric, they want a healer, and if they aren't, they want high DPS generally. That said, there is no reason that you couldn't be both an effective offensive character and a healer. Those are the best clerics by far. You toss a BB, get your melee on, and keep everyone from dying--the Renaissance cleric.

I'd rather have one of those in a group, if they perform their roles well, than a healbot, but I wouldn't take a battlecleric who doesn't heal into any quest that is at all challenging.

BurningDownTheHouse
11-16-2009, 07:46 AM
Thats the general Idea :) I'd expect the build would get better and more refined after each journey to 20 therefore improving my knowledge about it but I was hoping someone had some insight about similar builds or playstyles, could you elaborate on what you were thinkin gof the build as doing?

Well, assuming that the second tier of warpriest will have nice combat bonusses i see it working like this:

For standart adventuring you're tactic will be to throw some buffs on youself and melee with a greatsword, ocasionally throwing AoE damge spells and healing alies.

When tanking is needed you go sword and board and use intimidate and AoE damage spells to draw agro to you, then heal yourself while the party takes care of the mobs.

In end game raids you are going to be in the thick of it with the rest of the melees, Dpsing with your greatsword (hopefully shroud crafted by then) and throwing mass cures once in while to support the main healer.

sephiroth1084
11-16-2009, 07:50 AM
Yeah I'm probably going to build the same thing on every server in different variations to farm up some TP to unlock content, then after I've lvl 20'd on every server I'll try to perfect it. until then though its just theory, most likely I wont get any powergamer's approval about this...

While the favor you'd gian would be good, you'd also keep missing out on 32 pt. characters (unless you bought it in the store), as unlocking 32 pts. on one server won't unlock it on others. And if you're trying to refine your build, moving up to 32 pts. is a big part of that.

Now, Greater Reincarnating could fix that problem, but then that requires grinding or TP anyway, negating part of the point of doing all that TP grinding in the first place.

And what Burning said is true as well; I've been playing for around 2 years, and have 3 capped characters. Admittedly, I've spent time playing a lot of characters, and have gotten a few to level 10 before rerolling or deleting them, but even if I hadn't done that, I'd maybe have 5 capped characters. And if they had all been essentially the same character, I'd probably have gotten bored pretty quickly.

Deathknight_Xael
11-16-2009, 07:54 AM
both of you have good thoughts. Honestly I see you both have some experience, sephiroth is more detailed but burning is more hinging on what role I'm trying to play. Also I don't plan to be anything but f2p with unlocks by turbine points for all servers.

I want to melee, always have always will. Tanking fits my playstyle better, then melee dpsing. However I always play a hybrid if its possible. I wouldn't mind being an AC/Saves junkie with moderate melee DPS that lays down a hammer with spell support. of course, not only wouldn't I mind it, but thats prolly what my end product will be. Thanks guys for your advice.

If you have any more advice please post it and I'll read before getting back onto DDO at noon, its nap time :)

Arianrhod
11-16-2009, 07:55 AM
Not a build expert, so can't offer a lot of help there, but as for the origin of Death Knights, here we go:

First death knight in D&D was from Dragonlance - Lord Soth, a highly respected member of an exlusive order of knights (Knight of the Rose, an elite branch of the Knights of Solamnia). I expect he was a paladin to begin with. Bad things happened to him, and he ended up becoming undead, and evil.

Lord Soth got put into the Ravenloft setting for a while, but was apparently removed at some point. As far as I know, there was never a death knight class, just the one guy. Making a death knight build is kind of like making a Drizzt or Elric build - fun experiment, but can only ever vaguely resemble the originals due to their high power and unique status.

Personally, if I were trying to make one, I'd go with either a pure paladin or a paladin/rogue (for UMD), and take an offensive prestige enhancement line. Paladins in DDO can be roleplayed as evil as any other character, as there are no ingame repercussions for doing things like slaughtering helpless innocents (Purge the Heretics...).

Deathknight_Xael
11-16-2009, 07:58 AM
edition 3.5 and ed 4 I think both have deathknights, either class mods or NPCs

Arianrhod
11-16-2009, 08:00 AM
edition 3.5 and ed 4 I think both have deathknights, either class mods or NPCs

Oh? Must have been some supplement I never got (haven't got any 4.0 stuff). Maybe it would be helpful to include some info about the class as published. Many of us are oldtimers who either never heard of death knights or only know of them from "that other game" ;)

Deathknight_Xael
11-16-2009, 08:01 AM
Oh? Must have been some supplement I never got (haven't got any 4.0 stuff). Maybe it would be helpful to include some info about the class as published. Many of us are oldtimers who either never heard of death knights or only know of them from "that other game" ;)

Good Idea I'll pick some links up for you soon before I nap

sephiroth1084
11-16-2009, 08:09 AM
edition 3.5 and ed 4 I think both have deathknights, either class mods or NPCs

Not in 3.5, unless you're referring to the Blackguard PrC. As for 4 E, you might as well just reference WoW. :rolleyes:

If you are aiming for that, just go paladin. Your melee ability will be much better than that of a meleeing cleric. You'll miss out on blade barrier, but will have decent self-healing until you acquire the Torc of Raiyum from the Demon Queen, at which point you'll have very good self-healing. You'll have the highest, or close to the highest, saves in the game, and some of the tools to attaining good AC (though AC builds are by far the most gear dependent route you could go).

As far as flavor and role-playing go, that doesn't have to be tied very strongly to your character's stats (especially since there is no evil alignment available to PCs in DDO).

Xaxx
11-16-2009, 08:17 AM
If your looking to build a death knight type class from dnd in ddo.... you'll need atleast 5 levels of wizard... something like 8 fighter 7 cleric 5 wiz, or maybe replace fighter with pally since if you wish to base it on soth he was a fallen palladin without his magic.

Not saying its a practical build, but you asked for it, I say more power to people if they wish to make a *copy* of a famous book character from ddo... but if your gonna do it, do it right... dont make a level 20 fighter named drizzt or a 20 sorc named raistlin.. or a 20 fighter named Richard Rahl (Rahl would be somewhere around 5 ranger 8 figher 7 wiz is about as close as you could come in ddo to him)

If I also remember right, if your making a soth template dont forget greatsword (or was soth bastard sword, been a long while since i read the black rose or the villans books)

*edit let me replace 7 wiz in the rahl build with 7 sorc since hes more about spontenously drawing his magic then practiced.)

Emili
11-16-2009, 08:22 AM
Not quite sure how it may be done... from a role play perspective the class is LE or LN, Originally started in AD&D as and NPC or Mob mirroring a Paladin (The anti-paladin). Later becoming a player class... Black Guard and Death Knights were added ... to build one with what DDO has would be difficult, maybe a Sorc/Fighter?

A 3.5 Deathknight Is a full BaB class looking somewhat like

1st +1 +2 +0 +2 Profanities +2
2nd +2 +3 +0 +3 Rebuke Undead, Netherblast 1D6
3rd +3 +3 +1 +3 Deathshroud +2, Detect Undead
4th +4 +4 +1 +4 Netherblast 2D6
5th +5 +4 +1 +4 Profanities +4, Shadowmeld 2x per day
6th +6/+1 +5 +2 +5 Netherblast 3d6
7th +7/+2 +5 +2 +5 Blessing of the vampire
8th +8/+3 +6 +2 +6 Netherblast 4d6, Death thralls
9th +9/+4 +6 +3 +6 Deathshroud +4
10th +10/+5 +7 +3 +7 Netherblast 5d6, Profanities +6,
11th +11/+6/+1 +7 +3 +7 Shadowmeld 4x per day
12th +12/+7/+2 +8 +4 +8 Netherblast 6d6
13th +13/+8/+3 +8 +4 +8 Honorbound
14th +14/+9/+4 +9 +4 +9 Netherblast 7d6
15th +15/+10/+5 +9 +5 +9 Profanities +8, Shadowmeld 6x per day
16th +16/+11/+6/+1 +10 +5 +10 Netherblast 8d6
17th +17/+12/+7/+2 +10 +5 +10 Deathshroud +6
18th +18/+13/+8/+3 +11 +6 +11 Netherblast 9d6
19th +19/+14/+9/+4 +11 +6 +11 Wraithshift
20th +20/+15/+10/+5 +12 +6 +12 Netherblast 10d6, Revenant, Profanities +10

...

Rebuke Undead: At level two you gain power over undead. You can use Rebuke undead as an evil cleric of your level -1.

Detect Undead: At level three you gain the power to detect undead at will.

Honorbound: If you die while trying to uphold an oath, agreement or contract and you die, thus making you unable to uphold your agreement, you rise as a Sword Wraith (gaining the template) an hour after being slain. This is permanent, and you can only be brought back to normal through a Wish or Miracle.

Deathshroud: You are protected from attacks by a host of screaming souls which add a profane bonus to your AC. This bonus starts at +2 at 3rd level, increases at 9th level to +4, and finaly to +6 at 17th level. When the terrorize profanity is activated the souls emit horrible shrieking noises.

Netherblast: Once every 5 rounds, you can project negative energy damage with your hand or your blade.
When activated through your hand, as a standard action, it manifests in a 30-feet cone. Enemies are allowed a Reflex save (DC 10 + half your level + Cha bonus) for half damage.
When used through your blade, as a swift action, the weapon lights up with unholy energy, which is unleashed on the next target you hit. The attack must be made within the same turn.

Blessing of the Vampire: This ability is the same as Netherblast with the following differences. You heal damage equal to the same amount of dice as your Netherblast. This ability is usable a number of times per day equal to 3 + your charisma bonus.

Revenant: Once per day, when you are reduced to below -10 hitpoints you can force your soul to keep powering your body, Activating this ability is an immediate action. You can stay active for a number of rounds equal to your charisma bonus(Minimum 1), once this time period ends the effects of your damage continue normally, E.G: If you are still below -10 hp and you had been hit with a disintegrate spell you revert to a pile of ashes.

Death Thralls: You can Reanimate monsters with your dark energies. You can use Animate Dead as a spell-like ability a number of times per day equal to 3 + your charisma bonus. Caster level is your class level. You can only reanimate creatures that you have slain yourself (either by dealing the death blow or inflicting a large amount of the damage that killed it).

Wraithshift: You gain 20 ft. fly speed with average maneuverability. When you fly, your appearance is cloaked in a shadowy haze, resembling a wraith.

Shadow Meld: A deathknight can travel from one shadow to another, in order for this ability to work, the shadow that the deathknight trying to use must be completely dark and must cover his/her body. Using this ability is a standard action and the range one Deathknight can travel from one shadow to another is 180 feet. A Deathknight can take only 1 target with him through the shadow, along the journey, the target cannot leave the Deathknights side and is considered helpless unless he/she has reemmerge through the other side. Notewise, the deathknight can not do anything to the target unless they are on the other side. The Deathknight gains this ability at lvl 5 and at every 5 levels after.

...

Death Knight Profanities

Unholy vigor: You gain a sense of power and your body almost moves by itself, The power of negative energy strengthens you. You and your allies gain a profane bonus to attack rolls equal to your Profanities score.

Soulflay: A faint purple haze hangs around you, the bane of all living. All living things suffer as the negative energy plane is brought closer this world. Everyone (including allies and yourself) receive negative energy Damage equal to your Profanities score every round at the start of your turn.

Gravemist: The area around you is covered in a darkblue mist. The air also becomes colder, the chill of death strengthens the dead. Allied Undead receive Turn Resistance equal to your Profanities score, except against your own Rebuke attempts.

Terrorize: The air around you grows darker, your eyes become glowing red and screaming ghosts wisp around you. Enemies within the area of your Profanity aura are shaken receiving a penalty to their attack rolls equal to your Profanity score. Opponents immune to fear effects are not subject to this ability.

Death Armor: The air grows colder. Your armor starts to give off a faint black light and the earth where you stand becomes barren of life; The death armor has come. Enemies within the aura are dealt 2 points of negative energy damage times your Profanities score when they deal damage to you or your allies.

Deathwind: The air is in turmoil, the wind beats against your enemies, who are pushed out of balance. You and your allies are unaffected by the raging of the wind. You and all allies within your aura gain damage reduction X/-, with X being your Profanities score.

Etherfloat: You are carried aloft by an ethereal wind that only seems to affect you. You float 2 inch per Profanities score above the ground. If there is no ground within that distance you fall slowly as per Feather Fall spell.

Soulreaver: Your blows not only cut into flesh and bone but also into your enemies very soul. You and your allies gain a profane bonus to weapon damage rolls equal to your Profanities score. This damage is negative energy damage. You and your allies must actually damage your opponent before this bonus is applied.

Chaosprism
11-16-2009, 08:39 AM
The original death knights where fire immune, could reflect spells, throw fireballs, walls of ice, symbols etc.

To make a death knight like thing on DDO I suggest a charisma High character. With Wisdom and Strength Decent also.
Race wise probably warforged for the extra level drain immunity, greatsword focus, great weapon aptitude etc

Paladin 4
Sorceror 6 (go fire spec)
Favoured Soul 10 (energy Resistance: fire)


Sure your fireballs arent going to be much, but it's all the image isnt it ;)

Sorceror Spell List:

1) Chill Touch, Ray of Enfeeblement, Shield, Charm Person
2) Snowball Swarm, Blur
3) Fireball

Suggested lv 10 Fvs Spell List:
1) Command, Divine Favor, Night Shield , Remove Fear
2) Hold Person, Sound Burst, Resist Energy, Bull's Strength or Summon II or Aid
3) Cure Serious Wounds, Blindness, Glyph of Warding or Prayer or Contagion
4) Divine Power, Order's Wrath or Symbol of Flame
5) Slay Living Or Greater Command or Symbol of Pain

(I wish animate dead was in there, then that 3rd level 3 spell would be that one)


feats:
1) Admantite Body
3) Two Handed Fighting
6) Power Attack
9) Cleave
12) Empower Spell
15) Improved Critical - Slashing
18) Great Cleave or Maximize Spell


A more viable option, would simply to be a paladin 4, favoured soul 16
Virtue is your best paladin option for spells.

1) Command, Divine Favor, Clw -> Night Shield , Remove Fear
2) Hold Person, Sound Burst, Resist Energy, Cmw->Aid
3) Cure Serious Wounds, Blindness, Protection Elements , Prayer
4) Divine Power, Order's Wrath , Symbol of Flame , Freedom Of Movement
5) Flame Strike, Greater Command , True Seeing, Stalwart Pact
6) Blade Barrier, Create Undead , Heal
7) Symbol of Stunning, Destruction
8) Fire Storm

Grab any helms, rings etc that boost your fire damage criticals or damage output.

Deathknight_Xael
11-16-2009, 08:39 AM
Theszze three are sites with actualy templates for the Death knight class:

http://crpp0001.uqtr.ca/w4/campagne/monsters/DeathKnight.html

http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Death_Knight_%283.5e_Class%29

http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Death_Knight_%283.5e_Prestige_Class%29

These two are Death Knights (albeit two completely different types)

http://www.enworld.org/forum/3917129-post14.html

http://www.dlnexus.com/fan/rules/12744.aspx

And this one is just general information on a death knight:

http://www.wizards.com/DnD/Article.aspx?x=dnd/dreo/20071003a



Using all those I'm trying to consolidate them into a single FEASIBLE type of general character, then further divide that type into maximizing an endgame playable DPS version, TANK version, and possibly a NUKE version or combination of two of the three(if not all). Once haveing that accomplished (not done yet) I want to further specify it for my playstyle and enjoyment.

I hope this will help everyone trying to help me. I'd be really interested if someone could theorize a endgame playable TANK based version of a death knight, with moderate Melee DPS, and about equal spell based DPS that can be use simultaneously.

Either THF, TWF, or Sword and board, if TWF or sword and board using bastard swords. Thanks guys!

Deathknight_Xael
11-16-2009, 08:46 AM
ok nap time till right before the servers reopen, please help and continue posting until then! I've got to take a nap >.<

Razic-Thule
11-16-2009, 09:10 AM
I cant speak for what they might have done for 3.5 or 4th for making a Death-knight class or templet. But for me a Death-knight always had 2 things that separated them from all other undead. 20d fireball, and instakill. Now i know you can't really get the 20d fireball in DDO. But you prolly could get an instakill. That's just my two cents.

Arianrhod
11-16-2009, 04:44 PM
Went through the template in the first link, here are my reactions as to how this would mesh with what's possible in DDO:

Hit Dice: D12 - Barbarian only
+2 Natural Armor - feasible with Barkskin potions
Cha mod to special attacks (smite?) - would have to be Paladin
Fear aura - closest equivalent in DDO would be to wear Fearsome armor
Spell-like abilities: Would have to be single-classed arcane to get the caster level of 20. As for the specific spells:
Detect Magic: Not in DDO
See Invisibility: In DDO, but useless
Wall of Ice: Not in DDO
Dispel Magic: In DDO, available on wands
Fireball: In DDO, available on wands
Power Word: at least some are in DDO, might be available on scrolls
Symbol: Pain & Fear (only ones the DK template has) are in DDO, might be available on scrolls
Summon Demons: The Summon monster IX spell summons a Hezrou, one of the others summons a Bezekira (that's not a demon, though). Might be available on scrolls
Undead type - not available to player characters in DDO, unless possible in some form with the future Pale Master Prestige Enhancement line
Darkvision - not in DDO
Turn Resist - not available to player characters (no Undead type, Paladins can't be Turned).
SR 16+ character level: Don't think this is possible with any race or class, though monks get some SR & so do Drow. Might be achievable with items, but seems likely too high
Summon Nightmare - no mounts in DDO
+4 STR, +2 WIS/CHA, - CON (undead type) : Can get close with tomes & 32-point builds, but the - CON just isn't possible
+8 Intimidate: Easily done with items
+8 Sense Motive: Skill not in DDO; Bluff probably closest equivalent
+8 Spot: Easily done with items

I still like the mostly-paladin with at least one rogue level so as to be able to max UMD. That would let you use items to mimic the spell abilities, without giving up much from the melee ability. Race would probably be Drow, for the bonus to Charisma & Spell Resistance, or Human, for the ability to take enhancements in 2 different stats (such as CHA & WIS), and skill boost for UMDing those high level scrolls.

Basically, you gotta pick whether you want to be able to pull off the spellcasting aspect of a proper death knight, or the melee aspect. You'll really only be able to do one well; the other will have to be faked, or for show (like running around in Fearsome Twilight Mithral armor on your 20 sorc or zapping things with fireball wands on your paladin).

Deathknight_Xael
11-16-2009, 05:49 PM
thanks for the thoughts and information, my nap actually took longer than I thought it would... unfotunately. I'm going to take all this information in. but I got to go to a meeting now...

THANKS VERY MUCH!

Chaosprism
11-17-2009, 01:25 AM
Summoning a ghostly lion (devil) bezerika would be fine for a death knight especially if you're pretending to be "lawful evil"

Hezrou is definitely for the chaotic evil death knight.