PDA

View Full Version : Well equipped, well built monk.



captain1z
07-01-2009, 12:54 AM
A comment was made in another thread that a well equipped and well built monk shouldnt get hit much.

I think Im having trouble understanding what exactly a well built and well equipped monk looks like.

Heres mine & I get hit often and very hard.

Human Monk lvl 14 (currently)

str- 18 (base 12 +6 item)
dex- 30 (base 19 +1 tome+9 monk stuff) stays in wind stance mostly
con- 18 (base 12 +2 tome +1 human +6 item -3wind stance)
wis- 26 (16 base+ 1 human+3 monk enhance+6 item)

305 hp w/ minos legens

AC = 42
10 base
10 dex
8 wis
6 armor (+7 available at 15th)
5 deflection
3 centered
-------------
42
-------------
+7 bark pot & shield clicky (temp/situational)
= 49 (binding the robes +shroud item will hit 55 all said and done)

feats = (I dont remember all Ive picked but) 2 weapon fighting, weapon finesse, toughness, dragonmarks X 3,


equipment

deathblock robes of invulnerability
weakening of enfeebling kamas x 2, bursting cold + shock + fire of enfeebling, transmuter of pure good. lets just say a buncha goodies but no vorpals

Handwraps again I got tons of em all goodies for any job.


Im still feeling squishy and sub par. With care I can run solo in the vale and rack up the kills. Tomes will happen eventually as will shroud items if I ever manage to flag or get in a shroud run with this guy (the stigma against monks is staggering and discouraging). What do I need to become this "well equipped, well built monk" I here of so often. Bear in mind some items are beyond me.... Icey rainments wont likely happen as well as a chattering ring.



Looking for ideas, comments and support.

Note to devs- the broken wraps continue to suck.

Uska
07-01-2009, 01:09 AM
Well my ac is a little better then yours at 47 before barkskin and haste and I get hit all the time as well but most of the time its fine I just use fists of light try to stun or trip them and then I dont take much damage I hope to get at least close to a 60 ac at some point but by then will be in higher level content still getting hit. Not sure what server your on but a proper guild will help you get the rainments the ring will be tougher though. difference in my ac is mainly from CE by the way

Enochroot
07-01-2009, 01:10 AM
Dex builds tend to not come together very well until end-game where they see MASSIVE AC jumps (this IS where a well-known poster with whom I was just arguing is correct):

- icy (as you mentioned) +4
- alchemical +1
- chattering +3
- insight +4
- armor 7 +1
- tomes - another +2?
-CE - +5


We're already looking +20 AC (there's more) - which - as has been pointed out - can take you from massive damage incoming to 19 times less damage.

In my opinion, if I wasn't going to farm all the end game loot, I wouldn't make an AC build. They depend very much on grind to be effective.

Vivanto
07-01-2009, 01:14 AM
I think Im having trouble understanding what exactly a well built and well equipped monk looks like.

All it means is that you have nuff ammount of stats for ac (as well as to kill stuff, else ac is useless), and as ac works even then you still need a couple item farming to get a high, near untouchable ac. If you have that ac, you won't get hit, thus you don't need heals. Tought it's pretty self explanatory.

Enochroot
07-01-2009, 01:30 AM
All it means is that you have nuff ammount of stats for ac (as well as to kill stuff, else ac is useless), and as ac works even then you still need a couple item farming to get a high, near untouchable ac. If you have that ac, you won't get hit, thus you don't need heals. Tought it's pretty self explanatory.

What a useless response. What level of stats might you need? What items might you need? What AC might you need?

Yeah, your explanation was "get all the right stats and gear" - when someone is asking "what are the right stats and gear?"

Great work.

FluffyCalico
07-01-2009, 01:39 AM
What a useless response. What level of stats might you need? What items might you need? What AC might you need?

Yeah, your explanation was "get all the right stats and gear" - when someone is asking "what are the right stats and gear?"

Great work.

Typically you want to be at least in the high 50s without buffs so you can buff into the low 70s when you really need it.

Vivanto
07-01-2009, 01:45 AM
What a useless response. What level of stats might you need? What items might you need? What AC might you need?

Yeah, your explanation was "get all the right stats and gear" - when someone is asking "what are the right stats and gear?"

Great work.

40 40 40 40 40 40 just for you. Sorry, if you can't figure out what "right" means for a monk then you don't know what a monk is.

If someone dosen't know what the right gear is, it is very likely he can't really get them in the first place. But for that purpose there are already dozens of very well written definite AC guides out there.

Simply don't gimp it, it's already been stated even in this thread, and lots of others. A dex based monk is gimp dps, A raw str monk lacks dc or ac or both, and most average monks lack con. All these must be close to equal. Also obviously you would want to qualify for ac.

Here's just a quick tossout just fyi then.
human 15,15,14,10,15,8, didn't do any spiffy math behind it, give or take a point from either stat and pump another depending personal preference.
The key word and answer to your question is "balanced".

Also the fact you tought captainz indeed needed any help or advice saddens me.

Uska
07-01-2009, 02:09 AM
40 40 40 40 40 40 just for you. Sorry, if you can't figure out what "right" means for a monk then you don't know what a monk is.

If someone dosen't know what the right gear is, it is very likely he can't really get them in the first place. But for that purpose there are already dozens of very well written definite AC guides out there.

Simply don't gimp it, it's already been stated even in this thread, and lots of others. A dex based monk is gimp dps, A raw str monk lacks dc or ac or both, and most average monks lack con. All these must be close to equal. Also obviously you would want to qualify for ac.

Here's just a quick tossout just fyi then.
human 15,15,14,10,15,8, didn't do any spiffy math behind it, give or take a point from either stat and pump another depending personal preference.
The key word and answer to your question is "balanced".

Also the fact you tought captainz indeed needed any help or advice saddens me.

your stats there leave out the possiblity of CE so no improved trip either which I love on my monk they cant hit you if they are on their back

Vivanto
07-01-2009, 02:16 AM
your stats there leave out the possiblity of CE so no improved trip either which I love on my monk they cant hit you if they are on their back

I did say it needs equipment, tomes are such.
But agreed, trip is very nice on them, used to have it, but at later levels, when stunning fist dc becomes stronger I respeced it.

Enochroot
07-01-2009, 02:24 AM
40 40 40 40 40 40 just for you. Sorry, if you can't figure out what "right" means for a monk then you don't know what a monk is.

If someone dosen't know what the right gear is, it is very likely he can't really get them in the first place. But for that purpose there are already dozens of very well written definite AC guides out there.

Simply don't gimp it, it's already been stated even in this thread, and lots of others. A dex based monk is gimp dps, A raw str monk lacks dc or ac or both, and most average monks lack con. All these must be close to equal. Also obviously you would want to qualify for ac.

Here's just a quick tossout just fyi then.
human 15,15,14,10,15,8, didn't do any spiffy math behind it, give or take a point from either stat and pump another depending personal preference.
The key word and answer to your question is "balanced".

Also the fact you tought captainz indeed needed any help or advice saddens me.

I have no idea who captianz, or you, are.

His comment was he doesn't want to get teh uber lootz - can he still build a well built well geared monk? That's not normally covered in AC guides. If you're saying he already knows the answer, well, fine, maybe some noobie that doesn't is reading this.

Vivanto
07-01-2009, 02:32 AM
His comment was he doesn't want to get teh uber lootz - can he still build a well built well geared monk?

After you writing this sentence you still can't see the contradiction in it? Don't even get me started on the rest of your post.

FluffyCalico
07-01-2009, 02:47 AM
I have no idea who captianz, or you, are. Except now I know you're an ass.
.

I could have told you that by his sig

Enochroot
07-01-2009, 02:56 AM
After you writing this sentence you still can't see the contradiction in it? Don't even get me started on the rest of your post.

In many games you can get a decent build without grinding out top end gear. Unfortunately not really true here.

FluffyCalico
07-01-2009, 02:59 AM
In many games you can get a decent build without grinding out top end gear. Unfortunately not really true here.

Actually it is true here. Your starting stats, level ups, feats, and enhancements are your build. Gear is something you collect. Unless you respec your build didn't change you just got more gear. Gear may be what makes your build work, but gear is not part of your build. It's just your gear.

Enochroot
07-01-2009, 03:02 AM
Actually it is true here. Your starting stats, level ups, feats, and enhancements are your build. Gear is something you collect. Unless you respec your build didn't change you just got more gear. Gear may be what makes your build work, but gear is not part of your build. It's just your gear.

Ok grammer nazi.

In many games you can get a decent toon without grinding out top end gear. Unfortunately not really true here.

Monkey_Archer
07-01-2009, 03:07 AM
Adding a level up point into dex at level 16 and getting a +2 tome would increase ac by 1
A +2 wisdom tome adds another point
Exeptional dex, or wisdom kamas could add another few points
+4 insight ac kama or DT armor adds another 4 points
you will get an additional centered bonus at level 15
instead of a chattering ring you could get +3 dodge on DT armor (requires either alot of luck or alot of grinding though)
+7 bracers, +8 bracers, or DT armor + chaos guards add 1 or 2 points
CE if you have the intel, or defensive stance if you dont
Not sure how valuable dragonmarks are to your build but you could exchange these for dodge and 2-weapon defence

totals

10 base
11 dex (level up and +2 tome)
9 wis (+2 wisdom tome)
8 armor (either +8 bracers or DT+chaosguards)
5 deflection
4 centered
4 insight (DT or kama)
1 dodge feat
1 2-weapon defence
2 defensive fighting
-------------
55 without too much grinding
3 bark pot
4 shield clicky
---
62 selfbuffed

maybe a couple more points if you add exeptional stats on shroud kamas or get +3 dodge for DT armor

captain1z
07-01-2009, 03:17 AM
Adding a level up point into dex at level 16 and getting a +2 tome would increase ac by 1
A +2 wisdom tome adds another point
Exeptional dex, or wisdom kamas could add another few points
+4 insight ac kama or DT armor adds another 4 points
you will get an additional centered bonus at level 15
instead of a chattering ring you could get +3 dodge on DT armor (requires either alot of luck or alot of grinding though)
+7 bracers, +8 bracers, or DT armor + chaos guards add 1 or 2 points
CE if you have the intel, or defensive stance if you dont
Not sure how valuable dragonmarks are to your build but you could exchange these for dodge and 2-weapon defence

totals

10 base
11 dex (level up and +2 tome)
9 wis (+2 wisdom tome)
8 armor (either +8 bracers or DT+chaosguards)
5 deflection
4 centered
4 insight (DT or kama)
1 dodge feat
1 2-weapon defence
2 defensive fighting
-------------
55 without too much grinding
3 bark pot
4 shield clicky
---
62 selfbuffed

maybe a couple more points if you add exeptional stats on shroud kamas or get +3 dodge for DT armor

great response. and 100% doable. I like my dragonmarks...adds a little flavor and function to the build so I can stand the loss of 2 pionts (can get 1 back with alchemical crafting) Big AC jump from where I currently stand and the best part is "without too much grinding".

+1 rep thnks (the 1st piont ive ever given)

Uska
07-01-2009, 03:25 AM
great response. and 100% doable. I like my dragonmarks...adds a little flavor and function to the build so I can stand the loss of 2 pionts (can get 1 back with alchemical crafting) Big AC jump from where I currently stand and the best part is "without too much grinding".

+1 rep thnks (the 1st piont ive ever given)

Yah I gave him one as well for a helpful and informative answer which will help me as well.

Kaboth
07-01-2009, 10:25 AM
Just a point for other monks to remember, two weapon defense does not work with unarmed combat, for now. Viv's monk is similar to mine, except I started with a 12 Int (ate a +2 tome for skill points and CE) and 12 Charisma (im the weird one for this). I am still working on the insight bonus from DT as I am first and formost a handwraps user. However, I do have a Kama sets, I have a transmuters and Vorpals. I am still working on other gear, I have two sets of second teir GS items, need cleansing, still working on the third teir aspects, and other raid items I am looking for.

Monkey_Archer
07-01-2009, 11:09 AM
Just a point for other monks to remember, two weapon defense does not work with unarmed combat, for now. Viv's monk is similar to mine, except I started with a 12 Int (ate a +2 tome for skill points and CE) and 12 Charisma (im the weird one for this). I am still working on the insight bonus from DT as I am first and formost a handwraps user. However, I do have a Kama sets, I have a transmuters and Vorpals. I am still working on other gear, I have two sets of second teir GS items, need cleansing, still working on the third teir aspects, and other raid items I am looking for.

Good point.
I have insight 4 and exeptional wisdom on my DT... I would actually loose 1 ac by using icy rainments.
Icy only gives better ac if you are holding an insight kama.

jaasper
07-02-2009, 01:56 PM
I have always expected that select gear, not uber or elite gear, is fine for a high end monk.