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View Full Version : Re-evaluate mechanics for Sap



Jay203
03-06-2009, 01:17 PM
as it stands atm, sap acts like hypnotism with no save on the monsters that aren't IMMUNE to it and will break free when damaged.
this is, however, really bad for two-handed weapon users as the glancing blow produced by the attack from using Sap will knock the monster back into action. making the sap attempt completely useless.
something needs to be done about this :(:(:(

Inspire
03-06-2009, 01:27 PM
as it stands atm, sap acts like hypnotism with no save on the monsters that aren't IMMUNE to it and will break free when damaged.
this is, however, really bad for two-handed weapon users as the glancing blow produced by the attack from using Sap will knock the monster back into action. making the sap attempt completely useless.
something needs to be done about this :(:(:(

A 2hF using sap will interupt the attack sequence of the mob even if their glancing blow connects in the same attack, this can often lead to a "stutter" effect and will often leave the mob open to attacks without retaliation for the next few seconds.

The fix I would like to see with this particular feat is the cooldown.

Jay203
03-06-2009, 02:29 PM
A 2hF using sap will interupt the attack sequence of the mob even if their glancing blow connects in the same attack, this can often lead to a "stutter" effect and will often leave the mob open to attacks without retaliation for the next few seconds.

The fix I would like to see with this particular feat is the cooldown.

the point is the aggro management portion of the feat is completely ruined =(

Inspire
03-06-2009, 02:36 PM
the point is the aggro management portion of the feat is completely ruined =(

The point was that some people dont use it for aggro management but rather free attack oppertunities, or to stop a mob attack/casting progression.

Impaqt
03-06-2009, 02:36 PM
ok.. How do you Fix the THF Barbarian from breaking Hypnos, Sleeps, and Fascinates?
I think SAP is WAI. as you said, theres no Save. the fact that it gets broken by glancing blows is the same issue we face on all the other similar effects.

Stunning Bow is a much better feat choice.

WeaselKing
03-06-2009, 02:51 PM
ok.. How do you Fix the THF Barbarian from breaking Hypnos, Sleeps, and Fascinates?
I think SAP is WAI. as you said, theres no Save. the fact that it gets broken by glancing blows is the same issue we face on all the other similar effects.

Stunning Bow is a much better feat choice.

Using trip, stunning blow and sap to juggle timers and maximize effectiveness is a great way to play a tactician (as long as your party understands how to handle the one you sapped.) But ya, take stunning blow if only taking sap or it.

Jay203
03-06-2009, 06:24 PM
ok.. How do you Fix the THF Barbarian from breaking Hypnos, Sleeps, and Fascinates?
I think SAP is WAI. as you said, theres no Save. the fact that it gets broken by glancing blows is the same issue we face on all the other similar effects.

Stunning Bow is a much better feat choice.

=_=, someone outta give you a kick in the butt :P
no one said sap is better than stunning blow, i have both on tactical in fact
it's great to go into a group of mob, sap one, trip another, and stun the 3rd
1 is out of combat for 16 seconds, 1 needs to make balance check to get back up, and the third will be easy picking for auto crits if it fails the save
argghhH~! but the way it is right now, glancing blow from using sap while holding a two-handed weapon knocks the monster right back out of sap so sap is essentially wasted =(

tihocan
03-09-2009, 11:49 AM
I don't have sap so I can't test it, but assuming it works like trip, it does not have its own swing animation and does not break the attack sequence.
Which means if you time it on your second swing (that has no glancing blow) you should be fine.

Oxvon
03-09-2009, 11:56 AM
People use sap? Don't think I've ever seen it in action.