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View Full Version : Make Tempest similar to Toughness



WeiQuinn
02-20-2009, 11:44 AM
We all know they changed the Toughness feat enhancements so the all races can get some benefit from the feat more so that the feat itself.

I think that the Ranger Tempest enhancement should be changed so that if any character has Dodge, Mobility, Spring Attack, Two Weapon Fighting and Improved Two Weapon Fighting, they should be able to take the enhancement line.

They already have this with Arcane Archer (to a lesser degree) with either Rangers or Elves being able to take the enhancement with the appropriate pre-reqs.

Changing Tempest in this manner may alleviate some (not all) of the balance issues that people are screaming about on the forums.

Ranged combat is another issue entirely, but I won't get into that in this thread.

frugal_gourmet
02-20-2009, 11:48 AM
True 'dat.

I think there are other issues though. There should also be more legitimacy to:

1) Two-handed fighting (for all races)
2) Sword and board
3) Ranged

... for starters.

Obviously, the proposed change would still result in a lot of "build sameness" (official term).

Yaga_Nub
02-20-2009, 11:50 AM
still whining about this?

WeiQuinn
02-20-2009, 11:55 AM
I'm not whining... this is a suggestion forum, so I'm suggesting it for the Devs to read. It has no effect on me if they don't make this change.

What about the Fighter or Monk out there that wants Tempest, but doesn't want to take the Ranger levels? Why are we forcing cookie-cutter builds? What ever happened to the ability to utilize the character building process from Dungeons and Dragons to make unique characters?

Impaqt
02-20-2009, 11:56 AM
Problem is is that it should NOT be restricted (Or opened up as the case is here) to just Tempest.

The entre PrE system in this game is broken. Tempest is just one example. Very few PrE classes have class Requirements at all.

Tempest doesnt actually require "Improved" TWF Either.. It is a Granted feat inthe PrC.

Deadz
02-20-2009, 12:01 PM
still whining about this?

No offense to Yaga who i tend to like..

But to the op.. get use to this, I see alot of people commenting to suggestions as calling the people whiners.. when in fact, who's really whining?

I think if we all drank a cup of civility, maybe turbine would take the player base / forums a bit more seriously..

Hendrik
02-20-2009, 12:15 PM
No offense to Yaga who i tend to like..

But to the op.. get use to this, I see alot of people commenting to suggestions as calling the people whiners.. when in fact, who's really whining?

I think if we all drank a cup of civility, maybe turbine would take the player base / forums a bit more seriously..


In Yaga's defence, who is a nub, this question by the OP was answered/discussed;

http://forums.ddo.com/showpost.php?p=2062310&postcount=18

;)

Yaga_Nub
02-20-2009, 12:27 PM
No offense to Yaga who i tend to like..

But to the op.. get use to this, I see alot of people commenting to suggestions as calling the people whiners.. when in fact, who's really whining?

I think if we all drank a cup of civility, maybe turbine would take the player base / forums a bit more seriously..

None taken! :)

It's true this is just a suggestion but if you will do a little search, this is probably the 912th time it's been suggested. Back around the 128th time it was suggested the devs said Go F yourselves we are doing what we want to do no matter what the guidebooks say. So the remaining 784 times this has been suggested have probably done nothing but make the devs snicker. And Mod 9 is probably getting delayed like Mod 8 was because they spend more time laughing at this suggestion than doing actual work.

Sorry.

Borror0
02-20-2009, 12:28 PM
still whining about this?
Yaga, you're annoying today. Had a bad day?

Explain me how is the OP whining.

Hendrik
02-20-2009, 12:30 PM
Yaga, you're annoying today. Had a bad day?

Explain me how is the OP whining.

I pee'd in his cheerio's....

:o

Yaga_Nub
02-20-2009, 12:32 PM
Yaga, you're annoying today. Had a bad day?

Explain me how is the OP whining.

Because once you're told that something isn't going to happen and you keep asking for it anyway you are, in my opinion, whining. Or you're an idiot and I don't think the OP is an idiot. Well not yet anyway but I guess there's always time to change my mind.

Like I said in the other thread today, we need to think up a different angle to attack this issue because what has been used to date hasn't worked and just constantly asking and giving the same reasons for changing it aren't working.

Borror0
02-20-2009, 12:36 PM
Because once you're told that something isn't going to happen and you keep asking for it anyway you are, in my opinion, whining.
One, we haven't been told anything about this, ever.

Two, while this topic has been brought up a few times, it was only but scratched each time.

Three, if you honestly think that the Devs do what they want, you're wrong. They do what they can igven time limitations.

Yaga_Nub
02-20-2009, 12:39 PM
Three, if you honestly think that the Devs do what they want, you're wrong. They do what they can igven time limitations.

Which is a very scary thought when you think about it.

Borror0
02-20-2009, 12:41 PM
Which is a very scary thought when you think about it.
How is that?

maddmatt70
02-20-2009, 12:51 PM
Because once you're told that something isn't going to happen and you keep asking for it anyway you are, in my opinion, whining. Or you're an idiot and I don't think the OP is an idiot. Well not yet anyway but I guess there's always time to change my mind.

Like I said in the other thread today, we need to think up a different angle to attack this issue because what has been used to date hasn't worked and just constantly asking and giving the same reasons for changing it aren't working.

Nice quote in your signature Yaga.. Haha, It looks familiar.

I agree with what your post here. The OP is engaging in fantasy land. I think everybody probably even the devs think that it would be nice if prestige enhancements functioned like prestige classes in D&D, but it is isn't happening. It probably is a heck of lot of programming work to make it happen. I am very happy with the current unparalleled character customization DDO offers in comparison to other mmos. Are there balance issues? For sure, but a more quality suggestion for the OP to make would be to make class X better so it is more competitive with the tempest. For instance, kensai and stalwart defenders should be better and Z is how he/she thinks it should be done..

Strakeln
02-20-2009, 12:54 PM
Interesting idea. Take it further!

Yaga_Nub
02-20-2009, 01:21 PM
How is that?

Well they only get to do what they have the time to do right?

What if they wanted to do lots more nerfs but don't have the time to do them?

Or what if they wanted to really screw up the balance of the classes with new items/spells/enhancements but don't have the time to put them in the game?

:eek:

Hendrik
02-20-2009, 01:24 PM
Well they only get to do what they have the time to do right?

What if they wanted to do lots more nerfs but don't have the time to do them?

Or what if they wanted to really screw up the balance of the classes with new items/spells/enhancements but don't have the time to put them in the game?

:eek:


I like the way you think.


Where can I subscribe to your newsletter?

:cool:

Borror0
02-20-2009, 01:29 PM
What if they wanted to do lots more nerfs but don't have the time to do them?

Or what if they wanted to really screw up the balance of the classes with new items/spells/enhancements but don't have the time to put them in the game?
If you're busy fixing all that breaks, there is no time for maintenance.

Deadz
02-20-2009, 02:27 PM
If you're busy fixing all that breaks, there is no time for maintenance.

Maintenance, we don't need no stinking badgers!? Or something like that.

toughguyjoe
02-20-2009, 02:40 PM
If you're busy fixing all that breaks, there is no time for maintenance.

If you advertise your game better perhaps you'll get more subs. If you get more subs perhaps you'll have more time for Maintenance, and also to Take the time to make things that don't just break shortly after implimentation

Maybe Bor just really wants a job.


Turbine, send that boy an application.

Borror0
02-20-2009, 02:52 PM
If you advertise your game better perhaps you'll get more subs. If you get more subs perhaps you'll have more time for Maintenance, and also to Take the time to make things that don't just break shortly after implimentation
It takes money for advertisement but we don't have that. Money comes from subs, subs comes from new players and keeping the current players' interest. New players can be brought through advertisement but we can afford that. We can keep the current players' interest through releasing new feature and content but creating new features and content takes time and time makes us loose players' interest... so we try to figure what is the best time investment we can put in features and content to gather players.

This includes:

Fixing bugs.
Fixing imbalances.
Adding new quests.
Adding new spells, enhancements, feats and items.

Probably that their plan is to improve the game and give another marketing try, after.

We don't know what their plan is, but if it is, it's not a stupid one. It's hard to gain a second chance, even more a third.

Try to never waste it.

WeiQuinn
02-20-2009, 07:55 PM
*snip* The OP is engaging in fantasy land. I think everybody probably even the devs think that it would be nice if prestige enhancements functioned like prestige classes in D&D, but it is isn't happening. It probably is a heck of lot of programming work to make it happen. I am very happy with the current unparalleled character customization DDO offers in comparison to other mmos. Are there balance issues? For sure, but a more quality suggestion for the OP to make would be to make class X better so it is more competitive with the tempest. For instance, kensai and stalwart defenders should be better and Z is how he/she thinks it should be done..

If I had more suggestions on how to fix the other classes to improve them to Tempest level, believe me, I'd be posting them. I probably shouldn't have restricted my post to Tempest, but since I play mostly Rangers, I can't really speak about the other classes and how to fix them without possibly ruining them...