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View Full Version : Normal / Hard / Elite ? why we have to do it 3 times???



Azon.Lightbringer
06-16-2008, 06:17 AM
Hi Dev´s

I just love this game, and congratulations for your continuous improving of it.

I just got things to ask:

Why the hell we have to do the quests 3 times? The majority of the players already did the adventures a lot of times in each difficulty level before begining a new character and be unable to open the quest any level he wants. My request, and i hope all players agree with me, is like to "unlock" once and for all the harder difficult levels from the begining. Maybe it can be "unlocked" by reaching a certain number of favors with any of your characters (like happens with the drow class).

Please people, support my request!!!

fefnir3284
06-16-2008, 06:34 AM
well long long ago the old head of development (I think) said that players enjoyed doing quests many many times, cause the feel of doing it perfect was an ultimate goal.

true reason?

there isnt much content compared to other games, but thats one reason why i stay. I play two games, ddo and wow, and they couldnt be more polar opposites...

sipior
06-16-2008, 07:24 AM
Why the hell we have to do the quests 3 times? The majority of the players already did the adventures a lot of times in each difficulty level before begining a new character and be unable to open the quest any level he wants. My request, and i hope all players agree with me, is like to "unlock" once and for all the harder difficult levels from the begining. Maybe it can be "unlocked" by reaching a certain number of favors with any of your characters (like happens with the drow class).

Please people, support my request!!!

I have to tell you, I can't get very excited about your proposal. You're going to want to do every quest a few times anyway, to optimise XP gain. Failing that, if you are truly desperate to have a go on Elite, you generally have at least one party member who can open it at that level (or at least Hard). Sometimes you get unlucky in that regard, but it is hardly an earth-shattering problem. I actually enjoy playing DDO, and so have no real problem with playing quests multiple times. By the way, you don't have to do anything in DDO, and understanding this point may alleviate a great deal of the mental anguish you appear to be inflicting upon yourself.

Rekker
06-16-2008, 07:47 AM
well long long ago the old head of development (I think) said that players enjoyed doing quests many many times, cause the feel of doing it perfect was an ultimate goal.

LOL...I remember that too. The worst part was, every time people found a way to run a quest better, the DEVs would change it /shakeshead

Riddikulus
06-16-2008, 08:05 AM
IMO ability to open elite without opening norm/hard would be a good favor reward... maybe for 3000 favor or something like that.

tihocan
06-16-2008, 12:01 PM
You can already unlock elite on the majority of quests with your alts. The few exceptions are:
- chain quests with more parts than the number of alts you have
- some quests that require you to enter to open (if you care about XP)
Honestly, it's really not hard to just repeat these quests while leveling up. Especially since most quest chains give good XP.

Pellegro
06-16-2008, 12:09 PM
I support the OP.

When I'm rolling up a new character with the goal of getting him to endgame, I want to get all the favor as I go.

Not being able to open quests on elite that I only want to run once is a hindrance. It causes me to have to get others (including other of my toons) to open it, drop group, then bring in the character who is going to actually run the quest. This can take time that I'd rather spend in the quest. More often than not, I'll modify the order of quests that I want to run simply to keep on task. That's not my first choice.

I don't know if its an easy "flag" to implement, but if it is easy, I'd love to see it.

Zenako
06-16-2008, 12:11 PM
Well I find that the same quest will play very differently depending on the setting, mainly with the change in spells the mob casters have access to.

As someone mentioned, if you just enjoy playing, then it is not anywhere near as much an issue. For veterans, who have higher level characters, if the group really only wants to run it once on elite (Favor runnning for example), they can just swap toons for a few moments, pop the quest open and then switch back once someone enters the quest. Not much of an issue.

Beherit_Baphomar
06-16-2008, 12:16 PM
You want to cut content by 1/3rd?

Yeah, the Devs'll jump on that...

sigtrent
06-16-2008, 12:17 PM
Considering there is already a very easy method for opening quests on hard and elite without having done them before, I don't see much harm in making it work that way by default.

Many people would still run them on all difficulties for the extra expereince points (I do) so I really don't think it would be sacrificing any real content.

In some ways I like the idea that you earn the more difficult quests, but in practice it doesn't really work that way for most players. (although the OP seems to be having difficulty with it)

Either way I don't see it as being a big deal.

sigtrent
06-16-2008, 12:21 PM
there isnt much content compared to other games, but thats one reason why i stay. I play two games, ddo and wow, and they couldnt be more polar opposites...

Having played a lot of other games, I have to say there isn't really that little content in DDO, its just that it can be consumed very quickly. Some folks talk about the small city, but if you sticth all the zones together its really quite big. And the number of dungeons dwarfs any other game I know of, so if you stick all of them together it would make a pretty monumental map.

It's just that you don't waste much time in DDO roaming around looking for stuff or traveling from zone a to zone b to deliver some doodad or another. I've no doubt there are bigger games than DDO (WOW), but there are certainly some smaller ones (Conan).

Avelin
06-16-2008, 12:59 PM
I say once you are 5 levels ahead of the quest you should automatically be able to open it on any difficulty. So if it's a level 2 quest at level 7 you can open hard or elite even if you've never run that quest before. I think it's silly to have to run Waterworks 3 times with your capped character to get the favor.

Dariuss
06-16-2008, 12:59 PM
I don't think there's any lack fo content here, it's just that alot of players, 'powergamers' especially, tend to skip 80% of the content whilst racing to endgame

Arianrhod
06-16-2008, 01:09 PM
Not this old argument again....sigh.

You want the favor, you can take the 5 minutes to run the quest on normal/hard before elite (or find an elite opener). You want to get rid of an inconvenience locking away content from those who can't abide tedium, look to the raids that make you collect relics/sigil pieces, etc. to open them :P

Hendrik
06-16-2008, 01:23 PM
You want to cut content by 1/3rd?

Yeah, the Devs'll jump on that...

Add in people will 'mostly' just do Elite then move on, so yea, far as bad idea's go, this is in top ten, again.

Not only cut the content by a 3rd, but more XP for doing that solo or short manned. Need to STOP making changes to make this like other games and start thinking up idea's that will make DDO stand out, all on it's own.

Zaodon
06-16-2008, 02:15 PM
They already have this technology in place for "Devil Assault". You do not need to "unlock" hard or elite. You simply click on the quest entrance and all 3 levels, Normal/Hard/Elite are available right away.

They simply need to make this the way all quests work. If players want to do Normal and Hard (and solo), so be it. If they don't, so be it.

Wow, a choice. Imagine that!

Zenako
06-16-2008, 02:28 PM
They already have this technology in place for "Devil Assault". You do not need to "unlock" hard or elite. You simply click on the quest entrance and all 3 levels, Normal/Hard/Elite are available right away.

They simply need to make this the way all quests work. If players want to do Normal and Hard (and solo), so be it. If they don't, so be it.

Wow, a choice. Imagine that!

However, the Barracks is unlike any other quest, it gives no Favor. It is more akin to the Giant Caves.. a very tough giant caves. It was also created that way specifically to enable all players a reasonable chance to experience the conclusion of the marketplace events in about the same real time. It was essentially three different quests all at the entrance, since the content of the three levels of mobs inside dramatically increases in challenge at each bump.

It would be deterimental to new players to enable them to open challenge levels that they have little to no chance of being able to defeat in the harbor with new characters. It is but a matter of a few moments to get an elite opener for quests for those veterans looking to power level/favor their toons. Imagine a new player, who decides to try WW on elite with a new character and gets owned. Do this a few times and pretty soon you get discouraged. Going thru normal, hard and then elite, actually gives the player a lot more opportunity to learn the game and become ready to try harder settings. You have to keep in mind the experience of a new player in the game, not just the vet with their 20th toon build.

Riddikulus
06-16-2008, 02:37 PM
You want to cut content by 1/3rd?

Yeah, the Devs'll jump on that...
I don't consider the 3 (or 4) difficulty settings to be extra "content"... it's just extra "grind".

If I want to grind I can do GH quests repeatedly on my various characters to try to qualify for the raids (finally got my 4th into Reaver yesterday, none in Abbott nor Shroud yet), or if all else fails I've got a WoW icon on my desktop that gives me plenty of grind. I don't need anymore grind here... less would be better.

Azon.Lightbringer
06-16-2008, 02:46 PM
I´m not saying that it should be prohibited to open on easier difficult levels. I am just saying that people who already did the quests on elite and already got to the end game stuff should have the option to open the quest on any difficult level.

Why are we obligated to "cheat" the game by bringing a character who already did the quest to open it on elite and then go away, just because dev´s think that doing quests 3 times with each character you get is funny.

People who would want to maximize XP would still be able to do the quast as many times he wants in wich level, but people who prefer to do other quests shouldn´t be forced to do it 3 times.

And, as i said on my post, i should be a reward for achieving a number X favor with any character, so only people who already have a lot of knoledge about the game could open in whatever difficult level they want.

moorewr
06-16-2008, 02:55 PM
It would be nice if it unlocked the harder settings for once you'd gotten 5 or more levels higher than the quest level. It would make it easier to go back and bust out 1750 favor... I get derailed on my 16s when I'm soloing and realize I'd have to redo the same quest from normal on up to get anywhere.. nope, time to switch characters.

Samy
06-16-2008, 03:13 PM
I agree it'd be a nice favor reward, for very high favor, say 2500. Once you have done THAT many quests on your main, I think you should be trusted with the judgment of what difficulty level you want to take.

Stanley_Nicholas
06-16-2008, 04:35 PM
When DDO first launched, everybody was able to open every quest on any difficulty, regardless of whether they had done it before. They changed it to where you had to unlock higher difficulties because too many people were going into quests on elite that they weren't familiar with or able to handle, getting frustrated by repeated party wipes, and cancelling their subscriptions.

They went overboard to resolve an issue IMO, but that's why it is the way it is today.

Pyromaniac
06-16-2008, 04:48 PM
That's content for you :)