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View Full Version : 8 runs and counting....this is ridiculous



efreet5
05-19-2008, 03:50 AM
The idea of EQUIVALENT loot should be looked at again. I've run the frickin deleras series 8 times now on my toon that is now 14th lvl and i still haven't gotten the cartouche in a reward list. +1 axe of tendonslice 2% oh great! :mad: The man that implemented this system should be drawn and quartered for stupidity of the highest order!

Hvymetal
05-19-2008, 04:56 AM
Blame all the players that were sick of getting the same static reward list each time.......

Aesop
05-19-2008, 05:31 AM
Other suggestions have been put forward

1st run full list
2nd run half the list (other half random generated gear)
3rd run other half of the list (rest random generated gear)
4th run first half of the list (rest random generated gear)
...see the pattern...etc

that was my suggestion

Aesop

Bunker
05-19-2008, 06:05 AM
The idea of EQUIVALENT loot should be looked at again. I've run the frickin deleras series 8 times now on my toon that is now 14th lvl and i still haven't gotten the cartouche in a reward list. +1 axe of tendonslice 2% oh great! :mad: The man that implemented this system should be drawn and quartered for stupidity of the highest order!

I want to get this straight. You are lvl 14 still trying to get an item that frankly, was great in the day, but now that you are lvl 14 and soo to be capped, you will find that item will soon take up space in your bank, space in-which has more value then the actual item.

Do we have moderator that have the power to close threads on the basis of just being too lame?

Riorik
05-19-2008, 06:47 AM
Why would you say the Cartouche isn't great today?

Until you replace it with something better - Titan or Shroud raid loot, it's the only other game in town. For some, raid loot is viewed as practically inaccessible. Some players when adding up all the raids they've run between all of their characters are still in single digits.

Bunker
05-19-2008, 07:06 AM
Why would you say the Cartouche isn't great today?

Until you replace it with something better - Titan or Shroud raid loot, it's the only other game in town. For some, raid loot is viewed as practically inaccessible. Some players when adding up all the raids they've run between all of their characters are still in single digits.

Check out the OP's Sig. Doesn't look like someone that is new in the Realm.

death_smurf
05-19-2008, 07:12 AM
I want to get this straight. You are lvl 14 still trying to get an item that frankly, was great in the day, but now that you are lvl 14 and soo to be capped, you will find that item will soon take up space in your bank, space in-which has more value then the actual item.

Do we have moderator that have the power to close threads on the basis of just being too lame?

since there is only one other equipable umd item that is better than the cartouche(gloves from titan) i fail to see how the cartouche has lost any appeal to a umd build. in regards to shroud crafted items the umd bonus from charisma skills stacks with the cartouche bonus. so not really sure what u are basing your statement on but gl with that line of thought.

MysticTheurge
05-19-2008, 07:14 AM
The idea of EQUIVALENT loot should be looked at again.

The random items are equivalent in price.

Of course none of them are going to be the equivalent of a bonus-to-UMD item, because that can't be randomly generated.

Despite all the "We're doing it because people got tired of the same list of items" blather, one has to assume that this is all really working as intended, and that it was intended to make it harder to get the significantly-more-powerful-than-average static end rewards on any given character.

That said, I'd be fine with a system that gave you the full list of statics the first time you ran the quest and then used the current system for all subsequent rewards.

Tin_Dragon
05-19-2008, 07:37 AM
It was stated before, and I am sure since,

on all chains that have named end loot, Delera's, Tangleroot, Co6, Threnal etc... There should now be a similar mechanic as Raid 20th, Only down to 5 runs (n-h-e is 3 runs, 2 more is plenty for any chain in this game) and at the 5th run, and EVERY run there after, you get the FULL STATIC LIST. Period. That is not too much to ask, too much is running Tanglroot a dozen times on 1 toon and being capped at 16, and still not haveing a single Visor on him.

Emili
05-19-2008, 07:45 AM
I want to get this straight. You are lvl 14 still trying to get an item that frankly, was great in the day, but now that you are lvl 14 and soo to be capped, you will find that item will soon take up space in your bank, space in-which has more value then the actual item.

Do we have moderator that have the power to close threads on the basis of just being too lame?

Aside from the cartouche (+3 umd, +1 Int) his options are not so varried...
seven finger gloves (+5 umd, +10 DD) - Titan raid loot,
stave of seer (+5 umd, +2 int, +2 wis, true seeing clickie) - rare drop in Ghola,
Vial Blasphemy (+5 dex, +3 umd, power drain clickie) - Abbot raid loot
Plus he can run shroud a lot and build an item with exceptional cha skill bonus's of and thier are the rare persuasion item drops like the circlette.

Now then the cartouche is a necklace, the gloves from abbot are probably the nicest umd item the titan gloves maybe but maybe not as would typically will be a toggle in and out for using your umd as a glove spot usually is dex or str ... the staff is a toggle completely. In a nutshell I would have to say the cartouche is one of those items which is still very suitable in a build at level 16.

A shrould built item would be nice also but would also stack with any of the other umd items above so I would have to say the cartouche is probably one of the best items in the game still after all this time. It fits in a slot easily toggleable and typically where only wis, con and protection items fit... the abbot gloves are by far the best umd item in game but not many are out there farming that quest, thus would probably take 80 times the time to get 8 runs in ... much easier to get the cartouche. It is still by far the best piece of static loot from the lower quests available and competes with those attained from very heavy raiding. My bard still uses the things and has an extra 2 in the bank... I destroyed her seven finger gloves by accident over a year ago and still have yet to replace them as I have 8 other characters and a ton more raids to farm outside titan.

Accelerando
05-19-2008, 08:34 AM
It is still by far the best piece of static loot from the lower quests available and competes with those attained from very heavy raiding.

QFT.

I for one would like to see UMD enhancements on characters who have it as a CLASS SKILL!
Why bards and rogues cannot take this is beyond me. :mad:

Furbitor
05-19-2008, 09:17 AM
Ha! 8 lousy runs. If you really want them, just keep runnin'. A friend and myself ran Delera's 34 times before he finnaly got offered the Iron mancles....

Buck up and enjoy the ride... you just started.

lobode
05-19-2008, 09:20 AM
Something really should be done as that was one of the worst changes that have happened in this game. Its almost impossible to get a group for threnals now and when you do get through it all and you get the screaming arrows and the other worthless named loot its just frustrating and that frustration gets even worse after you've gone through south 5 times and still not get the reward you want. I mean to even get to south you end up running west and east about 2-3 times each to catch others up. Its lame and it should have never been changed. It should at least be like raid loot where after a certain amount of times you get the full list.

Kaldaka
05-19-2008, 09:35 AM
the staff is a toggle


No kidding ... how can you equip a staff and a scroll of raise dead at the same time???

You can't.

Cartouche is the shiznits!!! :D Besides the rare Titan gloves, its the best UMD item in the game, easy to get and very viable at level 16.

ChainsawXIV
05-19-2008, 10:10 AM
Aside from the cartouche (+3 umd, +1 Int) his options are not so varried...
seven finger gloves (+5 umd, +10 DD) - Titan raid loot,
stave of seer (+5 umd, +2 int, +2 wis, true seeing clickie) - rare drop in Ghola,
Vial Blasphemy (+5 dex, +3 umd, power drain clickie) - Abbot raid loot


It's not technically UMD specific, but I'd include this on the list because it might as well be. :p
Cloak of the Silver Concord (+2 Cha, +10 Haggle, +10 Diplomacy, +3 Cha Skills) - Dragon / VoN
Not that that changes anything at all (it doesn't), just might as well be thorough.

MysticTheurge
05-19-2008, 10:34 AM
There's also Command (+2 to cha skills) on armors. Which is actually pretty prevalent, though it would be nice if it showed up on some other things too (shields at the very least, maybe some other slots too).

Strakeln
05-19-2008, 11:07 AM
Blame all the players that were sick of getting the same static reward list each time.......Or blame the misleading devs who said we'd get loot that was equivalent.

Like, instead of +3 str bracers, we would get +3 str gloves. Not gloves of remove fear 3x.

mgoldb2
05-19-2008, 11:13 AM
opps should finish reading thread before posting was just pointing out that cloak from dragon gives +3 to umd also but ChainsawXIV beat me to it.

Angelus_dead
05-19-2008, 11:18 AM
Or blame the misleading devs who said we'd get loot that was equivalent.
No. Blame the misleading PLAYERS who said we'd get equivalent loot, and then refused to stop spreading that lie even when the obvious truth was repeatedly explained to them.

Dungnmaster001
05-19-2008, 11:58 AM
The loot is equivalent in price... not necessarily in value.

Aesop
05-19-2008, 12:49 PM
I like the random loot I can get from some of these

+3 Wis rings from tangleroot
+3 Cha or Int Rings from Deleras
Featherfall and POison Immunity items from Waterworks...


I just think the drop of the named stuff needs to be a little more consistant

Aesop

Strakeln
05-19-2008, 01:51 PM
No. Blame the misleading PLAYERS who said we'd get equivalent loot, and then refused to stop spreading that lie even when the obvious truth was repeatedly explained to them.It's like making a deal with the devil.

The players asked for equivalent loot, meaning equivalent utility.

The devs gave us equivalent loot, meaning equivalent price.

After 1.5 years, it was abundantly clear that the players judged loot by utility, not price.

Uska
05-19-2008, 02:06 PM
I did delera's around 20 times on one character never got the cartouche gave up when my umd was high enough that I ddint need it. so I never got it was a bummer to be sure.

Ciaran
05-19-2008, 02:15 PM
I want to get this straight. You are lvl 14 still trying to get an item that frankly, was great in the day, but now that you are lvl 14 and soo to be capped, you will find that item will soon take up space in your bank, space in-which has more value then the actual item.

Do we have moderator that have the power to close threads on the basis of just being too lame?

I don't think you know what you're talking about. My level capped paladin still carries the Cartouche as I've not gotten any of the raid loot that's equivalent/better and only recently did my lowbie pull the Circlet of Persuasion.

I guess you've never played a UMD build or something, because the Cartouche is one of those things that is valuable at all levels unless you are lucky enough to get the previously mentioned raid loot or the Circlet of Persuasion, which is a random and rare drop.

As for the OP, I feel your pain. My 9 ranger has soloed TR now going on 15 times and I still haven't gotten the Crimson Gemstone.

efreet5
05-19-2008, 02:17 PM
As has been said the utility of the cartouche cannot be replaced except by raid loot, which, to be quite frank is even harder to get in most cases. Titan? hehe, i've never gotten anything from there cept on 20th/40th runs on my toons and i dont wanna have to go there that long. Command? I never liked it as it usually takes the place of a better suffix that could be on the armor. My armor now gives me both dr and ac which is much better. The beauty of the cartouche is that you can quick swap it in when you need to and then switch back as there are absolutely no great necklaces for a melee toon in this game. Scourge choker is gimp if worn all the time you don't get hit enough to keep from getting 10 sec debuff.

As for Abbott raid loot....it exists? :p

No one ever asked for loot that was equivalent in price. We wanted more variety, but, frankly, these items are not so overpowered that they'll last that long. Cartouche and Carnifex are some of the only items i can name off the random lists that are even worth anything in the end game. The other loot? By then it should be discarded or one will have a rough time.

Ciaran
05-19-2008, 02:22 PM
As has been said the utility of the cartouche cannot be replaced except by raid loot...

Or the CoP I mentioned above. Although, after two years of frequent play I've seen it drop once to memory, and that was relatively recently, so it's probably as elusive as raid loot, if not more so. I've seen the Sunblade drop more frequently.

It's nice running Delera's with the promise of getting a +3 UMD item, and usually from level 4-8 you're running that quest a bunch for the XP anyway. But yeah, it's frustrating to never get the one item you are looking for. I don't think my Barbarian got Carnifex until my 8th or 9th run at level 10 or 11! :p

Bogenbroom
05-19-2008, 03:21 PM
2 Points.

1) I have several capped characters with the cartouche generally equipped. It is a very solid piece.

2) The Op's premise is faulty. It assumes that we, as players, have the "god" given right to whichever piece of loot we want. That is not/should not be the case. I would compare it to black jack. You only have a certain percentage change to win each hand and you really can't complain when you don't. Those are just the odds.

tigerheart_iv
05-19-2008, 03:54 PM
antoher item that will become useful soon is black widow bracers. I can never get those to drop for new casters when it would be somewhat useful to them. How many new monks will be running for an xtra 4 ac soon? Pretty sure i will be chasing those a bit :D

BillBob
05-19-2008, 04:03 PM
Relying purely on randomization is poor game design and only creates bad game experiences for players. The loot reward in DDO is a part of the reward experience for time spent playing. When the loot is generated with a pure randomness there is a statistical chance that the loot may not be in their mind 'justly' rewarded for their efforts. As the OP states, after 8 runs of a 4 part quest the character has not received the reward that best suits their play style and/or character design.

This experience frustrates players where they have correctly applied a significant amount of time playing (and Paying) with their efforts not being positively reinforced (Pavlov's Dog). As with most things, bad experiences are more commonly communicated in social circles than good experiences thus tainting the community. In some cases these stories of woe can become legendary and can further distort the perception of an aspect of the game regardless of statistical fact.

As an example, a player could run the Stormreaver Raid the first 20 times and not receive a reward that is relevant to their character. The players frustration ebbs a bit when their realize that the could potentially find the item on the reward list for 20th completion. Sadly, this reward list is also randomized and there is a good chance that they still will not receive the reward they wish after paying for a subscription for 2 months or more. If this character is very 'unlucky' they may NEVER receive a reward that they desire as they are the victim of this sad statical possibility.

Every player will have their limit to how much of an activity they will dedicate time to before they give up without being rewarded. This negative experience will contribute to the player leaving and ultimately a loss of revenue.

That said, there has to be a balance, of course, but in my opinion the developers will have to investigate and balance the randomness issues in this game with predictable reward systems for time invested.

Absolute Randomness:

Loot, Abbot Raid Teleportations, Reward Lists, Component Drops, etc

boldarblood
05-19-2008, 04:05 PM
I'm in favor of completely random loot.

That being said, get yourself some command armor or robes. While not the full 3, its still worth 2, gets the job done for the most part.

MysticTheurge
05-19-2008, 04:21 PM
antoher item that will become useful soon is black widow bracers. I can never get those to drop for new casters when it would be somewhat useful to them. How many new monks will be running for an xtra 4 ac soon? Pretty sure i will be chasing those a bit :D

Potions of Mage Armor are equally effective and far easier to come by.

redoubt
05-19-2008, 06:04 PM
I want to get this straight. You are lvl 14 still trying to get an item that frankly, was great in the day, but now that you are lvl 14 and soo to be capped, you will find that item will soon take up space in your bank, space in-which has more value then the actual item.

Do we have moderator that have the power to close threads on the basis of just being too lame?

I use the golden cartouche on all my umd characters. Its a great item.

Aesop
05-19-2008, 07:57 PM
Potions of Mage Armor are equally effective and far easier to come by.

nah with the number of times I run my lowbies through WW I usually have the option to take the BW bracers 3-5 time each character.

Infact I already have a set for my monk just hanging around

Aesop

Mindspat
05-19-2008, 09:10 PM
Why would you say the Cartouche isn't great today?

Until you replace it with something better - Titan or Shroud raid loot, it's the only other game in town. For some, raid loot is viewed as practically inaccessible. Some players when adding up all the raids they've run between all of their characters are still in single digits.

then maybe it's your explanation which measures its rarity?

Bogenbroom
05-19-2008, 09:41 PM
As an example, a player could run the Stormreaver Raid the first 20 times and not receive a reward that is relevant to their character. The players frustration ebbs a bit when their realize that the could potentially find the item on the reward list for 20th completion. Sadly, this reward list is also randomized and there is a good chance that they still will not receive the reward they wish after paying for a subscription for 2 months or more. If this character is very 'unlucky' they may NEVER receive a reward that they desire as they are the victim of this sad statical possibility.

Every player will have their limit to how much of an activity they will dedicate time to before they give up without being rewarded. This negative experience will contribute to the player leaving and ultimately a loss of revenue.

That said, there has to be a balance, of course, but in my opinion the developers will have to investigate and balance the randomness issues in this game with predictable reward systems for time invested.

Absolute Randomness:

Loot, Abbot Raid Teleportations, Reward Lists, Component Drops, etc


I fully get you and I think the way I would lean would be more toward only having named loot drop on your first run at any difficulty level. I don't think the devs would ever go that way, because named loot gives folks a reason to run quests repeatedly... but that is just why I would do it, because the model currently is for folks to run the same handful of quests repeatedly. Mostly raids.

It is probably just me, but I think named loot is a bit too common. It makes it feel, to me, less special. I am sure I am in the monority, though.

Kraldor
05-19-2008, 10:05 PM
http://ddo1liners.co.uk/archives/107.jpg
That pretty much sums it up.

Strakeln
05-19-2008, 10:33 PM
That pretty much sums it up.Indeed. Well done, sir.

Auran82
05-20-2008, 03:50 AM
My bard has been wearing a fearsome robe of command since level 6. But then again, caster bards (with a decent Cha) don't really need UMD items that much.

Tin_Dragon
05-20-2008, 07:41 AM
There's also Command (+2 to cha skills) on armors. Which is actually pretty prevalent, though it would be nice if it showed up on some other things too (shields at the very least, maybe some other slots too).

Robes of course, which are easily changed. Maybe you meant to include that with Armor?

JTsays
05-20-2008, 09:00 AM
I'd love to see a dialog line at the reward NPC giving us the choice between a list of the 'static' items or a list of random stuff. You'd get yer lewtz and have a reason to come back again.

Allistair
05-20-2008, 09:14 AM
nah with the number of times I run my lowbies through WW I usually have the option to take the BW bracers 3-5 time each character.

Infact I already have a set for my monk just hanging around

Aesop

LMAO no you don't, they bind

MysticTheurge
05-20-2008, 10:46 AM
Infact I already have a set for my monk just hanging around

Um... yeah. They bind.

So unless you have a character you're planning to multi-class into Monk, you don't already have a pair for your monk.

And it doesn't change the fact that Mage Armor potions last 10 minutes and are trivially cheap and freely available (without having to quest and hope you get offered them).

Lyletuba
05-20-2008, 01:45 PM
LOL. And to think - I was upset when I had to run it 5 times on my Bard/Rog. ;)

Re-running the lowbie quests with a capped character kinda makes me feel like that kid that was left back in school too many times. Ya know, that kid that was shaving and driving 3 years before anyone else in his grade. :D

Melkor_The_Mighty
05-20-2008, 01:57 PM
Why would you say the Cartouche isn't great today?

Until you replace it with something better - Titan or Shroud raid loot, it's the only other game in town. For some, raid loot is viewed as practically inaccessible. Some players when adding up all the raids they've run between all of their characters are still in single digits.

Not True the cloak of persuasion from The Velah Dragon raid a lvl 10 quest have a +3 modifier that goes toward UMD, same bonus as Cartouche but with +10 haggle and something else on it.

Just go kill velah a few times as other can leave you items they dont want you can get one with far less difficulty.

Gunga
05-20-2008, 02:03 PM
QFT.

I for one would like to see UMD enhancements on characters who have it as a CLASS SKILL!
Why bards and rogues cannot take this is beyond me. :mad:

Your bard or rogue doesn't have enough umd? Waaa? ;)

Loot system is broke. Please fix it now.

Gunga
05-20-2008, 02:12 PM
2 Points.

1) I have several capped characters with the cartouche generally equipped. It is a very solid piece.

2) The Op's premise is faulty. It assumes that we, as players, have the "god" given right to whichever piece of loot we want. That is not/should not be the case. I would compare it to black jack. You only have a certain percentage change to win each hand and you really can't complain when you don't. Those are just the odds.

1. Yup
2. Nah. If we run a quest x # of times, we should get what we're looting for.

There was a post up here recently where this poor schlep ran the Titan 80 times for the belt and it didn't drop. That's enough to get a guy to stop playing. I'm not sure 5 runs is the answer, but there should be a point where the grind gets us what we're looking for. Is it 20? 40? 60? 100? If it were 50, and we get a full list of every possibility, I think people would grind more. I have 4 toons who have done the reaver 20 times, and I stopped grinding the minute the shroud came out. If at 50, I knew that I was going to get exactly what I needed, I'd be grinding it every 3 days with all toons. Same with the queen, which I haven't run for a few MODs. I pretty much gave up on the Titan after reading that poor guy's story...I ain't running 80 times to be stiffed.

MysticTheurge
05-20-2008, 02:30 PM
2. Nah. If we run a quest x # of times, we should get what we're looting for.

You do. X just varies greatly from person to person.

Gunga
05-20-2008, 03:13 PM
You do. X just varies greatly from person to person.

You don't. x must = getting what you want. Some haven't in 80 runs. No good.

You could say, well just run it again. Then I could say, 1000 runs isn't practicle. It would take 7 years to get 1000 runs if you reran the quest the hour it reset. No good.

Need a new system. Loot drops are broken.

Aesop
05-20-2008, 03:53 PM
Um... yeah. They bind.

So unless you have a character you're planning to multi-class into Monk, you don't already have a pair for your monk.

And it doesn't change the fact that Mage Armor potions last 10 minutes and are trivially cheap and freely available (without having to quest and hope you get offered them).

Silly MT of course I Multi Class my monks :D I even MUlticlass wizards on occassion and Monks for the last 3 levels don't have anything I'm really all that interested in

Aesop

Aesop
05-20-2008, 03:55 PM
LMAO no you don't, they bind

see above... yes I do :D

TFPAQ
05-20-2008, 04:09 PM
Something really should be done as that was one of the worst changes that have happened in this game. Its almost impossible to get a group for threnals now and when you do get through it all and you get the screaming arrows and the other worthless named loot its just frustrating and that frustration gets even worse after you've gone through south 5 times and still not get the reward you want. I mean to even get to south you end up running west and east about 2-3 times each to catch others up. Its lame and it should have never been changed. It should at least be like raid loot where after a certain amount of times you get the full list.

Ignoring when u could exploit Threnal for end rewards, the lack of people willing/wanting to run Threnal seems at an all time low. I'm working on my second 1750 favor and I'm amazed at how many more choices there are to get there. Nothing gives me shivers more than that blessed desert caravan (now that we can heal Coyle that is).

I still wish I had the optics, lol.

Wizzly_Bear
05-20-2008, 04:25 PM
You do. X just varies greatly from person to person.
there is no guarantee. this is the issue. statistically, you could run reaver 1000 times and never pull a single item youre looking for. highly unlikely, but possible.


Ignoring when u could exploit Threnal for end rewards, the lack of people willing/wanting to run Threnal seems at an all time low. I'm working on my second 1750 favor and I'm amazed at how many more choices there are to get there. Nothing gives me shivers more than that blessed desert caravan (now that we can heal Coyle that is).

I still wish I had the optics, lol.
desert caravan? not sure what you would need optics for there. just fts everything, sit back in a lounge chair, and drink a beer while you wait.

MysticTheurge
05-20-2008, 10:00 PM
there is no guarantee. this is the issue. statistically, you could run reaver 1000 times and never pull a single item youre looking for. highly unlikely, but possible.

Then your X is greater than 1000.

X is a variable, it can be anything. Statistically, if you run something an unlimited number of times, you're guaranteed to pull what you want, eventually. It was a joke.

Wizzly_Bear
05-20-2008, 10:06 PM
Statistically, if you run something an unlimited number of times, you're guaranteed to pull what you want, eventually. It was a joke.
sorry, home sick today....must've failed my wisdom check :o

MysticTheurge
05-20-2008, 10:12 PM
sorry, home sick today....must've failed my wisdom check :o

It's ok, it was kind of a math joke anyway. ;)

sirgog
05-21-2008, 12:35 AM
It was stated before, and I am sure since,

on all chains that have named end loot, Delera's, Tangleroot, Co6, Threnal etc... There should now be a similar mechanic as Raid 20th, Only down to 5 runs (n-h-e is 3 runs, 2 more is plenty for any chain in this game) and at the 5th run, and EVERY run there after, you get the FULL STATIC LIST. Period. That is not too much to ask, too much is running Tanglroot a dozen times on 1 toon and being capped at 16, and still not haveing a single Visor on him.

I believe that the Visors only appear on the end reward list if you release the Flesh Render before completing Q5b. That may be why you haven't seen it.

Spisey
05-21-2008, 12:41 AM
You all forgot about the circlet or persuasion! +3 char based skills. Random rare drop. I keep one in storage just to level up toons till I get them the gloves. :)

Gunga
05-21-2008, 10:54 AM
Then your X is greater than 1000.

X is a variable, it can be anything. Statistically, if you run something an unlimited number of times, you're guaranteed to pull what you want, eventually. It was a joke.

Nope. X could = 0. There is no guarantee that you'll pull what you're looking for in the current looting system.

Frodo_Lives
05-21-2008, 11:10 AM
I ran Tangleroot 7 times on a wizard and never had the SP Trinket drop for him. That's ok, cause soon he was level 7 and could use a regular POP5 and now he has 5 visors.

Seriously it does stink when you run a quest chain over and over and you can't get the one item you want to drop. I do agree that Thernal has some really amazing rewards and some really sucky ones. Considering the time it takes to actually complete all the quests (most of the time is spent trying to find 5 others to run it with you) it does stink that none of the items that you actually wanted drops but instead the lousy junk that you just sell anyway.

muffinlad
05-21-2008, 11:35 AM
http://ddo1liners.co.uk/archives/107.jpg
That pretty much sums it up.

I acutally did LOL on this.

Well done.

muffinchortle.

muffinlad
05-21-2008, 11:37 AM
Then your X is greater than 1000.

X is a variable, it can be anything. Statistically, if you run something an unlimited number of times, you're guaranteed to pull what you want, eventually. It was a joke.

Math Nerd alert!

Whooop, whooop, whoop.

Flee the building.

muffindunce.

Strakeln
05-21-2008, 11:41 AM
I believe that the Visors only appear on the end reward list if you release the Flesh Render before completing Q5b. That may be why you haven't seen it.Not true.

I obtained the goggles on all of my characters by soloing T-root. The *only* optional I ever stop for is to kill Whisperdoom, just because people still think it's impossible, and I like doing the impossible. Even when I'm all alone.

Gunga
05-21-2008, 03:17 PM
Not true.

I obtained the goggles on all of my characters by soloing T-root. The *only* optional I ever stop for is to kill Whisperdoom, just because people still think it's impossible, and I like doing the impossible. Even when I'm all alone.

impossible.

Emili
05-21-2008, 05:51 PM
No kidding ... how can you equip a staff and a scroll of raise dead at the same time???

You can't.

Cartouche is the shiznits!!! :D Besides the rare Titan gloves, its the best UMD item in the game, easy to get and very viable at level 16.

Aye, it has always been a useless item... I wonder who thought it up?

To the OP I am sorry to hear of your frustration and I support you whole heartedly in you posting this... It took my fighter 80 dragon runs under the old raid loot system to grab an SoS. My rogue still has yet to pull a cartouche but I do not grind it... My pard luckily got hers (actuakky 3 or 4?) prior to the loot change and when I did get seven finger gloves banked the cartouche for a while I accidentally sold the gloves though prior to mod 3 (before u could lock) and nvr looted another pair... am not sure if I want another pair as I can cartouche and buff her at 44umd and a glove slot is a pertinent prime stat spot.

boldarblood
05-21-2008, 06:18 PM
Aye, it has always been a useless item... I wonder who thought it up?

To the OP I am sorry to hear of your frustration and I support you whole heartedly in you posting this... It took my fighter 80 dragon runs under the old raid loot system to grab an SoS. My rogue still has yet to pull a cartouche but I do not grind it... My pard luckily got hers (actuakky 3 or 4?) prior to the loot change and when I did get seven finger gloves banked the cartouche for a while I accidentally sold the gloves though prior to mod 3 (before u could lock) and nvr looted another pair... am not sure if I want another pair as I can cartouche and buff her at 44umd and a glove slot is a pertinent prime stat spot.


Not completely useless. Decent for a melee based (with no rogue/bard mix) for a quick +5 boost. Good for putting on equipment that you would otherwise not be able to.

GramercyRiff
05-22-2008, 12:32 AM
I've never understood the rationale behind this change. It never made sense. Instead of being able to be guaranteed what you want, you get randomized poor low level loot. I suppose it's ok for those who have just started the game, but since we know those people don't exist (half joking) that's irrelevant.

That cartoon said it all.

Aesop
05-22-2008, 05:28 AM
I've never understood the rationale behind this change. It never made sense. Instead of being able to be guaranteed what you want, you get randomized poor low level loot. I suppose it's ok for those who have just started the game, but since we know those people don't exist (half joking) that's irrelevant.

That cartoon said it all.

I've gotten decent stuff honestly... I'm still using the Proof Against Poison ring I got at level 3 on my wizard (until I create a NOM item anyway)... and the Featherfall Boots on another character and Blindness Ward Goggles on another... and some other stuff... there aren't a lot of great ones but if they just changed the way its divied up a little then I think people would be a lot happier. split the rewards in half 1st run give the first half as choices and make the rest random 2nd run give the 2nd group as choices with the rest random... and repeat

Aesop

Lcdr_Swizzle
05-22-2008, 08:33 AM
My Dwarven fighter basically solo'd Deleras 8 times (yes, he had a lowbie or another hit the level in part 2) as a level 16 fighter to get Carnifex. He had done the quest 4 times when level appropriate before that. No cartouche ever, and Carnifex only once.

Go figure.

I like the idea of every 5th run having the complete list.
That way at most you do the quest another 5 times to get the item you want.

issiana
05-24-2008, 12:34 AM
I want to get this straight. You are lvl 14 still trying to get an item that frankly, was great in the day, but now that you are lvl 14 and soo to be capped, you will find that item will soon take up space in your bank, space in-which has more value then the actual item.

Do we have moderator that have the power to close threads on the basis of just being too lame?

well lets see...... at capped lvl 16 sorc i still have the item your bagging. its in constant use.

why?

i only get what i can get in the times i can play and that dosent allow for grinding quests endlessly to get items from raids. heck i have enough troubles getting to do half the quests i want to do due to lack of groups let alone try endlessly raiding for stuff.

i'd like the old system back as it makes ppl like me have a much better gaming time loot wise, but i do understand how getting offered the same stuff over and over can be a bit boring. but then again rerunning a quest endlessly trying to get an item gets boring real quick to, lol.