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View Full Version : a recommendation for mod 7 raid



Jack_No.7
02-22-2008, 10:40 AM
no crafting, make named items.not that i hate the system, it is simply too much and a grind that is so persistent the raid looses meaning and value, i can do part 1,2,3 and almost 4 and 5 in my sleep now, or reading a book or watching CNN political debates like last nite, running 1-3 elite in 35 minutes.... common. dont get me wrong, i like the raid, its just u can only eat the same thing for so long.... with this raid if u want anything, u need to constantly grind it. over and over and over and over and over and over and over. oh and when ur ransacked , just need to prep another toon and gather more ingredients.... wow fun
so plz dont make the next raid a grind simply for the grind factor, its starting to seem like WoW, instead of killing 10 mobs of this kind its ransack this chest so many times... although i really like mixing it up with part 2 , although ppl have found ways around that one.

does anyone feel the same way?

i dont hate crafting, i just dont want it to be present as the only way of getting kick ass rewards.

MysticTheurge
02-22-2008, 10:56 AM
It seems odd to me that people complain about the grind of the new raid when we've had so many complaints about the grind of the old raids ("60th completion, still can't get what I want").

I have to assume it's not the same people.

Yaga_Nub
02-22-2008, 11:02 AM
someone will always complain, MT.

Dane_McArdy
02-22-2008, 12:05 PM
someone will always complain, MT.

What's that supposed to mean? ;)

maddmatt70
02-22-2008, 12:49 PM
It seems odd to me that people complain about the grind of the new raid when we've had so many complaints about the grind of the old raids ("60th completion, still can't get what I want").

I have to assume it's not the same people.

Mystic Theurge your a casual player so you don't quite understand alot of the dynamics whereas I play alot of ddo and I can fully understand what the OP is talking about as there are major differences between this raid and the old ones. The old ones you couldn't run 24/7 this one you can because you don't need to complete this one to run it and there is almost an infinite amount of raid loot you can construct.. Some players out there are literaly running this raid 8-10 hours a day 7 days a week. Tell me if that isn't a vastly different dynamic then before.. What is more is the hints are that future raids will be more like this system then the old one / more of the same grinding effect.

MysticTheurge
02-22-2008, 01:11 PM
The old ones you couldn't run 24/7 this one you can because you don't need to complete this one to run it and there is almost an infinite amount of raid loot you can construct. Some players out there are literaly running this raid 8-10 hours a day 7 days a week. Tell me if that isn't a vastly different dynamic then before.

So the problem is with the timer then?

It's the fact that you can do parts 1-4 non-stop that's causing people to feel like they have to just keep doing the Shroud?

(It's funny, I'm flagged now, and I've run it a few times, but if I'd rather do something else on a given night, I do that instead. Maybe if you don't want to do something then you should just not do it?)

Jack_No.7
02-22-2008, 01:11 PM
collectables and ingredients should be useful, but not the main outcome of a raid, common a cr 38 pit fiend doesnt have anything of value on him? other then discarded remains of other minions? ***... wheres my pit fiend plate armor!
i totally understand u can make some crazy items.... but the imput it takes and the willingness to share information on certain combos doesnt make sense, we all like our secrets, and i think we will all horde the outcomes of combos. well the majority will.
great job and great introduction to crafting, but not something id like to c persist in other raids, i dont wanna play a guessing game.

Yaga_Nub
02-22-2008, 01:26 PM
collectables and ingredients should be useful, but not the main outcome of a raid, common a cr 38 pit fiend doesnt have anything of value on him? other then discarded remains of other minions? ***... wheres my pit fiend plate armor!
i totally understand u can make some crazy items.... but the imput it takes and the willingness to share information on certain combos doesnt make sense, we all like our secrets, and i think we will all horde the outcomes of combos. well the majority will.
great job and great introduction to crafting, but not something id like to c persist in other raids, i dont wanna play a guessing game.

A cr 38 pit fiend doesn't need anything on him other than his spells, and his claws, and his horns, and his bad breath, and his lamp, and his chair, and his paddle-ball, and his dog.........(grrrrrrrrr)..... okay so not his dog. :)

MysticTheurge
02-22-2008, 01:38 PM
A cr 38 pit fiend doesn't need anything on him other than his spells, and his claws, and his horns, and his bad breath, and his lamp, and his chair, and his paddle-ball, and his dog.........(grrrrrrrrr)..... okay so not his dog. :)

Yeah, when you've got At Will blasphemy, mass hold monster, PW:Stun, unholy aura, greater dispel, create greater undead, invisibility and greater teleport, what more could you possibly need?

Vhlad
02-22-2008, 01:46 PM
Yeah, when you've got At Will blasphemy, mass hold monster, PW:Stun, unholy aura, greater dispel, create greater undead, invisibility and greater teleport, what more could you possibly need?

A sandwich.

MysticTheurge
02-22-2008, 01:52 PM
A sandwich.

That's what created undead minions are for.

Or, if they give you trouble, you can always gate in some other devils.

Yaga_Nub
02-22-2008, 01:54 PM
A sandwich.

Do you think he's a PB&J type of devil or a meat and cheese type?

Myrdinn
02-22-2008, 02:32 PM
I think this not a matter of who like it and who doesn't. But more that it is true that running a raid one after the other is nice first then fast become dull... I mean I never did a raid more than 20 times (since first I don't HAVE the time to do any raid this many time) I am a casual player, like 10 hour a week and sometime like 2-3h a week. When will I be able to get all this cool new stuff with crafting if i can do this raid like 1-3 time a week. I will need at least 15 run to get all tier upgrade, meaning min 5 weeks and max 4 month... most probably will take 2-3 months. I can be patient, but not THAT patient, and will finally just stop doing it. I want my item and the fastest as possible, so the fastest route would be to buy plat from internet. I don't mean that Iwill do it, but for most people playing casual, this will be their idea, and turbine is telling us not to encourage it, but they encourage it themself... Playing casual, you always are low on cash and trying to find good item is hard (since you don't always have time for long quest, which got the best chest and loot). Even more if you like to have 2-3 toons.

To give you an idea, I did the following raid:
Vellah x 1
Demon Queen x 0 (tried, but was unsuscesful)
Titan x 2
Preraid 3 dragons x 20-30 ( had to roll in guild to get my armor... and buy the second one)
Stormreaver x 15-20 (only got 1 good item, napkin...)
The Shroud x 4

The most money i ever had was 300kplat and I now have 5kplat. Reason being I need to buy what I need since i don't have the time and luck to farm it.

But don't misunderstand, I am not complaining (even if it look like it :p). Just trying to help you figure out what is the difference in being casual and playing a lot and the difference in thinking in that regards.

An idea to make it a little more casual loving would be for raid ingredient to drop in vale rarely and put a little more drop ingredient to drop from the raid, not too much but like 3-4 instead of 1-3.

But will comply with what turbine do, since I like the game anyway :)

Jack_No.7
02-22-2008, 07:14 PM
seems my thread lost its point. does anyone agree with me? that future raids should not be crafting raids? or do yall like the excessive repetition/farming?

MysticTheurge
02-22-2008, 10:22 PM
that future raids should not be crafting raids? or do yall like the excessive repetition/farming?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_dilemma

sirgog
02-23-2008, 01:51 AM
seems my thread lost its point. does anyone agree with me? that future raids should not be crafting raids? or do yall like the excessive repetition/farming?

I prefer running a raid 12 times to certainly get exactly the item I want, rather than running the Reaver 30-40 times in the hope of pulling a +3 tome. Personally, however, I'd prefer unbound, very rare named loot like any other quest, no timers, and the only difference between raids and non-raids being difficulty and party size.

GlassCannon
02-23-2008, 02:06 AM
i dont hate crafting, i just dont want it to be present as the only way of getting kick ass rewards.

You have made it clear that the crafting is not the major malfunction... the grind is.

DDO contains a large quantity of people who do not like to WAIT or to GRIND. Some of our characters are not self sufficient and cannot survive Vale or Orchard encounters, others are designed for support only and amass an expense attempting Vale or Orchard encounters superior to gain.

I want the Altars to be the heart and soul of the Crafting system, with potential to upgrade even beyond the 3rd stage, to an obscenely useful item. The new raid must behave according to current non-shroud loot mechanics, but with a higher drop rate. The old Drop problems have resurfaced again, as If : Then restrictors have not been implemented as suggested numerous times. If Total Raid Items < 2, then Reroll Raid Loot. This applies even to a solo artist(hint... tied to a brick... launched from trebuchet...). If total Raid Items > Party Size -1, then Reroll Raid Loot, exception=PartySize<4.

GlassCannon
02-23-2008, 02:07 AM
I prefer running a raid 12 times to certainly get exactly the item I want, rather than running the Reaver 30-40 times in the hope of pulling a +3 tome. Personally, however, I'd prefer unbound, very rare named loot like any other quest, no timers, and the only difference between raids and non-raids being difficulty and party size.

Problem mentioned in post below is noted and attended to by 'If : Then' suggestion presented again.

Item Acquisition Check: IfPlayerHasItem: Then, Reroll Raid Loot.

ItemPrimaryClassDesignation: IfClass=0(quantity of players), then Reroll Loot Item.