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View Full Version : Opinions on TWF build . . .



snakethejake
01-30-2008, 12:45 PM
This is a build I am looking to make . . . let me know what you guys think, any changes you think should be made.

Its basically a well rounded TWF toon with very good rogue trapsmithing thrown in. A little bit of Paladin to get the saves up along with wand usage and other inherited feats. Let me know what you think!


Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 2.80
DDO Character Planner Home Page (http://www.rjcyberware.com/DDO)

Level 16 Lawful Good Drow Male
(3 Paladin \ 1 Rogue \ 12 Ranger)
Hit Points: 152
Spell Points: 115
BAB: 15\15\20\25\25
Fortitude: 16
Reflex: 21
Will: 10

Starting Feat/Enhancement
Base Stats Modified Stats
Abilities (Level 1) (Level 16)
Strength 12 15
Dexterity 16 21
Constitution 10 10
Intelligence 16 16
Wisdom 10 10
Charisma 16 17

Starting Feat/Enhancement
Base Skills Modified Skills
Skills (Level 1) (Level 16)
Balance 7 23
Bluff 7 7
Concentration 0 0
Diplomacy 7 15
Disable Device 7 28
Haggle 3 3
Heal 0 0
Hide 7 9
Intimidate 3 3
Jump 5 8
Listen 0 2
Move Silently 7 9
Open Lock 7 11
Perform n/a n/a
Repair 3 3
Search 7 35
Spot 4 12
Swim 1 2
Tumble n/a n/a
Use Magic Device 7 21

Level 1 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Skill Focus: Search

Level 2 (Paladin)

Level 3 (Paladin)
Feat: (Selected) Skill Focus: Disable Device

Level 4 (Paladin)

Level 5 (Ranger)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Vermin

Level 6 (Ranger)
Feat: (Selected) Nimble Fingers

Level 7 (Ranger)

Level 8 (Ranger)

Level 9 (Ranger)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Evil Outsider
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Finesse

Level 10 (Ranger)

Level 11 (Ranger)

Level 12 (Ranger)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Piercing Weapons

Level 13 (Ranger)

Level 14 (Ranger)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Undead

Level 15 (Ranger)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Slashing Weapons

Level 16 (Ranger)
Enhancement: Ranger Skill Boost I
Enhancement: Ranger Skill Boost II
Enhancement: Ranger Skill Boost III
Enhancement: Ranger Skill Boost IV
Enhancement: Drow Melee Damage I
Enhancement: Drow Melee Damage II
Enhancement: Improved Drow Spell Resistence I
Enhancement: Improved Drow Spell Resistence II
Enhancement: Elven Dexterity I
Enhancement: Elven Dexterity II
Enhancement: Elven Perception I
Enhancement: Elven Perception II
Enhancement: Elven Perception III
Enhancement: Elven Perception IV
Enhancement: Follower of Vulkoor
Enhancement: Paladin Courage of Good I
Enhancement: Paladin Bulwark of Good I
Enhancement: Paladin Resistance of Good I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training I
Enhancement: Paladin Diplomacy I
Enhancement: Rogue Disable Device I
Enhancement: Ranger Search I
Enhancement: Ranger Search II
Enhancement: Ranger Search III
Enhancement: Ranger Search IV
Enhancement: Paladin Charisma I
Enhancement: Ranger Dexterity I
Enhancement: Ranger Dexterity II
Enhancement: Rogue Improved Trap Sense I

sigtrent
01-30-2008, 04:23 PM
Looks decent.

I think you don't need quite so much charisma, I'd move two points to constitution. I'm also not sure you need the rogue skill feats. Between that and the enhancemetns you are actualy overdoing your trapping skills unless you just want to show off big numbers.

captain1z
01-30-2008, 09:07 PM
In addition to the above..................


If you are just taking paladin for the boost to saves and have a Charisma of 16 for this reason, as of mod 6 you no longer need to do this.

I would switch your Charisma with your wisdom and drop the paladin class all together.

Force of personality feat will gain you +3 to will saves and your increased wisdom will get you +3 more.

You will also be able to cast your ranger spells (you cant cast with a wisdom of 10 without an item)

Your spot and ranger abilities and SP will increase dramaticly. reflex saves come naturally for rogues and rangers as does Fort saves for rangers.


My advice = Drop the pali levels and switch charisma with wisdom. (or split the points between WIS & CON) 13 each... While this will drop your UMD by 3 point the benefit is great and you can easily get a cartouche out of deleras.

snakethejake
01-31-2008, 03:33 AM
I'm not really understanding the swapping of Charisma and Wisdom . . . If I dropped my Charisma to 10 and bumped my wisdom, Force of Personality wouldn't work since its base stat is Charisma . . . 10 Charisma gives me no bonus with FoP. Plus my saves would be lower going with just 1 rogue / 15 ranger. I ran that scenario . . . even a pure rogue would have lower saves than this triple class (only missing the improved evasion).

Also, I do have a +4 wisdom item in the bank that I can send to him so he will be able to cast spells.

Thanks for the input.


In addition to the above..................


If you are just taking paladin for the boost to saves and have a Charisma of 16 for this reason, as of mod 6 you no longer need to do this.

I would switch your Charisma with your wisdom and drop the paladin class all together.

Force of personality feat will gain you +3 to will saves and your increased wisdom will get you +3 more.

You will also be able to cast your ranger spells (you cant cast with a wisdom of 10 without an item)

Your spot and ranger abilities and SP will increase dramaticly. reflex saves come naturally for rogues and rangers as does Fort saves for rangers.


My advice = Drop the pali levels and switch charisma with wisdom. (or split the points between WIS & CON) 13 each... While this will drop your UMD by 3 point the benefit is great and you can easily get a cartouche out of deleras.

snakethejake
01-31-2008, 03:51 AM
Ok, I made some adjustments . . . removed the skill focus on search and some of the enhancements for it since it was overkill. Added force of personality instead to get my will saves even higher. Also moved a point of charisma to str to increase my damage output. Also moved some enhancements around.


Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 2.80
DDO Character Planner Home Page (http://www.rjcyberware.com/DDO)

Level 16 Lawful Good Drow Male
(3 Paladin \ 1 Rogue \ 12 Ranger)
Hit Points: 152
Spell Points: 115
BAB: 15\15\20\25\25
Fortitude: 16
Reflex: 22
Will: 13

Starting Ending Feat/Enhancement
Base Stats Base Stats Modified Stats
Abilities (Level 1) (Level 16) (Level 16)
Strength 13 16 16
Dexterity 16 17 22
Constitution 10 10 10
Intelligence 16 16 16
Wisdom 10 10 10
Charisma 15 15 16

Starting Ending Feat/Enhancement
Base Skills Base Skills Modified Skills
Skills (Level 1) (Level 16) (Level 16)
Balance 7 25 25
Bluff 6 7 7
Concentration 0 0 1
Diplomacy 6 13 13
Disable Device 7 22 28
Haggle 2 3 3
Heal 0 0 0
Hide 7 10 10
Intimidate 2 3 3
Jump 5 9 9
Listen 0 0 2
Move Silently 7 10 10
Open Lock 7 10 12
Perform n/a n/a n/a
Repair 3 3 3
Search 7 22 30
Spot 4 10 12
Swim 1 3 3
Tumble n/a n/a n/a
Use Magic Device 6 21 21

Level 1 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Force of Personality

Level 2 (Paladin)

Level 3 (Paladin)
Feat: (Selected) Skill Focus: Disable Device

Level 4 (Paladin)
Ability Raise: DEX

Level 5 (Ranger)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Vermin

Level 6 (Ranger)
Feat: (Selected) Nimble Fingers

Level 7 (Ranger)

Level 8 (Ranger)
Ability Raise: STR

Level 9 (Ranger)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Evil Outsider
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Finesse

Level 10 (Ranger)

Level 11 (Ranger)

Level 12 (Ranger)
Ability Raise: STR
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Piercing Weapons

Level 13 (Ranger)

Level 14 (Ranger)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Undead

Level 15 (Ranger)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Slashing Weapons

Level 16 (Ranger)
Enhancement: Ranger Skill Boost I
Enhancement: Ranger Skill Boost II
Enhancement: Ranger Skill Boost III
Enhancement: Ranger Skill Boost IV
Enhancement: Drow Melee Damage I
Enhancement: Drow Melee Damage II
Enhancement: Improved Drow Spell Resistence I
Enhancement: Improved Drow Spell Resistence II
Enhancement: Elven Dexterity I
Enhancement: Elven Dexterity II
Enhancement: Elven Enchantment Resistance I
Enhancement: Elven Perception I
Enhancement: Elven Perception II
Enhancement: Follower of Vulkoor
Enhancement: Paladin Courage of Good I
Enhancement: Paladin Bulwark of Good I
Enhancement: Paladin Focus of Good I
Enhancement: Paladin Resistance of Good I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training I
Enhancement: Rogue Disable Device I
Enhancement: Ranger Search I
Enhancement: Ranger Search II
Enhancement: Ranger Search III
Enhancement: Ranger Search IV
Enhancement: Paladin Charisma I
Enhancement: Ranger Dexterity I
Enhancement: Ranger Dexterity II
Enhancement: Ranger Dexterity III
Enhancement: Rogue Improved Trap Sense I

snakethejake
01-31-2008, 03:53 AM
What would you recommend as a good point level for search and disable skills? I'm trying to maximize them as much as possible . . . for possible mod 6 traps and also the infamous cabal. But I'm still trying to be a good TWF based build.

Thanks for the input.


Looks decent.

I think you don't need quite so much charisma, I'd move two points to constitution. I'm also not sure you need the rogue skill feats. Between that and the enhancemetns you are actualy overdoing your trapping skills unless you just want to show off big numbers.

Aesop
01-31-2008, 05:15 AM
as far as stats go


If you are intending on having this be a maxed out character at the end game (think level 20ish) ya might consider an adjustment or two.

ways of increasing Stats


Level Ups: total of 5 this is the biggest determination of Stat distribution because of the limited number you have

Items: typical top end item is a +6 (though with new content you could get a +6 with a couple of extraordinary points as well +8 I think was said)

Tomes: As long as they don't screw this up and I think they are doing ok so far +5 at top end

Enhancements: Race +2 Dex Ranger +3 Dex Paladin +1 Cha

so by this assuming you are going dex heavy to favor the Weapon Finesse Shortsword/Rapier theme of Drow

+5 Tome +5 Enh +5 Level Up +6 (8) Item = +21(23) Dex so start with an Odd Number

+5 Tome +1 Enh +6(8) Item = +12(14) Cha so start with an Even Number

+5 Tome +6(8) Item = +11(13) for the Rest of the Stats so Start the rest with Odd Numbers

should optimize a bit there

I'd Say Drop Int by 1 and cha by 1 and Wiz by 1 and add 1 to Dex and Con and find a cheap Int tome to give to have your guy read at level 1 ... ya lose 4 Skill Points total but everything works out all nice in the end... in theory

13 (+5 +6) = 24
17 (+5+5+5+6) =40
11 (+5 +6) = 22
15 (+5+6) =26
9 (+5+6)= 20
14 (+5+6+1)= 26


Aesop

Aesop
01-31-2008, 05:17 AM
What would you recommend as a good point level for search and disable skills? I'm trying to maximize them as much as possible . . . for possible mod 6 traps and also the infamous cabal. But I'm still trying to be a good TWF based build.

Thanks for the input.

You probably won't hit the Cabal Trap ... well... maybe ... its possible but it has a DD of like 75 and a Search in the low to mid 60s like 63 or 64 I think

Aesop

Geonis
01-31-2008, 07:25 AM
You probably won't hit the Cabal Trap ... well... maybe ... its possible but it has a DD of like 75 and a Search in the low to mid 60s like 63 or 64 I think

Aesop

I thought they were lowering "The Trap".

captain1z
01-31-2008, 08:20 PM
I'm not really understanding the swapping of Charisma and Wisdom . . . If I dropped my Charisma to 10 and bumped my wisdom, Force of Personality wouldn't work since its base stat is Charisma . . . 10 Charisma gives me no bonus with FoP. Plus my saves would be lower going with just 1 rogue / 15 ranger. I ran that scenario . . . even a pure rogue would have lower saves than this triple class (only missing the improved evasion).

Also, I do have a +4 wisdom item in the bank that I can send to him so he will be able to cast spells.

Thanks for the input.

Aaahhh yes..... oversight on my part. 13 Charisma. Well if you need to cut points to put elsewhere, you have some room to play here.




And geonis...... I think those difficulties for "the trap" may be correct on elite. I have 2 rogues Im building just to get at those traps.
Wanted to get to it b4 mod 6 but Im too late.

also geo. .... thnx for the Paragon (I still need to play around with that...make it feel like my own)