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Borrigain
09-21-2007, 04:23 PM
So something had been eating at me for the last few days, and I think I found it:


Weekly Development Activities

In QA
These items are in QA and are scheduled for Module 5: Accursed Ascension (Litany of the Dead Parts 3 & 4).


Plane of Night
Velah has informed the guardians of the islands within the Plane of Night that if they leave the areas they are supposed to be protecting, she will eat them.
The bridges within the Vault of Night should no longer occasionally be ethereal.


Now, don't get me wrong, I've always detested the way Von6 has been run. Always felt dragging to home was "cheap". But, that said, I'm wondering how this new mechanic will work.

For a group of locked and loaded level 14's, this won't pose a problem. But for a group of level 8-10's or so, this might be a nightmare. Even on normal.

So my questions are: will the base mobs continue to respawn? or can I put or more than one toon on a base without drawing Velah's wrath?

My concern is a level 10 fighter is going to have one heck of a time by himself tackling those flensers unless he is fully uber-ized. I highly doubt a new player's untwinked first toon is going to be able to roll 3 of them up at once. Or the earth elementals for that matter.

Now, if I can run 1 man/bridge at a time to the base and load it up without Velah flaming us, cool. But if I put two toons on the base and she flames us along with the mobs, this could be a disaster for those who haven't acquired high-end gear.

Understand, I don't want it to be easy, but the reason people used to exploit this was it was near impossible at that level to single-handedly clear the base and drop the pillar before they respawn. Now that the "technique" is gone, all bets are off.

I'm guessing bards will now become the raid group's new best friend. But if you don't come with fascinate or 5 billion disco balls, you might be hosed.

I mean, our guild is thinking up what new strategies we can use as we speak, ;) , and it won't stop us from running it, but I'd just like to get other's feelings on this, and maybe a dev response on if any other mechanics are changing.

After all, I want to encourage the youngsters to try it, not just let it become the playground of the capped 14's.


Just tryin to help the noobs survive long enough to have a small chance at success,
Borr.

Nitestalker
09-21-2007, 05:21 PM
I think the key will be to use things like Fascinate, Hypno, Suggestion and the like. Without knowing for sure, I am going to assume that they will still have the respawn when the mob dies, like it does now. So the only way to keep that from happening, is some way to keep the mobs from attacking, without killing them.

Raithe
09-21-2007, 05:45 PM
Flesh to stone. Wizards get it at level 11. Sorcs can get it at 12. It gets honorable mention as "Broken DDO Spell of the Year", behind charms, for being overly powerful and having all sorts of game breaking uses.

The fact that fighters are still running around the bases and dying multiple times is hilarious.

captain1z
09-21-2007, 05:47 PM
I agree fascination will become the norm......until a dev clues in on what we are planning and makes them all immune (thus the delay....tin foil hat anyone)

The more direct way would be to split the group up into 3 groups of 4 kill the mobs and hit the bases as one. The dragon lands when the shield goes down so we can all run back without fear of fire and attack her as we normally do.

This would likely be the way they intended for us to play it and honestly as a group is not that difficult.


Besides........I thought dragons were supposed to be difficult. Velah is a joke as she stands now. VON 5 is harder.....I dare say VON 3 is harder.

Borrigain
09-21-2007, 06:36 PM
I agree fascination will become the norm......until a dev clues in on what we are planning and makes them all immune (thus the delay....tin foil hat anyone)

The more direct way would be to split the group up into 3 groups of 4 kill the mobs and hit the bases as one. The dragon lands when the shield goes down so we can all run back without fear of fire and attack her as we normally do.

This would likely be the way they intended for us to play it and honestly as a group is not that difficult.


Besides........I thought dragons were supposed to be difficult. Velah is a joke as she stands now. VON 5 is harder.....I dare say VON 3 is harder.

See, my question is just what you stated. Will we be able to get that many peeps onto a base? We had only 2 out there one day, and she was flaming us. No biggie, but ........

ah screw it, I'll let it go........

I was just thinking of the kids is all.

Borr.

Gratch
09-21-2007, 06:41 PM
Flesh to stone. Wizards get it at level 11. Sorcs can get it at 12. It gets honorable mention as "Broken DDO Spell of the Year", behind charms, for being overly powerful and having all sorts of game breaking uses.

The fact that fighters are still running around the bases and dying multiple times is hilarious.

Now you just need to convince an arcane why they should be running the dragon for the completely useless (to an arcane) raid loot. Unless you're going to let them roll on the belt...

"Why look... superior ice storm on a necklace. People love it when I cast ice storm."

I guess you can poke arcane guildies in the back or lie to them about the raid loots. Even the guild groups seem to be 2 clerics and 10 sword of shadow seekers.

Base wise you can have one person per island or bridge segment at a time. Casting range from the bridges should be able to hit most of the island.

Maybe bards will come and fascinate if you promise them the delver suit.

Muirtach
09-21-2007, 06:44 PM
Two people on a base will cause her to send fire.

You can have someone on the bridge next to an island without garnering her attention. If someone is on an island and other people run across it she will fireball those running and they will usually be out of the way before the fireball hits. If the person on the island is far enough away from the runner, no problems there.

Toy around with those and you should be able to come up with a number of alternatives.

Brianius
09-21-2007, 07:03 PM
1st & 3rd can be shot at the pitchers/home bridge and 3rd/2nd from 3rd/home bridge and 1st/2nd from 1st/home bridge 2-3 11th lvl ranger or archer(fighter) with multishot and a greater construct bane bow could do the same without entering combat and a ranger with high str and wis can do the same as a pally and be just as effective in low man groups

Spookydodger
09-21-2007, 07:04 PM
Flesh to stone. Wizards get it at level 11. Sorcs can get it at 12. It gets honorable mention as "Broken DDO Spell of the Year", behind charms, for being overly powerful and having all sorts of game breaking uses.

The fact that fighters are still running around the bases and dying multiple times is hilarious.

I always sort of wondered if charmed mobs would make Velah torch the island.

Flesh to stone is nice, but stoning Flensers is damn hard and, ironically, Earth Elementals look at you funny when you try to turn them to stone. :D

captain1z
09-21-2007, 07:08 PM
you can pretty much ignore her fireballs on normal or hard with a fire resist of 20..........1 at a time goes to each base, I guess melees 1st.



Yeah, does sound overly complex tho. fascination,fear and persuation will definately be the way to go.

Ghoste
09-21-2007, 07:13 PM
Um...why even bother going onto the bases at all?

They don't leave them, range the pillars and ignore the monsters.

Easy enough.

issiana
09-21-2007, 07:20 PM
Um...why even bother going onto the bases at all?

They don't leave them, range the pillars and ignore the monsters.

Easy enough.

i'm sorry, but that is just to simple a concept for many to understand, lol

Ghoste
09-21-2007, 07:22 PM
i'm sorry, but that is just to simple a concept for many to understand, lol
A lot like ignoring charmed monsters, especially when there are a lot of them...

Attomic
09-21-2007, 10:45 PM
i'm sorry, but that is just to simple a concept for many to understand, lol

What did I miss? I've never seen a clear shot at second base... unless you're talking about putting one about halfway to first or third and range from there.

Ghoste
09-21-2007, 10:56 PM
What did I miss? I've never seen a clear shot at second base... unless you're talking about putting one about halfway to first or third and range from there.
Player A approaches 1st base, clsoe enough to get agro, then backs up to home.

Player B runs past 1st base and stands on walkway between 1st and 2nd.

Player A already has lock on pillar at 1st.

Player C already has lock on pillar at 3rd.

Start shooting.

PurdueDave
09-21-2007, 11:09 PM
Now you just need to convince an arcane why they should be running the dragon for the completely useless (to an arcane) raid loot. Unless you're going to let them roll on the belt...

lol

Arlith
09-21-2007, 11:19 PM
I understand the concern, but there will be a way around it. They aren't giong to make it impossible. I kind of like it. I think all the quests should be "tweaked" a bit each mod, it puts the excitement back in the quest when you don't know whats coming next.


Velah has informed the guardians of the islands within the Plane of Night that if they leave the areas they are supposed to be protecting, she will eat them..

Now what would be REAL cool, is if by some chance you can lure one of the mobs away from their post and Velah swoops down and CRUNCH CRUNCH!!! I could spend some time in Von 6 watching that. :D

Jaysensen
09-22-2007, 01:44 AM
Now you just need to convince an arcane why they should be running the dragon for the completely useless (to an arcane) raid loot. Unless you're going to let them roll on the belt...


You mean bribe the arcane to give you the belt or sword if he rolls them himself...

Cashiry
09-22-2007, 02:11 AM
Try disinigrate on the pillars from a distance.

I can cast on the pillars without gettin aggro from the mobs and still hit the pillars with disinigrate. 2 shots max/empowered and the pillar is gone. Of course I havent ran the dragon in the past 2 months, so not sure if Disinigrate will work on the pillars anymore.

Ghoste
09-22-2007, 04:03 AM
Try disinigrate on the pillars from a distance.

I can cast on the pillars without gettin aggro from the mobs and still hit the pillars with disinigrate. 2 shots max/empowered and the pillar is gone. Of course I havent ran the dragon in the past 2 months, so not sure if Disinigrate will work on the pillars anymore.
I ran it earlier this month, 2 normal disintigrates was enough to get it down to the 10% waiting point. A 3rd to finish it off. Mind you that was from a level capped caster with a greater potency 6 item.

Pyromaniac
09-22-2007, 05:58 AM
Now you just need to convince an arcane why they should be running the dragon for the completely useless (to an arcane) raid loot. Unless you're going to let them roll on the belt....

Sword of Shadows wielding arcane with Tenser's I guess?:)

Riorik
09-22-2007, 07:06 AM
Unless I'm mistaken, you can't range the pillars without Precise Shot - which is on some items, of course, these days.

On the Wizzie tactic - why bother with Flesh to Stone - just hit 'em with the 4th level Fear spell. We usually don't kill anything at all - between both of those approaches - when slaughtering Velah.