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Kisaragi
09-21-2007, 11:26 AM
I had an idea earlier this morning that I thought I would share with people here on the forums and see how well it was recieved.

Imagine that apon doing so many missions instead of just getting the next rank, you gain so many Favor Coins (from the Coin Lords)[So if you have 400 House K favor you get 400 House K Favor Coins]. Now here's the cool part.

You can normally take the reward that you would get for reaching that level, such as for House K getting the extra bank slot. Or you can exchange your favor coins for items fitting the nature of each faction.

House P = Might equal power/magi items, robes, staves, scepters, daggers, or jewelry.
House D = Might equal melee weapons or returning special ammunition.
House J = Might equal wands, scrolls, and even magic clothing.
House K = Might equal armor or shields.
The Silver Flame = Might offer blessed/holy items or blessings.
The Coin Lords = Might equal actual money rewards, titles, or even a residence.
The Free Agents = Might offer special areas such as a black market, or even strange unusual islands.
The Agents of Argossen = Might offer Acient Trinkets of Forgotten Power, or Rare scrolls.
The Tweleve = Might offer special pets/familiars/servants.

You do enough favor to get 400 favor from House K. You can be done with it and respected, or you cash it in for something rare from their vaults. The choice is yours. If you do cash it in, you can run the quests again in order to build it up.

You can keep cashing in the favor in order to earn extra rewards, giving high level characters reasons to keep playing after they're capped and after they have 1750 favor.

All items would be bound to that character, and 'favor coins' wouldn't actually be an item. The representative of a given faction would tell you would have so many based on available rank.

Somewhat like the idea of Influence from Vampire the Masquerade.

blakbyrd
09-21-2007, 11:33 AM
I would have no problem with such a proposal, given the following stipulations:

- Favor coins should be bound
- Items recieved from the coins should be bound
- Items recieved should be of the named power level no higher than the highest quest for that house. (for example if a house or favor listing has no quest higher than level 12, then the item reward should not be any more powerful than a level 12 or named level 12 item). Actually if it were me I would make the items be 2 levels lower than the highest level quest, but make them the power of a named item.

Anyways, that would just be my recommendations. Intersting proposal though and probably worth some thought.

Impaqt
09-21-2007, 11:42 AM
We have enough Grinds in this game already.... ANd from the looks of it.. Mod 5 is gonna be one HUGE Grind..... No thanks..... I think the Favor rewards we have now are pretty decent.

DSL
09-21-2007, 11:46 AM
Hmm, I don't know about this. Ultimately, what you're talking about is yet another grind/time-sink that people complain about. There's already plenty of item-related rewards in the game (chests, end rewards, collectables, etc.), and the nice thing about the favor system is it normally grants intangible boons. I know not all the things you mentioned fit into this category, but nevertheless it's still a little redundant.

However, what might be interesting is to let players "trade in" favor from one house for favor from another, at a reduced rate. For example, let's say you don't have much use for House D special ammunition, but you really want an extra bank space tab, you could arrange with house D to give you a writ of recommendation for the House K dwarves, essentially trading in your House D favor at, say, half its normal value. Of course, within the framework of the current favor system, this could cause problems, given that a quest's favor can only be used once, and somehow I doubt that a total revamp would be likely.

Dane_McArdy
09-21-2007, 12:00 PM
That actually goes against the idea of what they said favor was about when it first came out.

So far, the only reward of a tangible item that effects the game are the tomes for 1750, which aren't tradable, so basically, a +2 bonus to a stat of your choice.

The rewards are to be conviences as you move about the city, not to effect game play in quests. Like the time pendent to move faster. Longer buffs, less chance of damage on repairs. Faster regen of mana and health in the city.

Adding rare items from the vault or such goes against that idea.

M1A1
09-21-2007, 12:11 PM
That actually goes against the idea of what they said favor was about when it first came out.

So far, the only reward of a tangible item that effects the game are the tomes for 1750, which aren't tradable, so basically, a +2 bonus to a stat of your choice.

The rewards are to be conviences as you move about the city, not to effect game play in quests. Like the time pendent to move faster. Longer buffs, less chance of damage on repairs. Faster regen of mana and health in the city.

Adding rare items from the vault or such goes against that idea.

and the House P Trinket is nice if I ever remember to use it.
The price reduction for heals and these potions that are coming out are all tangible too. Buffs that dont expire when shrining do change the game you play. +4 Healers/Repair/Tools and your weapons not wearing down(seems like they wont ever break anyway) all these are tangible and do have a direct impact on your game...I'm just saying, I dont think his suggestion is a bad one or against what "they said" favor was about, its just different. No?

Dane_McArdy
09-21-2007, 12:30 PM
and the House P Trinket is nice if I ever remember to use it.
The price reduction for heals and these potions that are coming out are all tangible too. Buffs that dont expire when shrining do change the game you play. +4 Healers/Repair/Tools and your weapons not wearing down(seems like they wont ever break anyway) all these are tangible and do have a direct impact on your game...I'm just saying, I dont think his suggestion is a bad one or against what "they said" favor was about, its just different. No?

I can't remember if the buffs last through shrining, but they only last 30 minutes, it's not much different then if you were to buy potions and scrolls of those either and kept them up all the time. So all it really alters is the dent in your pocket book.

+4 healer/reparir kits, I really have never meet anyone that uses those, not that there people don't. I just don't think they are widely useful. Tools certainly do help rogues, but you can get +5 in chests, again, that's more a convience then game altering.

None of these change the game, they make it easier on the player. Which was the whole intention of the favor system.

DSL
09-21-2007, 01:08 PM
I can't remember if the buffs last through shrining, but they only last 30 minutes, it's not much different then if you were to buy potions and scrolls of those either and kept them up all the time. So all it really alters is the dent in your pocket book.

+4 healer/reparir kits, I really have never meet anyone that uses those, not that there people don't. I just don't think they are widely useful. Tools certainly do help rogues, but you can get +5 in chests, again, that's more a convience then game altering.

None of these change the game, they make it easier on the player. Which was the whole intention of the favor system.

Exactly. The tools, sturdy arrows, etc. are really more of a convenince than anything. And the most tangible of these is still a far cry from, say, the black anvil mines' adamantine items, or random-drop end rewards.

M1A1
09-21-2007, 01:11 PM
The better your favor with a patron, the more benefits you get from it
— for example, access to better equipment. One of your characters must accumulate 400 favor
(with all patrons, combined) before you can create a drow character.
+2 Tome. When a character achieves 1,750 favor, he receives a +2 tome. This tome increases
one ability score (your choice: Strength, Intelligence, Wisdom, etc.) by +2.
Unlocking Seventh Character Slot. Achieving 1,750 favor for the fi rst time also opens up a
seventh character slot and allows you to create a new character with a 32-point buy (versus
the standard 28 points when you first start adventuring).



Heres (http://www.ddo.com/article/432) another one to...



I can't remember if the buffs last through shrining, but they only last 30 minutes, it's not much different then if you were to buy potions and scrolls of those either and kept them up all the time. So all it really alters is the dent in your pocket book.

+4 healer/reparir kits, I really have never meet anyone that uses those, not that there people don't. I just don't think they are widely useful. Tools certainly do help rogues, but you can get +5 in chests, again, that's more a convience then game altering.

None of these change the game, they make it easier on the player. Which was the whole intention of the favor system.


Exactly. The tools, sturdy arrows, etc. are really more of a convenince than anything. And the most tangible of these is still a far cry from, say, the black anvil mines' adamantine items, or random-drop end rewards.

So trying to say what you "think" there "intentions" were is not really a good idea

Palmetto
09-21-2007, 01:14 PM
I can't remember if the buffs last through shrining, but they only last 30 minutes, it's not much different then if you were to buy potions and scrolls of those either and kept them up all the time. So all it really alters is the dent in your pocket book.

+4 healer/reparir kits, I really have never meet anyone that uses those, not that there people don't. I just don't think they are widely useful. Tools certainly do help rogues, but you can get +5 in chests, again, that's more a convience then game altering.

None of these change the game, they make it easier on the player. Which was the whole intention of the favor system.
They do, but not through death.

Dane_McArdy
09-21-2007, 01:48 PM
The better your favor with a patron, the more benefits you get from it
— for example, access to better equipment. One of your characters must accumulate 400 favor
(with all patrons, combined) before you can create a drow character.
+2 Tome. When a character achieves 1,750 favor, he receives a +2 tome. This tome increases
one ability score (your choice: Strength, Intelligence, Wisdom, etc.) by +2.
Unlocking Seventh Character Slot. Achieving 1,750 favor for the fi rst time also opens up a
seventh character slot and allows you to create a new character with a 32-point buy (versusthe standard 28 points when you first start adventuring).

Heres (http://www.ddo.com/article/432) another one to...

So trying to say what you "think" there "intentions" were is not really a good idea

Remember, how you asked to be told when you are being whatever...right now.

As for the link you posted, that doesn't say anything about what the rewards are to be, does it? No, just that there would be rewards.

I speak of their intention based off of what they TOLD us on these forums as to what purpose the favor system was to server. Many people, when they first read about didn't want uber items as the rewards, and they assured us that the rewards would NOT be along that lines, that they would reflect getting conviences that apply more to the city, then to questing.

So what I think their intentions were is based on what they told us their intentions were.

M1A1
09-21-2007, 01:49 PM
Remember, how you asked to be told when you are being whatever...right now.

As for the link you posted, that doesn't say anything about what the rewards are to be, does it? No, just that there would be rewards.

I speak of their intention based off of what they TOLD us on these forums as to what purpose the favor system was to server. Many people, when they first read about didn't want uber items as the rewards, and they assured us that the rewards would NOT be along that lines, that they would reflect getting conviences that apply more to the city, then to questing.

So what I think their intentions were is based on what they told us their intentions were.


I am in no way being aggressive, I am disagreeing with you and showing you why.

On the other hand, you are making vague statments about them and they, please show me these statments and I will drop it.

5footStep
09-21-2007, 01:58 PM
favor coins. I commend you posting ideas for development. personally I hate seeing anything added to the game which requires MORE collecting of anything. So far I was fine with antique bronze tokens as they were more of an optional prize collectible. And I enjoy collectbles because I can pick them up or not. I don't enjoy grinding to collect a bunch of things just in order to do another set of things.. ie... GH relics. I guess I am old fashioned in that everytime I get one of those I think back to Pen and Paper and then get grumpy that an npc would make me go back again and again.. thats just me.

Favor however in the world of Eberron is very instrinsic to the game. In PnP the more favor you cull with your house, the more benefits you reap. Its an intrinsic political powergame within and between houses. It is also a complicated system as well and I have only been in a few PnP sessions where the DM felt comfortable enough to explore this area of the world at length. At least the way it is set up now it crosses over alright with how I personally have interpreted the Eberron source books such as Dragonmarked. yah.. i know.. this is ddo and not PnP. But I enjoy this game because it follows suit as best it can. meh.. and i just get BORED with grinding.. or sitting in front of some gate doing my nails while some mob melts in cloudkill.

Happy Friday everyone

Kisaragi
09-21-2007, 02:18 PM
I think I should mention again what I had said in my post beforehand, and discuss ideas that may have gotten overlooked.

'Favor Coins' aren't actually coins, they are equal to your current favor with a house, to which they can be exchanged for rewards. From things as simple as a random level chest, a potion, a temporary buff, or something along those lines.

They are designed to reward players who have done quests on elite, and give players who have already achieved high favor to keep playing their characters. In effect the factions, thanking the player for to keep protecting the realms.

You may exchange these 'coins' in at any time at the given representative, but are not required to. You have a choice. You can hold onto them till you get the next 'rank' of a given faction. Same as it is now.

On the other hand, if a player has gotten a ton of House K favor, likes House K quests, and wishes to be associated with them, they can cash in 'favor' in order to recieve advantages/items that define them as related with a house.

I already mentioned the items would be bound, and that there were no actual 'coins' favor is merely represented in text at the representatives with a worth.

There are quite a few people in my guild who are constantly making new characters (perhaps due to boredom). Regardless, I believe we should have something to inspire high level characters to keep playing. This is one way I see of doing it. It's optional. It allows characters to not follow the route of everyone else. If someone knows that they run a given quest at least once a week, they can get a 'reward' for protecting the individuals in the city from that threat.

If characters want to be aligned with the coin lords, they will keep doing harbor quests and cashing in favor to show their alignment and recieve coin lord associated services and items. It adds to the roleplaying by letting characters pick a faction they want to be associated with.

If you like it great ^-^ if you don't so be it. I'm not as young or naive as I once was, thinking I could change minds of people. I figure one more idea is one more inspiration for those reading. I figure the world always needs more inspiration.

M1A1
09-21-2007, 02:27 PM
Lets just use House K favor....

Just assume the Favor Coin/Token system has been put into the game.

You just got your First Level of House K Favor and the Options are you Keep your 75 or 150 Coins/Favor and you got a new bank slot

OR

You turn it in and get _________________ (whatever Devs decide)


Now the catch is....REGARDLESS of what you choose (bank slot/other item) your favor is erased and you have to do the quests over again (elite could still be open of course) to get the favor back.

This would give people a reason to do CoK or The Vons, etc, etc other than for the raid or one time favor...

Am I translating well my idea onto paper or no?

bnrilfun
09-21-2007, 02:27 PM
Wouldnt this mean then that you gain favor each time you run a quest, because otherwise earning them as a one time option to me would be a bummer, however if you earned it each time you ran the quest and could save the favor for special unlocks or items that would be pretty kewl to me.

Kisaragi
09-21-2007, 02:46 PM
What it would probably take is that if you cashed in your Favor coins, you select the mission you're cashing them in from (including all for a faction). Then the progess for these missions is set back down to none. You do not recieve the experience rewards for running it for the first time (unless you haven't run it on that difficulty yet) but can get the favor back for it.

So you spend 16 from the Von Mission on Elite, you can cash it in, gaining 16 points, and setting your favor at that mission to 0. If you redo it on elite again, you get 16 points. It allows you to either get title rewards first, or extra point rewards first and still get the other.

Once you get the title reward you do not get it again, and do not lose the title even if you have 0 favor for that faction.

So the menu would look like the action point selection screen.

[Coin Lords]
The Butcher's Path [Elite = 12 points]
The Den of the Kobold Brothers [Hard = 6 Points]
ETC [Normal = 3 points]
ETC [Normal = 4 Points]
ETC [Normal = 3 Points]
ETC [Normal = 2 Points]

{So say that someone was cashing in all these missions}
Total Cashed in = 30 Favor Coins

Options;
Accept - Give me my reward
Refuse - Eh, let me think about it some more

(I don't know how many points these quests give)

People would click on quests they wanted to cash in at that particular representative for a rewards list. Once they accept, the favor is gone, and if they come back to the representative, he offers them their choices of rewards again.

Ghoste
09-21-2007, 02:57 PM
We have enough Grinds in this game already.... ANd from the looks of it.. Mod 5 is gonna be one HUGE Grind..... No thanks..... I think the Favor rewards we have now are pretty decent.
His suggestion doesn't add any grinding at all, just more choices for your favor rewards. Same favor, just more choices when you reach those benchmarks.

Dane_McArdy
09-21-2007, 03:05 PM
It's not such as a bad idea, it's just outside the realm of what they are using the favor system for. When the favor system came out, you had to do all quests on elite to get the max favor to have enough. Now with more quests not so much.

At first this lead to peole rushing through quests only on elite to get the max favor. That's died out.

So to get these favor coins, you are going to have that again. People redoing quests, on elite only, and zerging as fast as they can, for favor coins, to get rare house items and such.

So, there are items in chests, items as end rewards, and now, items for favor coins for just running quests on elite.

I really don't think we need another source of rewards on top of the normal rewards you get. There is already a glut of items in the game. Not to mention the AH makes it much easier for people to get the gear they want.

To do that moves it farther from the spirit of the fun of Dungeons and Dragons.

Davrim
09-21-2007, 03:26 PM
It's not such as a bad idea, it's just outside the realm of what they are using the favor system for. When the favor system came out, you had to do all quests on elite to get the max favor to have enough. Now with more quests not so much.

At first this lead to peole rushing through quests only on elite to get the max favor. That's died out.

So to get these favor coins, you are going to have that again. People redoing quests, on elite only, and zerging as fast as they can, for favor coins, to get rare house items and such.

So, there are items in chests, items as end rewards, and now, items for favor coins for just running quests on elite.

I really don't think we need another source of rewards on top of the normal rewards you get. There is already a glut of items in the game. Not to mention the AH makes it much easier for people to get the gear they want.

To do that moves it farther from the spirit of the fun of Dungeons and Dragons.

Just an idea Dane, but instead of adding special house items, just make it a list of random named items that drop in that houses quests. IE, for house J, the list MAY include Chaosguard since Xorian Cipher is a quest in that house.

Just a thought, will keep the adding of more items out of the picture.

Ghoste
09-21-2007, 03:27 PM
His suggestion doesn't add any grinding at all, just more choices for your favor rewards. Same favor, just more choices when you reach those benchmarks.
My bad, I read the op again. Ya...I'm definitely not interested in the idea of doubling the already lengthy favor grinds.

Spookydodger
09-21-2007, 04:20 PM
So trying to say what you "think" there "intentions" were is not really a good idea


I am in no way being aggressive, I am disagreeing with you and showing you why.

On the other hand, you are making vague statments about them and they, please show me these statments and I will drop it.

Don't get me wrong, disliking Dane is a hobby for me, but yet you certainly could have phrased the former, and perhaps the latter, in less petulant ways.



So trying to say what you "think" there "intentions" were is not really a good idea

works so much better as:



I don't recall seeing this. Do you have any links to the material you are citing?

or



I would like to see which developer comments you are drawing your conclusions from.

Otherwise you might as well pound your ! key and call him a noob liar. Some people are misguided, but few are actually out to actively mislead.

Spookydodger
09-21-2007, 04:27 PM
My bad, I read the op again. Ya...I'm definitely not interested in the idea of doubling the already lengthy favor grinds.

I think we are mistaking, however, "required" versus "voluntary".

Having more options for gameplay is rarely going to be a bad thing. Some people enjoy the grind. Not me, but a best friend likes sitting there in WoW and killing squirrels ad-naseum for a bit of fur, or eyeballs, or whatever the little buggers are sporting in their wallets.

If, indeed, the favor rewards would be out of line with rewards already granted, then yes, I can understand reservations. However I don't think it is required to nix an idea because we, as individuals, do not enjoy that particular form of play.

Personally I thought the way of adding more characters (before it was a 'bug') by getting to 1750 over and over was a decent enough reason. Gave me more options of play, which I like. A +2 tome on a character doesn't really draw my glistening eye to favor running. More options on the other hand... boy howdy, point me to Oz, Dorothy.

ahpook
09-21-2007, 05:01 PM
Remember, how you asked to be told when you are being whatever...right now.

No he isn't Dane. He was merely disagreeing with you. If that makes people a "whatever" there are a lot of them around :)

Anyway, I agree with what you say the stated intentions of the Favor system were. However, things like +10 permanent HP or 32 point builds are not mere "between quest" conveniences like they first indicated the favor was going to be. So, I would say that Turbine already broke with that goal.

However, I don't think cashing in favor to buy things is all that great. I would rather turbine returned to the original goals rather than deviate further from them.

Spookydodger
09-21-2007, 06:33 PM
Anyway, I agree with what you say the stated intentions of the Favor system were. However, things like +10 permanent HP or 32 point builds are not mere "between quest" conveniences like they first indicated the favor was going to be. So, I would say that Turbine already broke with that goal.

However, I don't think cashing in favor to buy things is all that great. I would rather turbine returned to the original goals rather than deviate further from them.

10 more hitpoints isn't so bad. If this were repeated, though, that could make it from a nice convenience to a must-have. As it is, most everyone can get the favor for those hitpoints and its a lot like a little bit better false life.

I think item rewards for favor are bad, too, just because they are even more dated than the house P spell buffs. Or have the potential to be. House P and J spell buffs enable you to be a little more self-sufficient and maybe stretch mana for mid-level quests. I still have a use for them to this day. Not nearly as much, but my high characters still do use them. A special weapon is out-of-date almost as soon as its available because more than likely random stuff will be more suited to the majority of the population's needs.

Kisaragi
09-22-2007, 08:23 AM
I would like to have faction related named items without many powers. Certainly there can be some rare stuff, but a +3 Mithril House Kundrak Shield. Or +4 Adamantine House Deneith Bastard Sword.

Things that might be witnessed in your information when looked at. That's my dream. Or even titles, you have a special item you have a new title. So for above your title would become House Kundarak Warder or House Deneith Defender.

We're not talking severe game changing powers. Maybe there can be 1 or 2 unique favor items for turning in 400 favor coins. Mostly it's for roleplaying, and fun items.

Areas too. Everyone with enough faction for The Free Agents might get an in game invitiation aboard an airship to 'explore' new lands and have access to unique stores.

Now before anyone says anything I realize this would be very game intensive in terms of work. However, if we impliment it over time (1 new set of favor rewards every mod) then we would have a chance to start aligning ourselves before level 20.